Throttle blipping technique...

[Scriber]

...not bleeping throttle technique!

 

When entering a corner with some pace, what is the best technique for blipping the throttle to downshift smoothly and efficiently? What should the timing be on the clutch/throttle/shifter (I'm talking about the rhythm and timing of each)?

[Eschelon1]

H-D recommends once every 3 seconds at a stoplight.

 

[Scriber]

All right. I should have called the post "down shifting technique".

 

Here is my current technique:

 

- Pull in the clutch

- Blip the throttle to add about 500 to 1000 RPMs

- Down shift quickly and let out the clutch

 

I haven't been preloading the shifter. Should I? And it seems like the cadence of the whole thing should be a little different. A K12S is not the slickest shifting machine around. But I'd like to refine the down shifts. Blipping is key, but my timing doesn't seem right for some reason.

 

Does one of our seasoned instructors have some tips?

[ShovelStrokeEd]

Here's one man's opinion.

 

Don't blip except maybe to get down into first gear.

Just maintain throttle and quickly fan the clutch with a slight downward preload on shift lever.

 

The deal is, the higher gears are spaced closely together enough ratio-wise that the blip is not needed, just unloading the engine via the clutch will provide enough RPM change. Kinda like a reverse power shift.

 

It does take a bit of practice to synchronize it all and, each bike has a slightly different character. On a bike like a K12S, it shouldn't really matter much at all. 2nd and third gears should handle any road you can find keeping in mind you don't want to use the engine for slowing, that is what the brakes are for.

 

If the bike is new to you, just be patient and keep on playing with it. This is one of those situations where, if you have to think about it, you blew it. It is/should be, an automatic thing. Far more important to be concentrating on your entry line and turn-in point. After a little bit, the gears take care of themselves.

[Francois_Dumas]

Heh... I've 'blipped' all my life, but can't tell you how I do it. It is such a quick automatic action, like blinking your eyes or checking your mirrors or scanning T-6.

[T__]

...not bleeping throttle technique!

 

When entering a corner with some pace, what is the best technique for blipping the throttle to downshift smoothly and efficiently? What should the timing be on the clutch/throttle/shifter (I'm talking about the rhythm and timing of each)?

 

Scriber, I never blip as I have no way of knowing where the RPM will be after a blip.. I use a controlled steady throttle very similar to Ed’s method.. As Ed mentioned the RPM will gain just with the drive train unloaded by pulling the clutch in… For me it’s all in the throttle position & de-clutching/ down shift speed.. Do it correctly & the down shift is seamless..

 

Twisty

[Mister Tee]

I think there was a similar discussion on clutchless shifting a while back.

 

On a sportbike, for upshifts, I ease up on the throttle slightly to unload the transmission, and at the same time to reduce RPM's for the next shift as I'm shifting, normally without using the clutch. On a downshift, I do a "reverse blip" where I ease up on the throttle to unload the transmission, then immediately apply throttle to raise RPM as I'm shifting, again normally without using the clutch. Obviously this is an extremely quick process.

 

Given the wide spacing of the gears on the RT, the consensus seems to be that clutchless shifting isn't that great of an idea, and I'm using the clutch on all shifts. But I otherwise use the same throttle technique.

[Ken H.]

I don't think it is "blipping" at all. At least not for any good reason. Rather, as Ed said, the whole key to quick, smooth shifts, up or down is RPM matching. IMHO.

[ShovelStrokeEd]

That throttle technique is a good one. Far too many people think you have to add a couple of thousand RPM to achieve a good down shift, when, in fact, it usually is no more than a couple of hundred.

 

For you disbelievers, watch your tachometer when you upshift and note the difference in RPM. The same difference is required for a down shift. The spread will be a bit more when being aggressive in the twisties but, I just tend to run in 2nd or 3rd gear all the time. My bike will pull away from a stop in 2nd gear at no more than 1200 RPM and will run down to 1100 in second with no chain snatch or engine jerking. The top of second is 93 mph so there is little need for me to do any shifting on a twisty road. Even on big, long sweepers, I seldom need more than 4th which tops out at 140.

[motoguy128]

I learned to ride on a 600cc sportbike and quickly picked up rev matching for smooth downshift and because it sounds cool. (I loved watching F1 and CART on TV when I was little).

 

The R bikes are a little trickier since the engine has a lot mor inertia, and the heated grips are thicker and have a heavier spring. I have small hands and it's easier for me to blip the throttle with the brake lever pulled... but on the BMW R bikes you rarely need much braking unless riding aggressively.

 

The other good habit developed is learning to control the throttle while your index and middle finger are covering the brake. This is another "ace-up-the-sleeve" for motorcycles. You can ride around town with the brake covered while still using the throttle. In your 4 wheel "cage" you have to pick one or the other, meaning you reaction time is longer.

[Francois_Dumas]

In your 4 wheel "cage" you have to pick one or the other, meaning you reaction time is longer.

 

Not in the way my niece in Florida apparently was taught to drive an automatic.

She keeps one foot on the accelerator and the other on the brake pedal..... I was quite amazed by this (to me) extremely weird technique.... (and secretly wondered about brake lining wear and tear on her Toyota).

[Mister Tee]

In your 4 wheel "cage" you have to pick one or the other, meaning you reaction time is longer.

 

Not in the way my niece in Florida apparently was taught to drive an automatic.

She keeps one foot on the accelerator and the other on the brake pedal..... I was quite amazed by this (to me) extremely weird technique.... (and secretly wondered about brake lining wear and tear on her Toyota).

 

I was taught that technique in a police/EMT driving course once (a segment of a race school I attended.) But no, I don't actually drive an automatic like that.

[Francois_Dumas]

Racing with automatics? Another novel concept

[Wyn]

H-D recommends once every 3 seconds at a stoplight.

 

 

[wsearl]

Don't blip except maybe to get down into first gear.

Just maintain throttle and quickly fan the clutch with a slight downward preload on shift lever.

 

I tried this on the weekend and I like it a lot. I have used the blipping technique previously and it works OK but, it is more time consuming and usually is happening at a time when all your concentration resourses are needed elsewhere e.g. approaching an intersection. If you have left your downshifting a bit late, the time wasted using the blipping technique can compromise your rediness for the following actions you need to take.

The other thing I noticed with the blipping method is that unless you get the revs just right when you let out the clutch after the downshift, the engine braking is more severe than intended which can be uncomfortable (certainly for a pillion) and have bike control consequences as well.

[ShovelStrokeEd]

The same technique works well for upshifts too, provided you wish to continue accelerating.

 

The biggest mistake most people are making when they complain about rough shifting on the BMW motorcycle is too large a throttle movement. Once you understand the relationship between engine speed in the gears and the ratios of the next higher or lower gear, the problem of rough shifting just goes away.

[Wyn]

The same technique works well for upshifts too, provided you wish to continue accelerating.

 

The biggest mistake most people are making when they complain about rough shifting on the BMW motorcycle is too large a throttle movement. Once you understand the relationship between engine speed in the gears and the ratios of the next higher or lower gear, the problem of rough shifting just goes away.

 

Right on the money!!

[Mister Tee]

Racing with automatics? Another novel concept

 

That would be funny huh. Actually, that training was bundled in with the school package, but our actual race training vehicles were standard stick Toyotas. The police/EMT training vehicles were stripped out Dodge Diplomat pursuit specials with roll cages and five point harnesses.