Gps power allways on

[jmf]

I installed the 83300413585 connector for my Quest 2 gps on my 06GS. I connected the ground (brown) and hot (red & white). Before putting the tank back on I tested function and all was well. Key on GPS on,, Key off GPS power off after a minute or two. I soldered the wires shrink-wrapped and added an accessory outlet on the beak.

 

After every thing is back together the GPS stays on, No power off. Even after setting overnight the gPS does not power down. Any chance soldering the wire can throw the system for a loop? I tried cycling the ignition and taking the Quest out of its cradle. But there is always power. I also disconnected all other accessories still doesn’t power down.

 

Any ideas other than cutting the wires and try without solder? Thought I would post up and see if anyone has ideas before I dive into it again. I

 

Thanks Matt

 

[johnlt]

I just did the same thing today for a friend's R12GS (2006) and it works fine. Powers down after ~1 minute delay. Try disconnecting the accessory outlet.

[bobbybob]

Solder isn't causing this.

 

Are you saying you removed the gps from its cradle and checked for voltage across the gps socket terminals in the cradle after the switch had been off for a long time--and found voltage? Or am I misunderstanding what you said? Does the GPS have an internal battery? If so, maybe its running off its own battery....?

 

And what did you mean by "added an accessory outlet on the beak." ?

 

 

[jmf]

johnlt

 

I have the accessory socket and fuse block disconnected from the battery. Still power stays on. If i disconnect the battery from bike the gps powers off. Reconnect battery and gps stays off until key on then it stays on. Even disconnected the accessory socket at beak after reading your post

 

 

I had a BMW tech tell me awhile back never to solder with the can bus. I cant see how solder joints at this connection would matter but it might.

 

 

Im puzzled. Did you solder the wire on the install you did?

[johnlt]

Yes, I cut off the OEM connector and soldered the GPS ground to the brown lead and the GPS hot to the red/white lead. All works fine. I can't see solder making any difference. Now "arc welding" is an absolute no-no on the canbus unless you disconnect the battery.

[jmf]

Solder isn't causing this.

 

Are you saying you removed the gps from its cradle and checked for voltage across the gps socket terminals in the cradle after the switch had been off for a long time--and found voltage? Or am I misunderstanding what you said? Does the GPS have an internal battery? If so, maybe its running off its own battery....?

 

And what did you mean by "added an accessory outlet on the beak." ?

 

Bob

 

I'm leaving the gps in the cradle. The quest has an internal battery. When it loses power the screen shows a count down until the gps powers off unless any button is pressed. Once a button is pressed the gps goes to internal battery.If no button is pressed the gps turns off. This is what it did when i checked before buttoning everything up. Now the gps stays on. No screen showing external power is lost.

 

The accessory socket is an added socket that is put on the beak next to the wind screen of the GS. I have it wires direct to the battery.

[jmf]

As an added piece of information. With the key off i can take the gps off the bike turn it off put it back in the cradle and it powers up without turning the key on.

 

Thanks for the replies

[Bullett]

If your power socket is wired direct to the battery, it should always be on, unless the unit has some other way to power itself off. For example. My Starcom1 unit is wired to the battery, but turns off when I unplug my helmet.

 

My Gerbings heated gear connector is "always on," but I unplug the gear when I stop.

 

Your GPS apparently has no way to power off, so it is always on. Does you GS have a powerlet socket that is wired to turn off when the bike does? That's the socket I use on my GS.

 

Good luck.

 

 

[johnlt]

As an added piece of information. With the key off i can take the gps off the bike turn it off put it back in the cradle and it powers up without turning the key on.

 

Thanks for the replies

 

Does this happen even after several minutes? If you put it back in the cradle prior to the "time out", I'd expect it to power back on. If it powers back on "after" the time-out, I haven't got the foggyist idea what the hell is going on.

[jmf]

If your power socket is wired direct to the battery, it should always be on, unless the unit has some other way to power itself off. For example. My Starcom1 unit is wired to the battery, but turns off when I unplug my helmet.

 

 

 

 

The power socket is separate from the gps plug. The gps is connected to the plug that is used to plug in the BMW branded gps. I bought the adapter from the dealer to plug into the bike.

the plug for the gps should power on with the bike and turn off after a couple minutes after the key is turned off

 

The added accessory socket i added for heated jacket. I wired it direct to the battery to avoid the bikes computer from shutting down from to much current draw.Its always hot

 

Matt

[RSR]

Is there a chance you shorted the hot to the speed sensor wire when you soldered your connections? If the canbus senses a sufficent amp load it will stay on. My electric vest will keep my canbus on until I unplug.

