Disconcerting vibrations on a nearly "new" RT

[rwbloch]

I could use some perspective. I bought a beautiful '09 RT with 600 miles with the 600 mile service done and began riding it in the last few weeks. it's stock except for a Russell Day Long seat. From the get/go I noticed an uncomfortable "buzz/vibration" beginning at just over 4,000 RPM and intensifying up to about 6,500 rpm, then diminishing as I approach 7,000 RPM. It happens in just about every gear, and is felt in the grips, in the seat, and in the fairing. It is uncomfortable, distracting and you wouldn't want to ride more than a minute or so under these conditions, so I'm riding around with a usable rev range of 3,000 to 4,000 rpm.

 

I have read several comments here and elsewhere by riders who observed vibes being present during low mileage riding but then disappearing as the miles pile up.

 

I took the bike to Frank's BMW, a reputable local dealer for a look see and to do a short list of minor tweaks. They "adjusted the valves", the owner of the dealership took a test ride and pronounced that it "ran OK".

 

Today being a beautiful day in Vermont, I took the bike from the dealer on an hour plus ride. The vibrations are still there. So my question:

 

Is this as good as it gets? Is it simply a matter of putting on some more mileage? What am I (and Frank's) possibly missing? I'd like to think I could comfortably ride this bike at more than 4,000-4,500 rpm.

 

I love the bike but am a little frustrated.

 

Thank you for any ideas.

__________________

RB

 

 

[Paul In Australia]

HI RB

I have a 2008 R1200RT with 32000 kilometres ( 20000 miles).

I have a very slight buzz under hard acceleration , especially over 4000 revs. Just a buzz not a vibration and not uncomfortable. Only notice in hand grips, not seat or fairing. Yours sounds to be a lot worse than this, and therefore NOT normal ( unless you are super sensitive). I would suggest another dealer check specifically checking this problem only. Is the bike running roughly ( like a dead spark plug)?

Seems to me you may having something else rather than the well known BUZZ boxer 1200 give off.

best regards

[rglassma]

Sounds like you may need your throttle bodies re-synchronized. You did mention that the valves were adjusted but it doesn't sound like the throttle bodies were checked.

 

I would have that done if it hasn't been done before you go any further.

[rwbloch]

Thanks, that's what I fear. I rode a rented '08 RT for a week last October (had +10,000 miles on it) and it was quite smooth right up through the rev range.

 

I'm not that sensitive, but I can tell when my Multistrada needs a valve adjust.

 

I plan to talk to the dealer again tomorrow AM and see if he can shed some more light on it - and I may take it to another dealer as you suggest.

 

RB

[psmitty]

I don't know if this is the cause of your vibration or not, but my 07RT had a vibration. It vibrated so much in certain gears I had a hard time seeing my GPS screen. Come to find out it was the u-joint going out. Your RT being new and all, I wouldn't think it would be this, but I thought it worth mentioning.

[T__]

RB, kind of comes with the larger 2 cylinders.. It will get slightly better with more miles but it is still a flat 2 cylinder boxer with large pistons & has it’s inherent buzz points..

 

The basic engine is inherently a balanced engine but has some firing frequency disturbances at 4,000 RPM’s up, has some 2nd order disturbances throughout the RPM range & has a rocking couple disturbance at higher combustion loads & certain RPM’s..

 

One of the problems is BMW added a SINGLE balance shaft to the 1200 hexhead engine to remove some of the troublesome high vibration points.. That would work better if the basic engine was not a balanced design to begin with.. What that means is the balance shaft removes some harshness in some RPM ranges but adds it back in others..

 

There was also a balance shaft change sometime in very late 07 (basically 08 up).. Mainly a front case change & shaft difference.. Not sure if that changed the engine harshness or not but to me the earlier 1200 hexheads feel smoother at mid RPM,, but that could all be due to the earlier engines having lots more miles on them now..

 

My 09 1200 is getting better with miles but still not real smooth at 4000-5000 RPM’s on the freeway..

