oil change procedure

[Schnell]

So its cold up here and I'm dieing to work on my bike. I've got it in the basement warm and all and I would like to change the transmisson and differential fluid. I even went out and bought synthetic stuff. So, the directions I've read here tell me the bike needs to be ridden to get it up to temp. Since that's out of the question should I wait until spring or skip that part and change it anyways?

 

Ken

[keithb]

Can you take the bike outside? If so, take it outside and run it till it hits 4/5 bars on the temperature meter and bring it back inside. Then change the fluids. You did not say how many miles you have on your bike. Most people I know don't put in the synthetic stuff unless the bike has at least 15K miles on it.

[Wooster]

Schnell,

 

Wait til Spring. In order to heat up trans & rear end fluid (so as to facilitate their prompt and complete flow out the drains), you must ride the bike. Getting so many "bars" on the oil temp gauge does nothing to rear end fluid temp and little to trans fluid temp.

 

Wooster, Member of Well Mannered Motorcyclists.

 

Once you've seen one shopping center, you've seen a mall.

[Tom R.]

What Wooster said!

[Bob Palin]

Can you take the bike outside? If so, take it outside and run it till it hits 4/5 bars on the temperature meter and bring it back inside. Then change the fluids. You did not say how many miles you have on your bike. Most people I know don't put in the synthetic stuff unless the bike has at least 15K miles on it.

How will that warm up the transmission and final drive oil? (Read his post again!)

[Schnell]

Ok.... I'll take a nap & wait till spring.

 

Thanks Guys

[Ken H.]

Wait til Spring. In order to heat up trans & rear end fluid (so as to facilitate their prompt and complete flow out the drains),

I disagree. It may drain slower, and you may want to let it drip overnight or something, but it will drain never-the-less. Gravity is gravity.

[ShovelStrokeEd]

Well, yes and no. Drain it will, but, the surfaces within will retain a much thicker film of old, contaminated oil. If this is the first drain after the 600 mile inspection, I would want to get all that I could out of there. Nothing to stop the owner from placing a small fan driven heater(s) in proximity to the rear drive and transmission and letting them cook for a couple of hours, tupperware off, of course. A turn or two of the rear wheel while so doing will help to distribute the heated oil in both transmission and rear drive and better aid the drain process. Might even consider some of that heat tape used to keep pipes from freezing.

[No_Twilight]

I agree with Ed, a little fan driven "under desk" heater will do just fine. THese fluids never really get hot. You could alsotry spinning the rear wheel with it on the centerstand while you warm it up. Don't tell your insurance agency you read it here though!!!

 

--Jerry

[DiggerJim]

I did an oil change on mine this weekend. Not too bad coming out (rode the bike to warm it up) but putting it back in was a trick --- ever see how slowly 15-50 pours at 20 degrees? Finally had to bring the bottles in the house, sit them in a hot water bath and bring them out 1 at a time to fill the bike.

 

Jim

[Ken H.]

Well another thing I thing we forget about in this 'get it all out' fanaticism, is the percentages thing. So I only get 99.7% out when drained cold vs. hotter. It's still a pretty darn good removal of the majority of "bad stuff," whatever it may be, and the remaining, re-diluted in the new "good stuff," has a minimal impact on the circumstances going forward.

[keithb]

Messed up. I was thinking oil.

[RFW]

So its cold up here and I'm dieing to work on my bike. I've got it in the basement warm and all and I would like to change the transmisson and differential fluid. I even went out and bought synthetic stuff. So, the directions I've read here tell me the bike needs to be ridden to get it up to temp. Since that's out of the question should I wait until spring or skip that part and change it anyways?

There is no need at all to get the oil up to temperature. All that the higher temperature will do is make the oil less viscous, so it drains out faster.

 

If the oil is cold, then just let it drain for 1 to 2 hours. In the end, it will all come out; it just takes a little longer.

 

Bob.

[RFW]

Wait til Spring. In order to heat up trans & rear end fluid (so as to facilitate their prompt and complete flow out the drains),

I disagree. It may drain slower, and you may want to let it drip overnight or something, but it will drain never-the-less. Gravity is gravity.

EXACTLY!

 

Bob.

[Pilgrim]

I did an oil change on mine this weekend. Not too bad coming out (rode the bike to warm it up) but putting it back in was a trick --- ever see how slowly 15-50 pours at 20 degrees? Finally had to bring the bottles in the house, sit them in a hot water bath and bring them out 1 at a time to fill the bike.

 

Jim

 

Nuke 'em for a couple minutes each and they'll pour just fine.

Pilgrim

[Blue Beemer Dude]

I did an oil change on mine this weekend. Not too bad coming out (rode the bike to warm it up) but putting it back in was a trick --- ever see how slowly 15-50 pours at 20 degrees? Finally had to bring the bottles in the house, sit them in a hot water bath and bring them out 1 at a time to fill the bike.

 

Jim

 

Nuke 'em for a couple minutes each and they'll pour just fine.

Pilgrim

 

Maybe one could disassemble your home microwave so that it can modified (ala "Mythbusters") to heat up the differential in your motorcycle in the middle of Nebraska winters so that bored snow-bound enthusiasts can perform neccesary maintenance?

 

Just don't stand near the thing while it's working.

 

Me, I live in the South. It should be in the seventies here later in the week. I'm taking the afternoons off.

 

Michael

[RFW]

Nuke 'em for a couple minutes each and they'll pour just fine.

Pilgrim

I'm wondering if you have you actually TRIED this? It would be suprising if it really works, or let's just say that if it DOES work, it is by sheer luck.

