Wethead vs. Hexhead

[FEBUTT]

My last BMW was a 2010 R1200RT. I am looking at a new 2019 R1200RT. It appears to be a similar but substantially different bike. I'm curious what you guys think about making this transition. I loved to 2010 Boxer engine; it appears that has change a bit since then. Thanks.

[TEWKS]

If you're tall, you may feel a little cramped between the pegs and stock seat. I don't know for certain but just seems like there is a little less distance between those two points. Other than that, YOU'll LOVE IT! 

[Pappy35]

Biggest non-obvious change is the alternator is now buried INSIDE the engine and they changed to a wet clutch located behind the front engine cover. This is good and bad. Good because the clutch is much easier to service but bad because should the alternator fail you're looking at a $3,500 repair because the engine has to be removed and split in half to access it. I am pretty handy but I would never do this myself because it involves splitting the gearbox housing off and unlike the Camheads and earlier generations it's no longer a self-contained unit. You needs special tools, etc. It's a mess. Also good news is that I don't recall reading about anyone failing one of these recently so it would seem the newer units are better (there weren't many reports anyways but it's worth a mention here regardless).

 

There are other more minor changes like you have to navigate through a few menus to set the heated grip/seats on/off or change levels. The new ones are water cooled are a little heavier due to the added radiators and coolant. There are other minor differences but those are subjective as to whether they are better or worse than the earlier bikes.

 

Given a choice like yours I'd probably go with a '19 since you already owned a Camhead and I like the ShiftCam having ridden one at the rally. The Shiftcam uses a different cam chain and I found the valve train was very quiet as a result. The Wetheads always sounded to me like there were ball bearings clattering around inside the head whereas the Shiftcam had a Camhead-like "sewing-machine" quality to it that I liked very much. The low end torque is also just simply stunning. The thing pulls like a freight train at ridiculously low engine RPMs!

 

Very nice ride these new ones are! I'd buy one tomorrow if I was shopping but I would consider buying an extended warranty just in case as repairs can be outrageously expensive.

[RTinNC]

I made a similar change in 2016 when I swapped my 2006 RT for A 2016 RT.  Short reply is I LOVE IT!   While I did love my '06 RT what the 2016 brought to the table was waaaay better.   I love the increased power,  Shift Assist Pro,  Wonder While,  better handling and especially the 12K valve check intervals.   Also the simpler final drive service.   Leg room for me is not an issue although I thought it might be since I am 6'3" tall.   I do miss that the '06 was built like a tank compared to the 2016 and for me the '06 body work was easier to remove.  All that being said I would do it over again in a heartbeat!   The new LC RT is the best yet. 

[longjohn]

Smaller tank. Single horn instead of dual. It feels lighter. Improved dashboard readability. Yep the seat is lower but unless you have bad knees it shouldn’t be a deal breaker. More power. A slightly lower 2nd gear. Smaller harder hand grips but most use slip on grip puppies. Battery is behind a body panel instead of under seat. Clutch is more accessible but stator isn’t.

available shift assist and brake hill hold. Charge your phone on the fly with usb in small glove box. Different blinker switch set up.  No tranny oil. No TB sync. Push button fork lock at least with keyless fob. 

[AndyS]

14 hours ago, longjohn said:

Smaller tank.

 

However, a greater range. My Wethead is way more frugal than the previous bikes.

 

14 hours ago, longjohn said:

 Single horn instead of dual.

 

Yes that's a sad thing. I loved the dual horns of my 1150!

 

16 hours ago, FEBUTT said:

My last BMW was a 2010 R1200RT. I am looking at a new 2019 R1200RT. It appears to be a similar but substantially different bike. I'm curious what you guys think about making this transition. I loved to 2010 Boxer engine; it appears that has change a bit since then. Thanks.

 

The engine and gearbox of the later Wetheads are delightful. SO smooth and gutsy.

As for the handling. You will have to test ride and see for yourself. For me the Wethead handles fine. But nowhere near as amazing as people seem to feedback on the posts I have read. So much so that I have now tried many Wetheads thinking it must be mine, but nope. They all feel just the same. Handling good, but nothing I would rave over above other bikes I have owned. Certainly not as supple ride as my 1150 for sure.

