Double Yellow Passing

[ThomasJ]

Seems as though I have been seeing much more frequently riders passing on double yellows here in Northern Cal. Just yesterday on the way home up 49 between Lotus and Cool was trailing a couple cars, waiting for a broken yellow when a cycle went flyin by us all...great PR for those of us on cycles. Asked the wife who drives a school bus and she thinks is more of a cultural thing...immediate gratification thing...don't see the point in waiting...no patience. I think there is something to that (as an experienced husband should) but I'm wondering if roads that had passing lines on them have had them removed (painted over), as there seem to be plenty of areas that could be but aren't.

Anyone else see the same thing or am I just imagining things as I, with great impatience, wait for the next passing line.

Tom

[PhilipJCaputo]

I'm a fairly new rider to the SoCal area so perhaps what seems normal like a regular occurrence to me really isn't.

 

 

Today for about 4 miles, I followed another guy down a canyon road between the valley and beverly hills. We mostly were on the other side of the double yellow. Traffic was at a near stop the entire time to our right. We only had to slide back into the correct lane 4 or 5 times for oncoming traffic.

 

Once we reached the head of the snake, traffic was totally stopped for some road construction, and no oncoming traffic was being let through.

 

Passing against the double yellow isn't a first resort, but I will do it if the car in front of me is going abnormally slow for conditions (10-15 under the limit), and I feel I can dart past quick enough. I would even do it in my car if I could do it safely.

 

The funny part was that as we rode through beverly hills, I was able to observe his riding style. We had to stop at several stop signs (this was after the construction mess), I noticed he never used his front brake, was wearing no gloves, and it was clear from the rash on his helmet that he had gone down before and had taken all the paint off an area for about 3x1.5 inches. Might not have been the best to follow that guy's lead.

 

Shortly after that I saw a car turning a corner with a sideways orange cone pinned under the car and being dragged along.

[DaveTheAffable]

I see it frequently too. The double yellow line is old.... has little value. I encourage my car driving friends that live in Los Angeles that drive the Angeles Crest, my friends that drive Hwy 1 and 101, and my relatives that live in San Diego and drive up and down Palomar and the Ortega Hwy, to simply cross the double yellows anytime they want. If they can see ahead, it's safe, and they're a good driver, there's no reason not too, even in a car.

 

[DaveTheAffable]

I see it frequently too. The double yellow line is old.... has little value. I encourage my car driving friends that live in Los Angeles that drive the Angeles Crest, my friends that drive Hwy 1 and 101, and my relatives that live in San Diego and drive up and down Palomar and the Ortega Hwy, to simply cross the double yellows anytime they want. If they can see ahead, it's safe, and they're a good driver, there's no reason not too, even in a car.

 

 

Just in case someone thought I had lost my mind. I was KIDDING.

 

Thomas and Phillip... be aware that you will find some riders that believe that this is perfectly acceptable, and others who believe it is not.

 

It's kind of sad... car drivers feel that way too. And many who cross the double yellows kill motorcyclists.

 

I can tell you I don't do it, and won't ride again with those who do. That's not me being arrogant, just stating it plainly.

 

[Paul Mihalka]

Oh, the double yellow... I am a bit flexible, just like those who prescribe the double yellow are not consistent. Example: a 10 mile piece of nice country road on which I commuted for 8 years originally had 3 passing zones. Every time they repainted the lines, they took one away. Now there is none. Nothing has changed. Same houses, same traffic volume. I know where the ex-zones are. If there is a slow car in front, I pass.

Big difference of passing zone design between West Virginia (the best) and Maryland/Virginia.

Interesting the law in Vermont (Vermonters correct me if I'm wrong): No passing over a double yellow is a recommendation, not the law. For no passing there is a "Do not pass" sign.

Yes, on occasion I pass over the double yellow. The car has to be real slow. I don't pass if there is more than one car. I have to be able to pass like it was a passing zone, without need to be extra aggressive.

Flame-proof suit on...

[Bernie]

Same here, Paul. Most people don't know what the markings on the road mean anyway. Especially down here in Florida.

