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Is just 'thinking' about it betrayal too ??


Francois_Dumas

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Francois_Dumas

Today I visited the Yamaha dealer....... eek.gifeek.gif

 

Yesterday a nice shiny brochure dropped on the doormat.... special action for the FJR1300A and AS motors. Including heated grips, side and top case, ABS .... the works.

 

So I dropped by at the dealer today to have a look. The new FJR looks very sleek, lower than the RT, lighter, and with more power. Seat doesn't look bad (I am a 'stock seater'), and there is a larger windscreen available as an option.

 

The best thing is the price. 18.300 Euros, versus some 22.000 for the new 1200RT.

And they offer 11.300 for my 3-year old 1150RT, unseen.

 

I arranged for a test ride next week.....

 

The catch !?

 

1) I feel like I'm betraying 'my brand'

2) still need to cough up some 7500 Euros

3) ..... and the biggest proiblem.... it has 143 HP, and in France only 100 are allowed, so I probably can't take it with me when we should move !!! dopeslap.gif

 

Oh, I forgot #4

 

4) Nina doesn't think I should by ANYTHING for the next 20 or so years..... grin.gifgrin.gif

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Francois

 

Did I read it correctly? 100 max hp in France?

BTW, wives always clarify that motorcycles are "wants" not "needs". wave.gif

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Bikes are just machines.

 

BMW is just a company that competes in a marketplace for our money. So is Yamaha. Any apparent loyalty to their customers is just marketing. I could expound...

 

There is no betrayal. There is just business.

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Did you say test ride? In the state of California I don't know of any Japanese dealer that will let you ride one out the door unless you already paid for it.

Beemers, Ducs and Harleys yes, everybody else, no.

Got a friend with one, likes it. Has a beemer as a backup. wave.gif

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I wouldn't even bother lookin at it.

 

Since I've gone from the RT to the FJR I have so much extra time on my hand all I do is ride.It's really tough sometimes.I have to go to Colorado this week and see Killer and Azaisr.....sucks having to put all those miles on it between valve adjustments.

 

lmao.giflmao.giflmao.gif

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Francois_Dumas
Francois

 

Did I read it correctly? 100 max hp in France?

 

Yes, apparently the idiots (pardonnez-moi le mot) have introduced a new law limiting motorcycles to only 100 hp. A dealer who sells a non-capped (or up-tuned) bike faces a 30.000 Euro fine and 2 years in prison.

 

I am rethinking our move to France now...... dopeslap.gifdopeslap.gifeek.gifwink.gif

 

P.S. It is alright to have a 500 hp Ferrari though......

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I think that your loyalty to BMW should be equal to their loyalty to you.

 

Beyond that, consider how boring it may be to not have to wonder what is going to break next. Sometimes we don't know the true value of something until it's gone... grin.gif

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I think that your loyalty to BMW should be equal to their loyalty to you.

 

Beyond that, consider how boring it may be to not have to wonder what is going to break next. Sometimes we don't know the true value of something until it's gone... grin.gif

 

aMEN tO tHAT..!!

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baggerchris

Japanese dealers not allowing test rides? Maybe, maybe not. I know of three that I have been to in the last year that do. One in Sacto; one in the sierra's and one on the coast. The only ones I have been to where I have been rudely told no have been at two Suzuki Dealers.

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John Bentall

Francois,

 

Registering a full-power FJR in France will be almost impossible, & even a full power 110PS R1200RT might be difficult. You will have to buy another bike when you get to France,say a 98PS R1200GS.

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Francois_Dumas
Francois,

 

Registering a full-power FJR in France will be almost impossible, & even a full power 110PS R1200RT might be difficult. You will have to buy another bike when you get to France,say a 98PS R1200GS.

 

Yeah, that's what I'm afraid of too...... the GS or RT would do of course. I saw the 1200RT with 110 hp still advertised on the BMW website.... not sure what the story is there yet. frown.gif

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BitScribbler

Presumably sales of FJRs, K1200GTs and the like are very low in France?

 

I could imagine riding my old R1200ST limited to 100bhp, but not my K1200GT. It'd be a bit of a lardy slug for sure, especially two-up and loaded with luggage.

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Francois, could it be you are excessively concerned about what others think? Perhaps so much so as to become non-life-serving - to deny that spark, that thrust, that impulse to give and grow?

 

Concerns you express as #1 and #4 are skewed from a common range of balance - as is posting the thread. In all three you show care for others, even respect - all wonderful things. However, those seem about appearances rather than substance.

 

Betrayal is mostly about agreement, and somewhat trust (that agreement and harmless will be maintained). What agreement is there really, and what real world rather than emotional, contrived/created/imagined world harm is to be done? Of trust, are your companions needing of support for their insecurities, and not quid-pro-quo mindful and wishing to be helpful of your needs and desires?

 

Perhaps as well external concerns rule in your #3, what France thinks. What's factually going on there: Are 100+ hp bikes actually banned from operation in France? Does the EU allow a country to forbid "grandfathering" one's possessions as a vistor? I could see disallowance were you to become a citizen, but not as a resident/worker alien.

