Final Drive Minder

[BeemerLover]

There are numerous posts with pics in the hexhead section about this. Reducing the oil to 180 ml may have solved the problem but I know I would like to put a vent in. The removable plug at 9:00 would be the logical place but the 180 ml of oil comes up to that level so any vent open to the air might leak oil. Some sort of flexible membrane that keeps the oil in but temporarily relieves the pressure might work.

[realshelby]

The removable plug at 9:00 would be the logical place but the 180 ml of oil comes up to that level so any vent open to the air might leak oil.

 

That is what I need to be able to do some research on. At the Austin Tech Days recently it looked like the oil was not quite at the 9:00 level. If it is above that level, there is no way to make it work. At least in a practical easy to use design. Anybody in the Houston area with a 1200 series with a 9:00 drain/fill plug want to be a gineau pig?

[Selden]

I changed all the oils this week at 99,126 miles, in preparation for a road trip. I guess I'm a poor tester for the final drive minder, as the FD oil came out clear enough to see through, with just the usual collection of fine black powder on the drain plug magnet. But, the peace of mind of being able to unscrew the little FD minder plug and look at the residue on the magnet is priceless between oil changes.

 

Transmission oil looked equally good, with no unusual residue on the drain plug magnet.

[realshelby]

I guess I'm a poor tester for the final drive minder, as the FD oil came out clear enough to see through, with just the usual collection of fine black powder on the drain plug magnet. But, the peace of mind of being able to unscrew the little FD minder plug and look at the residue on the magnet is priceless between oil changes.

 

Selden, you are a fine tester! There are just over 30 of the Final Drive Minders in use. I don't wish any one running them bad luck and the rule of averages means it would take quite a while for one of the 30 to show a problem. There have been no problems with the design so I feel good about that. Like you said "peace of mind" is what they are all about.

 

 

[The Beav]

Terry,

 

I just read the string of posts about your FDM and would be interested in installing one on my '99 RT with 88,000 miles. Let me know if you start selling them or want to increase the beta tester pool.

 

JB

[algover]

.... also lurking.

 

[philbytx]

Terry,

 

So far so good with mine with just the usual black gunk on the tip.

I check it after every long ride. The peace of mind factor is wonderful......

 

Let us know when you have them for sale and the pricing.

As I, for one, would be happy to be a salesman for you !

 

 

 

[Michaelr11]

My RT has nearly 90,000 miles. At my last gear oil change the drain plug came out with much more debris on it than usual. The Drive Minder also had much more on it than it usually does. No play or noise, so I filled it and rode another few days. Pulled the Final Drive Minder and it has a lot of fuzz on it for 270 miles so I have ordered a new ball bearing for the final drive and will replace it before this one implodes and destroys the crown gear. The FDM allowed me to easily check the oil.

[realshelby]

Michael, I need to talk to you about this. This is the kind of info I need to build from. My main concern is was there ANY SOLID PARTICLES? If there were any particles that you could feel between your fingers from the final drive minder that is exactly what I am hoping it will pick up. If you are still riding it some please pay attention to the stuff on the minder and if possible maybe a picture of what is on it, especially if it is more or different from what you have seen over the past months. Can you wipe it across a tissue ( my favorite ) and see any shiny particles? Note your mileage when you first seen the change in build up, maybe we can get an idea of what you see first and how long till it gets bad.

[GrayNFast]

Terry,

 

Been checking mine and finding only black sludge. Looks almost like a drop of liquid on the Minder. Can I assume this is good news. Bike has 44k.

 

 

[realshelby]

GrayNFast, yours sounds normal. A black "blob" on the end of the magnet. The black is actually iron in suspension attracted to the magnet, not a sign that the oil is dirty at all.

 

The best thing I have found to wipe the minder off is a tissue ( think kleenex ). It absorbs the oil and leaves the residue on top where you can inspect it.

 

What you are looking for is SHINY particles, very small flakes ( think of gold flakes in the bottom of a prospectors pan ), anything you can feel between your fingers. Those are the things a bearing will put out during the early stages of failure. Big chunks come later!

[rustyfingerz]

test subject rustyfingerz checking in.

Just did a transmission and final drive gear oil service, bike has 39k and installed

FDM a little less than 6 thousand miles ago.Having gotten the FDM with already about a thousand mile into the gear oil service I went ahead and installed it anyway.

sure and heck wasn"t going to wait.

I dont use the bike for around town riding, its mostly used as a long distance traveler.

I would check the condition every five or six tankfuls of fuel whilst riding.

So far so good grayish black blob, no shinny metal particles [thank you],

also do the rear wheel wiggle test.

Thank you realshelby, hope this helps

Mark

 

[realshelby]

Most of you testers out there have the aluminum Final Drive Minders. There are a few stainless steel versions. I need input on the appearance of the aluminum versions after several months of use. I recently had one returned ( a very early version, owner sold bike and graciously shipped it back for testing ) that was rather dirty and would take some polishing to clean up. Appearance is more important to some than others and I need to know how the aluminum is looking on bikes where owners are.....well, keeping everything spotless?