[jmf]

 

Does this happen even after several minutes? If you put it back in the cradle prior to the "time out", I'd expect it to power back on. If it powers back on "after" the time-out, I haven't got the foggyist idea what the hell is going on.

 

I can leave the gps out of the cradle for an hour and it powers back up.

 

If i disconnect the battery the gps is off until i turn the key on. then it stays on after i turn the key off.

 

Matt

[jmf]

Is there a chance you shorted the hot to the speed sensor wire when you soldered your connections? If the canbus senses a sufficent amp load it will stay on. My electric vest will keep my canbus on until I unplug.

 

The first thing I did was seal the end of middle wire. I'm looking at pullling it apart and checking every thing. I might of missed something like the middle wire. Something to look at.

 

Matt

[RSR]

When I installed my GPS I ended up using crimp connectors because the insolation on those skinny wires melted so easy they stuck together when I tried soldering them.

[Limecreek]

Matt--I am working on a couple of bikes this Saturday over in Cedar Park. (6K service and tires) If you do not have it sorted by then, you are welcome to come over and let us take a look. PM if you want directions.

[jmf]

Matt--I am working on a couple of bikes this Saturday over in Cedar Park. (6K service and tires) If you do not have it sorted by then, you are welcome to come over and let us take a look. PM if you want directions.

 

Limecreek

 

Thanks for the offer. PM sent

[bobbybob]

So it sounds like the canbus is keeping power on continuously even after shutting the bike down. Try this: if the gps doesn't shut down after 15 mins, remove it and immediately check for voltage at the socket where it plugs up. If voltage is present, check it periodically for a while to see if the voltage stops after a while. if it stays on (hours) then sounds like canbus is malfunctioning. If it turns off soon after removing gps, then it sounds like gps is creating a load "fooling" the canbus into keeping power on. At that point, i'd trash the oem connector and just wire it thru the centech or other relay. Lifes too short to play grab-ass with the stupid canbus.

[Ken H.]

So it sounds like the canbus is keeping power on continuously even after shutting the bike down.

Yes, exactly where I was going to go with this.

 

This is a know issue with some GPSs (although the first I’ve heard with a Quest). The current drain of the GPS is too high for the ZFE module to know to shut it down. (Not the "CANbus", CANBus is the communications method and protocol between the modules on the bike.) It can be as sensitive as to what brightness level a particular unit’s display is set, thus effecting the total current drain. Or brand to brand, model to model differences. Remember, the GPS aux. connector is set up for a specific model of BMW labeled GARMIN.

 

Also, different versions of the ZFE software have the current threshold different.

 

As you say, the simple permanent fix is to relay the GPS’s power. The relay’s current will be so low the ZFE will always shut down the GPS power circuit.

 

[bobbybob]

[quote=bobbybob (Not the "CANbus", CANBus is the communications method and protocol between the modules on the bike.)

 

 

Ken, technically you are correct, but I think the word "Canbus" has now become a catch-all generic term for the computer module controlled electrical system, at least among most of us "DIY-Dorks".

[jmf]

All right hears a kicker. I disconnected an reconnected the battery then turned the key on without the gps on the bike. Key off and wait 5 minutes and put gps in the cradle and the gps powered up. Seems the cradle is always hot after key on regardless of gps being present. Im thinking i got the wiring wrong or its a software issue.

 

And i thought this would be simple.

 

 

[bobbybob]

Check your accessory socket to see if it behaves the same. It should also power down.

[Limecreek]

Matt...I am assuming you have some other accessories on the bike that require a switched power source? If so what did you tap into?

 

Rear hyper lights, front fogs or driving lights, Autocom?

[jmf]

Check your accessory socket to see if it behaves the same. It should also power down.

 

Good idea. Ill check

[jmf]

Matt...I am assuming you have some other accessories on the bike that require a switched power source? If so what did you tap into?

 

Rear hyper lights, front fogs or driving lights, Autocom?

 

The gps im trying to power from the factory outlet. Down buy the steering head to the left just in front of the fuel tank. Every thing else is powered from a fuse block straight from the battery or to the battery itself.

 

I have lights and horn run though relays but main power is from fuse block.

Motolights trigger off low beam. Piaa off high beam and horn off factory horn wire. Ive disconnected every thing from the battery. with no change.

 

Matt

 

 

 

[Limecreek]

Matt...I am assuming you have some other accessories on the bike that require a switched power source? If so what did you tap into?

 

Rear hyper lights, front fogs or driving lights, Autocom?

 

The gps im trying to power from the factory outlet. Down buy the steering head to the left just in front of the fuel tank. Every thing else is powered from a fuse block straight from the battery or to the battery itself.

