Saw my first 1200RT on the road today!

[Couchrocket]

Scared the heck out of me.... a face only a mother could love... I think I've seen this somewhere before?

 

 

[Jim VonBaden]

No offense, but you guys do realize that every time you insult the RT/ST etc. that you are insulting someone's dream or new baby, right?

 

Just my humble opinion, and yes, everyone is entitled to one.

 

Jim

[beemerman2k]

No offense, but you guys do realize that every time you insult the RT/ST etc. that you are insulting someone's dream or new baby, right?

 

Just my humble opinion, and yes, everyone is entitled to one.

 

Jim

 

 

Well my opinion is that people who feel insulted when someone else doesn't like their choice of vehicle needs to grow up! I like my RT and that's the only thing that matters to me. It's nice that after 5 years and 63,000 miles I still -- almost on a daily basis -- I get compliments on my bike. But I'd still have bought it and own it to this day if noone else thought it was a good bike. In fact, I do get picked on by other motorcylists because of how "slow" it is, but so what?

 

If your ego is tied in with whether someone else approves of your choice of vehicle, you've got some growing up to do. And that's my humble opinion!

[Marty Hill]

Roger that!

[Couchrocket]

No offense, but you guys do realize that every time you insult the RT/ST etc. that you are insulting someone's dream or new baby, right?

 

Just my humble opinion, and yes, everyone is entitled to one.

 

Yup, pretty much! That's what all the smiley faces were supposed ot be about! And, ya gotta admit that it bears more than a passing resemblance to "The Predator" from straight on..... LOL.... it really does.

 

Just so that I don't appear as more of a naysayer than I am, really, I'm totally impressed by the stats, reports of power and handling, the nice more manageable seat height, and the way it looks from the side. Very clean looking from the side, in person.

 

I couldn't own one because of three things, regardless of the performance, etc.: Its "face," the LT swoop to the bags that is totally non-functionable (as they say in these parts), and the whale-like tank width a la the LT.

 

Purely personal preference. It just isn't my cup of tea. It is obviously a significant leap forward in boxer technology, and amenities -- though also a leap in the LT direction IMO, which is someplace I don't want to go at the moment, though for many others it is easy to understand why it would "exactly" the direction they were hoping the RT would go.

 

I'm a guy who traded in a loaded GL1800 in order to get back to "simple" and clean. My RT has no radio, no MP3, no cell phone, no intercom, no radar. So I'm not a good candidate for more "stuff" on a bike a la cruise control and such like.

[k7qz]

Purely personal preference. It just isn't my cup of tea. It is obviously a significant leap forward in boxer technology, and amenities -- though also a leap in the LT direction IMO... snip

 

I'm with you Scott, as I mentioned in another thread I had the opportunity to lay hands on a R12RT, R12ST and K12S this past weekend.

 

The new models were all lined up at my LD but my eye kept roaming across the aisle to an '04 R1150RT. The 1150 just looks like a BMW to me. Classy smooth integrated lines with an understated elegance. I know it's subjective but real nonetheless. For me, the new ST evoked more of a wow response than the RT did.

 

FWIW, the LD had a new Aprilia Futura there as well and I think the angular front end of the 12RT looks more like an Aprilia than a "predator".

 

The new K bike is without doubt a K bike of BMW lineage. I thought awesome, an RS on steroids!

 

To each his own! See them for yourselves and make up your own minds. I mean hey, it's your ride!

 

-Mike

[Geraldh]

No offense, but you guys do realize that every time you insult the RT/ST etc. that you are insulting someone's dream or new baby, right?

 

Just my humble opinion, and yes, everyone is entitled to one.

 

Jim

 

Thanks Jim. This is my first BMW and I love it's looks. I actually prefer it to some of the older BMWs that others are going gaga over. Each there own.

[David]

The reason I know you didn't take this picture? Because it was behind you.

[MoDog]

If your ego is tied in with whether someone else approves of your choice of vehicle, you've got some growing up to do. And that's my humble opinion!

 

Yup...this is real life, brother, and everyone doesn't get a medal and a hug.

