Bose Wave Radios and $300 Outlet slacks

[azkaisr]

So as I was driving out to Couch's for a few days, I passed the Palm Spring Outlets on 10. Knowing I needed slacks, I parked near what I thought was the Polo Store. Now when it comes to work clothes, I tend to buy Polo, not for the name, but I have really found that they last twice as long as any other clothes. I found a pair I wanted, tried them on and only then looked to see what they cost. They were $300 and this is at the outlet!? Turns out I was in the Ralph Loren store. Now I have a couple of suits I rarely wear that run in that ballpark, but no way am I paying that much. So off to the Hilfiger store and come out with 2 pair for about $60.

 

On a lark, I walked into the BOSE store to look at the speakers. They had the famous wave radio you see on late night TV and had a few that were refurbs. Long story short, I purchased one and set it up yesterday. It has a line in for my IPOD and I can also run the TV sound on it up here in the Den. The sound quality in this room is amazing.

 

Pretty cool to see something live up to the hype. The features are limited for the price, but the sound well is clear and the package fits in the shelf the TV sits on.

 

Anyone else have one?

 

Kaisr

[skinny_tom (aka boney)]

I've got one of the portable iPod docks with the Li-ion battery. It sounds great at any volume (much better than any of the portable iPod docks that I've heard) and the battery makes it good for wherever I may be. Pricey, but worth it.

[sgendler]

I hate to burst your bubble, but you are falling for the hype rather than the product living up to it. You can find ay number of similar compact radio/speaker combos for half the price that sound every bit as good. The components in it are as cheap as they come, including the speakers. A quick google search will turn up ample criticism of the entire line of Bose products.

 

There's a reason why Bose sell predominantly from their own stores or telesales. There is no way to do a side by side comparison that way. And even in Best Buy and Circuit City and such, you'll find that their retailer agreement with Bose prevents them from setting up the Bose products in the same area with other audio gear. The Bose home theatre systems always have their own little area so you have to stand up and walk to another part of the store in order to compare it to anything. Most people don't have a critical enough ear to manage to do a meaningful comparison in that context. But Bose systems in any kind of blind head to head with equivalently priced product from other manufacturers and Bose rarely wins.

[Pilgrim]

I hate to burst your bubble, but you are falling for the hype rather than the product living up to it. You can find ay number of similar compact radio/speaker combos for half the price that sound every bit as good. The components in it are as cheap as they come, including the speakers. A quick google search will turn up ample criticism of the entire line of Bose products.

 

There's a reason why Bose sell predominantly from their own stores or telesales. There is no way to do a side by side comparison that way. And even in Best Buy and Circuit City and such, you'll find that their retailer agreement with Bose prevents them from setting up the Bose products in the same area with other audio gear. The Bose home theatre systems always have their own little area so you have to stand up and walk to another part of the store in order to compare it to anything. Most people don't have a critical enough ear to manage to do a meaningful comparison in that context. But Bose systems in any kind of blind head to head with equivalently priced product from other manufacturers and Bose rarely wins.

 

Yeah, but I like mine a lot, too. I'm not sorry I bought it 18 months ago. But like you say, ears differ. Mine are terrible.

 

Pilgrim

[bakerzdosen]

Bose is the Microsoft of the speaker world.

 

Great marketing, merely adequate products. Unfortunately, marketing usually wins for most consumers. I nearly bought an AM6 system a few years ago before I looked into it.

[Husker Red]

 

A college buddy had one and we all thought it sounded awesome. It really filled the room with music. He had it high on a shelf and it was difficult to determine where the sound was coming from. I'm sure all that smoke in the room altered our perception a bit too...

 

 

[Fugu]

ears differ. Mine are terrible.

 

Pilgrim

 

I often hear this from people w/ bad hearing when this topic comes up.

 

The only similar analogy I can think of is a nearly blind person buying books w/ small type because their eyesight is poor.

 

If you're going to get a slice of pie that's 1/12th of the total, you want to start with a little 8" pie, or a great big 18" pie?

 

 

 

 

[Boffin]

ears differ. Mine are terrible.

 

Pilgrim

 

I often hear this from people w/ bad hearing when this topic comes up.

 

The only similar analogy I can think of is a nearly blind person buying books w/ small type because their eyesight is poor.

 

If you're going to get a slice of pie that's 1/12th of the total, you want to start with a little 8" pie, or a great big 18" pie?

