Bike to bike communciation on the PP Run

[Bud]

Do any, all, most or ? of the folks doing the Pied Piper Run have any B2B communication set up? CB, FRS ?

[Firefight911]

B2B. Probably channel 2.

[Ken H.]

We have B2B FRS. As mentioned, often this bunch sits on 2.0

[Bud]

Phil and Ken,

 

I currently don't have any speakers/mic in my Nolan flip up helmet. So I'm looking for an economical (that's S. IL talk for cheap ) way to do this.

 

Any advice is appreciated. FYI I have a Motorola T5950 Talkabout radio. Has headphone jack but I don't see a PTT jack. Is the same jack used for both?

 

I've seen the B2B thread here but I'm still in the dark if the Midland speaker/mic/PTT talk combo would work on my radio.

[90RedRider]

If your RED RT - Too Fast is like mine , you will normally be moving faster than the sound waves. So out of reach anyway , just a thought.

As for helpful information , I am also trying to get some communication via a midland CB radio and am pretty sure I know less than you , sorry.

[Bud]

If your RED RT - Too Fast is like mine , you will normally be moving faster than the sound waves. So out of reach anyway , just a thought.

As for helpful information , I am also trying to get some communication via a midland CB radio and am pretty sure I know less than you , sorry.

 

Yah, that's the problem, I'm riding too fast.

[Redbrick]

Phil and Ken,

 

I currently don't have any speakers/mic in my Nolan flip up helmet. So I'm looking for an economical (that's S. IL talk for cheap ) way to do this.

 

Any advice is appreciated. FYI I have a Motorola T5950 Talkabout radio. Has headphone jack but I don't see a PTT jack. Is the same jack used for both?

 

 

I have a T5950 Motorola set also but not using them BTB....Try talking to Porttronics...They make accessories for these radios....(800) 322-6872 and www.porttronics.com...

They have a VOX headset but it is not bike specific....Wind and ambient noise may be a problem I was told...

 

Phil......Redbrick

[Bud]

Well, I went ahead and ordered this and will let you know how it works when it shows up.

[Redbrick]

Bud.......I'll be interested in the compatibility of the Midland headset and the Motorola radios...I saw these in Fry's (big electronics store) the other day.......That's a much better headset for bike use than the Motorola set up that wasn't made for it....

 

 

Phil.......

[Bud]

Phil,

 

The shipped today so it will most likely be next week some time before it shows up.

 

The photo doesn't show a boom mike the but the description said it was included. I will take a photo of what shows up and post it.

[KMG_365]

I hope it works out for you! Riding in a group that can communicate going down the road is like a whole 'nuther experience--even if you can only monitor!

 

I'm glad to see that it comes with PTT, as using VOX to transmit (especially a cheap version without noise-cancelling mics) usually can be annoying for the group in this situation as it's invariably going off in the wind and tying up the channel, cutting off your words or generally disturbing the rest of the group.

 

Yes, 2/0 has been the default simply because it accomodates the majority of different hardware setups (ham guys, FRS, GMRS, expensive, cheap, etc.), but as we join up in person and see what we've all got we can find another frequency. Especially going near any populated areas, 2/0 can get annoyingly "chatty".

 

On a previous Mini-Pied Piper from Torrey to Un-II in Eureka Springs, AR, AZAl set up the whole riding group with impromptu set-ups to at least monitor. It's a great sales job, as once you've tried it . . . you're HOOKED!!

 

Did I mention how excited I'm getting already??

[Redbrick]

Phil,

 

The shipped today so it will most likely be next week some time before it shows up.

 

The photo doesn't show a boom mike the but the description said it was included. I will take a photo of what shows up and post it.

 

Thank......Appriciate info......And thanks to Jamie for the VOX noise issue info...Novice here with this stuff.....

 

Phil........Redbrick

[Bud]

I hope it works out for you! Riding in a group that can communicate going down the road is like a whole 'nuther experience--even if you can only monitor!

 

I'm glad to see that it comes with PTT, as using VOX to transmit (especially a cheap version without noise-cancelling mics) usually can be annoying for the group in this situation as it's invariably going off in the wind and tying up the channel, cutting off your words or generally disturbing the rest of the group.

 

Yes, 2/0 has been the default simply because it accomodates the majority of different hardware setups (ham guys, FRS, GMRS, expensive, cheap, etc.), but as we join up in person and see what we've all got we can find another frequency. Especially going near any populated areas, 2/0 can get annoyingly "chatty".

