Doug_Baliko Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 Seeing '14 wet head RT's for 16K in the classifies doesn't look good for the value of used RT's. And with dealers still having a lot of '14 buy backs in stock around the country as the '16's start hitting showrooms, pre owned RT values most likely rate to stay stagnant or drop more. Doug Link to comment
Drakas Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 There's just too many of them around. http://nashville.craigslist.org/mcy/5105498736.html Why spend two times this much for a newer used, or three times this much for a new bike when this bike is just getting the bugs out and has lots of farkles? I see em like this all day. Link to comment
moshe_levy Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 Don't complain too much. My HD, which I have $20k invested in, isn't getting too many nibbles at $12k now. It's only 10 months old! -MKL Link to comment
mickeym3 Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 Doug, it's my RT you referenced and it's indeed painful to see the used Wethead market so weak, especially since they are such great bikes. If mine doesn't sell for 16K then I can easily rationalize getting a 650-800 dual sport (gosh, the Triumph XCX is tempting) and having the best of all worlds. Knew the Harley guys took beatings on theirs but geez.... Link to comment
greiffster Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 If mine doesn't sell for 16K then I can easily rationalize getting a 650-800 dual sport :grin: I think you just made my day. Link to comment
tallman Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 This is nothing new. Happens all the time. With very few exceptions, never buy a car/bike w/out expecting 25-33% depreciation immediately, more w/some models or circumstances. Years ago we were selling R 1100 S modela @$14,000. Sold one to a good friend. Shortly afterward, BMW came out w/huge rebate/discount ($3K) knocking the bottom out of used R 1100 S's. WE knew nothing of the corporate policy which happened a few months after I wsold the bike, FElt awful for my friend. Bottom line, they depreciate. Go back and check the RT MSRP for about ten years after the R 100 model came out. They stayed very close for a long time (memory, ball park $16,400) and don't remember any one complaining then. Like Moshe, pointed out, not exclusive to BMW or HD. We had to give away traded bikes that didn't move well in our market. So sometimes folks were not happy w/trade in offers. I've seen HD's people bought/added $$$$$$ to modify and then tried to sell ayear later and ended upside down $15,000. Buy 'em, ride 'em, keep 'em or sell 'em, but enjoy them. Best wishes. Link to comment
APDDave Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 If you think the used WC bikes are going for cheep, you should look at what you can get for a used oil cooled bike. I traded in my 2013 90th anniversary model with only 6,000 miles on it in perfect condition. The dealer already had 7 others used for sale and really did not even want mine. I took a huge loss to upgrade to the WC 2015. I plan on keeping this one for a while and getting my money's worth out of it. Link to comment
Guest Kakugo Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Perhaps you should send your used Wethead RT's here. 2014 buybacks go for the same price as new minus VAT, perhaps even a tiny bit more. Dealers here just cannot keep up with Wethead orders (especially GS-A) because BMW is giving the US and Australia top priority in deliveries and leaving us on the hook. I've been toying with buying a Wethead GS-A but was driven off by price (not a peso off even if buying cash and with no trade in) and especially delivery times. Link to comment
Bud Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Don't complain too much. My HD, which I have $20k invested in, isn't getting too many nibbles at $12k now. It's only 10 months old! -MKL I have a friend who just bought a 14 F 700 GS and will be selling his 14 Street Glide. Knowing nothing about the used HD market, I hope he does better than that. Dunno.......... I do know I'm very happy with the 09 GS that Foot sold me a few weeks back. Link to comment
MikeB60 Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Don't complain too much. My HD, which I have $20k invested in, isn't getting too many nibbles at $12k now. It's only 10 months old! -MKL I have a friend who just bought a 14 F 700 GS and will be selling his 14 Street Glide. Knowing nothing about the used HD market, I hope he does better than that. Dunno.......... I do know I'm very happy with the 09 GS that Foot sold me a few weeks back. The switchback is on of Harley's better efforts but they don't sell. The sales manager at my local dealer was griping about the two that Harley sent him that have been on the floor for six months just last weekend. The Street Glide is Harley's biggest seller, I suspect your friend wont have any trouble getting rid of it. Link to comment
CVA-42 Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 No real surprises. As stated, they all depreciate. At different rates, maybe, but they all do it and it's all unacceptable to me. I've never bought a new bike or car and I've never traded one in to a dealer for that matter. But I'm grateful to those who buy new bikes; farkle them out; ride them several years; and then sell them with ten or twelve thousand miles. Sure -- taking a chance on out-of-warranty repairs but (to me) that is far outweighed by the savings. Plus, I enjoy the thrill of the hunt and the art of the deal, as they say. There is very little of both inside a dealership. Link to comment
