B(reak) M(y) W(allet)

[Rob_Mayes]

I was on another forum and a contributor referred to BMW as "Break My Wallet".

 

So far I have found the purchase prices and replacement parts/labor are very comparable to other brands.

 

What do you think?

[effexer1]

Ever bought a Honda oil filter and Honda branded oil, or a harley chrome part? I find they are all expensive when you are talking "dealers".

 

I don't think BMW is any worse than the rest. The main reason BMW got that moniker is that, when they break, they break big things, like final drives and clutch splines and stuff that other manufacturers don't have problems with. Hopefully the newest generation of BMW's has the design and engineering straightened out.

[stubble!]

Everywhere I look, a new beemer is significantly more expensive that a comparably-specced other brand. It could be argued that beemers have better off-paper specs like build quality, warranty, etc, and that stuff is worth something.* But even so, I think it's pretty clear that you pay extra for the badge, throughout the model range.

 

* I'd tend to agree, generally, and in fact that's why my last two bikes have been used BMWs instead of new 'something else' for the same or less money.

[GregB]

Very comparable - I currently own a Ducati, Honda, KTM in addition to BMWs.

Also, I own a mail order auto parts business specializing in European cars. Those customers whine about the prices also. Frequently whining hardest about items that are downright inexpensive. People just have no clue. The other "facts" that "everyone knows" tend to be completely false or years out of date.

The one thing about prices that I have found is that the European companies tend to be inconsistent about prices, some items are too cheap and some are too high. They should work to make them consistent. People that buy the black sunvisor clip that is $2 and should be $5 don't notice. People that need the same item in beige for $13 do remember and think everything is high.

[Francois_Dumas]

I don't think anyone buys a BMW to get a cheap bike....

[AZKomet]

I was on another forum and a contributor referred to BMW as "Break My Wallet".

 

So far I have found the purchase prices and replacement parts/labor are very comparable to other brands.

 

What do you think?

 

 

Don't know about that.....my 08 KLR 650 mysteriously toppled over in the barn last month. Only damage was the choke lever and bent shifter. $ 1.99 for the choke lever and $23 for a shift lever. 6 months ago I stripped a rather harmless bolt on my RT.... $13.00 for a 2 inch long bolt. Hmmmmm...I am not agreeing with ya on this one.

 

BTW I get lifetime oil changes for the KLR for $ 19.99 includes filter oil and labor. Does BMW offer that???

[Mister Tee]

No, but people do expect reliability. The one thing I find a bit aggravating is that in general, maintenance is more difficult and expensive compared to other similar bikes. I'm sure it's a ways off, but the prospect of replacing the clutch scares me. And you'd think that they would come up with a throttle body and linkage assembly that doesn't require frequent syncs. Every 6,000 miles is assinine.

[BUSTED]

I often hear BMW referred to as, "Bring More Wallet!"

[tallman]

Motorcycle Consumer News did a comparison between the K1200 LT, Goldwing, and HD Electra Glide(I think that model).

5 years

15,000 miles/year

75,000 miles total

all scheduled maintenance

cost of purchase

value of resale

 

#1 BMW best value based on cost which was lowest

#2 Honda fairly close

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

#3 by quite a bit the HD

 

YMMV

[baggerchris]

My experience has been that BMW costs are in line with my costs for my HD. (Hundred Dollars). One thing to note, is that I have been looking at a new 650 Vstrom, which is almost 1/2 the cost of a new 800 GS, but where the weestrom has a 1 year unlimited milage warranty, the Beemer has a 3 year 36 K warranty, and if you google Suzuki V-strom dl650 review you will come up with a very good site where Mark from California Scientific has taken his vstrom over a lot of territory and written about it. He has now put a big disclaimer on the from which says: Suzuki does not honor warranties" Oink! Looks like a great bike, with lousy support from the maker, maybe.