[BailyD]

It can be a favorite ticket, but discretion can be used and understood when, for example an elderly driver is going way under the speed limit or someone is going extra slow because they have their sofa in the back of the pickup. You have to look at the totality of the circumstances surrounding the action.

 

Passing motorists doing the speed limit is an immediate 4 point ticket.

 

Don't forget that everyone in front of the MC, but behind the slow moving vehicle is thinking about passing and sometimes they meet as they both decide to accelerate. In addition it really pisses off the people who are "trying" to do the right thing by waiting for the passing zone. "because I can" is rarely a good answer......

[tallman]

I've done it.

Mostly don't as it is illegal.

Some drivers/riders operate in a dangerous manner, too fast, too slow, and I'm trying to get more like Dave.

[jaytee]

I will cross the dbl yellow (assuming it's safe) if I'm on a motorcycle road (like ACH, GMR, etc) and the slow car in front won't pull over enough to let me by. Most of the cars on those roads are used to mc traffic, though, and will let you by.

 

But I *never* cross the dbl yellow as part of my ride. If I can't make a turn completely in my lane, I slow down.

 

And yes, I have seen a lot more passing zones repainted double yellow and some even turned into "safety zones" with no passing at all and large bumpy divots put along the double yellow (Ortega comes to mind). Very frustrating as a motorcyclist.

 

As to cagers getting frustrated, too bad. Buy a bike.

 

JT

[DaveTheAffable]

I can tell you I don't do it, and won't ride again with those who do. That's not me being arrogant, just stating it plainly.

 

 

So today is a new day, and reading my own post DOES sound harsh. So... I'm probably closer to Paul's position. If I was honest and said I'd never ride with someone who's done it, I couldn't ride with myself!

 

A few years back I just decided to go a little slower... in life. Be more affable. In my riding too. So, a more 'affable' statement would be, "I've ridden with some that give little or no regard to the double yellow", and I try not to ride with them. Not because I'm judging them, but because I worry for them and I'm uncomfortable when they do it.

 

Ohhh... the weekend is here. The RT hasn't felt my backside for about 2 weeks. (Too much work). An early Saturday ride is calling. Hmmmmm...

[Mister Tee]

I am also of the camp that I don't do it as a general rule, but I will do it if there is a glacially slow driver ahead of me and I can do it safely - i.e. I have both the visibility and the speed. No I don't like to contribute to the bad rider club.

 

I don't mean to suggest that motorcycles should have different rules than cars, but in reality, motorcycles have a lot more flexibility in passing that cars do.

[Quinn]

Most of the responders seem to be from California. Wonder if that's because they allow lane splitting and therefore lane sharing? A case of give them an inch and they'll take a mile?

 

I cross double yellow lines to pass bicyclists all the time; figure they deserve the whole lane but know I can encrouch if need be. Cars are trickier. I need a long sightline and no evidence that they're going to turn, and no tailgaters taking up room I might want to squeeze into. Also, noone on my tail who might be more antsy than me.

 

----

 

 

[outpost22]

Every time they repainted the lines, they took one away. Now there is none. Nothing has changed.

 

Yep, this is a common occurrence here too. Repaint and double stripe it. We have a section of mountain road that is solid double yellow for 7 miles. 3 passing zones have been painted over. People haul RV's and boats down this going 25-30 mph (55 zone).

 

Yep, I NEVER pass on double yellows

[Mister Tee]

Most of the responders seem to be from California. Wonder if that's because they allow lane splitting and therefore lane sharing? A case of give them an inch and they'll take a mile?

 

I don't connect the two. Completely separate issues. I know that if I'm in another state, I have play like a Roman when it comes to lane sharing.

[ltljohn]

Most of the responders seem to be from California. Wonder if that's because they allow lane splitting and therefore lane sharing? A case of give them an inch and they'll take a mile?

 

I don't connect the two. Completely separate issues. I know that if I'm in another state, I have play like a Roman when it comes to lane sharing.

