Another M/C accident. It is a jungle out there,. Be careful.

[keithb]

I just found out a buddy of mine and two of his friends were involved in a m/c accident 2 weeks ago in Borrego Springs, Ca. It was the classic left turn in front of 5 riders. The first rider made it through, the second, third, and fourth were not so lucky and the fifth was alright. The damage, 3 totaled motorcycles, my friend suffered broken wrist, broken ankle, and separated knee and shoulder. One of the other guys sustained a broken foot and the last guy involved broke his upper arm. Not pretty but thank God none of them had life threatening injuries such as head, neck, or spinal injuries. So pleeease be vigilant and alert at all times. Seems to me a darn good reason to have additional lighting on your bike so you are more likely to be seen. Ride safe.

[OlGeezer]

I just found out a buddy of mine and two of his friends were involved in a m/c accident 2 weeks ago in Borrego Springs, Ca. It was the classic left turn in front of 5 riders. The first rider made it through, the second, third, and fourth were not so lucky and the fifth was alright. The damage, 3 totaled motorcycles, my friend suffered broken wrist, broken ankle, and separated knee and shoulder. One of the other guys sustained a broken foot and the last guy involved broke his upper arm. Not pretty but thank God none of them had life threatening injuries such as head, neck, or spinal injuries. So pleeease be vigilant and alert at all times. Seems to me a darn good reason to have additional lighting on your bike so you are more likel

y to be seen. Ride safe.

 

That is indeed terrible news.

 

In hindsight, do you or your buddy think there was anything the group or group leader could have done to prevent or at least reduce the likelyhood of the incident? I know more lights are a good idea, but it seems to me there were already (at least) five of 'em.

[keithb]

It does not appear in this case anything could have been done. There was no indication this person was going to turn left. According to my friends wife (rider #5) they were riding at 50 mph with no time to brake and there were no skid marks at all. Apparently the driver got out and stated "he thought he could make it". I can't imagine watching my husband/wife fly over the back of a car. Not a pretty sight at all I am sure.

[jssgranite]

Apparently the driver got out and stated "he thought he could make it". I can't imagine watching my husband/wife fly over the back of a car.

 

Had it been my wife doing the flying, and after hearing that driver's comment, I'd have made sure the driver took a trip to the hospital as well....

[Quinn]

That's just amazing! He thought he could make it? That implies that he saw them and just discounted their speed, presence. Maybe he just thought they were bicycles and wouldn't get there for another ten minutes. I guess motorcycles don't register in some people's driving universe.

 

Lord protect us all from the uncaring.

[motorman587]

The left turner. The Hurt Study shows that this is the number #1 motorcycle killer. It has gotten me twice. Lucky, with training I get to talk about it.

[keithb]

Yes this all very sad indeed. I have ridden with this couple many times and they are good and safe riders. I am so glad his wife was riding sweep and was not injured.

[Crazy_Canuck]

"he thought he could make it".

 

That's Crazy!

[Carnadero]

The left turner. The Hurt Study shows that this is the number #1 motorcycle killer. It has gotten me twice.

I've always ridden on my bikes (my cars/trucks even) with this rule in mind: if a situation develops where the possibility exists that the other party could perform a very stupid maneuver, assume that they will execute it. In this case, that means that if I see someone stopped at an intersection waiting to go across or turn and I legally have the right of way (no stop necessary), I immediately roll off the throttle a little, put two fingers at the ready over the brake lever, and the left thumb goes immediately to the high beam rocker switch. If I see any vehicle movement and I'm still a reasonable distance away, they'll get the high beam flash, especially if I see them looking in my direction. If they're looking the other way, then it's the horn that gets the exercise.

