Higher gas prices, time for 4 day week?

[tallman]

Would we save enough gas by reducing the amount of commuting for a substantial number of people, or, would we use as much or more having 3 day weekends?

 

Some/many school districts go with 4 day, 10 hour work schedule in the summer.

Some Gov't agencies do this too.

I'd like to see full time implementation of programs like this.

Back in the first "gas crisis", not the 70's, WWII, we implmented drastic policies to reduce consumption.

Not advocating rationing, yet, but some form of mandatory policy to make an immediate impact.

I commute up to 110 mile/day.

I've replaced my favorite car with one that gets much better mileage. (32+ on highway)

I ride my GT which gets decent mpg.

We carpool, once in a while, but location is an issue.

I'm willing to do more, but I look for some direction from our policy makers.

What do you think, could a modified work week have a major impact?

 

[Francois_Dumas]

Isn't it true that much if not most US pastime/hobbies involve burning huge amounts of fuel in the process? In that case, it would hardly help (judging from what ya'll have stashed in your garages.... *grin*).

 

Better: more home workers, Internet workers, companies moving out to the suburbs.

 

Better also: lot less aviation traffic, kill them prize fighter airlines, stop hopping to exotic places 4 times a year.

 

Too radical?

[Paul Mihalka]

"I'm willing to do more, but I look for some direction from our policy makers."

 

Good luck to get something that is not influenced by some major lobby.

[Rob_Mayes]

That is a good idea. We need a mandated 4 day week.

 

In Illinois we mandated that car dealer are closed on Sunday. I see no reason that we cannot mandate a 4 day week.

 

The problems will be that some of us will then get part time jobs. Hey that might not be all that bad. We need to displace the illegals. I can mow yards and cook food.

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

Some/many school districts go with 4 day, 10 hour work schedule in the summer.

Some Gov't agencies do this too.

 

Ayup. We do it here. Most of the techs work a "4 10's" schedule - 4 ten hour days per week, reducing their commuting by 20%. Most of the engineers work a "9-80" schedule: every two-week pay period is comprised of 8 9-hour days, one 8-hour day, and one off day, totalling 80 hours in ten business days. Reduces commuting by 10%. not only that, but having a day off every two weeks is fantastic. In my own case, I have every other Friday off, and the Thursday right before it is my eight-hour day, so I have as long a weekend as possible.

[Mike]

Isn't it true that much if not most US pastime/hobbies involve burning huge amounts of fuel in the process? In that case, it would hardly help (judging from what ya'll have stashed in your garages.... *grin*).

 

Better: more home workers, Internet workers, companies moving out to the suburbs.

 

Better also: lot less aviation traffic, kill them prize fighter airlines, stop hopping to exotic places 4 times a year.

 

Too radical?

 

It's sensible, but the U.S. has been slow to adopt this approach. I think it's largely because of concerns about getting a full day's work out of someone if they're not under their boss's watchful eye. Most people I know who do have jobs that permit them to telecommute tell me that they actually find that they are more productive--usually what I hear is "This is such a good deal for me that I don't want to risk blowing it by goofing off."

 

Boy, I'd love to have a job like that.

[Huzband]

I like it!

 

A four day work week means more time to ride on the weekends.

 

I'll start tomorrow.

 

Bonus, Monday's a holiday.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh, wait. I'm self employed, I don't have time for such frivolity.

 

 

[tallman]

Danny,

If you're feeling pretty, I mean frivolous, I'm grilling burgers and brats on Monday.

Bring your swimsuit,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

please.

[Marty Hill]

Danny,

If you're feeling pretty, I mean frivolous, I'm grilling burgers and brats on Monday.

Bring your swimsuit,

 

Hmm, how far to tally?

 

Just kidding/don't panic.

 

 

 

 

 

 

please.

[Bob Palin]

Most of the engineers work a "9-80" schedule: every two-week pay period is comprised of 8 9-hour days, one 8-hour day, and one off day, totalling 80 hours in ten business days.

I always dreamed of working a 9/80 when I was at a corporation, I usually found myself working at least a 10/100 schedule and occasionally a 12/140 or more (In 2001 I worked 250 straight days averaging over 12 hours a day). Companies are not going to like having their salaried employees hours restricted...

[E30TECH]

My company is going to start this on 6/1. The confusing part is they want us to work 1/2 day friday (4 hours). I have requested nearly every friday off as it is a waste of time to go in for four hours.

