Happy Man NO HAPPY!!!! Need Help with Stuck Tupperware Screw!

[HappyMan]

One of the screws holding on the Tupperware, the one of six that thread into the top of the gas tank, is spinning. I've tried applying pressure to it while backing it out but to no avail. In fact I've chipped the paint off while trying!!

 

Happy Man is not happy!!! From what I can tell I'm going to have to cut the head of the screw off and then try to remove it from the tank. Once that is done I'm not sure how I will fix it.

 

Anyone ever have this problem or have some words of advice? I've stepped out of the garage before I started throwing things........If I cut the screw (Provided I can get something to cut it into the space provided) am I going to need to replace the tank? I'm thinking of not putting the screw back in and maybe just gluing the head in it's place for appearances.

 

HELP!! On a brighter note, I'm picking up my new DR650 tomorrow.

[E30TECH]

I'm not sure what to do other than maybe drill into it (if its even possible since it spins) and use an easy out. THis would allow you to put a lot of pressure on it while lifting. If that doesn't work, maybe you can epoxy the torx bit into the screw head. This will allow you to lift and twist at the same time.

 

The main reason I wanted to reply is to let you know you wont have to buy a new tank. There are inserts in there, and you stripped it.

 

I would consider masking the area around the screw so you dont F up the paint anymore.

 

Good idea to walk out/ I like to throw things too

[ShovelStrokeEd]

Can't offer much advise on how to get the damn thing off short of a Dremel tool. Once off, you will find a nut that looks about 1/2 pop rivet, 1/2 nut. You need a new one. The good news is that McMaster Carr can probably sell you one, they are called Pem nuts, check spelling. May not be available in metric, or they may, but an 8-32 will make a good substitute for size. You might also look for a gadget called a Rivnut, again, spell. Either will require an installation tool to match.

 

Spend a little time in the catalog and you can find just about anything you need. They ain't cheap but they have the stuff.

[HappyMan]

My description of which screw was misleading. This is not the Torx screw that goes around the fuel cap but one of the six allen head screws (three per side) that are part of the main fairing and screw into the center section of the tank to either side of the filler cap. Currently I can not get the left side of the tupperware off because of this one screw holding it on.

 

With that information does it change any of the advice the two of you gave me? Thanks very much for your advice. I'm ready to blow a gasket so any ray of hope is helpful.

[Couchrocket]

See if you can get something "under" the head of the screw. Something thin, plastic, w/ a "long-ish" handle on it so that you could apply gentle "up pressure" on the underside of the screw head. If you can do that, try using the smallest lenght allen wrench you can to apply "gentle" couter-clockwise spin on the wrench as you gently "up lift" the screw head. It might enable the threads to engage enough to start lifting out.

 

If that don't work, the other posters have the right ideas.

[HappyMan]

Unfortionately gentle up pressure (and not so gentle) has not worked. In fact the not so gentle pressure is what has caused the paint to be marred. Even though it was well protected I applied enough pressure to crack the paint. I've tried every trick in the book so far to apply upward pressure for the last several hours but to no avail.

 

Thanks!

[HappyMan]

Do any of you think it might be possible to pull the insert out if I remove all of the remaining screws holding the tupperware on. Since I need to replace it anyway if I could pull it out I could chop it off after the tupperware is removed. I'll go and try it but if any of you have an opinion before I do I'd love to hear it.

[Quinn]

Can you solder or exopy a hex bit to the screw head? If so, you can then spin it at rapid reverse speed while gently lifting and wear off the rest of the threads so it will come out. You've already ruined the insert anyway. If you can get it up far enough you can get nippers under the head.

Other suggestion would be to find some way to hold the screw head still while you drill it for an easy out to finish destroying it.

[HappyMan]

Good thoughts. I can get a hold of it and drill it for an easy out but I didn't feel an easy out would work. Please correct me if I am wrong but an easy out will help me if I've got a stripped head. Since my problem is that the T-Nut (or whatever the insert is called) is spinning. If I put in an easy out will it not just spin?

[Yeeha! Stephen]

T'were my repair, my method would be to drill the head off of the screw first and remove the tupperware to prevent and more damage to paint/plastic.

 

Then I would find a way to pin the insert down and remove the screw by other means.

 

If the screw won't turn loose, I'd pry the insert out and glue/JB Weld/epoxy, etc... another one in it's place.

 

I haven't found it on the microfiche yet, but there's bound to be a replacement insert of some kind. If not, I'd make one.

[HappyMan]

My thoughts exactly. That is where I'm headed and you just confirmed it for me. I just came in from looking it over and drilling out the head seems to make the most sense. Thanks!

 

O.K. Thanks to all that posted. Any more thoughts from you would be welcome. I'm going to bed before I do something stupid and attack this sometime tomorrow. Now I will go dream about my new bike to be picked up in the morning. Ride it 'till I can't stand anymore and haven't the will to throw things in my garage and tackle the RT then.

 

Danke!!

[Sidmariner]

I would epoxy the screw as it sits into the fairing, so that it will not turn. Then, I'd carefully drill out the center of the screw. This will be a long slow process, requiring a series of progressively larger and very sharp carbide steel bits. Once the centre of the screw is drilled out, the fairing should lift off. You will then have to break out the head of the screw which remains epoxied into the fairing...more careful drilling I'm afraid, but a larger bit will probably bite and snap it out.

[Ken H.]

Put a slightly oversize drill bit into the head of the screw and then with a drill spin the screw insert and all until the insert releases the rest of the way from the tank. Some speed is needed. The insert is shot at this point anyway. Once released you can cut it loose from the underside of the tupperware when it is completely off.