Drakas Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 No real surprises. As stated, they all depreciate. At different rates, maybe, but they all do it and it's all unacceptable to me. I've never bought a new bike or car and I've never traded one in to a dealer for that matter. But I'm grateful to those who buy new bikes; farkle them out; ride them several years; and then sell them with ten or twelve thousand miles. Sure -- taking a chance on out-of-warranty repairs but (to me) that is far outweighed by the savings. Plus, I enjoy the thrill of the hunt and the art of the deal, as they say. There is very little of both inside a dealership. This is how I ended up with a '93 K75S, a '99 R1100RT-P, tags, insurance, gear, tires, shocks, fluids/filters, etc, and not $5000 in the whole batch. It really pisses off the HD guys who have $5000 front wheel/tires. Link to comment
Stan Walker Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 It really pisses off the HD guys who have $5000 front wheel/tires. Why? I don't understand getting upset over someone else's choice on what to spend their money on. Can you explain this to me? Stan Link to comment
Drakas Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 It really pisses off the HD guys who have $5000 front wheel/tires. Why? I don't understand getting upset over someone else's choice on what to spend their money on. Can you explain this to me? Stan Not really. I just know that when I tell some guy on a ripped out bagger that I have $2500 in each bike as she sits, he grinds his teeth and walks away. I keep one bike for a loaner, and lots of times the rider is my BiL, who is sales manager at Rocket Harley. He'll laugh and say, that guy has more than that in his front wheel, or chrome, or wtf-ever farkles they bought. The best is when its on a Sportster, because the rule still stands here: NEVER PAY MORE THAN $2500 for a Sportster, because that's all you're gonna get out of it. Link to comment
realshelby Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Back to RT values...I paid $19,990 for my bike. Plus standard taxes and dealer documentary fee ( which is profit for them, but was not all that much). I then added the topcase, and my bike is not one with shift assist, alarm and so forth. Used ones selling for 15-16K are actually in the better than I would expect range! Your first year hit is always the biggest. I don't see all that many for sale, but I am not actively looking either. I think if this model continues to be free of some of the issues the older generation RT's had and develops no new one, it will keep a good resale value. Link to comment
HH0 Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 I have a 98 1100rt that I paid $2500 last year and a 1150rt with 23K miles that I bought this summer for $4K because it was an excellent deal. I have a 2000 HD that I bought new for $16K 15 years ago so if you figure in inflation for current $ it would be over $20 easy. I bought the 1100rt on a whim because I wanted to try a BMW. Not to offend anyone, but riding the 1100 is so much more fun than the HD so the HD mainly just sits. I ran across the deal for the 1150 and bought it with the thought of selling the HD. I was only going to get $7K max out of the HD so I decided to keep it. I will never buy another new bike, even though I could afford to, as they are such a waste of money in relation to what you can buy used. A little research and some patience when you are looking pays big dividends. And yes BMWs require much more maintenance the other bikes, especially HDs as they go forever with almost no maintenance. Even with my 15 years of experience and maintenance, I prefer the BMWs. Link to comment
Francis Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 I'm currently bike-less and have been tracking K1300GT's and wet RT's and noticed there are almost no 2014 RT's on ebay and Cycletrader. There are plenty of 2012 and 2013 K16oo's but almost no 2014 RT's. Prices on the K1300GT's are all over the place as are the prices on 2005-2009 RT's. It also seems to me from tracking these ads, and it may just be that I am not riding at the moment, that sales of motorcycles are slowing. What do you guys think? Link to comment
Panhandle Chuck Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 Agree. I've been tracking dealers, cycletrader, and all the common bike sites looking for RT's for two friends all over the country. They both wanted to find a '14, assuming the new bike loss would be substantial between a '14 and '15, and it just hasen't happened. Manufacture incentives closed the gap in some case to 2k. So, it's a hard sell, and with the '16's on the doorstep, things will get even more complicated. I talked to my dealer today in Pensacola, they haven't had '14 since I purchased mine in April and only have (2) ebony 15's. They both have a $1200 incentive. So, one friend gave up, found what he wanted at Eurocycles of Tampa, and purchased a '15 RT. My other friend is still looking, the dealer's aren't giving anything away! Link to comment
Ponch Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 Well, If you have a bike, pass. No use doing someone else a favor. Wait until the crazy demand has been met. Link to comment