[keithb]

Joe

I thought I would add my .02 on this one. About 10 years ago I took an Experienced Rider Course. My instructor recommended we ride with our high beams on during the day. He said it was a lot less expensive replacing a high beam bulb vs. not being seen during the day with the low beam on. If you have ever ridden with people behind you and they have their high beam on you cannot miss them vs. other people in the group with their low beam on you can hardly see. Since that course I have ridden with my high beam on during the day. When I am riding with other people I always look to see who is riding with their brights on. They are always more visible. I would be willing to bet the guys involved in the accident did not have their high beams on. Most people are trained to look for multiple lights on a car vs. just one light on a bike. I also have 2 sets of aux. lights on my RT and about 95% of the time at least one set is always on along with the high beam.

[OlGeezer]

If I see any vehicle movement and I'm still a reasonable distance away, they'll get the high beam flash

 

I try to do this even if there is no movement. Four or five times on the rocker is good exercise anyway. I once suffered the consequence of a car pulling out of me from a perpendicular stop sign. Even though that event was more than 30 years ago (Yikes!), I can still see my bike caving in the passenger door and my body rolling over the top like it was yesterday.

 

A few cycles on the high beam rocker is not a huge effort.

[AdventurePoser]

I can see your point, but in some places it's customary to flash your high beams when you WANT the other vehicle to go. Misreading this signal could have disasterous results...

 

Ride safe,

 

Steve in So Cal

[Carnadero]

Yeah, that thought has crossed my mind from time to time. If I'm going to make that a habit, I guess I'll have to buy an extra H3 bulb and stash it under the seat for when the existing one flames out.

[keithb]

Steve

I was thinking the exact same thing about flashing lights. I have flashed my lights to let trucks and cars over in to another lane or to have people move forward or turn at an intersection. You are absolutely right. Misreading the signals could be disastrous.

[Carnadero]

...but in some places it's customary to flash your high beams when you WANT the other vehicle to go.

It always seemed to me that rapid flashing of the high beams was typically taken as a go-ahead sign by other motorists, so what I do is not so much a "flash" as it is a high beam on, stay on, then back down to low once I'm sure they're looking in my direction.

 

So far, so good.

[ESokoloff]

Steve

I was thinking the exact same thing about flashing lights. I have flashed my lights to let trucks and cars over in to another lane or to have people move forward or turn at an intersection. You are absolutely right. Misreading the signals could be disastrous.

 

I use a slalom type manuver to gain their attention.

 

Sure wish Gleno did too

[jssgranite]

I've been thinking about this post all week and I'm still angry. Sometimes, $#!t happens, but the driver's comment makes me nuts. It reminded me of a comment made by one of the traffic guys who flys around Atlanta. When he's on the air, he never refers to vehicular incidents as "accidents", because they aren't accidental. They are wrecks caused by poor decision making or skills, inattention, haste, etc. We all take on a huge amount of risk when we ride and we do many things to mitigate that risk. I have found riding has made me a better driver in my truck. I'm more alert, focused, conscientious (does spelling count?) and courteous than I was before I began to ride. I don't want to hijack this thread as the topic has been covered elsewhere, but our driver licensing proceedures could use some more hurdles and education.

 

And FWIW, I ride w/ my high beam on always during the day and sometimes at night.

[keithb]

Eric you have to let me know what you mean about a slalom manuever.

 

I will give you my opinion on drivers education in this country. It is woefully inadequate and a total joke. I drive for a living being in sales and the shit I see on freeways, highways is just ridiculous, unbelievable and appalling in terms of the lack of skill of some drivers. Having talked with friends from Europe the permitting process is quite different and much more thorough. Heck you have to be able to change a tire on the road over there. We could use a whole lot more of that over here. Enough said.

[Exploreinman]

the left thumb goes immediately to the high beam rocker switch. If I see any vehicle movement and I'm still a reasonable distance away, they'll get the high beam flash,

 

Let me chime in from the southeast. In this part of the country the high beam flash would very likely be interpreted as a "go ahead" signal. Leaving the high beams on during the day is fine, but I wouldn't incorporate the flash. You just might be making the situation worse.

 

I'm very sorry to hear about the accident and hope everyone heals well. Let's look out for one another brothers.

