Its Rubber Chicken Time Again!!!

[Paul Mihalka]

Yep, its easy putting together routes. But making sure everything is a road in West Virginia (that is full of back roads, country roads, dirt trails, bike paths, etc), well..... that's a bit more of a challenge.

 

Amen! Following a GPS can get you in trouble if your not on an off road bike. Many of the paved county roads after 10 - 15 miles become gravel and then turn into rocking "goat trails".

 

Bob, remind me of this when I'm following you ...

[Lone_RT_rider]

Yep, its easy putting together routes. But making sure everything is a road in West Virginia (that is full of back roads, country roads, dirt trails, bike paths, etc), well..... that's a bit more of a challenge.

 

Amen! Following a GPS can get you in trouble if your not on an off road bike. Many of the paved county roads after 10 - 15 miles become gravel and then turn into rocking "goat trails".

 

Bob, remind me of this when I'm following you ...

 

For those of you who have not met me, nor know that I practice sarcasm as an effective communication methodology, my comment about it being "easy" was based on my BRR planning experiences. lol.

[mrzoom]

The water wasn't that deep and besides it was in Tenn. so it doesn't count.

[Albert]

For those of you who have not met me, nor know that I practice sarcasm as an effective communication methodology, my comment about it being "easy" was based on my BRR planning experiences. lol.

 

You big meanie!

[Chris K]

 

 

I'm not doing a ride tale...you will have to guess....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And a big tease!

 

details my friend, details...

[jbr7t]

Ok, finally got approval on my leave from work. I am officially IN. Reservation made at the Inn. I hope OoPEZoO doesn't want to spoon ?!?!?!

 

Keith - You still staying out the house wednesday night?

Craig - Meeting keith and I thursday for the ride out?

 

Other VA people - if interested we'll be leaving the Richmond area Thursday the 7th to head out.

[ltljohn]

What's a little gravel among friends. I managed loose gravel switchbacks at the last BRR. Thanks Matt

[TyTass]

Yep, its easy putting together routes. But making sure everything is a road in West Virginia (that is full of back roads, country roads, dirt trails, bike paths, etc), well..... that's a bit more of a challenge.

For those of you who have not met me, nor know that I practice sarcasm as an effective communication methodology, my comment about it being "easy" was based on my BRR planning experiences. lol.

Yeah ... we feel ya, Shawn. You were just spreading the love! Since others might not understand, Jim explained a bit.

[TyTass]

About the routes ... A wise woman once quipped, "Anything worth doing, is worth overdoing."

 

On that note, we're doing our best to do just that. You have a grunch of routes coming your way in great big bleedin' GDB/GPX files. Jim is QCing them now and that's not a particularly quick task (poor bastage! I don't know who left him with that task.). As soon as we've worked out any anomolies, we'll post the routes.

 

At that point, everyone can feel free to download them, import them, and edit to their hearts' content. However, import them with different map versions or preference settings and not double-check them and you're just about guaranteeing you'll wind up on gravel (or worse) roads.

 

We are again creating an RCR route booklet in PDF (more like the one for last year's UN X). The booklet too is well in work, but we won't post that until shortly after the routes are finished.

 

The booklet isn't just for those without GPS devices. The route directions/maps in the booklet should assist folks in verifying if their routes imported correctly. I have stolen Ken's idea for providing written instructions for importing routes and that too is included that in the booklet. Of course, few will probably follow our directions either and will wind up on gravel roads. (Oh Craig! Oh Jim! That route you gave us put us on the worst ).

 

Then again, we may have snuck one ot two in just because we like the excitement they create! (Oh Craig! Oh Jim! )

[TyTass]

Ok, finally got approval on my leave from work. I am officially IN. Reservation made at the Inn. I hope OoPEZoO doesn't want to spoon ?!?!?!

 

Keith - You still staying out the house wednesday night?

Craig - Meeting keith and I thursday for the ride out?

 

Other VA people - if interested we'll be leaving the Richmond area Thursday the 7th to head out.

I'm down with this (the riding together ... not the spooning part). I was planning on heading out early, early. But if we need to leave later for any reason, I can hit breakfast along the way. Coming up 10 then around 288, etc. so it should be a good ride (rather than the slab). You guys looking to head in via backroads?