[MoDog]

 

I'm a guy who traded in a loaded GL1800 in order to get back to "simple" and clean. My RT has no radio, no MP3, no cell phone, no intercom, no radar. So I'm not a good candidate for more "stuff" on a bike a la cruise control and such like.

 

Yes, I couldn't agree more. Other than the twin-spark upgrade, one of the things I liked best about the '04 was the fact that it had a sizable finished storage compartment and wasn't radio ready.

 

The new RT definitely seems to be leaning more toward LT land than in the past. That will be a positive thing to some and a negative to others; it's a negative to me and I'm ok if everyone doesn't agree...and glowing bike rag reviews aside, it will be interesting to how it handles the road long-term and how it sells.

[John Bentall]

No offense, but you guys do realize that every time you insult the RT/ST etc. that you are insulting someone's dream or new baby, right?

 

Just my humble opinion, and yes, everyone is entitled to one.

 

 

Jim

 

I agree absolutely. I do wish the moderators would insist that there is a single thread, maybe a sticky at the top of the forum, that everyone who detests the looks of the new machines could post to. Then everyone who likes the look of the new machines could just ignore it.

[steveknapp]

The 1150 just looks like a BMW to me. Classy smooth integrated lines with an understated elegance.

 

The 1100/1150RT's have just been around long enough that they are what you think of when you think of BMW motorcycles.

 

Your description hardly matches what came before these bikes, does it?

 

 

And as far as useless shapes of the saddle bags, has anyone looked inside their RT's bags? Or at the BMW top box? Did I get the wrong version or something? Mine look normal on the outside, but the inside reveals this strange shape that's hard to pack full. The top box requires I put my helmet in "just so" otherwise it won't close.

 

I actually prefer it to some of the older BMWs that others are going gaga over.

 

What, ya don't like brown?

[Couchrocket]

The reason I know you didn't take this picture? Because it was behind you.

Now, there's a man who understands my tag-line!

[steveknapp]

FWIW, I asked a coworker if he saw anything across the generations of RT's that he thought was common. It pointed out that all RT's previous to the 1200RT had a "snout"..the windscreen sloped into the bodywork, and made a point just above the front wheel. The 1200RT looks like it hit a wall, and lost it's snout.

[k7qz]

The 1100/1150RT's have just been around long enough that they are what you think of when you think of BMW motorcycles.

 

Your description hardly matches what came before these bikes, does it?

 

Perhaps, but I think we have to compare apples to apples. I liked the looks of the 70's BMWs and still do. (as well as the Triumph, Norton, Ducati, Moto Guzzi etc. of that era) Compared to most bikes of the times, I'd choose your example '78 R100RT over, say a '78 Honda CB750. But like I said, JMO.

 

Aren't you glad we have choices?

 

-Mike

[smiller]

The 1200RT looks like it hit a wall

 

Well now, glad to hear you admit it...

[Bob Palin]

No offense, but you guys do realize that every time you insult the RT/ST etc. that you are insulting someone's dream or new baby, right?

It will be a sad day when you can't express your opinion of a motorcycle because somebody else will be insulted.

[John Bentall]

No offense, but you guys do realize that every time you insult the RT/ST etc. that you are insulting someone's dream or new baby, right?

It will be a sad day when you can't express your opinion of a motorcycle because somebody else will be insulted.

 

It will be a sad day when you can't express your opinion of your partners dress sense because he/she will be insulted.

[beemerman2k]

See what happens when you can't debate politics, or religion, or helmet laws, and now personal preferences in motorcycle asthetics? Sheesh.

 

Oh well, at least the Yankee's still SUCK!

 

Go SOX!

 

And don't anybody hurt my feelings on this one

[drodg]

You know looks aren't everything. I had the "beautiful" RT1100 sitting in my garage. Yes it was great to look at but every time I rode it I missed my ST1100's engine. The beautiful looks didn't cure the constant surging.

[steveknapp]

I'm not thinking it can't be discussed. Just seems sorta endless and pointless. Like if I posted every time I saw another bike..."So I saw this GL on the road today, it was horrid, and it made me think, how beautiful my RT really is"..