[Paul Mihalka]

I think part of problem is that BMW bikes have a (deserved) reputation of going into high mileage, and are purchased by riders who do high mileage. Many BMW riders will run out of warranty by mileage and not by time. Late series BMW bikes, I would say starting with the oilhead series, are more susceptible to mayor incapacitating failures than the older bikes. I am talking about Hall sensors, clutch splines, rear drives, clutch slave cylinders oiling the clutch. These failures are not as frequent as some may suggest, but they are items that basically just should not fail. I do ride high mileage and I experienced every failure on the above list, so on my part it is not anecdotal. When they happen, they can happen in the middle of nowhere where Roadside Assistance does not reach you - and I'm not talking Africa or Bolivia, but Arkansas 60 miles West of Memphis - and getting the bike and yourself out of there and repair the bike will cost you BIG MONEY.

Just in case, I love BMW bikes for what they are and I am selling them for the last twenty years. But I am not blinded.

[russell_bynum]

No, but people do expect reliability. The one thing I find a bit aggravating is that in general, maintenance is more difficult and expensive compared to other similar bikes. I'm sure it's a ways off, but the prospect of replacing the clutch scares me. And you'd think that they would come up with a throttle body and linkage assembly that doesn't require frequent syncs. Every 6,000 miles is assinine.

 

FWIW, I found most of the routine maintenance on my R1100's to be pretty easy. The frequency of maintenance pissed me off, but everything was pretty easy.

 

Yes, replacing the clutch is a pain in the ass compared to a bike with a multi-plate wet clutch hanging out there on the side (I can change my dirt bike clutch in less time than it took to take the fairings off the RT. ) but the other side of that is it'll last a very long time. Getting 100K+ out of a clutch is not uncommon assuming you don't lose a seal and oil it up, or something like that.

 

The price of the official BMW parts pissed me off (which is the same for BMW cars, by the way). Fortunately, with this forum and others on the interwebs, there's a good stock of information on suitable replacement parts...so you don't have to buy the $60,000 BMW O2 sensor, you can go to Auto Zone and buy the exact same sensor (for a Ford Mustang or somesuch) for $60.

 

The routine maintenance is pretty easy, though.

Fluid changes: Pretty much like any other fluid change.

Oil filter: You need a special wrench to reach the damn thing, but with the right tool, it's easy.

Valve adjust: Somewhat time-consuming, but very easy.

TB Sync: Very easy.

 

 

My issue wasn't that the maintenance was difficult, it's just that I was doing it too often. My other bikes require more frequent oil changes (thanks to the clutch, transmission, and engine sharing the same oil), but that's so quick that it doesn't bother me. Doing a 6K on the RT took much longer.

 

I also didn't like how long it took to get the fairings off so I could start working on the bike. I realize that an RT's got a lot of fairing and that's one of the things that makes it such a good bike, but I wish they'd use Dzus fasteners instead of all of those silly little allen screws.

[russell_bynum]

I think part of problem is that BMW bikes have a (deserved) reputation of going into high mileage, and are purchased by riders who do high mileage. Many BMW riders will run out of warranty by mileage and not by time. Late series BMW bikes, I would say starting with the oilhead series, are more susceptible to mayor incapacitating failures than the older bikes. I am talking about Hall sensors, clutch splines, rear drives, clutch slave cylinders oiling the clutch. These failures are not as frequent as some may suggest, but they are items that basically just should not fail. I do ride high mileage and I experienced every failure on the above list, so on my part it is not anecdotal. When they happen, they can happen in the middle of nowhere where Roadside Assistance does not reach you - and I'm not talking Africa or Bolivia, but Arkansas 60 miles West of Memphis - and getting the bike and yourself out of there and repair the bike will cost you BIG MONEY.

Just in case, I love BMW bikes for what they are and I am selling them for the last twenty years. But I am not blinded.

 

What he said.

[Francois_Dumas]

No, but people do expect reliability. The one thing I find a bit aggravating is that in general, maintenance is more difficult and expensive compared to other similar bikes. I'm sure it's a ways off, but the prospect of replacing the clutch scares me. And you'd think that they would come up with a throttle body and linkage assembly that doesn't require frequent syncs. Every 6,000 miles is assinine.