 

I think overall, it is a very fine bike and a worthy successor to the Camhead.

[Paul De]

Sorry I can't speak directly to the hexhead experience, but maybe you find my comments helpful anyway,

 

The Wethead/Shifcam breaks from the evolution refinement approach from the Oilhead through Camhead and is a full on re-imaging of the boxer twin.  With that extensive of a blank page redesign it is almost like changing to a different brand.  The personality of the latest Boxer bikes is very different.

 

I jumped from an '99 Oilhead to '15 Wethead and found that the boxer became a fully modern m/c with none of a quirks of my Oilhead.  Handling moved from a touring-sport to a sport-tour focus even though BMW lists this bike as a light weight touring bike. It has quicker responsive steering, quicker revving engine and the power expected from a modern sport-touring M/C.  It hit all my punch list of "wish it were better" items from my Oilhead.

 

Save for the shock recall on the 2014 Wethead, this new platform seems to be avoiding fundamental design flaws particularly the drive train issues of some versions of the dry clutch drive train models. Now that some guys have wracked up big miles on the Wethead it is proving to be one of the most reliable Boxers in the last 30+ years. Some here comment how difficult/expensive it is to replace the alternator, but ask yourself this.  When have you had an alternator issue? When has any of your riding friends had an alternator issue? My '71, my '99 and now my '15 boxers never have had an alternator issue in the hundreds of thousands of mile of riding.  Just say'n!

 

I still really like my Oilhead for what it is, but it is like riding Dad's bike whereas my Wethead is truly not your father's boxer bike.   To sum up my Oilhead is a gentleman in a tuxedo and my Wethead is a rouge in a tuxedo.  On Friday night who would you rather hang out with?

[AndyS]

1 hour ago, Paul De said:

I jumped from an '99 Oilhead to '15 Wethead and found that the boxer became a fully modern m/c with none of a quirks of my Oilhead. 

Well, although I agree fully with the sentiment, it isn't without it's quirks (just like the Hexhead and Camheads).

For example more than a few of us have had the bike briefly pop into (and then back out of) limp mode occasionally.

 Also the other odd electronic glitch too - generally fixed by 'turning it off and then back on again'!

 

1 hour ago, Paul De said:

The personality of the latest Boxer bikes is very different.

Yes and very good it is too.

 

1 hour ago, Paul De said:

Some here comment how difficult/expensive it is to replace the alternator, but ask yourself this.  When have you had an alternator issue?

Absolutely agree here.

 

1 hour ago, Paul De said:

...on Friday night who would you rather hang out with?

Well, actually, my 1150. Why? She was VERY pretty. She was VERY comfortable. She was very forgiving. People always commented of her good looks. That doesn't happen so much with the new girl.

However, the new girl can do a LOT more than the older one. She doesn't get tired so quickly.

 

[dirtrider]

3 hours ago, Paul De said:

Some here comment how difficult/expensive it is to replace the alternator, but ask yourself this.  When have you had an alternator issue? When has any of your riding friends had an alternator issue? My '71, my '99 and now my '15 boxers never have had an alternator issue in the hundreds of thousands of mile of riding.  Just say'n!

 

 

Morning Paul

 

Yes, I have had a number of alternator failures in my motorcycle life. All have been internal constant-output alternators like the new BMW  wetheads use. Never failed an external (automotive type) BMW alternator myself but have seen a couple of external BMW motorcycle alternators  stop-charging  due to regulator issues. 

 

I have failed 2 internal alternators on my early BMW 800 bikes (very poor BMW stator cooling design) my good friend failed 3 internal alternators on just one BMW 800 bike, I failed an internal alternator on an old Goldwing that I had (lots & lots of early BMW 800 bike internal-alternator stator failures, Google it), also a pretty  good failure rate on the old  Honda boxer-engine shaft-drive bikes with constant charge internal alternators.

 

You really can't compare the old BMW external automotive type alternators to the new wethead  internal constant-output, oil drenched alternators as they work inside the engine, working in very hot engine oil, continually in contact with engine oil acids & additives, & run at almost 100% output all the time. (internal alternators can't use variable magnet  rotors like external alternators do so pretty well run at almost full output all the time)

 

BMW's past history with internal alternators was dismal on the early 800 bikes (later 800 bikes got an updated flywheel that did offer better oil flow cooling), but BMW never did update the 800 voltage regulator to a linear type  (those take some of the heat load off the stator). 