 

I didn't see the point of my company doing this, so i came up with a way so it benefits me.

 

I doubt my company will do this next year. When they see shipments coming to a halt on Fridays....

[Dave McReynolds]

Would we save enough gas by reducing the amount of commuting for a substantial number of people, or, would we use as much or more having 3 day weekends?

 

I think the fact that you're thinking about it, along with a few million other Americans, is the important thing.

 

Gas prices just weren't at a high enough level before to affect people's decisions to any great degree. How'd you like to be an RV salesman these days? I pass an RV lot on the way home, and I sometimes feel like stopping in just to see how low they would go. Maybe I could buy one and use it as a guest house?

 

Gas prices have finally gotten people's attention, and they're starting to do things about it. New terms are entering the language: "staycation". Even the USAF is testing planes on alternative fuels.

 

Even though I'm somewhat to the left wing of this group, I don't think anything has to be mandated about 4 day weeks or anything else. I think with higher food prices, higher transportation prices, etc. people have gotten the message and are beginning to look for ways to compensate.

 

Who knows, there may eventually even be an opportunity for the re-emergence of local industries, as the higher cost of transporting goods from China opens a competitive window here.

[bmwscoot]

Well it might work for some.

As it is, Barb works in the lab @ a local hospital, and unfortunately, for some reason they stay open 7 days a week (she works a straight 5 day - 8 hour week).

 

Now, the fact that we have been carpooling since we got married in 1974, I think I'll keep my 5 day work week as well!

I have passed on a few jobs over the years when we could not have made carpooling work.

 

I wonder how much petrol we have saved by carpooling since 1974?

 

As an aside, I have not been riding the scoot as much this year...weather sucked all spring. But, sometimes I feel guilty just hopping on and "wasting a couple gallons" just for a joy ride on the scoot. Uh oh, this could be the year.

[Kitsap]

A 4 day 40 hour work week was not a viable alternative for my work group but working virtual was.

 

The past year I've been working from home 2 to 5 days a week. It has its advantages in that I can work from anywhere there is a secure internet connection. This helps save vacation time since I can work from the road while in transit to my destination. It works great accept at the Chuckwagon in Torrey

 

I feel it's important to save my commute gas for fun times out on the road.

[Lawman]

But, sometimes I feel guilty just hopping on and "wasting a couple gallons" just for a joy ride on the scoot.

 

If that's true I think you need to be riding more and working less...

[Twisties]

We have the 9/80 schedule. We're an 11,000 person top tier architect/engineering firm. Management feels it is necessary to compete for, and retain, top talent. I don't think they like it, but it saves them money: Although we have only 8 paid holiday days a year, if one falls on your 9 hour day they pay an extra hour, but if one falls on your Friday off you get nothing. On average, I've been paid about 6 fewer holiday hours a year on the 9/80 schedule.

 

It also really helps when you want to flex your schedule. For instance, I was scheduled 8 hours last Friday when I was at Torrey. I put down 4 hours of leave for Friday morning, which goes on last week's time sheet. Then for Friday afternoon, which should have also had 4 hours leave - nothing. Instead I'll work 4 hours this Friday, saving 4 hours of leave.

 

I don't know if it saves gas. I sure burned more going to Torrey than I would have commuting to work, and now I'm commuting to work anyway.

 

Anyway it's not restriction - if you are need for overtime, you are needed for overtime, just like before. Last year I didn't a Friday off for the first 6 months, all OT. Since then, I've made a pretty much perfect record.

 

We also allow work from home. But my work is usually best accomplished in person. Still, I stay home when it snows. Why fight that!

 

 

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

We have the 9/80 schedule. We're an 11,000 person top tier architect/engineering firm. Management feels it is necessary to compete for, and retain, top talent. I don't think they like it, but it saves them money: Although we have only 8 paid holiday days a year, if one falls on your 9 hour day they pay an extra hour, but if one falls on your Friday off you get nothing. On average, I've been paid about 6 fewer holiday hours a year on the 9/80 schedule.

 

So why doesn't management like it???

[Mark K]

Danny,

If you're feeling pretty, I mean frivolous, I'm grilling burgers and brats on Monday.

Bring your swimsuit,

 

 

please.

 

 

This is the first year I haven't had the pool open by Memorial Day weekend -- still in the 60's here.

[Mark K]

Most people I know who do have jobs that permit them to telecommute tell me that they actually find that they are more productive....