 

I am close to bringing these to market and if I offer the aluminum I may have to coat them if appearance is an issue. The stainless versions take a LOT longer to machine which adds to cost....

 

Input is much appreciated!

[cris nitro]

I have the aluminum version and it looks like new. Have had it now for almost a year and it works great. Check it every ride and knock on wood, all I get is the grey powder.

 

Although my bike lives in the garage and is kept spotless.

 

Thanks, realshelby!

[DiggerJim]

I'm running the aluminum and it's dirty but so is my wheel (and truth be told, my bike - I don't wash it much). I rubbed off the dirt and it looked fine. It matches the FD unit whereas I would think SS would be shinier and more noticeable.

 

BTW, nothing goobie to report in terms of catching anything...and FD isn't making noises either.

[BriSco]

Terry,

 

I'm running the aluminum one and it looks just like the day I installed it.

I do keep my bike fairly clean using S100 several times a year.

 

It seems like I am picking up less and less of the grey dust...

[realshelby]

That is what I had hoped to hear. More input is welcome. I machined those out of 6061 aluminum which is not too bad about corroding. Even if they dull a bit, like you said it matches the drive unit.

 

I have a couple owners that have had their oil sampled before/after. There was a considerable reduction in "iron" after they installed the minder and cleaned off the black blob ( iron ) each time. Don't know if that means anything, but less iron floating around sounds ok to me.....

[doc47]

Hey Terry, I'm curious. You obviously have machinist talent. Where did that come from? Share a little about yourself!

doc

[realshelby]

Hey Terry, I'm curious. You obviously have machinist talent. Where did that come from? Share a little about yourself!

doc

 

Ha! Doc, would you call someone that sewed up a nasty cut with fishing line in a remote area where there was no medical care a Doctor? That is the same as calling me a machinist!

 

I am not afraid of anything mechanical. I also hate to depend on anyone else for anything, and not being from money I have always done everything myself. Now I do everything myself because few others can do things to suit me.

 

As for the machining, I thank Jim for that. My friend and neighbor is a Master Machinist with years on manual lathes and mills. Everything I know he has shown me. When I go over there he looks to see if I have any fingers missing, smiles and says you are doin' good!

[taylor1]

Greetings realshelby Another tester here Thanks ! Have put @ 12,000 miles on fdm and all I can report is piece of mind. I have the aluminum and it looks as good as the day I received it 2002 RT 36,000

[DFWBo]

Have about 11K on the aluminum, and it is holding up wonderfully, thanks for allowing me to test!

[algover]

'Would definitely be interested in this if you go to production.

[ElevenFifty]

At 134K ... FDM installed about 20k ago ... check it frequently. All is well. Aluminum looks just fine.

 

D

[kd4yrp]

Just bought a '04 R1150RT with a tad over 30000. Would be interested in buying a FDM when they become available.

 

Thanks,

Walter

Clarksburg WV

[RedMac]

Same here.. when you ship, please PM me. I'd be interested in buying.

M

[BIWOZ]

Same here.. when you ship, please PM me. I'd be interested in buying.

 

And again ... in Australia.

[Big_Gray]

Most of you testers out there have the aluminum Final Drive Minders. There are a few stainless steel versions. I need input on the appearance of the aluminum versions after several months of use. I recently had one returned ( a very early version, owner sold bike and graciously shipped it back for testing ) that was rather dirty and would take some polishing to clean up. Appearance is more important to some than others and I need to know how the aluminum is looking on bikes where owners are.....well, keeping everything spotless?

 

I am close to bringing these to market and if I offer the aluminum I may have to coat them if appearance is an issue. The stainless versions take a LOT longer to machine which adds to cost....

 

Input is much appreciated!

 

I have an aluminum one for about one year now. It looks just fine although I do not keep either the bike or the minder spotless. About 15,000 km since installing. I check it prior to every day of riding and without fail always have a virtually identical black blob on the tip. I am going to change the O-ring soon...just as a precaution.

 

I have no idea whether this device will predict an impending failure in time but I sure feel good every time I see the familiar black blob...with no grit. Thanks again Terry for allowing me to test.

[philbytx]

My FD Minder is still solid and a trusted companion!!

I have it on my 2003 R1150RT and check it after every ride.

Thankfully, only little black blobs to report

 

[realshelby]

My FD Minder is still solid and a trusted companion!!

I have it on my 2003 R1150RT and check it after every ride.

Thankfully, only little black blobs to report

 

The "black blobs" are comforting.

 

I just got a pm from a beta tester....that had grey blobs. In his words looked like anti-sieze compound. I'll let him post about it if he chooses to.

 

That makes two owners out of just over 30 Final Drive Minders that I put out for testing to have bearing failure. The FDM units are able to catch and hold enough of the metal particles to show the owner....that they need to check on the final drives. Which is a lot better than the final drive telling the owner....I ain't going any further!

[RoanokeRider]

I have had the alum version but only for installed for 9 months. Looks as good as new and so far only the black blobs. The peace of mind is priceless.