 

I hope BMW learned enough with the early 800 bike internal alternators (high number of failures) to add the learned improvement to the new wethead boxer bikes-- Time will tell as it takes time for oil related stator failures to show up, especially motorcycle storage with acidic oil in it.   

[Dave_in_TX]

My 2014 R1200GS now has 125K with the original alternator. That's 15k longer than my 2011 R1200RT went before needing a new clutch.

[longjohn]

13 hours ago, AndyS said:

 

However, a greater range. My Wethead is way more frugal than the previous bikes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

As for the handling. You will have to test ride and see for yourself. For me the Wethead handles fine. But nowhere near as amazing as people seem to feedback on the posts I have read. So much so that I have now tried many Wetheads thinking it must be mine, but nope. They all feel just the same. Handling good, but nothing I would rave over above other bikes I have owned. Certainly not as supple ride as my 1150 for sure.

 

 

The wet head has a greater range?  I can't say that stands out from my experience going from '05-'18.  However the handling, especially low speed handling, really stood out.  There is very little weight change, so there must have been a significant lowering of the COG, or something.

[Paul De]

10 hours ago, AndyS said:

 

12 hours ago, Paul De said:

...on Friday night who would you rather hang out with?

Well, actually, my 1150. Why? She was VERY pretty. She was VERY comfortable. She was very forgiving. People always commented of her good looks. That doesn't happen so much with the new girl.

However, the new girl can do a LOT more than the older one. She doesn't get tired so quickly.

 

Well you got me on that one.   As I have posted before, I prefer the bodacious lines of my '99RT than the Star Wars X-wing fighter lines of the '15+ RT, and I will admit I get more comments of nice bike with the '99RT VS the '15RT. My wife preferrs riding on the '99 better as well and while it may be the Russell Day Long saddle it is the quieter exhaust note as well...+1 for the Gentleman in a Tux!

 

8 hours ago, dirtrider said:

 

I hope BMW learned enough with the early 800 bike internal alternators (high number of failures) to add the learned improvement to the new wethead boxer bikes-- Time will tell as it takes time for oil related stator failures to show up, especially motorcycle storage with acidic oil in it.   

Me too but I'm biased :{)  I admit that when it happens to you, failure rates mean nuth'n.  We also have to recognize that the K5x motor & drive train have been out in the wild since 2013 and the miles have been piling up without big numbers of the issues that we are biting our nails over. I don't know if 6 years is enough to show the alternator on the Waterhead is a reliable design, but I am not loosing sleep on it.

[Paul De]

To be clear, I prefer the new Wethead overall and particularly when I'm riding frisky I really appreciate the effort to improve mass centralization VS my Oilhead.

[Bernie]

I do get better fuel mileage with the WetHead, compared to the HexHead.

But I do have trouble getting comfortable with the fuel capacity.

 

[hopz]

Just one data point...

 

I went to the '14 Wethead and traded the '05 Hexhead to get it.

 

The '14 was more sophisticated, advanced communication and navigation and, and, and not nearly as much fun.

 

There is an old saying... what you see depends on where you stand... if you like being involved, mechanically, with your hobby (read that as your bike) you will find the Hexheads more fulfilling. You can actually access things without dismantling your bike.... Tupperware On, tupperware Off = easy. You can repair, maintain and enjoy things. I found the Wethead to be a nice "package" but it was nicely wrapped in all manner of panels and fittings, some of which are easy to break. The bike ran well and fast, and the electronics were fun, but then again I had nice things like Spot Tracker, and Audio Bt'd to my helmet via Sena, and GPS receiver on the handlebar... on the Hex

 

As with most things... Your Actual Mileage May Vary.... depending upon what you like. The hardware is m

early a means to an end.... think about what you like and value.... there is no right answer except via that.

 

 

Edited November 16, 2019 by hopz
improvement

[LAF]

16 minutes ago, hopz said:

Just one data point...

 

I went to the '14 Wethead and traded the '05 Hexhead to get it.