 

Of your concerns, what's real, how will you actually be treated, versus what treatment you might fear you'd receive.

 

I'm betting you'll be loved and regarded just fine regardless of your choice. And, treated in a physical sense quite well too.

 

You are indeed a kind, and caring person, Francois. Be at least as well so to yourself, please. I trust you'd do that for you in my absence.

 

 

Best wishes with your choices.

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Francois_Dumas

Thanks Dick, I always appreciate your well-chosen wording and intentions. Wish I had a way with words like that, even.

 

As for France, Nina and I have put our house here up for sale and have plans to emigrate to France.. hence my 'concern'. I don't care what France thinks, but I do care what the 'country' does that I want to be a citizen of.

It is not so much that I 'need' 100+ hp's (my current RT hasn't and does 0-100 in 3.9 secs... fine for me), but more the fact that I am looking for more freedom of sorts, only to aim for a country that now seems to head the same way as my current one; that of obsessive government restrictions.

 

Not good.

 

My post was also, at least partly, meant in jest, although I must admit I 'have something' with BMW. I owned many BMW cars and have some sort of an emotional tie with the brand. Mostly because of the associations I have with those cars and how they relate to my personal life's history.

Not very 'logical', I admit. smirk.gif

 

We're currently in a turmoil of plans, happenings and non-happenings in our life that makes decisions quite difficult.

I will probably put it off until we have a - somewhat - clearer view of our future blush.gif

 

Still want to do the test ride though smile.gif

 

Kind regards,

Francois

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but more the fact that I am looking for more freedom of sorts, only to aim for a country that now seems to head the same way as my current one; that of obsessive government restrictions.
Well you can always emigrate to the US... lots of good riding here and not many restrictions. But often no helmet laws, nor any rider training requirements... nor motorcycle horsepower limits. Hmmm... I wonder if there's a relationship there...
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Francois_Dumas
but more the fact that I am looking for more freedom of sorts, only to aim for a country that now seems to head the same way as my current one; that of obsessive government restrictions.
Well you can always emigrate to the US... lots of good riding here and not many restrictions. But often no helmet laws, nor any rider training requirements... nor motorcycle horsepower limits. Hmmm... I wonder if there's a relationship there...

 

grin.gifgrin.gifgrin.gifgrin.gifthumbsup.gif

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russell_bynum
Dick's back.

 

"reports of his demise are greatly exaggerated"

 

 

thumbsup.gif

 

Whip

 

John: "I thought you were dead."

Big Jake: "Not hardly."

 

thumbsup.gif

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Francois_Dumas
Today I visited the Yamaha dealer....... eek.gifeek.gif
Ban him - NOW!

 

 

Oh noooo... not again !!!!! lmao.giflmao.giflmao.gif

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John Bentall
Presumably sales of FJRs, K1200GTs and the like are very low in France?

 

I could imagine riding my old R1200ST limited to 100bhp, but not my K1200GT. It'd be a bit of a lardy slug for sure, especially two-up and loaded with luggage.

 

There you are Colin, straight off the BMW France website

107PS from the GT! Exactly the same as a French-spec R1200RT!

 

Puissance nominale 112 kW (152 ch) à 9500 tr/min,

79 kW (107 ch) à 7000 tr/min en version française

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Francois, I know it will all work out. Yet, I see the turmoil to be experienced in the changes that will come. I guess the idea is to have a new scene of less turmoil though, eh?

 

France will indeed be a place of some degree of turmoil; It's change in government and its stated change in direction aimed at rasising up an already great nation to one that is even more embrasive of its people's needs, both internally, and externally, is bound to bring unsettlement for a time. I'm aware it is a more Progressive path to be undertaken, and I hope there's an integrity, a uniformity to it that greatly reduces the many, isolated, digressive measures in the society - like penalizing all motorcyclists for fanatical acts of a few. It makes little sense to declare all who'd be able to benefit from 100+ hp in a heavy bike, labled Outlaw when they in fact don't contribute to public danger.

 

Facing such a world of change. perhaps there's a comfortable anchor in owning a BMW with all the security of your history with them, and the greater abundance of community abiding with that brand and the welcome that provides. "Why I own a..." is a seldom less than complex answer -- and just as seldom fully and truthfully examined. Bikes is Fun, and many folks want it kept only that way. Others can find comfort in less ostrich like passtimes.

 

It's always fun to see you openly share your life with us all, Francois. I'm so glad for your openness, a thing I call Honesty. It is so interesting to me an American since many of the facets that lead to your choices, attitudes and other personal expressions come from mores of places far different than I get to frequently see. I treasure each of my visits to your land of Western Europe for what it reveals about my own heritage, and how we've developed so differently - yet remain as humans so much the same.

 

Bon chance, mon ami.

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bakerzdosen
I must admit I 'have something' with BMW. I owned many BMW cars and have some sort of an emotional tie with the brand. Mostly because of the associations I have with those cars and how they relate to my personal life's history.