 

On a previous Mini-Pied Piper from Torrey to Un-II in Eureka Springs, AR, AZAl set up the whole riding group with impromptu set-ups to at least monitor. It's a great sales job, as once you've tried it . . . you're HOOKED!!

 

Did I mention how excited I'm getting already??

 

No, I can't tell.

 

I've never ridden with B2B. One good reason to listen is when when Phil starts screaming "Cops, cops, cops" as he rides point, collects the ticket while the other Pied Pipers slow down and pass him on the side of the road. (With a very polite, almost imperceptible nod of the helmet, out of respect.)

 

Thanks Phil.

 

 

 

At the very worst, I can just turn it off if it becomes an annoyance.

[Bud]

Not Phil ..... Redbrick

 

Phil .... 1bmwfan

 

My apologies to "Phil" for not making it clear in the post above.

[KMG_365]

Not Phil ..... Redbrick

 

Phil .... 1bmwfan

 

My apologies to "Phil" for not making it clear in the post above.

 

Say, Phil . . . . . "Redbrick", aren't you coming along, too??!!

 

It's going to be a shiite-load of fun!!

[Redbrick]

Not Phil ..... Redbrick

 

Phil .... 1bmwfan

 

My apologies to "Phil" for not making it clear in the post above.

 

I know you guys !! Knew the comment wasn't for me...

 

And to answer Jamie; Kathy and I are heading for Idaho, Montana and who knows next week...Kind of like James Garner in "Support Your Local Sheriff"; "Actually, I'm just on my way to Australia"...

 

No, but we'll make some events...Hopefully Fall Torrey .......

 

Phil........Redbrick

[Bud]

Not Phil ..... Redbrick

 

Phil .... 1bmwfan

 

My apologies to "Phil" for not making it clear in the post above.

 

I know you guys !! Knew the comment wasn't for me...

 

And to answer Jamie; Kathy and I are heading for Idaho, Montana and who knows next week...Kind of like James Garner in "Support Your Local Sheriff"; "Actually, I'm just on my way to Australia"...

 

No, but we'll make some events...Hopefully Fall Torrey .......

 

Phil........Redbrick

 

Sorry to miss you at the UN.

 

Ride safe.

[Bud]

Well, I went ahead and ordered this and will let you know how it works when it shows up.

 

Well it showed up. The ad copy from the web page said:

 

" * Works with closed faced helmets

* Works with all Midland� GMRS/FRS radios

* Speakers attach inside helmet for better sound quality

* Boom microphone allows for better reception attaches inside

* PTT button wraps around handle bar

* Includes 2 speakers and one boom microphone

* Brand New

* Full Manufacturer's Warranty

 

Well there is no "boom" on the mike.

 

Just a piece of wire. On the back of the mike is some hook and loop fastener. So there is no way to move the mike closer or further away from your mouth.

 

So now I'm going to try to get them to take it back w/o charging the 15% restocking fee since it was not as advertised.

 

Will let you know how that goes.

[Bud]

Here is the answer from Audio Discounters:

 

"The mic on a wire is considered a boom, they consider this a boom, let us know if you need return info. I have attached the picture of what this is."

 

So if you decide to order something from Audio Discounters, beware.

[KMG_365]

Well, Bud, let me say that I definitely feel your pain and I have so TOTALLY been there!

 

Before I'd spent many more years here reading of others' experiences and lessons learned, I'd done the same dance: try this really cheap brand (I'm not so sure about this B2B thing), replace the numerous things that would break--it really sucked. Then I'd try this "better" brand--it sucked too, try this "name" brand--not much better . . . .

 

Then I gathered up the whole mess and tossed it in a box in my storage (actually I gave some of it away to another rider just getting into B2B, and then he eventually threw it- or gave it away) and bit the bullet and bought the Autocom that everyone else I was riding with was using--and they always sounded so clear! In having logged over 100,000 miles now with B2B with dozens of different riders, I can almost always tell who's using an Autocom and who's using something else. There may be other newer stuff on the market now that is just as good, but I haven't been doing much group riding this year (actually since last November! ). But I'll wager if the system you're buying is half the cost of the Autocom system, it'll likely sound like it.