 

The '14 was more sophisticated, advanced communication and navigation and, and, and not nearly as much fun.

 

There is an old saying... what you see depends on where you stand... if you like being involved, mechanically, with your hobby (read that as your bike) you will find the Hexheads more fulfilling. You can actually access things without dismantling your bike.... Tupperware On, tupperware Off = easy. You can repair, maintain and enjoy things. I found the Wethead to be a nice "package" but it was nicely wrapped in all manner of panels and fittings, some of which are easy to break. The bike ran well and fast, and the electronics were fun, but then again I had nice things like Spot Tracker, and Audio Bt'd to my helmet via Sena, and GPS receiver on the handlebar... on the Hex

 

As with most things... Your Actual Mileage May Vary.... depending upon what you like. The hardware is m

early a means to an end.... think about what you like and value.... there is no right answer except via that.

 

 

And this is why I fell in love with a low GS and let a very fine example of a 15 RT go. 

 

I was not looking for a bike at all I very fine and happy on the RT. 

 

Then a friend totals his GS in front of me and I go through the whole process with him.  From finding a telephone pole to bend the bars back enough to get him home with me escorting him.  Then the haul to the shop for estimate which was a total.  Then shopping for a new bike.  BIG mistake for me.  So he is after a White bike me nothing I swear.  Well first enticement a used 16 Triple Black spoke wheels with like 2K on it what a pretty bike.  Then I sit on a low 17.5 GS Black with cast wheels.  Well it was over.  I got great financing from BMW for it being a leftover, a free NAV VI, a smoking deal on price, great cost of and free install of accessories.  And because they ran out of 17 parts my 17.5 has 18 body work changes which is really very minor. Of course I took a financial bath on trading a 15 RT 3 years in on a 5 year contract. 

 

The appeal to me and why it made me fall in love with motorcycling again is it is still that wonderful boxer motor but "naked".  I was tired of flimsy tabs and stripping a bike to even see, let alone do anything to the motor.  Well the air filter is still a bitch but still easier to do on a GS then a RT. 

 

I wear Stitch clothing and have heated gear so a heated seat and some plastic fairings I really dont miss in the winter.  I could never feel the heated seat anyway.  A Aeroflow windshield some of the most wonderful MAM hand guards that protect me from cold and rain and can be run open in summer and my gear and I am good.   I do miss the windshield to clear my face shield in rain.  I could raise and lower it with a button on the RT, now I have to stand up a bit to have it clean my face shield but I work through it.

 

The other thing is I wanted the new transmission of the 17 and on.  Everyone plays it off but it is and was a big upgrade and no matter what anyone says it was pure BLACK and WHITE on the 15 RT and the 17.5 GS.  It was HUGE!  Now I have been told I had a bad example of a 15 RT and that may have been but I could click the 15 no issues.  It would snick into every gear including first most of the time.  Thing is I had to concentrate on doing that it was subconscious but was there.  The GS nope just shift it, and yes I may get a bad 1st now and again but never like the 15RT.

 

The other wonderful thing is I run with just a Givi 42L Trekker top case on and that is it.  It saves a lot of weight and keeps the bike as skinny as it can be with no side cases.  Now when I travel I use the side cases and a Otlieb Dry Bag on the rear seat so I loose no and probably gain hauling capacity when I need it.  I run strait street tires on it and have had it on well cared for fire roads and hard packed gravel with none of the pucker I used to get on the RT which seemed to always happen.

 

As far as handling I can say I have had this bike leaned over more then I did on the RT but a lot of that is no bags and it is pretty flickable to me.  And it just feels better going through turns to me then the RT did.  Not sure if it is less Tupperware gives me a better perception or what.  I just know I still love the GS every time I get a leg over it.  And I ALWAYS look back at it when walking away after parking it.

 

So there are other boxer flavors out there but the only one I matched up to was the GS or GSA but I did not need or want that gas range.  Wasted on me as I never have had to hunt for gas but I was never at the top of a Bolivian Mountain Range wondering where the next town may be.

 

Point is ride a few BMW bikes and try them out.  Me, I found my "last" bike when I was not looking.

[RTinNC]

11 hours ago, hopz said:

Just one data point...