 

 

 

 

Poor analogy, when your hearing goes the first thing to happen is a loss of frequency response, like looking at the world through coloured glass, you can see but not all the colours. Making it louder does not fix that loss of frequency response. Poor hearing means that cheap sound systems sound the same as high-end systems. I save money and my wife suffers

 

Andy

[Fugu]

when your hearing goes the first thing to happen is a loss of frequency response

 

Yes, I understand that. Typically at high frequencies first.

 

Making it louder does not fix that loss of frequency response.

 

Who said anything about louder?

 

Poor hearing means that cheap sound systems sound the same as high-end systems.

 

Not really. At those frequencies where the subject still has good hearing, a better quality system will give them more information. Sure, response to 22khz isn't important for your average middle aged (or older) male because their ears can't hear there any more - but the quality of the information presented at 10khz sure as heck is important- perhaps more important for them as compared to somebody with great ears.

 

I stand by my vision analogy.

 

 

 

The function of the loudspeaker is to produce faithfully the audio signal. An excellent frequency response would be 20hz to 20khz +/- 3db. Bose, measured independently, comes out around 50hz to 13khz +/- 10db with a huge hole between 200 and 280hz where the crossover to the "acoustimass" module is. That's horrific by any measure. Bose thinks the stats don't matter, and to some extent I agree. Stats don't make a good speaker, but a good one won't have terrible stats.

 

Of course most consumers have no idea about this because Bose won't publish performance figures, and because they have a habit of suing anybody who says anything bad about their product. Consumer Reports, hardly a bastion of high end audiophile snobbery and resultant bias, was sued by Bose for fairly innocuous comments that were less than favorable.

 

[azkaisr]

I have used Bose Headsets on American Airlines and have a pair of a competitor. To me the BOSE headsets ARE superior. So far, like I said, I am really happy with the unit.

 

Let the bashing now continue!

[smiller]

Let the bashing now continue!

Ah but we are just puny amateurs, there is no way we could even come close the the amount of BOSE bashing found on the audio-related forums.

[bakerzdosen]

I have used Bose Headsets on American Airlines and have a pair of a competitor. To me the BOSE headsets ARE superior. So far, like I said, I am really happy with the unit.

I'm curious as to which competitor you used.

 

I've logged probably 200k miles flying with my Etymotic er-4p's (without separate amplification) and to me, there is no way I'd ever touch (again, I did try them) a noise canceling headset. With the Bose, the sound quality isn't there; Yes it cuts down on the noise caused by the drone of the engines, but it makes other ambient noises (think babies) actually seem louder.

 

I will always remember my second flight (CVG->CDG) with my er-4p's. As we were landing in Paris, I popped the plugs out of my ears. Soon after, a baby just behind us started screaming. I commented to the guy how it would have been a miserable flight had the baby been screaming the whole way. He looked at me like I was crazy. Apparently it had been screaming the whole flight.

 

Add that kind of isolation to very good sound reproduction and I'll never bother with battery operated noise reduction.

[Fugu]

I have used Bose Headsets on American Airlines and have a pair of a competitor. To me the BOSE headsets ARE superior!

 

Superior to what?

 

I thought we were talking about the Bose wave radio (and the ubiquitous "acoustimass" aka lifestyle, etc), though. I have no idea how the Bose headsets sound.

 

 

And SMiller's correct- I always found it hilarious to see posts by some "golden eared audiophile" who really, REALLY thinks that a new $300 power cable really "opened up" the sound of their CD transport talk about Bose...

 

On the one hand they firmly believe in voodoo ($10,000 and crazier speaker cables, etc.) but they completely eschew Bose's particular brand of Voodoo.

 

By the way, anybody want to buy a hardly used set of home made Mpingo style discs? Give 'em to you for half price. I make 'em in the shop with a hole saw. http://www.shunmook.com/text1.htm

 

Or I'll trade for a set of 1/4c diamond tipped isolators.

 

 

[smiller]

On the one hand they firmly believe in voodoo ($10,000 and crazier speaker cables, etc.)

Hey don't laugh... some are a scam but the ones with phase linear transconductance really do work.

[Stir]

I hate to burst your bubble, but you are falling for the hype rather than the product living up to it. You can find ay number of similar compact radio/speaker combos for half the price that sound every bit as good. The components in it are as cheap as they come, including the speakers. A quick google search will turn up ample criticism of the entire line of Bose products.