 

I have lights and horn run though relays but main power is from fuse block.

Motolights trigger off low beam. Piaa off high beam and horn off factory horn wire. Ive disconnected every thing from the battery. with no change.

 

Matt

 

 

 

Scratch off another possibility....

[jmf]

As per Bobs suggestion. I unplugged wires from the factory accessory socket that is under the left side of the seat. I pluged in a 12 volt bulb without the gps and then key on, key off.Light comes on then off after about a minute. Like it should.

 

Now here is the kicked. With the blub in the accessory socket connector and gps in the cradle both test light and gps power down after a minute. Tried the gps alone again and power stays on. Even plugged the test bulb back in. It stayed lit way past a minute. The only way to power down is disconnect the battery.

 

So im guessing i got the wiring correct on the gps connection. But im stumped as to why the load from the bulb in the accessory socket terminal allows gps to power down.

[bobbybob]

I had a 12v power adapter for a small audio booster that converted 12v to 4 volts, wired into my acces. socket. Used it to boost audio from the XM radio to the autocom. Right after I started using it, the audio would cut out after a few minutes and come back on after switching the motor off and back on. For some reason, the canbus system did not like something the adapter was doing at some point--I suppose it must have simulated an overload--and shut the circuit down. So I wired it thru a relay.

 

The point is, the canbus sometimes does strange things, and rather than try to out-smart it, it may be easier to just forget it and go straight to the battery or thru a relay.

[Paul In Australia]

Matt

 

Sounds like you have it all wired up correctly. It can only be some current drainage from the cradle or the GPS. Not familiar with the Quest. Do you have current draw specs you can check against the canbus style system. maybe the Quest draws a lot more than say a Garmin, or maybe the cradle is shorting out some how ?

Nothing else seems as if it is wrong.

best regards

[Indy Dave]

As per Bobs suggestion. I unplugged wires from the factory accessory socket that is under the left side of the seat. I pluged in a 12 volt bulb without the gps and then key on, key off.Light comes on then off after about a minute. Like it should.

 

Now here is the kicked. With the blub in the accessory socket connector and gps in the cradle both test light and gps power down after a minute. Tried the gps alone again and power stays on. Even plugged the test bulb back in. It stayed lit way past a minute. The only way to power down is disconnect the battery.

 

So im guessing i got the wiring correct on the gps connection. But im stumped as to why the load from the bulb in the accessory socket terminal allows gps to power down.

 

 

I have the Nav III and also some PIAA's mounted on the forks and wired to get power from the GPS connection. The PIAA's will turn off after about a minute when I power off the bike (if I haven't turned them off via the switch). HOWEVER, when I have the GPS in the cradle and hooked up, the lights will stay on indefinitely. . . (unless i turn them off)

 

Sounds like we have the same issue - I just assumed 'that's how it is . . " Bought the bike with both GPS and the lights already installed - the previous owner had both wired by the dealer.

 

[jmf]

Yep. Something to weird for me to figure out. I know the cradle buy itself has a current draw that's the main reason for going switched. With the cradle wired always hot it wound drain the battery it the bike set to long.( yea i know should never happen)

 

I'm looking at relaying the entire fuse block and power the gps from there avoiding this present deal.

 

Thanks for the replies and suggestions. Much appreciated.

 

Matt

[Pictou]

Seems odd to me that the cradle would draw power all by itself with no GPS but that may be the source of your problem.

 

I use a Garmin Zumo (which is basically the same as the BMW unit) and I get this issue on very rare occasions. Once or twice a season the GPS will not power down. Not sure which software version my bike has.

 

Have you tried turning the key all the way over to the lock position. My recollection from reading the manual is that this is supposed to turn the power off completely. Haven't tried this myself so no idea if it works.

 

Yep. Something to weird for me to figure out. I know the cradle buy itself has a current draw that's the main reason for going switched. With the cradle wired always hot it wound drain the battery it the bike set to long.( yea i know should never happen)

 

I'm looking at relaying the entire fuse block and power the gps from there avoiding this present deal.

 

Thanks for the replies and suggestions. Much appreciated.

 

Matt

[Ken H.]

Seems odd to me that the cradle would draw power all by itself with no GPS but that may be the source of your problem.

The GARMIN Quest is somewhat different that some of the other models - its audio (for talking) circuitry is in the motorcycle cradle itself. Or in the case of the automotive kit - in the power socket adaptor (which is also where its speaker is in that set up).

 

So yes indeed, the Quest cradle draws power on its own.

 

[BeemerLover]

IMHO forget about wiring things to the canbus. Much simpler to just wire a fuseblock directly to the battery and wire everything to that.