Log Building Systems

[Mike]

My wife and I are edging closer to buying some land in Wisconsin, where we'd build a small vacation home. Initially we were attracted to timber frame homes, but the construction costs are high, beyond our meager budget.

 

We've seen some engineered log homes that we like, but I've heard both good and bad about this type of construction. I'd be interested in hearing from those of you who have experience with these types of buildings--the pros and cons, things to watch for in making the building decision, etc. I understand the basics, but only the basics, and need a lot more info before we decide how to proceed. Thanks!

[Nice n Easy Rider]

My wife and I are edging closer to buying some land in Wisconsin, where we'd build a small vacation home. Initially we were attracted to timber frame homes, but the construction costs are high, beyond our meager budget.

 

We've seen some engineered log homes that we like, but I've heard both good and bad about this type of construction. I'd be interested in hearing from those of you who have experience with these types of buildings--the pros and cons, things to watch for in making the building decision, etc. I understand the basics, but only the basics, and need a lot more info before we decide how to proceed. Thanks!

I don't know much about log homes myself but I have read some cautionary articles regarding problems which often arise from inexperienced builders or materials not properly dried, etc. My wife and I saw this firm at a home show and were very impressed by their strategy and their willingness to let customers see their homes being constructed. If you are going to this years UN I believe that the manufacturing plant is not that far away and they apparently welcome visitors to see firsthand how they build their homes.

 

http://www.blueridgelogcabins.com/

[John Ranalletta]

We owned a 15 y/o D-log cabin in GA for a couple of years. I presume it was a "kit".

 

 

The ceilings and floors were 12" pine boards that make for a rougher finish as the boards will dry and shrink over time.

 

 

 

 

[Mike]

My wife and I saw this firm at a home show and were very impressed by their strategy and their willingness to let customers see their homes being constructed. If you are going to this years UN I believe that the manufacturing plant is not that far away and they apparently welcome visitors to see firsthand how they build their homes.

 

http://www.blueridgelogcabins.com/

 

Thanks! This is promising. My parents built a modular home years ago (back in the seventies) that arrived on site, like these, via a couple of flatbed trucks. Though not as complete a package as these homes, the basic structure of the house was erected within two days.

[John Ranalletta]

Though this is not an answer to the question you posed, why build? Likely, there are lots of already-improved properties for sale at a discount. Building a house is fun and if that's the joy, go for it.

 

We sold our cabin 3 years ago and the buyer has had it on the market every since. He hasn't figured out that it's worth less now than what he paid.

 

The ambiance of a spacious, well-constructed log cabin is cool but for occasional use, if I were to build, I'd investigate a more conventional, modular home. Wausau Homes used to make very good product, but I haven't seen one for many years.

 

The home is constructed in panels with all electical, plumbing, etc. installed.

 

[Kitsap]

A helped a friend build his cabin up in Hyak using this system http://www.singloghomes.com/index.php. Very stable product that went together fairly easy. Picture frame 25 in the Exterior Gallery is his place.

[Rocer]

Mike, we often work in stressed skin timber frame houses but rarely engineered log structures so take that into consideration when reading my post.

 

Perhaps you only plan to use your vacation home in warmer months. If you do plan on extended winter use either now or in the future you will need to consider insulation, or more to the point, the lack of insulation that engineered log homes present.

 

If I remember correctly, pine is about R1.5 per inch so with a 6" log you will only have R9 at it's thickest point. Our building code requires a minimum of R20.

 

In the examples of log "cabins" that other posters linked to, the rooves appear to be simple joists with ceiling boards on the underside. I'm not sure how wide those joists are but our code requires a minimum of R40 with allowance for an air space for ventilation. I expect the rooves shown n the gallery of homes will have ice dam problems, at least they would in my climate area. Most engineered log homes where I live have been capped with second rooves to allow more insulation and airspace / airflow for just that reason.

 

I would be concerned with design theory and actual field reports from owners of homes built by the specific company you might go with. It's not unusual for the corners, butt joints and even the gasket joints to become drafty due to shifting / twisting of the logs after they've weathered for a few years. Has the brand model you are considering had a negative air pressure test? If so has this test been repeated after a few years?

 

While attractive, you might want to consider that the combination of log walls and wood ceilings creates a challenge for interior lighting. Task lighting may be your solution to this.

 

Have you considered a conventional frame building with added non-structural timber frame details in the common areas?

 

Which ever way you go, a vacation home in Wisconsin sounds great. Have fun planning and good luck with your project.

[Quinn]

When I was looking (a long time ago), log homes were expensive for square footage and required a lot of maintanence such as yearly caulking, re-staining, and possible insect control. I'd be more tempted by a prefab with the walls delivered flat and erected on site. It would be a tighter home with better insulation. I'd also want whatever features would require no care for the next thirty years, energy saving features, and off grid capability when needed.

 

----

 

 

[Kitsap]

 

In the examples of log "cabins" that other posters linked to, the rooves appear to be simple joists with ceiling boards on the underside.

 

The example I posted and the cabin we built employed engineered roof joints that were rated for heavy snow load. The 2000+ sqft "cabin" is lived in year around and heated with one small wood stove and radiant floor heating in the bathrooms. There is a backup furnace that was required by code but rarely used.