 

Adding heavier handle bar ends helps a little as well as adding handlebar mirrors (more bar end weight changes the bar disturbance frequency)..

 

How & how hard you grip the bars also makes big difference & I think as you get used to the bike you will ease your grip up somewhat & that in itself will help what you feel while riding.. Moving your feet to place the balls of your feet on the pegs can also change the foot peg vibratory input..

 

I also believe that once you start riding the bike for longer periods you will pay less attention to the engine vibration & more attention to other things & once you don’t think about the vibration it won’t bother you nearly as much..

 

Go ride the new K1300,, that ultra smooth 4 cylinder has it’s buzz points also..

 

 

Twisty

 

[rwbloch]

Thanks all for the comments. I put about 2,000 miles on a rented 08 RT last October and it had some mild "hummy' vibrations but barely noticeable at any rev point. I ride on my balls (of feet) and grip lightly.

 

I think it might be the throttle bodies need synching. This has been mentioned in forums and the dealer even mentioned that before I brought the bike in.

 

However, the write up on the service form mentions adjusting valves but nothing about throttle bodies. I will try to confirm that throttle bodies were/were not synched when serviced. After that, I guess I will just have to ride like crazy and see if it gets better.

 

RB

[T__]

RB, I would be very surprised if a TB balance would have any effect on your vibration..

 

First off I haven’t seen a late model 1200 yet that was very far out of balance.. Also at 4000 RPM’s + the throttles are open a ways so any slight air flow imbalance has less effect there than at lower RPM’s.. Most TBI balance induced issues are at higher load lower throttle openings..

 

At 4000-5000 RPM’s that is mechanical imbalance not a firing frequency issue.. Low RPM’s possibly but not at freeway speeds..

 

Run the bike up to 6-7000 RPMs in 5th gear then hold the throttle steady & kit the kill switch I’ll bet the vibration is still there as it coasts down through the 4-5000 RPM range..

 

My 09 is at under 1” of water delta at 2000-3000-4000 RPM’s & it still vibrates at freeway cruise in the 4000-5000 RPM range (that is moving right along at traffic speed++)

 

 

Twisty

 

[Lawman]

Believe it or not I had the same complaint coming to my 05 RT from an 05 Harley Electra Glide..

 

I added these to my RT and it helped.

 

http://www.twistedthrottle.com/trade/productview/2870/620/

 

I think more than anything I just take advantage of my cruise control ...I would not own this bike without cruise control..

 

[rwbloch]

Thanks to all for your comments and suggestions. Here's where we stand: I spoke to the dealer again today and he verified that when they "adjusted valves", they automatically synched the throttle bodies as has been suggested here. He also amplified his earlier comment that the bike "ran OK" by saying that he observed nothing on the test ride that he would consider unusual in the way the bike was performing, but did state that the boxer engines have a tendency to be "tight" when new and "not want to rev freely", thus confirming what has been mentioned in the forum about the need to just put some more miles on the bike and work it out a bit.

 

So, I'd like to amplify on this some more but I have to leave work early to go out and rip up some fine Vermont country roads and try to remedy this situation!

 

RB

[T__]

RB, ride it while & see if either it gets better or you get less sensitized to it..

 

I guess if you really think you have a problem go to your dealer (or a dealer) & get a ride on an 09 demo.. If that bike is better than yours then maybe you have an issue.. I guess you could have a flywheel balance issue,, a heavy piston,, or a balance shaft that is out of phase,, loose engine mounting bolt,, or some other engine balance issue..

 

Heavier bar ends do helps a little (won’t remove it though) so that might be one option..

 

 

Twisty

 

[Nice n Easy Rider]

Heavier bar ends do helps a little (won’t remove it though) so that might be one option..

Twisty

 

+1 on the MANIC Salamander bar ends. They did help on mine although they didn't eliminate the vibration completely. But I've been having so much fun riding since then that I no longer notice it. I suspect you won't notice it soon either.