[Kinsley]

I have stolen Ken's idea for providing written instructions for importing routes and that too is included that in the booklet. Of course, few will probably follow our directions either and will wind up on gravel roads. (Oh Craig! Oh Jim! That route you gave us put us on the worst ).

 

Then again, we may have snuck one ot two in just because we like the excitement they create! (Oh Craig! Oh Jim! )

 

Yes, sometimes I wonder if I have the "invisible type" button engaged, or are they ignoring me like the ugly girl at the homecoming dance

[OoPEZoO]

I'm down with this (the riding together ... not the spooning part). I was planning on heading out early, early. But if we need to leave later for any reason, I can hit breakfast along the way. Coming up 10 then around 288, etc. so it should be a good ride (rather than the slab). You guys looking to head in via backroads?

 

You mean there are other kinds of roads?

Its a pretty easy ride from James's to Snowshoe, so I was hoping to stay on the goat paths as much as possible. I just mounted a new K60 Scout on my extra rear wheel, and was deciding if I wanted to go through the effort of swapping the front over to a TKC80. Of course, I haven't discussed any of this with James yet. How well does that Roadster play in the dirt James?

 

Ok, finally got approval on my leave from work. I am officially IN. Reservation made at the Inn. I hope OoPEZoO doesn't want to spoon ?!?!?!

 

Keith - You still staying at the house wednesday night?

 

Yup, still planning on taking up real estate on your couch Wednesday night......in the non-spooning section please. I'll share space with the dog, but only if you give her a breath mint. What do you want to do for a route on Thursday? I'm sure Craig and I could hash something out pretty quickly in Mapsource, but you know the area a lot better that I do.

[SteveHebert]

I am really looking forward to meeting many of you, and seeing old friends once again. It has been too long. I only have 5 days left in country until this short break and can't wait to leave.

 

See you Saturday afternoon-ish.

[Nice n Easy Rider]

Are those banjos I hear playing?

 

May 27, 2012 12:01 AM

W.Va. police find 4 bodies in wooded area

[Foot]

I am really looking forward to meeting many of you, and seeing old friends once again. It has been too long. I only have 5 days left in country until this short break and can't wait to leave.

 

See you Saturday afternoon-ish.

 

Steve we are looking forward to seeing you too!

 

Alan

[Lone_RT_rider]

I am really looking forward to meeting many of you, and seeing old friends once again. It has been too long. I only have 5 days left in country until this short break and can't wait to leave.

 

See you Saturday afternoon-ish.

 

Steve we are looking forward to seeing you too!

 

Alan

 

Steve,

 

Some dude sent me a PM and said he was going to steal your beers! When I told him that they were for service to our country, he blurted some gibberish about chi-town/conch-town crew being thicker than blood with the Mo-town crew....

 

[SteveHebert]

Let's keep that dude a secret for now. I'll kick his a$$ though if he steals both!

[Lone_RT_rider]

Let's keep that dude a secret for now. I'll kick his a$$ though if he steals both!

 

LOL...

[jbr7t]

Craig- I'm fine with early, early. I think it would be nice to log some mileage before lunch time then maybe take a leisurely lunch.

 

As for the roads..I agree with Keith..I didn't realize there was another option besides backroads. I haven't tried the R out on goat paths but it does fine on typical gravel roads, so I'd be ok throwing a few of those in the mix. Obviously it's not going to handle the abuse your GS's will but I'm also fine going around another way and meeting you guys on the other side. You know I'm certainly not going to be the one to ruin your fun. (now i'm really wishing I'd been able to afford that used GS i found)

 

I'm down with this (the riding together ... not the spooning part). I was planning on heading out early, early. But if we need to leave later for any reason, I can hit breakfast along the way. Coming up 10 then around 288, etc. so it should be a good ride (rather than the slab). You guys looking to head in via backroads?

 

You mean there are other kinds of roads?

Its a pretty easy ride from James's to Snowshoe, so I was hoping to stay on the goat paths as much as possible. I just mounted a new K60 Scout on my extra rear wheel, and was deciding if I wanted to go through the effort of swapping the front over to a TKC80. Of course, I haven't discussed any of this with James yet. How well does that Roadster play in the dirt James?