 

But what do I know, I'm a Cubs fan, we suck.

[questrider]

I've looked at the picture in this thread and I don't know what I'm looking at. It looks like someone hit something head-on with the RT and it tore the headlight out and all that is left is a hollow wreck where it once was. I'm missing something...

[Jim VonBaden]

No offense, but you guys do realize that every time you insult the RT/ST etc. that you are insulting someone's dream or new baby, right?

It will be a sad day when you can't express your opinion of a motorcycle because somebody else will be insulted.

No offense, but you guys do realize that every time you insult the RT/ST etc. that you are insulting someone's dream or new baby, right? It will be a sad day when you can't express your opinion of a motorcycle because somebody else will be insulted. Just as sad a day when it is not only accepted, but encouraged to insult people and their dreams.

 

I have to say that I am totally sick of the "me too" whenever someone say how much they hate, but when someone says they like, they are ridiculed.

 

I know many wont agree with me, and that is fine. But give it a break already. How many times can you say that you hate something, or that it is ugly.

 

Get over it!

 

BMW is moving on, and so should the rest of you! One day your old BMW's will be just that, old style and out dated. You may still love them, and that is fine, but the rest of us will have moved on!

 

I appologize for this rant to any sensibilities that may have been hurt. But if honesty is what you want, here it is:

 

BMW owners are some of the most generous and helpful people I have ever met, but also some of the whiniest! They complain endlessly, and it get's old.

 

Feel free to slam me all you want, it is in your nature. But geeze, relax and learn to allows others to NOT follow the heard.

 

Jim

[David]

Just as sad a day when it is not only accepted, but encouraged to insult people and their dreams.

 

Jim, it really is just a bike. Or maybe we're using "dream" differently. But none of my dreams have anything to do with the fleeting whims of a BMW designer, here today, gone tomorrow.

 

Just as you "insult" current owners of bikes whose "dreams" will quickly look silly, so too will the new bikes...just a few years hence.

 

I seriously doubt that anyone with a real opinion about the bike--one that happens to be unfavorable--is trying to stomp on your dreams. They just think they look stupid!

 

Me, I don't care. I've loved loved lots of stupid looking bikes. In fact I have three of 'em now and sold my beautiful bike to a board member!

[Jake]

And I drive a funny looking purple car!

[David]

And I drive a funny looking purple car!

 

[JR356]

Hi,

 

Have you seen the movie "Predator",do you recall what the creature looked like with it's mouth open.

Thats what the picture shows.

 

 

JR356

RED 98 K12RS

[steveknapp]

Bet you get a free bowl of soup with that car...OH but it looks good on you Jake!

 

[Jim VonBaden]

Just as sad a day when it is not only accepted, but encouraged to insult people and their dreams.

 

Jim, it really is just a bike. Or maybe we're using "dream" differently. But none of my dreams have anything to do with the fleeting whims of a BMW designer, here today, gone tomorrow.

 

Just as you "insult" current owners of bikes whose "dreams" will quickly look silly, so too will the new bikes...just a few years hence.

 

I seriously doubt that anyone with a real opinion about the bike--one that happens to be unfavorable--is trying to stomp on your dreams. They just think they look stupid!

 

Me, I don't care. I've loved loved lots of stupid looking bikes. In fact I have three of 'em now and sold my beautiful bike to a board member!

 

I was not insulted, I don't have a new RT or ST, and could care less if anyone else liked it. I guess I am just dissapointed in the basic urge for everyone to constantly knock the new bikes, and wonder how many people are biting their tongues because they want to say good things, but don't want to buck the trends. I know a couple who will admit it privately, but not publically.

 

Like my mother always said, if you have nothing good to say, say nothing.

 

Maybe I am too optimistic for this group sometimes, or maybe just tired. I am so tired of the two most popular first lines on many threads on this board: "You would think for the price of a BMW... bla bla bla" and "What the heck was BMW thinking when... bla bla bla"

 

Time to do more lurking, and less posting. Yes Greg, I know you will be happy for that!

 

For all the people of this board, I still stand by what I said before, you guys are the best, helpful and friendly. Thanks for that!