moshe_levy Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 Meanwhile I'm taking an absolute bath as I scramble to come with cash to pay down the RT. I stripped my HD and am about to sell a "Tour Pak" (topcase in BMWspeak) that ran me almost $1,600.00 (set up as mine is, which is to say loaded) last November for $685.00 now. And that INCLUDES shipping. Not even a year old, and it's like new! Crazy. The depreciation is just C-R-A-Z-Y. -MKL Link to comment
Effjay Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 We (or at least I) tend to rationalize what we want... And so I did when lust won me over with new riding buddy's 14 RT. Yes, "wethead envy" struck - even though my primo, well farkled 04 RT was ready to go anywhere without concerns for reliability. As nice as that R1150RT was, I truly missed my former 07 RT (sold with immediate regrets) with which followed a few oilheads incl that 04 RT. Started shopping for 1-owner low mileage end-of-series 12/13 camhead RT but didn't find combo of condition, low mileage and price. Ah, then spotted private party sale of (sig) 14 RT 500 miles away "across the border" nicely equipped plus with add'l desirable factory farkles. Cut a deal, then headed with truck 'n trailer to haul it home. Price was fair plus no double-dip sales tax to be collected in AZ since original owner provided original bill of sale as proof tax had been collected. Point being; the 04 RT went away for $7450 (reduced for de-farkled content per buyer preference) with nearly new 14 RT prox $10k more. For me, net cost difference (even before sale of 04 RT farkles separately) was well worth it. I'm loving this moto, which will serve me well until I can no longer ride. So yes, there is a secondary market... Link to comment
Panhandle Chuck Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 MKL, I owned a 2010 GSA and purchased a 2014 HD Road King, my first Harley (Rushmore) August '14. The GSA was sitting as the new bike was getting all the love being new to me. I left late March '15 out west to ride canyons, mountains, and all things twisty for my first "Harley" long distance ride. My goal was to decide upon returning between a new Street Glide or RT. I traded both the GSA and HD on a new RT within 2 weeks of returning. It wasn't because the HD was a bad bike or experience. In fact, I put a lot of chrome on it and new sundowner seat before leaving (no stage 1), loved the stock sound on the new Rushmore class, and wired my Zumo 665, soft lowers, all the quick detachables, it was road ready and performed flawlessly. I just learned real quickly riding a 815 lb bike like a BMW in the twisty's just isn't worth the additional risk. I loved a lot about the HD and if I were collecting them to look at I'd have kept it, but space limitations, and all the cost associated with herding a fleet just seemed like work to me, I just want to ride. So, I stripped it down, took everything off previously purchased and sold it all on HD Forums fairly quick. I took a financial beating on the trade for the '14 RT. In the end, I'm happy to back on a BMW and with the new RT.........and I feel your pain! //Chuck Link to comment
Guest Kakugo Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 Well, If you have a bike, pass. No use doing someone else a favor. Wait until the crazy demand has been met. Sound advice. My dealer told me they expect (no guarantee it will happen) demand and supply to start normalizing next Spring. No sense paying full price and/or waiting five months when I have two perfectly functioning bikes. Link to comment
realshelby Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 Well, If you have a bike, pass. No use doing someone else a favor. Wait until the crazy demand has been met. Sound advice. My dealer told me they expect (no guarantee it will happen) demand and supply to start normalizing next Spring. No sense paying full price and/or waiting five months when I have two perfectly functioning bikes. That makes sense. But then riding a motorcycle isn't always based on that! In my case the new RT is so superior to the '04 I traded I could justify the costs of trading up. While on paper you can bet waiting would allow a couple years old RT to be bought for a few thousand less, is it really a better value? I would have had to keep my '04 RT which I was simply not riding as much as I was the V STrom. Now the V Strom sits. The enjoyment I have gotten from the RT over the past few months is what I am paying for. It was NOT an investment. I can honestly say there has been ZERO buyers remorse at any time with this RT. Link to comment
Ponch Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 Well, If you have a bike, pass. No use doing someone else a favor. Wait until the crazy demand has been met. Sound advice. My dealer told me they expect (no guarantee it will happen) demand and supply to start normalizing next Spring. No sense paying full price and/or waiting five months when I have two perfectly functioning bikes. That makes sense. But then riding a motorcycle isn't always based on that! In my case the new RT is so superior to the '04 I traded I could justify the costs of trading up. While on paper you can bet waiting would allow a couple years old RT to be bought for a few thousand less, is it really a better value? I would have had to keep my '04 RT which I was simply not riding as much as I was the V STrom. Now the V Strom sits. The enjoyment I have gotten from the RT over the past few months is what I am paying for. It was NOT an investment. I can honestly say there has been ZERO buyers remorse at any time with this RT. It depends. If I already have a bike that works, what's the rush? After a time, the depreciation slows down a lot. I bought my current ride as a leftover and got the 49L topcase thrown in and it still was below MSRP with tax OTD. Sometimes waiting is ok. Link to comment