 

Stephen

[ESokoloff]

Eric you have to let me know what you mean about a slalom maneuver.

 

 

It's a just a series of tight /aggressive weaves as if there were a set of cones that you are dodging. IMHO my conspicuity is increased.

I initiate it as soon as I assess that it's needed. Maximize your impact on them.

They may wonder what that crazy motorcyclist is doing or at least it gives them more surface area to notice or a target thats moving in several directions to see.

At the same time I'm watching to make sure the vehicle stays put & I'm slowing down if necessary. If it's side traffic watching the rims is the fastest way to determine movement.

 

About 27 years ago I had an accident similar to Gleno's

I don't want another one.

[keithb]

Stephen

I grew up in Va. and the flash meant "go ahead" also.

 

And Eric I get you slalom move and agree with increasing the surface area you cover. That is exactly why I run bright lights and aux. lights is to be seen. I think I may just incorporate the slalom move in the future also. I went back and read Karen's email to me about how she doesn't know if she can ride anymore after witnessing her husband and friends "explode into the air" after the car turned in front of them. I sure hope she will climb back on her bike. She and her husband have been riding together for years and enjoy it so much.

[ESokoloff]

[quote

That is exactly why I run bright lights and aux. lights is to be seen.

 

My helmets white.

My stitch is hyvis.

My RT has a modulator, running & Moto lites.

 

I was ounce making a trip along 99 & saw a train coming the other way.

It was night & I couldn't help but think that the RT had a similar light display.

I thought surely all would see me & obey my space.

Then it occurred to me that some still do not see trains or worse yet try to beat them

 

Put on all your brite gear.

Blaze all your lights.

Ride like they don't see you.

 

RIP GM

[Exploreinman]

Ride like they don't see you.

 

Great advice!

[dhb]

Having ridden with Eric quite often lately, I can attest that his "slalom" maneuver is eye catching. I've seen cars creeping into an intersection jam on the brakes when they see this. It does look a bit odd, but that's the point. I should say that when Eric does this, he pushes the swerve and the turns are tight--almost a wobble. One would not want to give the impression that he were turning in front of the waiting car otherwise the car might go ahead.

I agree that flashing lights for visibility is sure (sometime) to be interpreted as a "go ahead" to a waiting car.

Dave

[OlGeezer]

I can see your point, but in some places it's customary to flash your high beams when you WANT the other vehicle to go. Misreading this signal could have disasterous results...

 

Ride safe,

 

Steve in So Cal

 

O.K., but I think it would be stoopid to either a.) invite someone to turn in front of you or to b.) for someone to think I'm inviting someone to turn in front of me. For those who think it's an invitation, I wonder what they think of head light modulators.

 

Otherwise, the cultural point is well taken. The wobble maneuver makes good sense, too.

[ShovelStrokeEd]

A point to remember in all this, in particular in light of the left turner's comment. "I thought I could make it".

 

It is difficult for a cage driver, or even a rider, to judge the speed of approach of an oncoming motorcycle. Drivers use the visual clue of the change in apparent spacing of the headlights (on or off) as an indicator of speed. A motorcycle, having only one headlight, does not present the same profile. Multiple lights don't help here as their spacing is such that they really don't look much different until the distance has really closed up.

 

Now add to this the simple fact that most of us ride faster than the typical traffic pattern and you have the formula for a problem. Don't give me any BS that you always obey the posted speed limits either.

[PhysicsWinz]

got to watch their wheels. The wheels move before the rest of the vehicle, gaining a split second of reaction time.

 

in my area flashing/modulating the headlight usually means to the other driver to go ahead.

 

The slalom idea sounds useful, though.

 

John

[Bheckel169]

Interesting. I've been using the slalom or weave approach for years and the hi-beams. I've actually had drivers begin to pull out in front of me at an intersection and slam on their brakes when they saw my extreme movement as I approached the intersection. Whatever works.