 

I went to the '14 Wethead and traded the '05 Hexhead to get it.

 

The '14 was more sophisticated, advanced communication and navigation and, and, and not nearly as much fun.

 

There is an old saying... what you see depends on where you stand... if you like being involved, mechanically, with your hobby (read that as your bike) you will find the Hexheads more fulfilling. You can actually access things without dismantling your bike.... Tupperware On, tupperware Off = easy. You can repair, maintain and enjoy things. I found the Wethead to be a nice "package" but it was nicely wrapped in all manner of panels and fittings, some of which are easy to break. The bike ran well and fast, and the electronics were fun, but then again I had nice things like Spot Tracker, and Audio Bt'd to my helmet via Sena, and GPS receiver on the handlebar... on the Hex

 

As with most things... Your Actual Mileage May Vary.... depending upon what you like. The hardware is m

early a means to an end.... think about what you like and value.... there is no right answer except via that.

 

 

 

Have to agree with the Wethead not being as easy to remove the Tupperware on as my Hexhead.  But that being said the only time I ever need to remove it now is for air filter.   I can still do all the fluid changes and the Wethead now as a real fill/drain plug setup for the final drive.   The Wethead also FINALLY has 12,000 intervals for the major stuff reducing coast and aggravation.   While I miss the "built like a tank" aspect of my '06 and the ease of removing the body work I think the benefits of the Wethead make is way more fun.  Better handling,  more responsive power and oh that Shift Assist. 

[lkchris]

Hexhead = 2005-2009 R1200

 

Camhead = 2010-2013 R1200

 

GS maybe a year earlier

[Skywagon]

On 11/16/2019 at 7:03 PM, RTinNC said:

Wethead not being as easy to remove the Tupperware on as my Hexhead

 

I never owned a hex, but the wet is loads easier to remove than my oil rt.  I really don't find it hard at all.  If you aren't familiar with how to remove them...then yes you can break the tabs.  I'm not wild about that cheap design. I can get all the panels off in very short order.  I can get all the sides off in less than 5 minutes including the lowers.  It has about 80% less screws than my 1150 had.

[Ken S]

On 12/10/2019 at 9:39 AM, Skywagon said:

If you aren't familiar with how to remove them...then yes you can break the tabs.

Can you provide details about removing the panels and not breaking the tabs?  Or is there a service CD that gives that info?

Thx

[PadG]

8 hours ago, Ken S said:

Can you provide details about removing the panels and not breaking the tabs?  Or is there a service CD that gives that info?

Thx

Needless to say, one have to be very careful not to force things!  My procedure is to remove the two screws up front, and then using one hand (left for the right-side panel) hold the top of the panel where the tabs are located, very firmly against any movements, and use my other hand to hold the lower part of the panel and flex the 2 pins out of their rubber grommets.  When the panel is free, and held on by just the two tabs, then it's a matter of very gently working the tabs out of their slots.  Now, my '15 does NOT have the extra velcro pads that BMW added later, presumably to "fix" the broken tabs issue, and so I can't tell you how to disengage them, but I suspect that the method that I described above would also cover it.

[migrant]

 

[Skywagon]

The key is knowing where the tabs are and how they come out. Big side panels come t out vertically in an upward motion.  Take the screws out...watch for the little nylon washers as they are almost invisible.  then basically push straight up from below.  Do not pull them horizontally at all until the tabs clear.  Take a look at the videos and a parts picture and it should come clear.  If not holler back.  There is a guy who does great maintenance video's who curses like a sailor.  I can't remember his name....Hope someone on here can find his videos.  I think they are very good and have helped me a lot.

 

[RTinNC]

On 12/10/2019 at 1:39 PM, Skywagon said:

 

I never owned a hex, but the wet is loads easier to remove than my oil rt.  I really don't find it hard at all.  If you aren't familiar with how to remove them...then yes you can break the tabs.  I'm not wild about that cheap design. I can get all the panels off in very short order.  I can get all the sides off in less than 5 minutes including the lowers.  It has about 80% less screws than my 1150 had.

I would agree the wet head is easier than the 1100/1150 generations.   But for me the 1200 Hex/Cam heads were a breeze.  But as I noted now you only need to remove the panels to change the air filter and that's every 12K.