 

Ok, finally got approval on my leave from work. I am officially IN. Reservation made at the Inn. I hope OoPEZoO doesn't want to spoon ?!?!?!

 

Keith - You still staying at the house wednesday night?

 

Yup, still planning on taking up real estate on your couch Wednesday night......in the non-spooning section please. I'll share space with the dog, but only if you give her a breath mint. What do you want to do for a route on Thursday? I'm sure Craig and I could hash something out pretty quickly in Mapsource, but you know the area a lot better that I do.

[Lone_RT_rider]

Well, thanks to Mr. Insley I have a plan to get up there. I am slabbing it (not a Ken idea obviously) to Abingdon, VA on Thursday night after work. According to Mapsource it should take me about 3 hours of riding time. I can easily do it on a tank of gas, so I probably wont even hop off the bike.

 

On Friday morning I am going to pry my arse out of bed and head out before 7 AM (yes, it can be done lol). I have a 290 mile day planned of all back roads from Abingdon to Snowshoe. Since I will be riding alone I should be in Snowshoe between 4 and 5.

 

See you all there!

 

tick.....tick.....tick.....

[Foot]

Tick.....Routes.......Tick.......Please!............Tick.............my GPS is having an panic attack..........Tick.........Tick.

[TyTass]

Finally, here are the routes!

 

CLICK HERE and then SAVE the GDB Version

 

CLICK HERE and then SAVE the a zip file of the GPX Version.

 

Why a zip file? Because the GPX version is 10MB. Zipped it's less than 2MB.

 

If you have problems downloading either, please let me know.

 

BTW: The RCR4 Info booklet (in PDF) is on it's way. It contains a lot of background info as well as written directions of the routes (and rudimentary maps). It'll be a few days yet.

[TyTass]

Below is a list of the routes. Aside from the two short half-day routes, the rest are named as follows:

 

-

 

Each named route has 3 variations of differing lengths. They are not always simply longer. Some track over different roads throughout the course of the route. There are just so many possibilities in the area, we didn't want to cover just a few of them.

 

Generally, the shorter rides have the more well-paved roads. The longer routes tend to have a higher percentage of the more remote and/or less well-paved roads. Most routes have a lunch break planned at restaurant we either recommend or have been recommended by someone we trust. YMMV!

 

Good luck choosing, have fun riding, but do realize ... YOU RIDE AT YOUR OWN RISK! Cheers!

 

A Short Ride 153

A Short Ride 226

E 249 - Chutes & Ladders

E 312 - Chutes & Ladders

E 334 - Chutes & Ladders

N 255 - Mouse Trap

N 280 - Mouse Trap

N 324 - Mouse Trap

NE 254 - Hide & Seek

NE 270 - Hide & Seek

NE 309 - Hide & Seek

NW 252 - Twister

NW 292 - Twister

NW 326 - Twister

S 266 - Trivial Pursuit

S 276 - Trivial Pursuit

S 316 - Trivial Pursuit

SE 253 - Connect Four

SE 289 - Connect Four

SE 332 - Connect Four

SW 265 - Red Rover

SW 284 - Red Rover

SW 326 - Red Rover

[TyTass]

Perhaps an overview of the routes will help visualize (except where routes cover the same roads) ...

 

[Paul Mihalka]

WOW!!!!!

[Lone_RT_rider]

WOW!!!!!

 

I dont know we might get bored. You know what the left coasters always say, all the good riding is out there.

[Lone_RT_rider]

Seriously folks. I think thats one of the best compilations of any mapset I have ever seen. I have lived near that area, and that's some incredible riding they have planned out there!

 

Shawn

[Chris K]

Randy and I will also be staying in Abingdon on Thursday night. PM sent.

[Kathy R]

WOW!!!!!

 

+1

That there is eye candy!!!

[Albert]

Can you guys change the colors, I don't really like them.

 

Seriously guys, that's an incredible amount of work. Nice job!

[Lone_RT_rider]

Randy and I will also be staying in Abingdon on Thursday night. PM sent.

 

PM and email replied.

[TyTass]

Can you guys change the colors, I don't really like them.