[RedMac]

Heavier bar ends do helps a little (won’t remove it though) so that might be one option..

Twisty

 

+1 on the MANIC Salamander bar ends. They did help on mine although they didn't eliminate the vibration completely. But I've been having so much fun riding since then that I no longer notice it. I suspect you won't notice it soon either.

 

I put the maniac bar ends on mine as well. They do help *somewhat*. It's not night and day, but it's an improvement. I did it the first year looking to improve the vibration issue.

 

I came over from a 4 cylinder K bike and I also thought the bike had a considerable amount of "buzz". Hated it at first and thought I had made a mistake going to the twin.... However...

 

Like Nice n Easy, after the first summer I quit noticing it. :)

[jaytee]

rw,

 

I had the EXACT same issues when I bought my R1200ST used with 900miles on the ticker. I posted up on this board and was told the same thing: check that the throttle bodies have been synched, and then RIDE IT!

 

It was a LOT better by the 6k service and by 12k it was very smooth.

 

Nothing to worry about here.

 

Welcome to "boxer" land

 

JT

 

 

[BanjoBoy]

I could use some perspective. I bought a beautiful '09 RT with 600 miles with the 600 mile service done and began riding it in the last few weeks. it's stock except for a Russell Day Long seat. From the get/go I noticed an uncomfortable "buzz/vibration" beginning at just over 4,000 RPM and intensifying up to about 6,500 rpm, then diminishing as I approach 7,000 RPM. It happens in just about every gear, and is felt in the grips, in the seat, and in the fairing. It is uncomfortable, distracting and you wouldn't want to ride more than a minute or so under these conditions, so I'm riding around with a usable rev range of 3,000 to 4,000 rpm.

 

I have read several comments here and elsewhere by riders who observed vibes being present during low mileage riding but then disappearing as the miles pile up.

 

I took the bike to Frank's BMW, a reputable local dealer for a look see and to do a short list of minor tweaks. They "adjusted the valves", the owner of the dealership took a test ride and pronounced that it "ran OK".

 

Today being a beautiful day in Vermont, I took the bike from the dealer on an hour plus ride. The vibrations are still there. So my question:

 

Is this as good as it gets? Is it simply a matter of putting on some more mileage? What am I (and Frank's) possibly missing? I'd like to think I could comfortably ride this bike at more than 4,000-4,500 rpm.

 

I love the bike but am a little frustrated.

My '05 R1200ST is approaching 20,000 mi and is exactly as you describe. I tuned it up myself per the BMW DVD/manual 7,000 ago, (and that really helped from it's previous state of tune) but since then have learned some tricks from this fine forum. I ordered a JVB DVD and will check the valves and sync again soon.

 

Either way, I figure it's a good thing 'cause it encourages me to ride 75 mph or less.

[krussell]

I could use some perspective. I bought a beautiful '09 RT with 600 miles with the 600 mile service done and began riding it in the last few weeks. it's stock except for a Russell Day Long seat. From the get/go I noticed an uncomfortable "buzz/vibration" beginning at just over 4,000 RPM and intensifying up to about 6,500 rpm, then diminishing as I approach 7,000 RPM. It happens in just about every gear, and is felt in the grips, in the seat, and in the fairing. It is uncomfortable, distracting and you wouldn't want to ride more than a minute or so under these conditions, so I'm riding around with a usable rev range of 3,000 to 4,000 rpm.

 

I have read several comments here and elsewhere by riders who observed vibes being present during low mileage riding but then disappearing as the miles pile up.

 

I took the bike to Frank's BMW, a reputable local dealer for a look see and to do a short list of minor tweaks. They "adjusted the valves", the owner of the dealership took a test ride and pronounced that it "ran OK".

 

Today being a beautiful day in Vermont, I took the bike from the dealer on an hour plus ride. The vibrations are still there. So my question:

 

Is this as good as it gets? Is it simply a matter of putting on some more mileage? What am I (and Frank's) possibly missing? I'd like to think I could comfortably ride this bike at more than 4,000-4,500 rpm.

