Transmission noise

[Roy in SC]

Greetings all.  Happy Holidays.  My 2006 R1200RT is approaching 67,000 miles.  Other than the Final Drive issue, it has behaved very well until recently.  When idling in neutral, I hear what sounds like either the input shaft, input shaft bearing, throw out bearing, or clutch splines creating a rumbling noise.  When pull in the clutch lever, the noise stops.  I did a search on the forums, and saw many issues with earlier models, but little on the R1200RT's.  Is this a common occurrence for this model, and if so, what is the most likely culprit?  Thanks

[Rougarou]

This racket:

 

 

If so, source a used tranny.

[GordonB]

Is it louder when cold and quiets down a bit as it warms up? My CamHead did, and I figured I'd just ride local til it blew. And it did.

Got a used tranny replacement. One thing I didn't do that I should have is drain and inspect tranny fluid for metal shavings. We inspected when we goti it to  the shop. OMG what a mess! An internal bearing had failed and blew.

[Roy in SC]

The noise stays pretty consistent, warm or cold.  I change the trans oil every 6000 miles along with the Final Drive.  Engine oil gets changed at 3000.

I did not see any shavings last change but that is a good thought.  Is there a Pilot Bearing in the flywheel?

 

[dirtrider]

2 hours ago, Roy in SC said:

The noise stays pretty consistent, warm or cold.  I change the trans oil every 6000 miles along with the Final Drive.  Engine oil gets changed at 3000.

I did not see any shavings last change but that is a good thought.  Is there a Pilot Bearing in the flywheel?

 

Evening Roy

 

You might not see any shavings or debris as most of the transmission bearings in your trans are sealed.

 

Can you record the noise as it might be a normal neutral gear rattle/whirr as your 1200 trans is a constant mesh so all the gears & all except the  output shaft spin all the time that the engine is running in neutral with the clutch engaged.  

 

Has the noise always been there, or has noise just started, or is it getting worse?  

[Roy in SC]

I tried to record the noise, but seemed to get more outside feedback than I wanted.  I did listen to the video posted by Rougarou.

This is exactly what I am hearing out of this transmission.  When I took it out of the garage to try to record the noise, I did notice that the rattling occurs when disengaging the clutch when starting out own first gear as well.  I will drain the transmission and see what might be floating around in there.  DR says the bearings are sealed, but 90w is cheap so it is worth a look.  I will keep the group posted.  On a more positive note, the 1983 R100RS performed flawlessly on its maiden voyage last week after rebuilding the master cylinders front and rear, calipers front and rear, fixing a short in the wiring harness and replacing the instrument lighting with the KatDash product.  

[GordonB]

While the bearings are sealed one of mine failed and blew apart (we cracked the case to inspect) after replacement. Rare.

[Roy in SC]

I just drained the trans fluid and it looks fine.

But the noise is still there after refilling trans.

I guess it it time to go shopping.  Disturbing.

[Roy in SC]

I went back out and created a video of the noise.  This time I was able to record what I was hearing.

For your listening pleasure.  

[Roy in SC]

Gordon

 

I just looked at a 2014 R1200RT that clunked loudly when being shifted into gear.   It was also very difficult to upshift or downshift.  Digging through the various forms lead me to a different post of yours where you stated you were taking your bike to the dealership.  That is my next step.  I am going to have them listen to the bike while I mentally prepare for the teardown and either rebuild or replacement of the transmission.  I guess I needed a new hobby this winter.  Good thing I have spare bikes to ride but disturbing nonetheless.

[Roy in SC]

Following up after the visit to Touring Sport in Greenville, SC.  They had the same thoughts that I did, which are bearings.

I contacted Tom Cutter of Rubber Chicken Racing, and will be setting up a call with him to discuss this issue as well as letting me know what I should look for.  Here is an excerpt from my email with Tom.

 

"I have rebuilt a lot of the six-speed gearboxes from the 2005-2008 R1200 series. Most had bearing failures that led to shift fork damage."

[Rougarou]

8 minutes ago, Roy in SC said:

Following up after the visit to Touring Sport in Greenville, SC.  They had the same thoughts that I did, which are bearings.

I contacted Tom Cutter of Rubber Chicken Racing, and will be setting up a call with him to discuss this issue as well as letting me know what I should look for.  Here is an excerpt from my email with Tom.

 

"I have rebuilt a lot of the six-speed gearboxes from the 2005-2008 R1200 series. Most had bearing failures that led to shift fork damage."

 

Be careful if you spend the $3k +/- to rebuild, if you go that route.  My rebuild lasted just beyond the shops warranty.  I'd highly suggest sourcing a used tranny.  Two BMW dealer shops (Greensboro and Durham) recommended used tranny, yet, I went with a rebuild,.....that was a $6k mess up after all said and done.

[Roy in SC]

Thanks, that is good to know.  The projected cost of the rebuild is one of the questions I will have for Tom Cutter.  A topic of conversation at the dealer was the value of the motorcycle as is.  Very low as you might expect being a 2006.  In the back on my mind, I am considering selling it as is which may save me a lot of time and money.   The teardown required to get the transmission out and putting a used transmission back in is not appealing.  If I did go that route, I would sell the motorcycle regardless.  

[Rougarou]

Ya, I thought about cost of rebuild or buying another.  Even with the rebuild and used tranny, it was still much cheaper than getting a new bike.  

 

Here's what it looked like at the first shop I took it to for the rebuild,......I shoulda listened to the dealers when they told me to get a used one.

[Roy in SC]

I am going to disassemble the bike this weekend and open up the transmission.  According to Tom Cutter, the bearings are suspect which can lead to bent shift forks.  My transmission has no issues with shifting, only the rattling.  Hopefully I can catch it early enough so I only need to replace the bearings.  I did something similar on my old Mercedes SL last summer.  Input and output bearings were worn out.

[Rougarou]

1 hour ago, Roy in SC said:

I am going to disassemble the bike this weekend and open up the transmission.  According to Tom Cutter, the bearings are suspect which can lead to bent shift forks.  My transmission has no issues with shifting, only the rattling.  Hopefully I can catch it early enough so I only need to replace the bearings.  I did something similar on my old Mercedes SL last summer.  Input and output bearings were worn out.

 

Ya, I had no shifting issues either.