 

We've had the same Autocom stuff hard-wired into our bikes now for about four years and over 100,000 miles each. The stuff lasts, it is crystal clear, the noise canceling mics are the bomb, the PTT eliminates any side noise, the range is fairly good, and with AZAl's molded earplug monitors (especially the new ones with the air tubes! ) we couldn't be happier! It's like being on one bike again, but we can carry twice the stuff, she gets her own handlebars and I don't have to listen to how "I'm braking too early", or "I never would've taken that line", or "Wow, you totally blew that exit point"!

 

The only thing I would still consider upgrading to see if it made a difference would be to retrofit an external antenna to see if we could increase the range in the twisty stuff as Leslie and I usually end up on opposite ends of the group (point and sweep). If you've never ridden with B2B, or you don't see yourself riding with anyone who does, yes, it is an expensive set up just to "check it out", but if I added up the total costs of all the other systems (tax, shipping, returns, batteries, replacement parts, etc.), plus the time and frustration dikking with the returns, repairs, re-wiring up, frustrations with batteries going dead on a ride, swapping out the system on both the bikes and/or the helmets--with my six years of perspective looking back vs. just the last four with the hard-wired Autocom system, well, it's easy to say I've MORE than gotten my moneys worth! But of course, YMMV!

[Bud]

Here is the answer from Audio Discounters:

 

"The mic on a wire is considered a boom, they consider this a boom, let us know if you need return info. I have attached the picture of what this is."

 

So if you decide to order something from Audio Discounters, beware.

 

OK After a few e-mails, Jeff, at Audio Discounters has decided to accept the return w/o the 15% restocking fee.

 

I guess I just didn't give him enough time B4 posting my first post.

 

It's nice to see a business step up to the plate and take care of their customers.

[Bud]

Jamie, thank for the words of encouragement.

 

You hit the nail on the head when you said "If you've never ridden with B2B, or you don't see yourself riding with anyone who does, yes, it is an expensive set up just to "check it out",

 

Kind of where I'm at right now. Oh well, I do have some time before the UN to get this sorted out.

[Ken H.]

So there is no way to move the mike closer or further away from your mouth.

Just as a side note, presuming you are wearing a full-face helmet, there is really no need. Once you have a mic in place inside the helmet in the 'hot spot' the point where it is exactly in front of your lips, that's about it. It never needs to move from there.

[Bud]

So there is no way to move the mike closer or further away from your mouth.

Just as a side note, presuming you are wearing a full-face helmet, there is really no need. Once you have a mic in place inside the helmet in the 'hot spot' the point where it is exactly in front of your lips, that's about it. It never needs to move from there.

 

Thanks for the info.

[KMG_365]

So there is no way to move the mike closer or further away from your mouth.

Just as a side note, presuming you are wearing a full-face helmet, there is really no need. Once you have a mic in place inside the helmet in the 'hot spot' the point where it is exactly in front of your lips, that's about it. It never needs to move from there.

 

Thanks for the info.

If you DO decide to keep it, you might want to place something behind the mic stuck to the front of the full-face helmet to bring the mic closer to your mouth. I do know the Autocom mic with the noise cancelling mic on the backside is very sensitive to placement.

[Bud]

So there is no way to move the mike closer or further away from your mouth.

Just as a side note, presuming you are wearing a full-face helmet, there is really no need. Once you have a mic in place inside the helmet in the 'hot spot' the point where it is exactly in front of your lips, that's about it. It never needs to move from there.

 

Thanks for the info.

If you DO decide to keep it, you might want to place something behind the mic stuck to the front of the full-face helmet to bring the mic closer to your mouth. I do know the Autocom mic with the noise cancelling mic on the backside is very sensitive to placement.

 

It's going back. I'm going to look at what is on display at the MOA rally in WI and then decide what I want to do.

[KMG_365]

It's going back. I'm going to look at what is on display at the MOA rally in WI and then decide what I want to do.

Alternatively, there is always occasionally Autocom stuff that shows up in our classifieds. Buying used means that you should lose less if you change your mind.

[Bud]

It's going back. I'm going to look at what is on display at the MOA rally in WI and then decide what I want to do.

Alternatively, there is always occasionally Autocom stuff that shows up in our classifieds. Buying used means that you should lose less if you change your mind.

 

That's probably what I will do. Most of the time one can at least break even buying used if it doesn't work out.

 

Reminds me of an old joke. Rancher in Montana had a friend that always had ways to make money, but never did. His buddy came up with another scheme and says "At the very worst, we will break even." Rancher says "Good, I can use the money."