 

If you drive like a Roman that means you will pass anywhere including the sidewalk

[Mister Tee]

Most of the responders seem to be from California. Wonder if that's because they allow lane splitting and therefore lane sharing? A case of give them an inch and they'll take a mile?

 

I don't connect the two. Completely separate issues. I know that if I'm in another state, I have play like a Roman when it comes to lane sharing.

 

If you drive like a Roman that means you will pass anywhere including the sidewalk

 

Don't laugh - I spend a fair amount of time in Southeast Asia for work. Yes I pass on the sidewalk, against the flow of traffic!

[Fubar]

Most of the responders seem to be from California. Wonder if that's because they allow lane splitting and therefore lane sharing? A case of give them an inch and they'll take a mile?

 

I cross double yellow lines to pass bicyclists all the time; figure they deserve the whole lane but know I can encrouch if need be. Cars are trickier. I need a long sightline and no evidence that they're going to turn, and no tailgaters taking up room I might want to squeeze into. Also, no one on my tail who might be more antsy than me.

Must say that the "CA lane-splitting" thought occurred to me as well. Having never ridden there, can't really comment on it though.

 

I hug the yellow passing bicycles, joggers, stroller pushers, etc. but stay on my side of it.

The only time I cross a double yellow is if the driver in front of me is presenting a truly dangerous situation, i.e., swerving, slowing and accelerating repeatedly, exhibiting "impaired" driving behaviour, or being a real menace to others and jeopardizing my safety in some tangible way. If an alternate route doesn't exist and the no-passing area is exceedingly long(several miles long), then I will rapidly pass them and put serious distance between us so he/she doesn't just hug my rear fender.

 

I won't fabricate an excuse to pass just to go faster or get beyond a cage. 10% under the limit is at most, 7 miles an hour, 15% is 10 under. Not worth the ticket to me.

A road-toaster doing 25 in a 55 is a different story. Most states, I believe, have laws stating that if you are holding up X number of vehicles you should move right/pull over and let them pass. I've been on both sides of that one repeatedly. Unfortunately, it requires drivers/riders to know the law (ignorance is no excuse) and to follow it. Easier said than done.

 

Alternately, I see a lot of people in passing areas in municipalities who desperately want past the person in front but who refuse to pass because they have the misguided idea thst passing "in town" is illegal, that somehow the dotted line means something different within city boundaries. Fools. I pass them when appropriate and safe. Drive 30 in a 45 and you will see my tail lights fading away while you curse my "reckless" behaviour.

[PhilipJCaputo]

But I *never* cross the dbl yellow as part of my ride. If I can't make a turn completely in my lane, I slow down.

 

Good way to put it...

 

Other than on 2 wheels, this is how I roll. After following the photographer guy (killboy.com) at the Tail of the Dragon, I really make it a point to ride in my lane, and when I can, I stay closer to the white on the right when I suspect a cage might cross over the double yellow to make their turn easier, especially around blind corners.

[boxerboy11]

I have never paid much attention to double yellow lines and consider them just suggestions. The only yellow line I even care about is the one on my side of the center line. Even then I pay more attention to safe passing areas than to an indiscriminate yellow line painted on the road by some yahoo. In my normal riding area we have at least 5 areas that have no yellow lines on my side of the center line stating a no passing zone but the visibility is such that cars or even small trucks could be hidden in road dips. OTOH there are many many yellow line designated no passing zones that have plenty of roll out room and flat visibility that are perfectly safe to pass on. There is one not too far from my house that takes the cake as it is yellow line marked as a no passing zone for close to 3 miles with a flat road no deep dips and only shallow curves that you can easily see all the way through. Just as that section ends and the yellow line stops the road has deep dips and blind roads entering making that the worst place to pass on the whole road.

So my passing mantra is to pass only when I feel it is safe not when some yellow stripe on the road tells me it is or isn't ok.

 

[notacop]

Double yellows is just Big Brother being safe for us. With modern bikes passing a slug is all too easy and quick. Too bad for us it's a revenue maker.