Not very 'logical', I admit.

But I thought you were always 'logical' with your vehicle purchases

 

coughJeepcough

 

smirk.gif

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Paul Mihalka

Well, I don't know about these horsepower needs - maybe I'm getting old - or remember when 50hp was a fast bike. For me a 150hp K1200GT properly detuned to 100 or so hp, with more torque at low rpm, might be a very nice engine.

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For me a 150hp K1200GT properly detuned to 100 or so hp, with more torque at low rpm, might be a very nice engine.
Not a bad thought. I read a comparison of the new Suzuki Bandit 1250 and the BMW K1200R (in Sport Rider, no less) where they noted that while the BMW was a much faster bike (and the horsepower curves clearly demonstrated why) they felt that the torquey Suzuki actually felt more powerful during most types of sub-warp street riding.
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Go for it, Francois !!! Life is too short for regrets. Don't pass up the opportunity. It won't be the last bike you buy. I strongly suspect you will enjoy the diversion. Please post a ride report and pictures. Many thanks for the beautiful photos you have posted in the past - what a wonderful eye and talent you have.

 

Bob

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I know what you mean Francois reference the feeling of "betrayal". I spent fifteen years with BMW bikes and recently purchased a Triumph. I felt a sense of loyalty to BMW (I don't know why but I did). I did feel guilty about "abandoning" my local dealer where there was a family environment. It was somewhat embarrasing to admit I had switched brands when I visited the shop.

 

I was amazed how many people commented on the fact that they thought I was a "BMW guy" and expressed their shock that I had switched brands.

 

Good luck with your choice.

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Fig%203%20Ferrar%20at%20Stake.jpg

 

Ban him?

Burn him! tongue.gif

wink.gif

grin.gif

lurker.gif

Go west youg man, live and ride in the states until you run out of roads. dopeslap.gif

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bakerzdosen

OK, so I gotta ask... Is it 100bhp generated by the engine or 100bhp at the rear wheel (aka measured on a dyno?)

 

It's kinda steep for the penalty. A €1500.00 fine and €3000 for a repeat offense... WOW. (Of course, I saw one reference that it was 'upgraded' last year to a €30,000 fine and you lose the bike...)

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Francois_Dumas
Hey Francois

 

The bummer is that your PM box is full.

 

dopeslap.gifdopeslap.gif

 

Whip

 

I fixed that now Larry cool.gif Sorry ! smirk.gif

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Francois_Dumas
I must admit I 'have something' with BMW. I owned many BMW cars and have some sort of an emotional tie with the brand. Mostly because of the associations I have with those cars and how they relate to my personal life's history.

Not very 'logical', I admit.

But I thought you were always 'logical' with your vehicle purchases

 

coughJeepcough

 

smirk.gif

 

Owwwww..... don't go there!!!! dopeslap.gifdopeslap.gif

 

wink.gif

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Francois ,

I have the ultimate solution .......... buy it , and as you can't take it with you .......... let me borrow it lmao.giflmao.giflmao.gifas I don't have a bike at the moment .

 

Seriously though , I had a go on one of those ....... there sure is some power in that engine !! thumbsup.gifthumbsup.gifthumbsup.gif

Steve

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Brand loyalty is emotional and not logical. Brand loyalty is about what others may think, not what is right for you. By all means test ride the thing.

 

I've struggled with BMW cost of ownership ever since I thought about buying one. I'm not mechanically inclined and generally don't care to be. I just want to ride the damn thing. I've always toyed with the idea of test riding an FJR1300 or an ST1300 to see if I liked them enough to ditch the high price of BMW ownership. Coincidentally, I got that chance yesterday to ride a 2005 FJR1300.

 

Three words describe my post-ride conclusion on the FJR: "wouldn't own one." Maybe if I'd never ridden an RT I would think highly of the bike. If you like gobs of power, smooth transmission and motor, fine. That's about all.

 

I found the FJR much harder than the RT to steer around corners. The handlebar pressure required surprised me. The RT just seems to follow my will into a corner. The heat emanating from the engine about cooked the back of my legs. The ride was much rougher than the RT. My wife would kill me if I came home with an FJR. I haven't ridden an ST1300 yet but they come in behind both the FJR and the RT in most reviews, so I don't hold out much hope it will be much better.

 

I'm now rethinking my willingness to learn how to work on my RT. If I can save significant money doing the work myself, I can relieve the cost factor and happily keep the best sport tourer in the world. I'm looking forward to the next tech daze in a neighborhood near me.

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I've struggled with BMW cost of ownership ever since I thought about buying one. I'm not mechanically inclined and generally don't care to be. I just want to ride the damn thing. <SNIP>

 

I'm now rethinking my willingness to learn how to work on my RT. If I can save significant money doing the work myself, I can relieve the cost factor and happily keep the best sport tourer in the world. I'm looking forward to the next tech daze in a neighborhood near me.

 

+1 - Kansas City

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