[Bud]

Here is the answer from Audio Discounters:

 

"The mic on a wire is considered a boom, they consider this a boom, let us know if you need return info. I have attached the picture of what this is."

 

So if you decide to order something from Audio Discounters, beware.

 

OK After a few e-mails, Jeff, at Audio Discounters has decided to accept the return w/o the 15% restocking fee.

 

I guess I just didn't give him enough time B4 posting my first post.

 

It's nice to see a business step up to the plate and take care of their customers.

 

Boy, have I learned a lesson.

 

I now have been promised a Return Authorization for 4 days in a row. Still no authorization so I can only presume they don't intend to issue one.

 

Back to my original thought If you decide to order something from Audio Discounters, beware.

 

Even if they now give me an authorization, after asking for 4 days and getting stonewalled, I can not recommend them as the customer service is lousy.

[Bud]

After I figured how much I would lose sending it back, I posted it for sale in the classifieds here.

 

Someone who can use it will get a good deal at $30.00 including shipping.

[KMG_365]

Dang, Bud--I'm sorry to hear about your troubles. But don't feel bad--you're in good company! If I had a nickel for ever Board member who has gone through this scenario I could've paid for my entire set-up!

 

Speaking of research, I just got an email from a member looking for more info on what an Autocom is/does and I thought it'd be a good idea to post my (long-winded) response here for everyone's benefit.

 

The Autocom is used as a sort of gathering device for multiple input devices and controlling outputs. There are many different models each with various feature options, but to give you an example, the old model I have (called the Pro-M1, though that won't help you any now), has inputs for B2B radio, music, radar detection and others like a "talking" GPS or a cell phone. It "prioritizes" each input automatically so that if you're listening to music and the phone rings, it shuts off the music, or if you're talking on the B2B radio it mutes the music and you get a radar hit it mutes all other inputs.

 

It has the ability to power some radios like the Kenwood FreeTalk XL so you never have to worry about batteries and it has outputs for rider and pillion with speakers and noise-cancelling mics that you can mount in your helmet. It also supports an available "push-to-talk" switch (PTT) so you don't have to rely on VOX (voice activated transmission) which is spotty in cross winds or at high speed (especially for pillions).

 

I started out with just a cheap Motorola FRS with a single earbud speaker and an in-line PTT mic that hung on the wire. I put a dot of velcro on the back of the PTT/mic and stuck it to the front of my full-face helmet. When I got on the bike, I had to make sure I had fresh batteries, put the radio in my pocket, put the earbud in my one ear and an earplug in the other ear, don my helmet and stick the PTT/mic to the inside. When someone in the group transmitted, the radio picked up the transmission fine, but I had to take my hand off the bars and reach up inside my helmet and push the tiny button with my gloved hand and try not to cover the mic to reply. Needless to say I got pretty tired of this set-up. The Autocom's PTT mounts to the left grip and I just slide my thumb over to push the button without taking my hand off the bars and the boom mic is slipped up inside the liner of my helmet and stays in place. Now I put in my ear plug monitors, don my helmet, get on the bike, plug the monitors into one pig-tail hanging from the helmet and the coiled extension lead into the other pig-tail and ride.

[Bud]

Thanks for the explanation.

[dhanson]

Okay my SO and I are planning on joining the pied piper tour some where between Dallas and Mo I reckon. Coming from Shreveport, La area.

 

I am currently connecting gps and Kenwood to my autocomm, plus have not even put the headsets in helmets yet, so have some work yet.

 

How do you mount the CB? I don't have a tankbag, but looking.

[KMG_365]

That's great news!

 

Perhaps a search/post in the K-bikes Wrenching Forum might lend some ideas from those more familiar with your model of bike. I'm really not sure what your specific options on that bike are, but many folks install the Autocom under the seat--then the questions become where to mount the B2B radio.

 

Our Kenwood B2B radios are mounted in the glovebox on our R1150RT's (upright gives the best range for the antenna). They are not easily reachable, but this hasn't been a big issue in 90K miles. We use the PTT switch on the grip to transmit and once we decide on which frequency we're using at the stop, we usually don't have a need to change it on the fly. The radios are bike powered, so batteries are also not an issue.

 

Our Autocoms are mounted in the dash behind the fairing (there's a LOT of space on an R1150RT once you take out the speaker enclosures), but I don't know how easy that will be for you to do on your bike. We have the older 5-pin din connectors, so I could use standard MIDI extension cables to run the helmet leads back under the seats for the pilot and pillion. I'm sure Autocom offers something for the newer 7-pin models if you need to go that way.