[Deadboy]

When I was looking (a long time ago), log homes were expensive for square footage and required a lot of maintanence such as yearly caulking, re-staining, and possible insect control. I'd be more tempted by a prefab with the walls delivered flat and erected on site. It would be a tighter home with better insulation. I'd also want whatever features would require no care for the next thirty years, energy saving features, and off grid capability when needed.

 

----

 

 

That is the best advice I have read on this thread so far.....my neighbor has a log home and says he wouldn't do it again if he had the choice.....looks cool but it is a 24/7 project.

 

[yabadabapal]

Mike, I get dwell Magazine and have seen some really stunning

modular homes. And they're really inexpensive. Check out Dwell and the archives. You might come across some nice options.

[barryd]

I live in a log home, of the sort that has been referenced in some of the other replies. In our home, the "logs" are milled at an angle on the outside to resemble clapboards and flat on the inside, 6 inches thick. The stacking edges are milled for splines to interlock.

 

But those interlocks are not perfect, there can be gaps where the logs aren't straight. You get checking in some of the logs that opens up big cracks inside and out. The grooves between the logs on the inside are dust magnets.

 

My advice, don't do it, for some of the reasons stated in the prievious replies. Poor insulative value, bugs, rot. Plus things like lack of flexibility in running wiring in the exterior walls. The wood walls look nice at first, but get tiresome after a while, then the choices are paint the wood or put drywall over it. And if you do that what's the point of the thin wood wall?

 

Many of the problems we've encountered are due to the brain-dead guy that built the place, but even without those issues it's not a construction I'd recommend for a cold climate, based on our experience of living in one in a cold climate.

 

 

[squints]

Before you go comparing "R" value do yourself a favor and study up on THERMAL Mass http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/402439/log_homes_rvalue_vs_thermal_mass_pg2.html

 

We have an 8" 3400sq,ft log home that we built ourselves with exposed timber roof. on top of that we added 4" of foam for an R32 value. During the last snow storm we lost electric for about 14 hours. In that time external temps were in the teens, the temp in the house dropped by 4 degrees. I don't think any stick framed house would have held the temp like that. It is more work to own in the first few years but after you get it stained and sealed a few time it slows way down. Let others say what they want but I wouldn't have anything else. Bought our kit from www.APPLOG.com

 

 

 

[Mike]

Thanks, all, for the information you've been sharing. The whole notion of the combined effect of the R-value and thermal mass makes it a little complicated to do a direct comparison to a conventional home. Of course, most heat is lost through the roof, windows, doors, etc., which are not dependent on whether or not you use log construction. Siting of the home and surrounding landscaping, particularly as those factors affect passive solar heating, further complicate the whole equation. It's enough to make your head hurt.

 

And we haven't even begun to talk about HVAC, solar panels, etc. . . . .

[Nice n Easy Rider]

Thanks, all, for the information you've been sharing. The whole notion of the combined effect of the R-value and thermal mass makes it a little complicated to do a direct comparison to a conventional home. Of course, most heat is lost through the roof, windows, doors, etc., which are not dependent on whether or not you use log construction. Siting of the home and surrounding landscaping, particularly as those factors affect passive solar heating, further complicate the whole equation. It's enough to make your head hurt.

 

And we haven't even begun to talk about HVAC, solar panels, etc. . . . .

Mike,

Whatever you decide just make sure you tell us where you're going to hide the keys during the summer for those of us who want to explore the back roads of Wisconsin and need a place to bed down.

[Mike]

Thanks, all, for the information you've been sharing. The whole notion of the combined effect of the R-value and thermal mass makes it a little complicated to do a direct comparison to a conventional home. Of course, most heat is lost through the roof, windows, doors, etc., which are not dependent on whether or not you use log construction. Siting of the home and surrounding landscaping, particularly as those factors affect passive solar heating, further complicate the whole equation. It's enough to make your head hurt.

 

And we haven't even begun to talk about HVAC, solar panels, etc. . . . .

Mike,

Whatever you decide just make sure you tell us where you're going to hide the keys during the summer for those of us who want to explore the back roads of Wisconsin and need a place to bed down.

 

Okay, I'll post it here.

[Mike]

Though this is not an answer to the question you posed, why build? Likely, there are lots of already-improved properties for sale at a discount. Building a house is fun and if that's the joy, go for it.

 

Well, we've figured it out. But, first, an answer to your question. We did look at several existing homes and none of them met our expectations--they were either designed much differently than what we want or the land they were situated on was just not right. A lot of "recreational" property consists of subdivisions where you're within a stone's throw of your neighbors. We wanted something that felt a little more secluded.

 

So, we decided to focus on finding the right piece of land and go from there. We've made a deal on a small plot of land (19 acres) on top of a ridge overlooking the Wisconsin River. We're scheduled to close on it a week from today. It's mostly wooded, with about three acres already being cleared and in agricultural use. Lots of work ahead of us, but it's exciting to have gotten to this point.

 

Incidentally, this area has some of the best roads I've ever ridden.

[Rocer]

Sweet.