[hink]

Well here in Vermont (the other left coast) we can pass on a double yellow as long as we can do it safely, the double yellow is just a suggestion. I generally apply that same rule if needed elsewhere as long as no one is looking.

[KCB]

Anyone who commutes in the mountains with limted passing opportunites has zipped by a slower vehicle to assure a clean ride the rest of the way through the twisties. Trucks are a big problem here in Vermont as there are few East-West major highways. Trucks/truckers must traverse some pretty challenging terrain transporting goods into Vermont and to our neighbors, Southern areas represent a majority of this traffic forced onto two lane mountain roads. Yes the stripe law is only a suggestion,

here too the dotted line have disappeared, as well as the addition of rumble strips down the middle of a two lane, pass here at your own risk !!

kc

[KCB]

just re-read the last post, No I'm not bad mouthing truckers, these folks earn every penny just for putting up with all the

"BEST DRIVERS IN THE WORLD"

kc

 

[Bill_Walker]

My personal preference if stuck behind a slow car on a "motorcycle road", is that I'll wait for a pretty long while for a marked passing lane or for the car to use a turnout. I'm patient, and more often than not I'll get one or the other before I run out of patience. But if the car has passed a couple of turnouts without pulling over, I'll pass on the double yellow if a clear passing opportunity presents itself. The issue to me is less about my safety, than about doing things that car drivers do not expect and making them angry at motorcyclists in general.

 

This becomes somewhat of a problem when riding with a group whose members may take the lines as more of a suggestion. Do I hold up the whole group by "riding my own ride", or do I pass? I've gone both ways. Radio communication with the riders ahead helps with safety, although not at all with courtesy to drivers.

[ridesmith]

In Vermont it is legal to pass on a double yellow unless otherwise posted. I confirmed this with a LEO recently. Apparently it has to do with the number of farm vehicles on their rural roads, and allowing cars and bikes to pass them.

[CoarsegoldKid]

I've been known to pass over the double yellow. Around here and on most California roads drivers pull to the right for MCs to pass. Lane sharing. I always give them a thank you wave.

[Polo]

This is too much on the nose for me.

 

Yesterday I went for a solo ride and entered a road I'm very familiar with. They have laid some new black top and thus there is no dividing line. I came up to a very slow car and passed doing probably 55-60, well within the limit. A County Sheriff in the opposite direction maybe 200 meters yards away, turned on his lights and slowed down. I looked at him as I got to be parallel and he pointed at me. I took a curve and stopped to wait for him.

 

He got there, did his Buford T. Justice walk over to me and asked for my papers. I asked for the reason. He then told me I had passed on a double yellow. I told him there were no lines painted. He said "there are up ahead".

 

So I took a picture of him with the road as background with my phone. Then asked him to write the ticket. He asked about the photo.

 

I told him I would use it in court to tell the judge that I was being cited for passing a double yellow that wasn't painted on the road. And I would ask him to produce the video from his cruiser if he had it. "My argument will be: how logic is it that I'm being cited for violating an advisory not posted?". The LEO looked at the road, then to me, he then told me not to pass on the double yellow that WAS pained up ahead. Got back in his car and made a rather fast U-turn.

 

Every once in a blue moon, you get the bear.

[Paul Mihalka]

"Every once in a blue moon, you get the bear. "

If the bear is stupid.

 

 

[CoarsegoldKid]

:clap:

[LBump]

So, did you pass on the Double Yellow up ahead?

[BailyD]

knew the double yellow should have been there, but didn't notice the road had been re-paved and the lines were not laid down yet. very embarrassing!

[Alan D]

If my wife drives to the end of our driveway, looks left and sees no cars coming and then proceeds to turn right just as you come over the hill on the wrong side of the yellow line....

I look both ways and watched a red Corvette pass a slower car on the wrong side of the yellow line, running about 50 in a 35mph. I'll look out for you, my wife won't.

There just might be a reason for the yellow line.

[Polo]

So, did you pass on the Double Yellow up ahead?

 

Me?! Law abiding citizen me?!

 

As they say, no pictures? didn't happen.

[jaytee]

...I'll look out for you, my wife won't.