 

To my knowledge there is no repair kit or similar for a missing insert. They are molded into the tank.

 

But your idea of just faking in a head for cosmetics is a good one. Two will hold the tupperware for that side on just fine.

[Eckhard Grohe]

Any spinning that will allow the insert to release from the tank will also tend to damage the tupperware. I concurr with the suggestion to use some epoxy and bond the screw head to the tupperware and use progressively larger drill bits to drill off the head. The plan would be to drill a hole larger than the minor diameter of the screw. You do not have to go deep just far enough get to the body of the thread.

 

Use oil to lube the drill bit and run the drill relatively slowly as the screws are made of stainless.

 

Another method would be to Dremel the head off. But that requires a deft hand and a well masked off area and lots of patience so as not to over heat the screw and melt the tupperware.

[Ben_Ricci]

I would epoxy the screw as it sits into the fairing, so that it will not turn. Then, I'd carefully drill out the center of the screw. This will be a long slow process...

 

I don't have a better suggestion and I'm not trying to be a know-it-all, but I'm curious due to my own ignorance about such matters. Wouldn't the friction from the drilling create sufficient heat to break the epoxy bond? I'm just curious.

 

In any case I hope Happy Man gets the deed done with minimal calamity and cosmetic damage.

[10ovr]

Have you tryed a high speed air tool ,!/4 drive impack gun,some times if you can get the screw turning faster than the clip,It well come loose!!!

[10ovr]

Can you take the gas cap off and remove top and side panel off at the same time,Was looking at an 1100 rt in my shop,seams like it wood work!!

[E30TECH]

Can you solder or exopy a hex bit to the screw head?

 

Solder wont work as it will have to be hot for the solder to take and will melt the plastic.

[Fugu]

Can you take the gas cap off and remove top and side panel off at the same time,Was looking at an 1100 rt in my shop,seams like it wood work!!

 

This sounds like a good plan - how does that center section come off?

 

Or get all the other screws off and get something wedged in underneath the tupperware to slow down the spinning of the insert enough to get the screw to release from it.

 

now that I'm scared to touch tupperware screws I wonder what caused this- overtightening the screw, perhaps? Regular wear/ tear?

 

Good luck.

 

I don't know how you'll get the epoxy off the tupperware if you glue that head in to drill the bolt.

 

If the bolt's loose enough, can you grab it with needlenose to drill its head out?

 

One other thing you might consider is using a conical grinding bit from a Dremel to grind its head off - not as prone to slippage at reasonable speeds as a drill bit cutting that steel - will take longer, but will be a little safer -just put the tip of the cone in the torx hole and apply gentle pressure.

 

Mask the area well, double thick- duct over masking tape?

[10ovr]

Can you take the gas cap off and remove top and side panel off at the same time,Was looking at an 1100 rt in my shop,seams like it wood work!!

 

This sounds like a good plan - how does that center section come off?

 

I think the only thing holding the top panel is the 6 gas cap screws,,

[notacop]

I like the Dremel/grind off the head approach. There are fine bits like dental stuff that should make short work of the offending fastener. Ya'll could always glue a dummy head in the opening when the jobs all done. There are entirely too many hold downs as it as now.

Patience and loud 'talking to god" epitats always work for me!

Then go throw the cat or offer a small animal for good luck.

[HappyMan]

O.K. Update on how it all ended. Thanks for all the advice. Stopping last night and taking the new bike out today definitely helped the "Un-Happy Man" mentality I was suffering with. By the way, I don't need an excuses to throw a cat.... Just kidding! Don't start the nasty emails cat lovers.....

 

Here is how it all came down. I could not take off the center section since the side panel holds it on. I did remove all screws and tried prying upward to slow the spinning but to no avail. I ended up drilling out the screw and popping off the head. Once the tupperware was removed I was then able to remove the center section. Tried like hell to get the remaining bolt out or to remove the T-Nut or whatever it's called. No luck. Took out the dremel and cut down the bolt flush with the tank. Then I tried to drill out the bolt. I had a good start but it eventually worked it's way sideways and started digging into the tank. At that point the point was moot and called it done. I put the tupperware back on. I could start a whole new post about getting the rubber O-Ring back re-seated. What's up with that??? I sheered off the bolt and left a 1/4" stem. Glued it in place and touched up the paint. I had some BMW paint on the shelf.

 

Now I hope my fairing doesn't rip off cruising down the road. If the Germans put that screw in it MUST be important. They would never over engineer anything ya know.

 

Now some asked how this happened. The bike is eleven years old now and I've only removed the tupperware once. Obviously I cross threaded it. I'm really careful about that so I'm a little shoked and emberassed. However, while putting the screws back in I had at least two screws that did not cross thread but did start to slip in the tank. I've got to tell you that that scares me to death and I'm real gun shy to take it off again. Next time I do I might cry.....

 

Thanks everyone!!!!! Time to go ride some dirt.

[notacop]

Happy ending, Happyman. Life is good.

I had a friend who was always suggesting that a sacrifice of a small animal, ant, cat, possum...etc. would make the project gods happy and the task could be sucessfuly completed. We would never do such a thing but knowing we had concidered it made us better mechanics.

Sacrifice didn't help the Incas fend off the Spammish. But they felt better.

[Michael_T]

Obviously, "we" are offering the wrong "sacrifice". My experience that "sacrificing" a braut and many "german" beers of your choice before, during and after a project using works as an appeasement of the aryan motocycle gods.

 

Just for the record, don't drink/eat and ride. This is just a "drink/eat and fix project" approach.

 

Michael