 

I'll start moaning when I encounter my first problem

[exwingnut]

Please ^^^^touch wood...

 

The gods are listening.

[AdventurePoser]

I was on another forum and a contributor referred to BMW as "Break My Wallet".

 

So far I have found the purchase prices and replacement parts/labor are very comparable to other brands.

 

What do you think?

 

I thought it was "Bring more Wampum."

 

Steve in So Cal

[ckatopodis]

I thought it was Bring Money in a Wheelbarrow.

[Christian_rider]

BEST MOTORCYCLE in the WORLD

[BUSTED]

Bowel Movement on Wheels.....was told to me by one of The Chosen Few MC members!

[steve.foote]

Never forget that the cheapest thing on a BMW is the rider.

[Dennis Andress]

It's all relative.....

 

[Deadboy]

I thought it was Bring Money in Wads....

[George Brown]

I thought it was Bring Money in a Wheelbarrow.

Long before I had my BMW bike and in reference to their autos I was told Big Money Wasted

[Flash9677]

I thought it was Beer Motorcycles Women at least that's what my t-shirt says

[tallman]

Bitch, Moan, & Whine.

Because that describes some of the owners behaviour.

[Paul Mihalka]

Bitch, Moan, & Whine.

Because that describes some of the owners behaviour.

Tim, I know the feeling. I too work at a dealer...

[Ben_Ricci]

Bitch, Moan, & Whine.

Because that describes some of the owners behaviour.

 

That’s kind of an unfortunate thing to say, particularly when the OP was probing opinions regarding the relative cost of parts. But as is typical things digress. I’ve been resisting the great temptation to say BMW more likely stands for POS, but I know my situation is unique; nonetheless it’s my experience with the brand:

 

6,000 miles (rear engine seal & clutch):

 

9,000 miles (clutch slave cylinder leak + new front rotors):

11,000 miles (likely transmission shaft seal—being repaired as I type):

 

I’m a customer of Paul’s and his dealership (despite a few minor glitches) has done everything possible to keep my ST on the road. I’m certain there are customers that are unreasonable, but there are also many who have a right to be dissatisfied and it is not unreasonable for them to make their opinion known.

 

I still like my dealership. I still love my bike. I just wish it was less prone to repair regardless of the cost or brand.

 

Sort of flies in the face of BMW's reputation, doesn't it?

[Paul Mihalka]

Ben, if every customer was like you, selling or servicing bikes would be just one step before heaven!

[SageRider]

Ben, if every customer was like you, selling or servicing bikes would be just one step before heaven!

Ben's not going postal, is he???

[BrianT]

I wouldn't call $800 valve checks and $3,000 for shocks comparable to other brands. Yea I enjoy BMW bikes and have to swollow that pill to ride the bike I like. But I definitly wouldn't call those prices for maintence and wear items comparable to other brands.

[GregB]

Service including valve adjust on my 650 was $131 including tax and that is a BMW. It is just a BMW that is easier to work on and requires less routine maintenance.

 

A Boxer motor with push rods and rocker arms is going to be a lot more work and need adjustment more often than many other designs. Ducati service was $600 ten years ago and that was 2 valve motor. Has to be far worse today and a 4 valve worse than that.

 

You hear people whine about price of saddle bag on BMW. My friend just paid $450 for one for his R1100RT. I assume the painted one for my R1200RT would be more. There is a whine session on advrider.com now about $1200 for one for a Honda ST1300. Honda parts that I have bought have been no cheaper for similar pieces except for some XR70 parts but then they haven't changed that model forever and built about 12 trillion of those.

 

One of my employees was service manager for a large HD dealer and I have heard LOTS from him about crazy overprices parts on those and he is service manager of my Jaguar shop before and after working for HD dealer. BMW really should figure out how HD gets the clientelle eager and proud to be overcharged.