There just might be a reason for the yellow line.

 

And very often there isn't a good reason. As cited in this thread many times the various agencies in America are repainting many passing zones to dbl yellow. Also the dbl yellow "suggestions" of when it's safe to pass and when it isn't are designed fir slow cars passing slower cars- not for a motorcycle performance envelope.

 

Bottom line, pass with care when safe but be prepared to pay the fine when caught doing so over a yellow line.

 

JT

[SKYGZR]

Do it every time there is the space. What's a "double yellow line?" Get a ticket, so what, pay it.

[drzep]

Just to add another opinion, I will occasionally pass if it is clearly a safe situation and I have a good reason to do it, i.e., someone doing 30 in a 50 on a secondary road with no cars around. When I do, I always pass as slowly as is safe for the situation and I always wave to the driver. Sort of a "please don't lump all motorcycle riders into the 'jerk off' category". Sometimes people wave back, other times they flash the highs when its safe to come back into the proper lane, and yet other times they will beep in annoyance (I assume).

 

I think that its all about discretion and considering the possibilities for what can go wrong. Being that it is a illegal and I usually feel guilt, its a pretty rare occurrence for me.

[bobbybob]

If my wife drives to the end of our driveway, looks left and sees no cars coming and then proceeds to turn right just as you come over the hill on the wrong side of the yellow line....

I look both ways and watched a red Corvette pass a slower car on the wrong side of the yellow line, running about 50 in a 35mph. I'll look out for you, my wife won't.

There just might be a reason for the yellow line.

 

It would be a good idea to advise your wife to look *both* ways before entering a roadway so that she isn't charged with failing to yield the right-of-way, vehicular homicide, & sued into oblivion. Or even worse. The traffic on the roadway has the right of way over entering traffic regardless of the side they are on and the presence of a double yellow. Besides auto's passing each other, there are also autos swerving across lanes to miss a child or dog, pedestrians walking on the shoulder or in the roadway, bicyclists on the "wrong side", joggers, and even an occasional motorcyclist passing illegally. The presence of a double-yellow will not cancel your liability for causing the death(s)/injuries of others. In court, the survivors' lawyer will ask "did you look to the left AND to the right before entering the roadway?" Doesn't really matter how you answer that one. Game over.

[Alan D]

If my wife drives to the end of our driveway, looks left and sees no cars coming and then proceeds to turn right just as you come over the hill on the wrong side of the yellow line....

I look both ways and watched a red Corvette pass a slower car on the wrong side of the yellow line, running about 50 in a 35mph. I'll look out for you, my wife won't.

There just might be a reason for the yellow line.

 

It would be a good idea to advise your wife to look *both* ways before entering a roadway so that she isn't charged with failing to yield the right-of-way, vehicular homicide, & sued into oblivion. Or even worse. The traffic on the roadway has the right of way over entering traffic regardless of the side they are on and the presence of a double yellow. Besides auto's passing each other, there are also autos swerving across lanes to miss a child or dog, pedestrians walking on the shoulder or in the roadway, bicyclists on the "wrong side", joggers, and even an occasional motorcyclist passing illegally. The presence of a double-yellow will not cancel your liability for causing the death(s)/injuries of others. In court, the survivors' lawyer will ask "did you look to the left AND to the right before entering the roadway?" Doesn't really matter how you answer that one. Game over.

 

You are right about all of that.

I'm just saying many people out there do not look both ways when crossing a one way street. I look both ways, my wife does not. The person passing on the double yellow will still be dead and maybe my wife. There may be a good reason for a yellow line and there may not be. You take your chance and you pay the price. I can wait.

This topic has been discussed before and nobody is changing anybody's opinion.

[bobbybob]

I'm just saying many people out there do not look both ways when crossing a one way street.

 

You're right. Thats why I wear a crash helmet every time I walk out to my mailbox.

 

 

[LBump]

I'm just saying many people out there do not look both ways when crossing a one way street.

 

You're right. Thats why I wear a crash helmet every time I walk out to my mailbox.

 

 

Heck... I sleep with one on!