 

Jim

[ghaverkamp]

I was not insulted, I don't have a new RT or ST, and could care less if anyone else liked it. I guess I am just dissapointed in the basic urge for everyone to constantly knock the new bikes, and wonder how many people are biting their tongues because they want to say good things, but don't want to buck the trends. I know a couple who will admit it privately, but not publically.

 

I, for one, like 'em, and I'm not going to sit around anymore, biting my tongue, worried that the folks here might get upset with what I have to say! And I say they still look BMW-y, too, despite the cries of the faithful to the alternative.

 

Whew. I feel so liberated.

 

Time to do more lurking, and less posting. Yes Greg, I know you will be happy for that!

 

Geez, Jim, don't mind me. I can't imagine how many people think I ought to just put on my skirt, mount my step-through, and twist-n-go right outta here.

 

(Okay, the skirt's a joke. But I did have to buy a suit the other day, and that felt pretty foreign to me, too.)

 

Greg

[Geraldh]

Hi,

 

Have you seen the movie "Predator",do you recall what the creature looked like with it's mouth open.

 

 

Got mine delivered last night and one of the neighbours made a reference to some creature or villain in the first Spiderman movie! It was ok, I wasn't insulted, I still love the look of my new R12RT

[MG37221]

I've mostly been lurking for a while. I read this DB at least daily, it not several times a day. There's just usually little for me to add. BUT, and as most have said, these bikes to look better in person than in the pics. The real ugly duckling, the R12ST turned out to be one of the most beautiful bikes I've seen (aside from the '00 RT !). It's not the bike for me but it just looks to be awesome and probably performs that way too.

 

The new RT will continue to be controversial until it's no longer so different (as in more of them on the road), when they will gain acceptance. Love them or hate them or anywhere in between, they are the new RTs.

[R-1150-RS]

With all the complaining, nit-picking, undermining, criticism, moaning, whining, etc., etc., over something as superficial and arbitrary as the shape and colour of a few body panels, while almost totally ignoring all the other superior factors that make the new bikes better than their predicessors at all the things motorcycles are best at, that make riding a motorcycle the joy and passion it is, and the primary reason we buy them - a psychoanalyst would have a field day...........

 

Gary

[steveknapp]

The new RT is horrible. No one buy any. Buy used 1150RT's instead.

 

I'll even make you this fab deal. I've got a wonderful pre-owned "classic" RT. All setup, all broken in. You bring me one of those horrible 1200RTs and I'll swap with you. No no no, I won't take your money. You look like a nice guy, I'll just take an even trade.

 

 

[David]

a psychoanalyst would have a field day...........

 

Yes, which is why our busiest moderator (writing reports all day) is a Ph.D. psychologist. He really is!

[Shawnee Bill]

I was not insulted, I don't have a new RT or ST, and could care less if anyone else liked it. I guess I am just disappointed in the basic urge for everyone to constantly knock the new bikes, and wonder how many people are biting their tongues because they want to say good things, but don't want to buck the trends. I know a couple who will admit it privately, but not publically.

 

Went down and saw the new bikes Saturday, I thought they looked pretty good. All three of them.

 

Like my mother always said, if you have nothing good to say, say nothing.

I think you are taking your mother's statement out of context, my mother says that also, but doesn't apply it to inanimate objects, not sure how the "Predator" is classified, looks sort of like an animated inanimate thing to me.

 

Rice grinders are inanimate for sure , not sure I can say that about Harleys and BMWs

[smiller]

Why are some people so offended by a simple difference of aesthetic opinion? In any event it's hard to imagine a more germane topic in a forum such as this so we might just have to get used to reading divergent views and resist suggesting that such opinions are the result of 'whining', should be restricted to a single thread, etc.

 

BTW, many of the 'negative' comments in this thread are obviously just tongue-in-cheek. The level of sensitivity is interesting, though.

[alkar]

I saw my first R1200RT on the showroom floor last weekend. It was still ugly, but it's MUCH better in person than it was in the photos I saw. It's lines are a product of extensive wind-tunnel testing - a root in physics that drives all bikes to assume a similar, aerodynamically friendly form. BMW just made it to the party a bit late.