 

Seriously guys, that's an incredible amount of work. Nice job!

Yes we can ... in fact, I'm taking the routes down now to change the colors ...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

JK

[Lone_RT_rider]

Can you guys change the colors, I don't really like them.

 

Seriously guys, that's an incredible amount of work. Nice job!

Yes we can ... in fact, I'm taking the routes down now to change the colors ...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

JK

 

I think Alan (Foot) just had a Coronary.

[TyTass]

Speaking of RIDING AT YOUR OWN RISK, here are a few warnings, cautions, and notes ... and a few disclaimers on top of that:

 

1. WVDOT uses gravel and cinder liberally for the road shoulders. This gets dragged into the road on right-handers by truck traffic (and poor drivers as well). Last year we found the hard way that the trucks carrying loads of this gravel and/or cinders can dump a large pile of it in the road. So take care and keep scanning the road between you and the vanishing point. Be ready to follow the clear paths made by tire tracks rather than a late apex and diving in hard.

 

2. The longer route variations have a much higher percentage of backroads, but no gravel. If you're on gravel, you imported the route incorrectly and/or didn't compare the before and after versions to search for differences/anomolies after you recalculating. I'll post recommended procedures tonight. Ken knows them by heart, I need to refer to my cheat sheet (provided to me years ago by Ken).

 

Following these procedures to ensure your route is exactly as created is particularly important in the Appalachians. Because there are so many little goat paths and dirt roads, which bviously are not reported to Garmin as such, any planned or unplanned recalcuation can send you off route. GPS's are great, but they don't do everything for you. Sharing routes by any means requires effort on the part of both people.

 

3. That said, there are two routes (that I know of due to riding out that way this past weekend) that are over a road that was just recently chip-sealed.

 

On S 266 - Trivial Pursuit and S 276 - Trivial Pursuit after lunch in Paint Bank VA and leaving Hwy 311 to bypass New Castle VA on Hwy 611 / Peaceful Valley Rd, the first 4.5 miles is what was recently chip sealed. The second 4.5 miles of that road is worth going very slowly and carefully over the 1st half of it. Besides, who wants to go thru the town of New Castle VA, anyway?

 

4. Many of the back roads in WV are not just bumpy, but BU~UMP~P-Py. (Yeah for ESA!)

 

5. Alan, Jim, Terri, and I discovered last eyar that the Corridor H Highway project has invaded the upper Canaan Valley area. So, one of my favorite 4-mile sections of well-paved, high-speed twisties - Hwy 42 where i meet Hwy 93 a few miles south of Mt Storm - was completely backed up due to truck traffic. I haven't been up that way since, so I can't say things have gotten better or worse. This would affect NE 309 - Hide & Seek. However, we left the route in because there's a lot of great riding on the rest of the route. If someone has an update on that area, please post.

 

6. This was the mildest winter for WV in over 40 years. While that would lead one to think that road work could have progressed throught the winter, it did not. Be prepared to come upon road crews. They do at least tend to mark road work pretty well in WV.

 

7. Yes, we've provided a lot of routes. Believe me you won't see new one's next year. Not to worry, because you won't be able to ride them all this year anyway. However, that means that we didn't reverify all these roads this year, either. These routes were created from our scouting over the past 5 years (since Keith and I first conceived of this event). That said, I didn't see any closures listed on WVDOT at the time I was intitially constructing the route. That doesn't mean there haven't been any closures since.

 

 

[TyTass]

Why all the warnings? Since I placed all these good roads out there in the public sector, I felt it my duty to try to scare off would-be interlopers (i.e., lazy, web-only route downloaders)!

 

Seriously, though the roads are fantastic, the views often stunning as well as unusual, the road conditions warrant your full attention and all of your skills.

 

And for the left-coasters ... yes, these are often green tunnel roads with curves so tight they make riding around the speed limit seem a challenge.

 

So, for you riders who like if you like wide open throttle, draggin a knee, or chugging along in formation ...

 

DON'T BOTHER DOWNLOADING THESE ROUTES!

[Lone_RT_rider]

So, for you riders who like if you like wide open throttle, draggin a knee, or chugging along in formation ...