[Bullett]

I'm just saying many people out there do not look both ways when crossing a one way street.

 

You're right. Thats why I wear a crash helmet every time I walk out to my mailbox.

 

 

Bobbybob, that right there is funny!

[AdventurePoser]

"Never" is a pretty strong word, but I pretty much never pass on a double yellow....I'll slow down and reexamine my own ride and wait for another opportunity that is legal.

 

YMMV,

 

Steve

[Jaguar]

Yes, I'm guilty of passing on a double yellow line. The cop let me know that when he handed me an $84.00 ticket years ago leaving TWO campground in N. Ga years many ago.

I was heading home to Florida down Highway 60 on an early Sunday morning. Enjoying one last ride in the twisties on the ride home. I came up fast on a senior couple poking along around 30 mph. I poked along with them just waiting for the right opportunity. We came up on a spot of a good 100 yards or more of strait, double yellow lined road and I grabbed a handful of throttle and took off. About half way into my pass, the blue lights came on. Smokey Joe was hiding up in the trees, totally camouflaged from any rider. It must have been a hot spot for riders just a few miles south of Two Wheels Only.

[Little_Brit]

We use white lines (rather than yellow) for marking the road centre here in the UK but this thread strikes a nerve for me.

 

Like many opinions expressed on this thread I took the view, in my youth, that these things were advisory but the law enforcment authorities took a very different view! I was prosecuted for crossing a solid double white line over 30 years ago. I don't do it now.

 

I don't know what your penalty system is but in the UK transgressions earn offenders penalty points on their license, in addition to any financial penalty. At 12 points your license is gone for up to a year. The minimum penalty is 3 points.

 

Paying fines is easy, cleaning a license takes 4 years after the offence, and insurers don't like penalty points! Driving without insurance incidentally is a 6 point offence...

 

Should you find yourself riding/driving in the UK please do not cross solid white lines as they indicate to traffic coming the other way that nothing will be in their carriageway. Many serious/fatal accidents occur due to people ignoring this simple rule.

[Jaguar]

Same penalty over here Little_Brit. I got three points as well as my $84.00 fine. Acquiring 12 points and your license is gone for one year here also. We have the option of sitting in a safe driving class for a day and they will remove the points. I opted out for the class and have since kept my riding habits safe and legal, so my three points have since been removed. Now, I opt for the safer riding to preserve my "safe driver" status on my drivers license.

[Little_Brit]

We have similar "safe riding" schemes here too. Sounds like there's been a conspiracy between law enforcing agencies :-)

[jaytee]

I view points and driver's Ed as renewable resources to spend in order to enjoy my hobby in SoCal. If I spend too much too soon then I get to drive like a granny for a year and a half...

 

JT

[Perlova]

Most of the responders seem to be from California. Wonder if that's because they allow lane splitting and therefore lane sharing? A case of give them an inch and they'll take a mile?

 

I don't connect the two. Completely separate issues. I know that if I'm in another state, I have play like a Roman when it comes to lane sharing.

 

If you drive like a Roman that means you will pass anywhere including the sidewalk

 

Hey hold on a minute. My name is Roman and I draw the line at passing on a sidewalk.

[Bob Palin]

Should you find yourself riding/driving in the UK please do not cross solid white lines as they indicate to traffic coming the other way that nothing will be in their carriageway. Many serious/fatal accidents occur due to people ignoring this simple rule.

 

I drive in the UK every couple of years and I'm amazed at the places that passing is allowed. On the other hand when I lived in N Cal the passing places were constantly being changed to double yellow for no apparent reason, even in remote straight sections of road (esp Highway 1 on the coast miles from anywhere) Utah doesn't seem quite so bad as California fortunately.

[Mister Tee]

Okay I am extremely frustrated and I ALMOST passed on a double yellow yesterday riding the 160 from the Highway 12 at Rio Vista to the I-5 in Sacramento.

 

They redid the road and put a solid double yellow ALL THE WAY FROM FREAKIN' RIO VISTA TO WALNUT GROVE!!!! I was beyond anger!