[realshelby]

I was sent some pictures of the final drive minder with questionable particles and colors on it. This owner was on a ride with a passenger when he stated he thought he could hear a noise when leaned over a bit ( could just be tires ?) and later thinks there might be a bit of movement of the wheel. That could be the swingarm bearings also, but time will tell. The owner is continuing to ride the bike, not sure how many miles he has since this started, but that is valuable input for how long they run till the symptoms become worse or leave you stranded.

 

We have mentioned the "black blob", that is what owners normally see on the end of the minder when they check it. It is a GOOD thing. When wiped on a tissue you see a smooth black area with nothing shiny. This picture shows the results of the questionable final drive. Notice how silver it is:

This picture shows a bit of the oil out of the final drive. While the oil is clean enough, look closely at the edge of the oil. Looks like small metal shavings?

 

My most interesting picture is this one! Clearly shows one fairly large metal particle and some smaller ones. The owner simply wiped the end of the minder across his finger for this pic. These were attracted to and held by the magnet on the Final Drive Minder. If I saw this on my minder I would want to drop the oil in the final drive and inspect that also. We will know more later, I suspect the crown bearing is starting to fail.

[ESokoloff]

My most interesting picture is this one! Clearly shows one fairly large metal particle and some smaller ones. The owner simply wiped the end of the minder across his finger for this pic. These were attracted to and held by the magnet on the Final Drive Minder. If I saw this on my minder I would want to drop the oil in the final drive and inspect that also. We will know more later, I suspect the crown bearing is starting to fail.

 

Just a few days ago I checked mine (03 RT 87k) and found along with the normal sludge, a very small ferrous flake.

 

Hoping all is well.

Great to have a device to enable monitoring the health of the final drive.

 

 

Fit and finish same as when new (garage stored).

Wish I had made note of the o-ring crush when new.

Now when tightening, the two components meet 1/4 turn after contacting the o-ring

[Gruesome]

This is in reply to the question how the aluminum version is holding up: on mine the knurled part is still looking like new. Bike is parked outside in the city during the riding season, and has seen a few rain showers on the highway as well. And I'm certainly not winning any prices for excessive cleaning...

 

So, I don't think the Al version needs a coating. The base part collected some dirt, but so did the rear axle drive that it's screwed into.

 

And, no shiny slivers so far! Thanks again for making the minder!

[algover]

Any thoughts/comments on when you might go production on this?

[realshelby]

It should be in a few weeks at most now.

[upfisk]

Will the Final Drive Minder fit the R1200RTs also, is it the same diameter as that for the he R1100RTs?

[nrp]

I suggest gently washing (swishing) the magnet off in solvent to remove the lube oil, let dry, and then evaluate the steel remains. This would be a much more sensitive way to gauge the nature of the slivers. I agree that simple steel dust isn't an issue, but that chunks that can be felt definitely are an indicator of things going wrong.

 

Masking or duct tape is a good way to clean up the magnet afterwards.

[realshelby]

Will the Final Drive Minder fit the R1200RTs also, is it the same diameter as that for the he R1100RTs?

 

While I looked over some of the 1200 series final drives last year at Limecreeks tech day event, I have not tried to machine one for them. I think it will be possible to machine one for the final drives that have the plug at the 9 o'clock position. I'll need a volunteer in the Houston area to come over for some measuring/fitting after I get the Oilhead units finalized.

[realshelby]

I suggest gently washing (swishing) the magnet off in solvent to remove the lube oil, let dry, and then evaluate the steel remains. This would be a much more sensitive way to gauge the nature of the slivers. I agree that simple steel dust isn't an issue, but that chunks that can be felt definitely are an indicator of things going wrong.

 

Masking or duct tape is a good way to clean up the magnet afterwards.

 

The concern I have with the silver colored matter on the magnet ( not the chunks or slivers of metal) is that it does NOT appear to be normal. Note that many of us refer to the "black blob" on the end of the magnet. That IS normal and it seems that no matter what oil is being used, how frequently it is checked, how often the oil is changed, the same "black blob" appears. While unfortunate for the owner that has these symptoms, it is valuable input for us. Especially since he is putting some more miles on it. We can see if it degrades further and if so how rapidly.

 

I have found a Kleenex tissue to be outstanding to wipe the magnet off with. It wicks away the liquid and leaves the black stuff on the surface where you can inspect it.

[algover]

....

 

While I looked over some of the 1200 series final drives last year at Limecreeks tech day event, I have not tried to machine one for them. I think it will be possible to machine one for the final drives that have the plug at the 9 o'clock position. I'll need a volunteer in the Houston area to come over for some measuring/fitting after I get the Oilhead units finalized.

 

Well, I would volunteer, but I'm no where near the Houston area! Also, taking a close look at my 2012 R1200RT it looks like the plug is at the bottom, in the 6 o'clock position. So it looks like "checking" it means draining it. That could still be useful, but you wouldn't be able to just casually "check" it without draining and refilling (unless I'm looking at the wrong thingy).