 

DON'T BOTHER DOWNLOADING THESE ROUTES!

 

Funny, when I used to ride some of those roads my speed formula was ((speed limit*2)+10). But then again, back then I was crazy enough to follow Big T around in the rain on those very same roads. I'm amazed I ever lived to tell about it.

[Paul Mihalka]

In WV I found that the yellow speed warning signs before turns are more realistic and consistent than in any other state. Unless you want to drag your knees or footpegs (or your butt) about ten above the warning feels good. I also found that being in the gear that matches the first number in the warning, like second gear for 20/25, third for 30/35, makes for good riding.

[TyTass]

So, for you riders who like if you like wide open throttle, draggin a knee, or chugging along in formation ...

 

DON'T BOTHER DOWNLOADING THESE ROUTES!

 

Funny, when I used to ride some of those roads my speed formula was ((speed limit*2)+10). But then again, back then I was crazy enough to follow Big T around in the rain on those very same roads. I'm amazed I ever lived to tell about it.

 

Yeah, I get what you're saying. I was talking about the road speed limit as it tracks throughout (say 45 or 50 mph) and then maintaing that (or +10 in your case) pretty much throughout (ie., not slowing down for the curves (posted at say, 20 mph). I personally can't always maintain that and remain smooth, but folks like big-t, you, etc. certainly can and do.

 

My point was to folk who are used to open road riding, WV riding requires a very different focus and skill set. Neither is better ... just different. To others ... YMMV.

[TyTass]

In WV I found that the yellow speed warning signs before turns are more realistic and consistent than in any other state. Unless you want to drag your knees or footpegs (or your butt) about ten above the warning feels good. I also found that being in the gear that matches the first number in the warning, like second gear for 20/25, third for 30/35, makes for good riding.

Hey, I like that about the gearing, Paul. Thanks.

 

In regards to comparisons ofposted curve speeds, I have limited experience and all of that is in the Appalachian states, and would definitely defer to your vast experience. All that I would add is that I personally find posted WV curve speed very accurate for the well-paved main arteries and State Hwys, but not so much for the back roads ... which I sort of find a crapshoot (when there is a posted limit at all). I wholly admit that may seem that way due to my lack of experience.

[Quinn]

Road game to play on these routes:

 

Count the number of Baptist Churches, subtract the number of other Churches, and then divide by the number of other Houses of Worship. When the result is higher than your average speed, you're a winner! Special prize if your result is higher than your maximum speed.

 

------

 

 

[Lone_RT_rider]

Road game to play on these routes:

 

Count the number of Baptist Churches, subtract the number of other Churches, and then divide by the number of other Houses of Worship. When the result is higher than your average speed, you're a winner! Special prize if your result is higher than your maximum speed.

 

------

 

 

I think I might loose that game more than I would win it. lol

[Lone_RT_rider]

My point was to folk who are used to open road riding, WV riding requires a very different focus and skill set. Neither is better ... just different. To others ... YMMV.

 

Well put.... and very true.

[Foot]

I revived my GPS, it took electro shock therapy and a few screen compressions, but it is ALIVE! Thanks Craig for all the work.

 

Alan

[jbr7t]

30K service getting done tomorrow. Maybe a new front tire too! I'll be ready to ride some of these beautiful routes.

[TyTass]

The work I did is a compilation of driving my two compatriots crazy the past few years. "Let's do this ... Let's d that! Next year I wanna ... yada, yada, yada."

 

Jim has been especially helpful in the most painful way ... QA'ing the routes and the booklet. Being a QA guy myself, I know what a farging PIA that is. The only thanks he get's from me is we go scouting in the spring every year. This year was ... well ... wet. Very wet!

[aterry1067]

I was in this area this past weekend. The cinder is still there, But great riding and beautiful scenery. Glad I got there last year, wished I could be there this year, but work yada yada yada, excuses, etc.

 

And yes, no matter how fast you are going, a local grandma wearing a moomoo and driving a '97 Buick or a '78 Ford 4x4 will pass you. They know the roads, and are impatient and crazy. Just swallow your pride and let her pass.

 

Good luck and safe riding.

 

Most of all, ride your own ride.