 

I think the new form will grow on me with time (like the latest generation of Dodge and Ford trucks). (On the other hand, I still think the Ford GT-40 and the Ferrari Dinos of the 60s and 70s are prettier than ALL the subsequent generations of super-cars.)

 

I can understand the urge to get away from the heavy, bloated Goldwing type of bike but, for me, it's about function, form, weight, and feel. I can't understand the objection to features like heated seats and cruise control - especially given the fact that the new bike is lighter, faster, and more nimble. Making a bike more comfortable on long, cold trips doesn't magically convert a lighter, faster bike into a bloated pig.

[steveknapp]

I can't understand the objection to features like heated seats and cruise control - especially given the fact that the new bike is lighter, faster, and more nimble. Making a bike more comfortable on long, cold trips doesn't magically convert a lighter, faster bike into a bloated pig.

 

I was thinking the same thing.

 

Tho part of what had me thinking more and more about a GS is the simple fact that no matter how light the RT is, the GS will always be lighter.

[99Roadster]

a psychoanalyst would have a field day...........

 

Yes, which is why our busiest moderator (writing reports all day) is a Ph.D. psychologist. He really is!

 

I wonder if her wrote his thesis on his experience here

[R-1150-RS]

Why are some people so offended by a simple difference of aesthetic opinion? In any event it's hard to imagine a more germane topic in a forum such as this so we might just have to get used to reading divergent views and resist suggesting that such opinions are the result of 'whining', should be restricted to a single thread, etc.

 

BTW, many of the 'negative' comments in this thread are obviously just tongue-in-cheek. The level of sensitivity is interesting, though.

 

I too agree that the level of sensitivity is 'interesting'.

 

People feel passionately about their bikes. But in many cases many have gone beyond 'a simple difference of aesthetic opinion.'

 

While I expect discussions of the appeal of styling, I am surprised how for so many it ends there, and no consideration given to how good the bikes really are, and where there is even implied mocking of those who had the bad taste as to buy them.....

 

I have noticed so many posters who reject outright the possibility of even considering purchasing these bikes, based solely on the highly subjective visual impressions they have gotten, many only from pre-release photos, rather than even consider the bikes based on its superiority over previous models in so many areas.

 

To me their priorities appear skewed and misplaced somewhat. When mere appearance seems to be the ultimate and primary criterion used to form their evaluations, I wonder if they really give the bikes 'fair' consideration.........

 

While appearance is a factor, a bike is so much more than just mere appearance. I am just so surprised how many hold something as subjective and arbitrary as a 'different' appearance above all else.

 

(It is not like the styling is 'that radical', after all!!

I could understand some of the objections if it were.

It seems that it is well within the styling realm of other bikes, but just 'different' from the previous models - so they are rejected outright!!

It seems a major objection from many is they look too Japanese............

There are an awfull lot of good-selling Japanese bikes out there............)

 

It is as if the critics don't sufficiently value, or even fully appreaciate, all the other performance and aesthetic factors that make motorcycles the wonderful vehicles that they are.........

 

I wonder how many of them would be the same ones to complain if the new bikes came looking much the same, and ironically asked why BMW didn't come out with something more 'fresher and innovative'!!!!

 

I guess it boils down to is, some people value appearances far more than substance..............

 

Gary

[beemerman2k]

Forgive me if this is a bit harsh. I won't be surprised if its removed; I don't mean to be mean. I'm just in total shock over the content of this thread -- total shock! So forgive me in advance. Thanks.

 

First of all, this thread was started by someone who does NOT like the looks of the RT. So if you don't like that fact, then YOU are the whiner on this thread. Go start a thread for those who DO like the looks. Then, if someone posts a contrary view, you can complain about "whiners". But here, in this thread, YOU are the whiner!

 

Second, to say that "BMW has moved on" and that we should passively accept what they give us is just not founded in reality. Look at the looks of their new cars: the fact that too many people voiced displeasure at the looks of the 7 and 5 series, the new 3 series will be given a much softer look. And they're going to smooth out the 7 series in its next iteration as well.