 

There's a reason why Bose sell predominantly from their own stores or telesales. There is no way to do a side by side comparison that way. And even in Best Buy and Circuit City and such, you'll find that their retailer agreement with Bose prevents them from setting up the Bose products in the same area with other audio gear. The Bose home theatre systems always have their own little area so you have to stand up and walk to another part of the store in order to compare it to anything. Most people don't have a critical enough ear to manage to do a meaningful comparison in that context. But Bose systems in any kind of blind head to head with equivalently priced product from other manufacturers and Bose rarely wins.

 

Hum...maybe. I've got the Bose Quiet Comfort 2. They truly eliminate most of the airplane's noise when I travel. I've looked other Noise Canceling, but Bose got the best marks. Even if the Panasonic's or another brand is half the price, it does not matter as the Bose does precisely what I want it to do. AZKaiser, congrats on your buy.

[Skywagon]

So one more view of Bose. This is often a similar debate in aviation. The difference in aviation is there is no separation in the demo booths of Bose vs.s any other brand. I have used nearly every aviation headset made over the last 30+ years of flying privately and commercially. Bose head sets go for a smooth $1000. Most competitors are $750 down to $500 for noise cancelling. Having tried most over extended periods of time, there is no doubt in my mind Bose runs circles around the others for quite and comfort. Where they aren't so good is in passive mode (electronics off). I have 4 of them in my airplane. I have had minor problems with them in and out of warranty and Bose fixed or replaced at no charge...warranty or not. Not all aviators share the same opinion, but most do. Most don't like the premium $$$.

 

What has that got to do with the wave radio...nothing.

[skinny_tom (aka boney)]

I hate to burst your bubble, but you are falling for the hype rather than the product living up to it. You can find ay number of similar compact radio/speaker combos for half the price that sound every bit as good. The components in it are as cheap as they come, including the speakers. A quick google search will turn up ample criticism of the entire line of Bose products.

 

There's a reason why Bose sell predominantly from their own stores or telesales. There is no way to do a side by side comparison that way. And even in Best Buy and Circuit City and such, you'll find that their retailer agreement with Bose prevents them from setting up the Bose products in the same area with other audio gear. The Bose home theatre systems always have their own little area so you have to stand up and walk to another part of the store in order to compare it to anything. Most people don't have a critical enough ear to manage to do a meaningful comparison in that context. But Bose systems in any kind of blind head to head with equivalently priced product from other manufacturers and Bose rarely wins.

 

Yawn.

 

Anything I've seen an iPod attached to that's the same size sounded like crap. No, I'm not an audiophile, an internet search geek, an electronics expert or other self-procliamed guru. I have however been around a bunch of iPod dock thingy's and pretty much think they stink. I figured the Bose system would be the same until I heard it.

 

A quick google search for (insert product here) will find credible critisism of (whatever your product.) Search for BMW Motorcycles and I'm sure you'll find a wealth of credible critisism there too. The existence of such material doesn't automatically make a product bad does it?

 

I'm sure that Bose is not the only "retailer agreement" binding company. Having one doesn't mean anything about the quality of a product. I'm willing to bet that Apple binds it's retailers pretty tightly. Are you saying Apple is crap too?

 

So far, you haven't said anything convincing.

[russell_bynum]

I hate to burst your bubble, but you are falling for the hype rather than the product living up to it. You can find ay number of similar compact radio/speaker combos for half the price that sound every bit as good. The components in it are as cheap as they come, including the speakers. A quick google search will turn up ample criticism of the entire line of Bose products.

 

There's a reason why Bose sell predominantly from their own stores or telesales. There is no way to do a side by side comparison that way. And even in Best Buy and Circuit City and such, you'll find that their retailer agreement with Bose prevents them from setting up the Bose products in the same area with other audio gear. The Bose home theatre systems always have their own little area so you have to stand up and walk to another part of the store in order to compare it to anything. Most people don't have a critical enough ear to manage to do a meaningful comparison in that context. But Bose systems in any kind of blind head to head with equivalently priced product from other manufacturers and Bose rarely wins.

 

Got examples?

 

 

I've been impressed by the Bose Wave radios, but I'm way too cheap to ever actually buy one. What is comparable or better at half the price?

[DaveTheAffable]

Got examples?

 

I've been impressed by the Bose Wave radios, but I'm way too cheap to ever actually buy one. What is comparable or better at half the price?

 

+1. Like when people say here... if no pictures, it didn't happen.