 

Microwave ovens are designed to run at 2.45 GHz, because this is one of the molecular resonance frequencies of the water molecule. They work by causing the water in foods to heat by molecular "friction". This is why only the food gets hot. Other substances have different molecular resonance frequencies, and are not excited into resonance at the microwave oven frequency, and thus do not get heated.

 

So your comment peaked my interest since oil ought NOT to get hot in a microwave. I'm curious to hear if it actually does.

 

Bob.

[DiggerJim]

Nuke 'em for a couple minutes each and they'll pour just fine.

Pilgrim

I'm wondering if you have you actually TRIED this? It would be suprising if it really works, or let's just say that if it DOES work, it is by sheer luck.

 

Microwave ovens are designed to run at 2.45 GHz, because this is one of the molecular resonance frequencies of the water molecule. They work by causing the water in foods to heat by molecular "friction". This is why only the food gets hot. Other substances have different molecular resonance frequencies, and are not excited into resonance at the microwave oven frequency, and thus do not get heated.

 

So your comment peaked my interest since oil ought NOT to get hot in a microwave. I'm curious to hear if it actually does.

 

Bob.

Okay, you just knew someone would have to try it. Since I went to the trouble of the water bath (I had thought about the microwave but figured it might make a mess), I just ran the nuke-em experiment.

 

1/4 cup Mobil-1 15W-50, room temp

1/2 cup small pyrex bowl

1350 watt microwave oven

 

Placed oil in bowl, bowl in oven, heat on high for 1 minute. Opened it up and smelled warm oil. Warmer then skin temp but not extremely hot -- in fact the bowl was hot to the touch.

 

Back in the oven for another minute. This time the oil was noticeably warm and bowl was hot. Felt the floor of the oven and it was hot in an 8" diameter circle (125F). Bowl (2" diameter) was 140F and oil was 122F.

 

What does that tell me except that I've got the vague smell of oil in the kitchen that I hope dissapates before my wife gets up in the morning...and an oily wad of paper towels in the wastebasket.

 

Jim

[Wooster]

What does that tell me except that I've got the vague smell of oil in the kitchen that I hope dissapates before my wife gets up in the morning...and an oily wad of paper towels in the wastebasket.

 

Jim

 

Tell the Mrs that Madame Pasteur got tired of all that spoiled milk and Monsieur Curie had had it with glow in the dark after effects of wife's work. Such is the price of knowledge.

 

As to benefits of draining lubricant (motor and/or gear oil) while hot, I assume any dirt, metal bits and flakes are more likely to be "carried along in the flood". So, I'll certainly remove fill plug, after heating fluids via recommended (recall OP statement) ride, then off w/drain plug. In this way a more powerful flushing action occurs, at least more so than Ken's recommended gradual gravity drip.

 

Wooster w/o oily microwave oven

 

Deja Moo = Feeling you've heard this bull before

[Ken H.]

I assume any dirt, metal bits and flakes are more likely to be "carried along in the flood". So, I'll certainly remove fill plug, after heating fluids via recommended (recall OP statement) ride, then off w/drain plug.

All right, but just to continue the debate for awhile (isn't that what this board is famous for? ), all those metal bits and flakes are heavier than oil, right? Then over time they will sink to the bottom of the oil pan as the bike sits, right? Then doesn't it more seem to reason that one is more likely to get more of all those metal bits and flakes out if you drain the bike when it hasn't been recently run, than right after it has and they are floating all over the place stuck to things all over the inside of the engine?

 

Although in reality capturing all those metal bits and flakes is what a filter is for, and if removing them is depended upon drain procedure, there are bigger problems!

 

But I think the same principle still applies for suspended contaminants beyond what the filter is designed to capture. Let it all settle to the bottom overnight, then drain cold.

[Bob Palin]

all those metal bits and flakes are heavier than oil, right? Then over time they will sink to the bottom of the oil pan as the bike sits, right? Then doesn't it more seem to reason that one is more likely to get more of all those metal bits and flakes out if you drain the bike when it hasn't been recently run, than right after it has and they are floating all over the place stuck to things all over the inside of the engine?

 

Although in reality capturing all those metal bits and flakes is what a filter is for, and if removing them is depended upon drain procedure, there are bigger problems!

 

But I think the same principle still applies for suspended contaminants beyond what the filter is designed to capture. Let it all settle to the bottom overnight, then drain cold.

 

OP: "I would like to change the transmisson and differential fluid"

 

Focus man, focus!

[Wooster]

Olla Ken,

 

In the ocean of critical issues, this topic lies at shallow end of the pool; however, recall thread began with OP quoting instructions, evidently on gear oil bottle, to ride bike prior to draining. My initial response was mostly to commmunicate the fact that idling engine wouldn't heat rear end and wouldn't do much to heat trans.

I change fluid in November, prior to putting away RT for the winter and make a point of draining immediately after a ride for reason stated in prior posts. FWIW, this "pre fluid drain" ride is w/o saddle bags and, interestingly, my R11RT's acceleration is noticably enhanced w/o bags (no bags so rear drive fill & drain caps are easily accessed); this improvement is most evident above 100 mph. I don't make habit of triple digit speeds but "last ride of the year" is typically atypical.

 

Wooster w/o bling

 

When I first turned grey, I thought I'd dye.

[Ken H.]

OP: "I would like to change the transmisson and differential fluid"

 

Focus man, focus!

Ah, um, hum, well... you're transmission and differential don't have filters???

 

 

Sorry about that rant then. Never mind.