 

Some mount their B2B radios on their tankbags. We use the BigMak "airbags" (suspended over the tank so they don't touch the paint and they flip up quickly for gassing up) and I've seen many slick installs into these and other brands of tankbags for those who switch between bikes or who want to be able to take their "electronics suite" with them for security reasons.

 

Others mount their B2B radios on RAM mounts that bolt to the handlebars or on mounts fixed to replacement the caps on the brake/clutch fluid reservoirs. Richard (Benicia_RT_GT) just did something like this, but there was a "gotcha" with a lip on the cap/mount that he had to deal with, so he'd be a good one for brain picking. He'll be at the UnRally, he's got a K-GT and he's done many installs on many different bikes (also, he's a helluva nice guy and definitely a farkling guru ).

 

If you get stuck, you can always go with batteries on both and just stick both the radio and the Autocom in the front pockets of your riding jacket. It's not clean, but if you're out of time to get it all wired up, road tested and troubleshot in time it's an option to consider for this trip.

 

Good luck!

[dhanson]

You are a endless supply of information, many options abound, ha! I did get a headstart, the previous owner already installed autocom under the passenger seat. I am in the process of installing headsets for me and wife, hooking up batt to GPS. Think I will try the tankbag routine for the CB, already have the PTT on left grip

 

Looking for spot to mount XM antenna, hmmm. Tupper ware off on left as I speak.

[KMG_365]

I'm an endless supply of something, I'm sure! I've just been hanging out here for too long!

 

 

It is one of the great things about this place where we share our knowledge, assistance and resources amongst some really clever folks from vastly varied backgrounds--we're getting really good at "skinning cats"!

 

Do a search under "EffBee" as he did an excellent write-up recently on electrifying his tankbag. Try: user= EffBee; key words= +tankbag, +autocom, +Kenwood; date range= 1 year should find it and a few other good threads for ideas.

 

We mounted our XM antennas in the front fairing right up under the top dash as there's just enough room right next to the windscreen armature. Since the microwaves are not blocked by the plastic, we've noticed no signal strength degradation and they've been there for a few years without problems. Of course the higher up and forward the better for less interference and blocking by your bodies, or you could try mounting it far behind on the luggage rack--they sure give you plenty of wire!

[SageRider]

Okay my SO and I are planning on joining the pied piper tour some where between Dallas and Mo I reckon. Coming from Shreveport, La area.

 

I am currently connecting gps and Kenwood to my autocomm, plus have not even put the headsets in helmets yet, so have some work yet.

 

How do you mount the CB? I don't have a tankbag, but looking.

Just for clarity, are you mounting a CB radio or an FRS/GMRS radio, or both?

FRS/GMRS is much more popular for B2B here than CB.

[KMG_365]

Just for clarity, are you mounting a CB radio or an FRS/GMRS radio, or both?

FRS/GMRS is much more popular for B2B here than CB.

Hmmm, good point.

 

When he said:

I am currently connecting gps and Kenwood to my autocomm [ . . . ]

. . . I assumed he was talking about FRS/GMRS (FM) as opposed to CB (AM). I didn't think Kenwood made CB radios . . . but I could be wrong. AFAIK, there are only a few CB makes that interface well with the Autocom (Cobra, perhaps? ) so everyone reading this should be aware of that "gotcha" as well.

 

 

CB=Honda Goldwing, etc.

 

FRS/GMRS=other newer Touring/SportTouring bikes.

[dhanson]

Okay now I am showing my age. We used to run CBs in the 70s, break 19, how about that south bound 35, you got peanut butter in your ears, the sidekick, northbound 35 hammer down, we by.

 

I meant the Kenwood freetalk frs, cool little walkie talkie looking thingy.

 

I had a 1974 superglide harley and in the late 70s, put a 9' (full ground plane) whip on the back and ran a normal CB (midland I think), got great range to the front, but when you went by me, I would loose you in a mile, ha.

[SageRider]

Not a problem, David.

Just wanted to make sure we were all on the same page.

[Bud]

What do you think?

 

 

The only question remaining is how long of a string I need.

[KMG_365]

What do you think?

 

 

The only question remaining is how long of a string I need.

Just long enough to reach from the tree branch to about six feet off the ground!