 

I'd like to know of comparable units to the Wave machine. That means size, shape, convienience, ease of use, lack of speaker wires, etc. Sure, it's a niche product... just like my Bose Quiet Comfort headphones! I use them for video editing because my editing desk is in a high traffic area of the building. Are there headphones that have a better dynamic range or frequency response? Yup. Is there a better set of headphones for me based on my experience. Nope. YEMV. (your experience may vary )

 

Congrats on your stuff Tommy.

[bakerzdosen]

Yup - I'll give you guys that. If you want something the exact size and a pretty close shape to a Wave radio, the Bose will definitely be louder, and probably sound better. I love my Klipsch iFi, but it's much bigger. (And it sounds much better.) However, you'd be hard pressed to beat the B&W Zeppelin in sound quality. (I won't even bring up the Fatman iTube ValveDock... Well, OK, beyond that mention. ) But if you want small, you guys are right. The Bose wins there.

 

Another place that Bose does indeed have a decent product is in Aviation. I'll not argue against that at all because I have no hands on experience, and I've never heard/read a negative thing about their products in that niche.

 

 

[AZKomet]

I hate to burst your bubble, but you are falling for the hype rather than the product living up to it. You can find ay number of similar compact radio/speaker combos for half the price that sound every bit as good. The components in it are as cheap as they come, including the speakers. A quick google search will turn up ample criticism of the entire line of Bose products.

 

There's a reason why Bose sell predominantly from their own stores or telesales. There is no way to do a side by side comparison that way. And even in Best Buy and Circuit City and such, you'll find that their retailer agreement with Bose prevents them from setting up the Bose products in the same area with other audio gear. The Bose home theatre systems always have their own little area so you have to stand up and walk to another part of the store in order to compare it to anything. Most people don't have a critical enough ear to manage to do a meaningful comparison in that context. But Bose systems in any kind of blind head to head with equivalently priced product from other manufacturers and Bose rarely wins.

 

Not so sure about that...my Bose home theatre gives out some spectacular sound. In some of my music I had never heard some of the crisp tunes that had always been there but absent in other home theatre settings. And it is true that others on the mkt are great in sound quality and less expensive. I for one like Bose....and others have said that it is the Microsoft of the radio world, possibly true. But just like the BMW logo it too has cheaper counterparts in the m/c industry but we ride them because of the status and the performance not seen in other machines.

 

I have often said that if Honda, Kaw and Yam put ABS, heated grips/seat cruise and better suspension on their machines I wouldn't even look twice at a BMW.

[Mike]

I suppose I should first qualify my contribution by saying that I listen to most of my music through a home intercom system that hardly sets any standards for quality sound. But, it's generaly adequate and on those rare occasions where I need more auditory gratification I have a bit better stereo system that I can use.

 

I'm by no means an audiophile, but I've had pretty good experiences with Bose products. Yes, there's a lot of marketing hype, but at their core they seem--to my middle-American ears--to produce pretty darned good sound. I owned a pair of Bose 901s a while back and thought their sound was outstanding. I bought my son a pair of 201s for his room a couple of years ago and again, to my ear, they sound pretty darned good. I've got a pair of Bose noise-canceling headphones and, apart from the fact that I don't particularly like lugging them along with me, have found that they work really well. The Wave stereos pump out some pretty darned good sound and, while not terribly cheap, are at least in the hunt as far as the price/value equation is concerned.

 

So, what I've found is that Bose offers a consistently good quality product, albeit at a somewhat premium price. For the Average Joe (or Jane), it seems a fair trade-off--you can be reasonably assured of a well-designed and above average performing product with excellent after-sales service. While they do not represent the pinnacle of audio performance, I've consistently been happy with my Bose purchases.

[russell_bynum]

Yup - I'll give you guys that. If you want something the exact size and a pretty close shape to a Wave radio, the Bose will definitely be louder, and probably sound better. I love my Klipsch iFi, but it's much bigger. (And it sounds much better.) However, you'd be hard pressed to beat the B&W Zeppelin in sound quality. (I won't even bring up the Fatman iTube ValveDock... Well, OK, beyond that mention. ) But if you want small, you guys are right. The Bose wins there.

 

That's pretty much what I was talking about. What I like about the Bose Wave is it's ability to fill the room with what sounds to me like pretty good sound, while not taking up a huge amount of real estate. It's only slightly larger than a normal clock radio. I bought Lisa a little iPod dock/clock radio thingy a while back and it's also pretty impressive for its size, but IMO not a good as Bose.