 

[RT_Jim]

>>The only thanks he get's from me is we go scouting in the spring every year.

 

Oh, I wouldn't say the only thanks I get is to go scouting. I also get to listen to your (bad) jokes, your snoring, your ....

 

Just kidding!

 

Jim

 

 

[Nice n Easy Rider]

Hi folks,

As someone who doesn't use his Zumo 550 for directions all that often I need some help.

 

I downloaded the maps and then recalculated each one. For the most part the mileages didn't change much. However, for three of the maps (NE254, I think and the next two NE's)the mileage changed significantly (like 50-60 miles). Most of the other maps were either right on or off by only 1-4 miles except the very last one which was off by 10 miles.

 

I'm using the 09 North American Garmin maps and my Zumo is set for fastest route and to avoid unpaved roads.

 

Another, unrelated question. I'm working until sometime on Thursday afternoon so I'll be hustling up to Snowshoe right after work. MapQuest & Google Maps tell me it is about a 5 1/2 hour ride. When I plug the coordinates for the Inn into my Zumo it suggests it is a 4 1/3 hour ride. Which would you trust? I'm trying to arrive at the Inn before it gets too dark if possible.

[TyTass]

As someone who doesn't use his Zumo 550 for directions all that often I need some help.

 

I downloaded the maps and then recalculated each one. For the most part the mileages didn't change much. However, for three of the maps (NE254, I think and the next two NE's)the mileage changed significantly (like 50-60 miles). Most of the other maps were either right on or off by only 1-4 miles except the very last one which was off by 10 miles.

 

I'm using the 09 North American Garmin maps and my Zumo is set for fastest route and to avoid unpaved roads.

George,

 

I'll post part of the RCR4 Info Booklet, the section on importing routes. Your answers are in there. It's not a 2-second solution, but it is required. One question for you ... why the '09 maps? You're missing out on one heck of a lot of important map updates. For instance, Smoke Hole Rd wasn't even shown as a thru road until last year's maps. So, if you don't update your maps, some routes just won't work as programmed no matter what you do. You'd have to reprogram routes like the ones going through Smoke Hole Rd as we did this in previous year ... as 2-leg segments. And that is a whole lot more work.

 

In the end, you're going to need to choose between: 1) updating your maps, 2) entirely reprograming any route route majorly affected by map updates, or 3) stop using you Zumo. I'm thinking you're going to want to choose door number 1.

[TyTass]

Importing Routes in Garmin MapSource

 

When importing any route file created in on a computer other than your own, each route must be recalculated in your MapSource. The reason for this is to see how your GPS will “see” (or interpret) the route given your map versions, preferences, and transfer mode. Recalculation provides you the opportuntity to correct unplanned deviations or anomalies.

 

MapSource Version

 

These routes were created using City Navigator North American NT 2013.01.

 

MapSource Preferences

 

When routes are recalculated—either in MapSource or by your GPS device while running the route—the preferences set as set in your MapSource (and therefore your device) are applied. Despite the best efforts of the route designer to use sufficient via points to reduce the likelihood of gross differences, it almost cannot be prevented to some degree. Having different preferences from the route designer often results in vast differences. Therefore, it is best to match the settings used by the route designer. [Note: Should a recalculation occur during the route and you suspect it changed the route improperly, simply restart the route and pick it up from your current location.]

 

The RCR4 routes were produced with the following settings on the Preferences Routing Tab:

• Route Style: Use Auto-Routing
  
• Try to Avoid: All deselected (blank)
  
• Calculation Style: Faster Time
  
• Road Selection: One position left of center, towards Prefer Minor Roads.
  

Importing and Recalculating

 

When importing and recalculating, check for and correct anomalies. Here's how:

• Open the RCR4.gdb route file in MapSource.
  
• Open a separate (empty) MapSource window.
  
• Copy the desired route from RCR4.gdb, then paste it into the empty MapSource window.
  
• Double click the new route and change the name slightly (i.e., add a number at the end, before .gdb).
  
• Select RECALCULATE. The mileage should stay the same (if not look for differences in route).
  
• Again copy the original route from the RCR4.gdb window and paste over your new route. For any differences, adjust the new route to match the original. Load the new route to your GPS unit.