 

BMW probably should figure out how to be less arrogant also but they aren't even close to being as arrogant as Honda as a corporate entity. They may have a small number of big warranty issues but things get really ugly when it happens.

[ShovelStrokeEd]

Brian,

That valve check on your GT is about on par with what Honda wants do to do the same on my Blackbird. Actually checking the valves is the easy part. Dismantling the bike far enough to access the valves is where all the time/money is. That and having to pull the cams to replace a shim.

 

This is kinda the price you pay when you buy a performance machine. Pushrods and rockers would limit your engine to 8K RPM or so and make it taller, along with messing with the port locations and the like.

[Matts_12GS]

This is kinda the price you pay when you buy a performance machine. Pushrods and rockers would limit your engine to 8K RPM or so and make it taller, along with messing with the port locations and the like.

 

That's an interesting point Ed.

I remember years back comparing outboard motors and I was shown where my existing mercury outboard made the same power on fewer cubic inches than the OMC engine I was looking at. Thus it was lighter and performed better on the same platform. Seems to me that part of the reason that the BMWs and the Ducatis seem to have more frequent maintenance is that it's required to keep these motors operating in that higher state of tune that allows them to run so well.

[Bud]

Hey Neighbor,

 

I drink the kool aid, I wear the underwear, and I try to save money by doing what I can myself.

 

The very best way to save a big bunch of money on a BMW is buy used. I would really be PO'd if I bought a new one and had to sell it two years later and take such a beating. Thank God for all of the folks who buy new, so I can buy used.

 

I do wonder, in 2020, will the "old" 2008 R 1200 GS bikes be thought of as more reliable than the then current offerings?

[JayW]

I wouldn't call $800 valve checks and $3,000 for shocks comparable to other brands...

 

If all you ask for is a valve check, then it should only cost about $120. Also, ESA shocks are not $3000 - they are $2505.

 

Sheez, some people! 'Course that's just for the parts, so then you have to pay big bucks to get them installed, so I guess you're right.

 

Jay

[ShovelStrokeEd]

Not on a GT, an oilhead or hexhead yeah.

By the time you get the bike dismantled enough to get the cam cover off, you are already 2-3 hours of labor into the job. Same for putting it all back. Checking the valves is simple, adjusting requires cam removal/replacement, 2 more hours.

[BrianT]

Brian,

That valve check on your GT is about on par with what Honda wants do to do the same on my Blackbird. Actually checking the valves is the easy part. Dismantling the bike far enough to access the valves is where all the time/money is. That and having to pull the cams to replace a shim.

 

This is kinda the price you pay when you buy a performance machine. Pushrods and rockers would limit your engine to 8K RPM or so and make it taller, along with messing with the port locations and the like.

Guess I was spoiled by the previous 20 minute valve adjustments on the RT that were far cheaper. Not to mention being simple enough to do it myself for no cost.

 

I'm curious to see what the maintenance cost of a K1200GT, Concourse 14 and FJR1300 over say 36,000 miles would be to see which one really is more expensive. That way we're comparing apples to apples. Sounds like I may have some homework.

[Don Miller]

Comparing my '02 RT with my '07 Honda ST1300, the labor rate is comparable. So far, my limited experience with parts is that they are appreciatively less for the ST. So too, the 600 mile service. I did the oil/filter/final drive oil. The dealer did the rest and charged me $34 for the 600 mile service. The next scheduled service (valve adjustment, primarily) is at 16,000 miles. The longer service intervals should result in lower cost of ownership than my RT. Time will tell.

[dduelin]

My ST1300 costs have been oil, filters, tires, three quarts of brake fluid (3 flush & replacements a normal service at 12K), two sets of brake pads, a thermostat, a gallon of antifreeze and a taillight bulb to 44,000 miles. I do my own maintenance. I bought an aftermarket rear shock at 40,000. The OEM replacement is $465 if I had replaced it with OEM.