 

Finally, if you can be insulted because someone doesn't like the looks of your new car/bike, if you feel "pressured" to NOT express your honest opinion on this electronic forum, then you have all the emotional development of a 15 year old pimple faced high school kid!! Grow up! Be free! Say how you feel! You have my full support. You won't see me holding my tongue.

 

Buy what YOU like! You don't have to justify your purchase to me or to anybody else. I can promise you one thing, I did NOT consult other motorcyclists when I bought my RT, and I won't consult others to get approval on my K1200S. No matter what YOU think about that bike, I'm getting one! You can call it ugly, slow, fast, heavy, whatever. It won't help/hurt my feelings or opinion of the bike, of you, or of me in the slightest.

[beemerman2k]

BTW, although my post says its in response to R-1150-RS, I am not directing this at any one person, only trying to address attitudes. Second, I sincerely apologize for labeling anyone's emotional development and comparing it to a teenager. I guess this is why we should read our emails over 3 times before we send them because in the heat of our emotions we can say things we later regret. I already regret that statement.

 

** So before the entire community, I was wrong and hypocritical to say that **

 

Please accept my apology if I have slighted anyone by that statement.

[David]

I sincerely apologize for labeling anyone's emotional development and comparing it to a teenager.

 

The only really pissed off people now are all the teenagers who've been compared to whining old BMW riders who used to think they had an opinion.

[BamaRider]

Dang, beemer scolded us good, but he made a good point. It's a fact, I didn't consult a soul when I purchased my bikes.

 

Guy

[MG37221]

The only really pissed off people now are all the teenagers who've been compared to whining old BMW riders who used to think they had an opinion.

 

That is the funniest thing I've read in days! LOL David.

[R-1150-RS]

Forgive me if this is a bit harsh.

...........etc. etc...........

 

While you clarified that "although my post says its in response to R-1150-RS, I am not directing this at any one person", it is pretty clear that it was targeted at the entire group, of which I am a member.

 

So, I will take the liberty to respond as the unofficial spokesman.

 

You have chosen to post 'anti-BMW' sentiments on a 'pro-BMW site', then take issue with those who chose to defend the bikes........

 

You think you should be immune to being called on this criticism simply because this was the topic of the thread?????

 

You even labelled 'the group' as having - "all the emotional development of a 15 year old pimple faced high school kid!"

 

Frankly, good-natured discussions of the pros and cons of our brand are, if anything, encouraged on this site.

 

But I believe that not only is personal criticism something our site owner justifiably discourages, I also think that once a poster has to divert the discussion from the topic at hand and rely on that tactic, then he really should evaluate the strength of his original position to stand on its own, without relying on such tactics to make his point.

 

No one is telling anyone how they should or should not determine for themselves the merits of any particular bike. But that doesn’t mean we cannot also voice our opinions and list our criteria too, as to what we value and why we justify our choices……….

 

Gary

[beemerman2k]

Go back and reread what I wrote because you seem to be making my argument for me. I said:

 

"Finally, if you can be INSULTED because someone doesn't like the looks of your new car/bike..."

 

I'm lobbying for free and open discussion! I'm saying speak and let speak! But I am also saying that if you are the type to get INSULTED because someone doesn't like your choice of vehicle, that strikes me as being "particularly immature" -- there, that's a better way to put it!

 

Besides, who said this is a PRO BMW site?! I thought it was just a BMW site where we could discuss all matters BMW positive and/or negative.

[R-1150-RS]

Go back and reread what I wrote because you seem to be making my argument for me. I said:

 

"Finally, if you can be INSULTED because someone doesn't like the looks of your new car/bike..."

 

I'm lobbying for free and open discussion! I'm saying speak and let speak! But I am also saying that if you are the type to get INSULTED because someone doesn't like your choice of vehicle, that strikes me as being "particularly immature" -- there, that's a better way to put it!

It seems you cannot discuss this, or let others voice their views, without you resorting to using insults..................

 

Gary

[David]

It seems you cannot discuss this, or let others voice their views, without you resorting to using insults..................

 

Read his statements again, please. There's nothing at all insulting about his arguments.