 

 

My wife is allowed to telecommute occasionally and she tells me she is much more productive at home -- absolutely no distractions.

[Francois_Dumas]

Most people I know who do have jobs that permit them to telecommute tell me that they actually find that they are more productive....

 

 

My wife is allowed to telecommute occasionally and she tells me she is much more productive at home -- absolutely no distractions.

 

I was asked to 'leave the office' back in 1995 already..... since I was hardly ever there anyway, and they wanted to use the space for new (local) hires.

 

I had gotten an international job and worked from home ......... and on the road, traveling all of Europe and the US for 160+ days a year.

 

So much for saving fuel... NOT!

 

But when I started my own (Internet) company, working from that home office, I've been saving TONS of fuel for not commuting anymore, not driving around Europe on 'international commute' and not flying around like a madman.

 

I figure I can use those savings now by running my touring company and for our 'leisure rides'.

 

 

[Twisties]

We have the 9/80 schedule. We're an 11,000 person top tier architect/engineering firm. Management feels it is necessary to compete for, and retain, top talent. I don't think they like it, but it saves them money: Although we have only 8 paid holiday days a year, if one falls on your 9 hour day they pay an extra hour, but if one falls on your Friday off you get nothing. On average, I've been paid about 6 fewer holiday hours a year on the 9/80 schedule.

 

So why doesn't management like it???

 

You'd have to ask them. I think they think less gets done, it can create staffing problems on Fridays, and I don't know what else. The word is the CEO hates it and is always talking about killing it. Fortunately he retired last week. We'll see what the new guy has to say.

 

Jan

[Francois_Dumas]

Now if MY employees would only have 6 or 8 vacation days in a YEAR I would worry too they would not work hard enough for me when left to it.... that's insane !

 

I guess that's why it works better (and is more accepted?) in the 'old' world where we have a normal 6 weeks vacation (except when you're self-employed of course).

[Twisties]

Paid Holiday, not vacation or sick leave. Those are separate.

 

Typically in the U.S. we get between 8 and 13 paid holidays, plus one to four weeks vacation, and 0 to 2 weeks sick leave. Disability benefits are yet separate again.

 

My company gives 8 paid holidays and three weeks combined sick and vacation a year to new employees. At 5 years of service that goes to 4 weeks combined vacation and sick.

 

Anyway, this is getting off topic...

 

Back to the show...

[PRC]

My old schedule was 12 hrs shift with rotating days off. start out working 2 days on, then 2 days off, three days on, 2 days off, 2 days on and then 3 days off and start the cycle again. I landed up working only 1/2 the year and if you took the 2 days leave after your 2 days off you turned it into a 7 day break with only burning 24 hrs of leave!

[Francois_Dumas]

Paid Holiday, not vacation or sick leave. Those are separate.

 

Typically in the U.S. we get between 8 and 13 paid holidays, plus one to four weeks vacation, and 0 to 2 weeks sick leave. Disability benefits are yet separate again.

 

My company gives 8 paid holidays and three weeks combined sick and vacation a year to new employees. At 5 years of service that goes to 4 weeks combined vacation and sick.

 

Anyway, this is getting off topic...

 

Back to the show...

 

Okay, let me rephrase that too then: a senior worker has about 30-40 paid holidays.

 

How does that sound, better?

[Albert]

I'm willing to do my part. I'll leave now. Just let me know.

[Bob Palin]

Okay, let me rephrase that too then: a senior worker has about 30-40 paid holidays.

 

How does that sound, better?

This is a linguistic problem.

In English 'Holiday' means any day off work, public holidays are called Bank Holidays.

In Amerilish a 'Holiday' is a public holiday, private holidays are called vacation (or increasingly 'personal paid leave' as sick leave and vacation are rolled into one).

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

I think they think less gets done, it can create staffing problems on Fridays, and I don't know what else.

 

I can relate to the Friday staffing issue. On any given Friday, less than half the staff is here. That could be fixed by specifying that everybody take the same Friday off, though I expect the loss of that choice would not make the employees happy.

[motoguy128]

We just need to adjust people's habits and attitudes.

 

How about a tax credit for living within 10 miles of your workplace? A larger credit for being within 5 miles.