 

I love the bike but am a little frustrated.

My '05 R1200ST is approaching 20,000 mi and is exactly as you describe.

 

I'm about 21k and have the same opinion. My bike has been dealer serviced since new. I recall that things got much better at the 6k service. I would say things get better over time, but I think one component to that opinion is that I've gotten used to it, or the nerve damage it causes has made me numb to it. :-)

 

I've also learned over several bikes that what bothers one person won't bother someone else and vice versa. It's very subjective.

 

I do know that when riding two up my pillion seems to particularly enjoy the 4k-6k stretch.

 

I recently bought a Kawasaki KLR650 thumper, and have a new appreciation for just how smooth the RT truly is! The KLR vibrates so much I want off after an hour. I regularly ride all day on the RT without issue.

 

In addition to some of the other recommendations, thicker gloves, at least in the palm, and/or grip puppies can be a big help.

 

I make an effort to avoid constant speed riding as much as possible. I suspect my desire for curves and lack of desire for superslab makes me more tolerant of the vibe issue than if I cruised the highways. If highway cruising was a priority I'd likely go back to an HD Ultra. But then I'd complain about the paint shaker feeling that the HD presents at idle.

 

Finally, for all the bikes I've owned I've learned to appreciate their unique character. On the RT, the vibes you describe are character to me. :-) I haven't yet owned a sterile bike that didn't exhibit some character somewhere.

 

 

[bobbybob]

Do you have crash bars mounted? Maybe with highway pegs attached to them too? I have Wunderlich's on my 07 RT with highway pegs mounted and there is a "hard" vibration that kicks in at 3800 rpm and goes away above 5K. I can quell the vibes when I rest my feet on the hiway pegs. Obviously a resonant vibe.

[Missouri Bob]

My '05 R1200ST is approaching 20,000 mi and is exactly as you describe. I tuned it up myself per the BMW DVD/manual 7,000 ago, (and that really helped from it's previous state of tune) but since then have learned some tricks from this fine forum. I ordered a JVB DVD and will check the valves and sync again soon.

 

Either way, I figure it's a good thing 'cause it encourages me to ride 75 mph or less.

 

2005 R1200ST w/24K and exactly the same vibration "issue". Consequently, I cruise below 4500 rpm.

 

Bob

[Dave_in_TX]

I originally had the same problem with my 07 RT. In addition to the heavier bar ends and grip pupies mention by previous posters, I also added a "Cramp Buster" that alloweed me to keep the throttle open without gripping it as tightly. I also found that in many cases, the bike was smoother in 5th than it was in 6th (70-75mph). I still don't use 6th below 70 mph. As the miles accumulated the bike smoothed out. With 55K miles , it's not like a counter balanced four but it's a lot smoother than it was originally.

[Blake_Welcher]

I have a 2005 R1200RT with about 12,000 miles and experience the same problem. Adding a Remus system seamed to move the high frequency vibration point to a little higher speed. I also added foam grips which also help.

[Mugs]

I have a new 09 RT. It vibrates around 3k and under moderate acceleration below that. I don't notice vibration above that except for a buzz around 4k.

 

In 6th gear, 4k is way over the 70 mph limit and I don't go there except for occasional, brief excursions, so I wouldn't know about cruising at 5k or so. When I accelerate up through 5-7 k I feel a bit of buzz but it goes away under steady throttle.

 

I do know that the bike felt stiff in both suspension and engine vibes for the first 1,000 miles or so. It has smoothed our suspension wise and the overall vibration is getting somewhat better. I don't consider the vibration excessive except if I try to accelerate moderately below 3k rpm. I just don't do that anymore. From just over 3k on up it is not as smooth as my old goldwing, but 2 cyl vs 6 is not a good compare.

 

I agree with most here that your bike is not typical. I would look for the cause before I tried to mitigate the effect. Good riding!