Steve W. Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 You can just wait it out. My 78 r100s is worth more than it cost new, and worth more than my 01 1150. So in ~40 more years the 1150 will go up. No worries. Cheers Steve Link to comment
Guest Kakugo Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 That makes sense. But then riding a motorcycle isn't always based on that! In my case the new RT is so superior to the '04 I traded I could justify the costs of trading up. While on paper you can bet waiting would allow a couple years old RT to be bought for a few thousand less, is it really a better value? I would have had to keep my '04 RT which I was simply not riding as much as I was the V STrom. Now the V Strom sits. The enjoyment I have gotten from the RT over the past few months is what I am paying for. It was NOT an investment. I can honestly say there has been ZERO buyers remorse at any time with this RT. I am not as old as some people here ( ) but I am wise enough to have understood it's always better to buy a bike towards the end of the production cycle than at the beginning. Some past experiences cured me of any temptation to buy a bike before it has been on the market for at very least two full years. I understand manufacturers cannot sort every single issue out of the box and that improvements can only come with time, but if I can avoid being stranded on an Alpine pass with a broken clutch actuator or having to deal with temperamental electronics, I will gladly do so. Link to comment
BFish Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 We are talking about motorcyles not apple stock. still have my bought new 2004 RT. yes, an antique, but worth all the years of fun. Link to comment
John Ranalletta Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Riding a '02 GS bought used in '08 w/ 8k miles for $8k. Can't really think of anything it can't do/doesn't have that would make riding any better. Perhaps a better rider could wring more speed, etc. Que sera... Link to comment
SK_in_AB Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 My history with BMW's is all used, never regretted it. 1)Bought a '79 R65 in 80 for $3200, I think new it was 4500 with Krausers (who remembers them!) Crashed it so only resale was $200 for the bags and $300 for parts. 2)Bought a 2001 R1150 in 2005 for ~C$11k from a friendly MD in Montana. 3 hour drive to the border, a 1 mile test drive and it was mine! I think I saved about $5k off the new price and it had 20,000 miles. Sold 3 years later for $9k (in part because Canadian used prices are quite a bit higher than in the US 3) BOught an 06 R1200RT in 08 for $16.5 including topcase. It had been bought in Calgary for $24k and had ~15000 miles. Its still my number 1 ride, don't know a reason to update, although I'm amazed to think its a 10 year old model now. 4)Broke with tradition and got a 2013 F700 from the local dealer in November 2014. Kept looking for used and couldn't find one nearby, Paid ~C$12K including cases which was ~$2000 off because it was a dealer demo with 3000 miles. PRobably could have saved $1500 privately but there was only 1 previous model year and and I was in a bit of a hurry for a trip the next spring ( Made it 9400km up/back the Dempster Highway last summer). Still have it and not going to unload either unless they make shaft drive 7/800GS that is my size! Bottom line is that buying used is the way to go for me (same generally with cars.... my two recent drives were 1 and 3 years old respectively) I love the idea of brand new, but my cheapskate outlook always prevails, and it is fun trolling the web for good deals. Link to comment
fourteenfour Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I just learned real quickly riding a 815 lb bike like a BMW in the twisty's just isn't worth the additional risk. I loved a lot about the HD and if I were collecting them to look at I'd have kept it The one issue that keeps me off HD is the weight. Having test drove a rushmore SG I was shocked by the weight, three hundred pounds over what I was riding and it became very noticeable even with the reduced seat height Link to comment
Rich06FJR1300 Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 i bought one bmw (used 2002 r1150rt) didn't have the greatest luck with it though it never left me stranded (almost did) but i managed (slave cylinder was failing on a trip) argh! but i hae an FJR now.....and that's really nothing but tires and oil. So the big question, can i go back to bmw? LOL.....hmmmmm. Link to comment
Dave_in_TX Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 i hae an FJR now.....and that's really nothing but tires and oil. So the big question, can i go back to bmw? LOL.....hmmmmm. I can say the same thing about my 2011 RT with 92k miles on it i.e. "really nothing but tires and oil". Link to comment
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