 

How about expanding a tiered system of credit for owning fuel effecient vehicles. Maybe $100 for each vehcile averaging >25mpg (combined city/hwy), $200 >28mpg, $300/30mpg, $500 >35mpg, $1000 >40mpg. $200 for motorcycle or scooter >500cc and over. $500 for motorcycle or scooter <500cc.

[Bob Palin]

We just need to adjust people's habits and attitudes.

How about we just use it all up and get on with whatever's next?

[Francois_Dumas]

We just need to adjust people's habits and attitudes.

How about we just use it all up and get on with whatever's next?

 

Where's the challenge in that !??

[smiller]

How about expanding a tiered system of credit for owning fuel effecient vehicles. Maybe $100 for each vehcile averaging >25mpg (combined city/hwy), $200 >28mpg, $300/30mpg, $500 >35mpg, $1000 >40mpg. $200 for motorcycle or scooter >500cc and over. $500 for motorcycle or scooter <500cc.

Under that plan a motorcycle > 500cc would get a $200 credit even though it may get the same mileage as a car ( >40 mpg) that gets a $1000 credit. You are thinking like a true legislator!

 

[Marty Hill]

Right on Bob!

[Dave McReynolds]

We just need to adjust people's habits and attitudes.

 

How about a tax credit for living within 10 miles of your workplace? A larger credit for being within 5 miles.

 

How about expanding a tiered system of credit for owning fuel effecient vehicles. Maybe $100 for each vehcile averaging >25mpg (combined city/hwy), $200 >28mpg, $300/30mpg, $500 >35mpg, $1000 >40mpg. $200 for motorcycle or scooter >500cc and over. $500 for motorcycle or scooter <500cc.

 

The problem with your suggested incentives is, while they would probably encourage people to buy more fuel efficient vehicles, people could just use their savings from the incentives and from the increased gas mileage to drive more miles, or at least keep driving the same number of miles as they were before. If you really want to get people to drive less, and look for alternatives to petroleum fuel, the stick approach would probably work better. And is working better, as we can now begin to see people everywhere look for ways to cut their gasoline bill.

 

Anything we do, or the market does, to increase the price of gas will have the desired effect of getting people to figure out ways to use less gas in order to save money. We could tax fuel more, and solve some of our budget problems at the same time we were encouraging people to drive less and look for alternatives to petroleum fuel, but even if we don't do that, decreasing supplies and increasing demand will accomplish the same result in the future.

[motoguy128]

We just need to adjust people's habits and attitudes.

How about we just use it all up and get on with whatever's next?

 

That is the more likely outcome of what will happen. As supplies decrease, high prices will eventually force decreased consumption. The primary energy source for transportation will become electric.

 

How hard would it really be to only have maybe 200 miles range, where you then had to stop for 1 hour to recharge your car?

[tallman]

I think they think less gets done, it can create staffing problems on Fridays, and I don't know what else.

 

I can relate to the Friday staffing issue. On any given Friday, less than half the staff is here. That could be fixed by specifying that everybody take the same Friday off, though I expect the loss of that choice would not make the employees happy.

 

Would 4 days always mean M-Th?

Couldn't flex time for some jobs create more coverage and still reduce gas usage?

How about Monday-Thursday is one shift and Friday-Sunday is the other.

Same pay as a differential for working weekends.

Flex that schedule and it would even out for all employees.

Obviously that wouldn't work for situations like schools, but for some gov't agenicies it would actually increase availability to the average user.

For private business, if they are face to face retail, each entity could work ouot a program and have it approved for tax credits.

How about 50% tax credit of the total value of the reduction in gas usage?

Why not couple fitness and energy conservation?

Employer could provide exercise area and stationary bicycles.

Employees pedal to produce energy which is sold back to electric company.

Bonus for top "producer" (literally).

Benefits of better fitness, reduced health care costs.

Health care/insurer provider could reduce rate or provide rebate based on measurable improvement in both fitness and reduction in costs to insurer.

How about closing all the drive through windows?

Or, add a fuel surcharge for the convenience.

Park your car and walk in.

Burns me up to wait in line 5 minutes, then have the person provide immediate service to a drive up customer whilst I wait some more...

 

[Francois_Dumas]

Methinks turning down all the airconditioners to 50% (less freezing) could save you guys enough energy to go riding for the next 40 years already !

 

In fact we're real jealous of the US... you still have so many ways to make REAL energy (and cost) savings.... we've exhausted all the obvious ways long ago and now have to rely on new ideas and technologies..... and pay more tax for it....