This is a bad actuarial group

[Quinn]

I've noticed a lot of posts that sound like me. Hi, I'm Quinn. I haven't been on a motorcycle in over 15 years, but have just bought another one that is bigger and more powerful than anything I'd ever imagined owning back then. I'm in my 50s and harkening back to the younger, more stress free times of my youth.

 

I thought I was being original until I started doing a little reading and talking. Seems like I'm still with the same group that thought they were rebelling against conformity by wearing the same style tie-dyed tee shirts and bellbottom pants. I've suddenly looked up and I'm in the middle of a herd of old men chasing after a nostalgia for something they never had.

 

Even worse, it turns out this is a group of idiots. The older returning riders are having just as many accidents as the young idiots on the crotch rockets. Even if you discount the statistics for the beer-drinking Harley wanta-be's, there's enough left for the rest of us returning oldsters. And the insurance rates reflect this. Not only was buying a bike not a very original idea for me, but I'm apparently a timebomb waiting to go off at the first intersection.

 

I've set myself a program of going slow; wading back into the cycle world. A few rounds around the neighboring subdivision to pactice slow speed turns and stopping, a few moderate and modest curvy roads, and an adventure onto the expressway as a treat. No heavy traffic or shopping centers yet; that'll wait a while. And no fast sweeper entrance ramps. My goal is to get confident enough to enjoy the Blue Ridge Parkway this Summer and return with all pieces of both the bike and me.

 

How many of y'all fit into my actuarial group and how are you trying to beat the odds?

[russell_bynum]

"I rode a CB400 Four in 1975 but I haven't been on a bike in 30 years, so I can handle a K1200S."

 

For me, I rode dirt bikes as a kid, didn't ride anything for 10 years, then bought a Suzuki Bandit 600. After 10,000 miles or so (about 5 months) I bought the RT.

 

Lots of parking lot practice, track schools, good gear, lots of great coaching from a few fantastic riders here, and a dumptruck full of luck has kept me alive and (mostly) unscathed.

[TonyS]

Find an MSF course and take it. The friend that taught me how to ride a motorcycle in 1973 had to take one several years ago as he was in the military. His description of the course convinced me to take one as well, about four years ago. No matter how much you think you know, there's always more, especially for us re-entry riders. When you have a stern Highway Patrolman watching and evaluating your every move you realize all those self taught lessons weren't totally correct. It sounds like your'e not riding over your head which is always a great first step.

[jssgranite]

Hi Quinn and welcome to the board from another, though younger, newbie. There have been a few threads in recent weeks that may interest you. One was a survey on how old we all are. Another was about why we (BMW riders) are different. And yet another went by 33 tips for safe riding. I'm paraphrasing, but you should be able to search and find some interesting info.

 

As someone who only rode a neighbor's dirt bike as a teen, I don't really qualify as "coming back". I started with the first MSF course before purchasing a bike. After finding a bike (which has since been sold), I put some miles on it to get comfortable and then took it ot the MSF advanced course. Both classes truly helped me ride smarter, safer and with more confidence. I'll likely pursue further rider education on the RT this spring. If you have these type of classes in your area, I would encourage you to take advantage of them.

 

Good luck with your program!

[Alan D]

Welcome,

Take an MSF course, ERC course, find your local BMW club and someone to ride with, read lot's of books on riding, stay alert, and have fun!

The fact that you are thinking hard about it is the first line of defense.

[Dennis Andress]

I stopped riding for about six years once only because I couldn't afford a bike. I bought one as soon as I could but felt like a fool riding it. After about a year I found this board and something I'd never had before, like minded riders willing to share decades of experiences. From reading and asking questions around here I quickly found I was a fool, and I found how to fix it.

 

Start off slow and gentle but have a plan that makes you grow. Have you heard of the book Proficient Motorcycling? Find a copy and make it your lesson plan. When you're ready find someone who'll ride with you and critique your actions. And, of course, ask questions on this board.

 

Equipment has changed dramatically in the last decade. The '76 Gold Wing I used to borrow has been superseded by machines just as heavy but vastly more competent, and powerful. Yes, this is the stuff that dreams are made of but after traveling across 83 miles of L.A. freeways in 58 minutes on a recent Saturday morning, I wonder how I measure up next to the machine.

 

Learn well and ride good.

 

Dennis

[Green RT]

How many of y'all fit into my actuarial group and how are you trying to beat the odds?

 

I don't quite fit your actuarial group since I am in my 60s and never quit riding, but I will add one suggestion for beating the odds. In addition to learning and polishing your skills as others have suggested, survival will require gaining some experience about all the things that can happen or go wrong. I don't think there is any substitute for experience. I think it takes hundreds of thousands of miles and riding in all kinds of conditions to see the full range of mistakes you can make (or hopefully avoid making). So after you have a few 10s of thousands of miles under your belt and start feeling really comfortable on the bike is a good time to realize you still have a ways to go. Even after many many miles we all still get surprised by some new life threatening twist.

[bakerzdosen]

I don't fit into your actuarial group at all really, but I'm nearly as bad. I'm 35, ridden a dirt bike twice when I was a kid and once as an adult (aka basically no experience), took MSF in June with a friend (whose wife still won't let him get a bike), got an f650csa, rode about 1k miles that week, traded it in for my r12st, and I've put about 13k on it (until the snow made it too tough to ride...)

 

With that said, you are most definitely not alone in your group. However, not all of them pick BMW's. Many go with the Harley or metric cruisers. Some make even bigger jumps to the 1.8 liter GW's. It's a big group at this point and insurance companies are WELL aware of it. You can find several video clips on youtube of 50somethings on their chromed out cruiser that show how dangerous it can be in that demographic. Some people do it the smart way and slowly work their way back into it. Others jump right back in. Some regret that decision, while it works out for others.

 

The fact that you recognize the issue (IMHO) puts you ahead of the game already though.

[ericfoerster]

Even after many many miles we all still get surprised by some new life threatening twist.

 

So true

 

Nothing like riding to build up the experience. Just do what feels good and work up from there. Seems to me you have your head on straight. Read and ride and do it all over again. Miles = comfort, so ride all you can. You will learn much faster behind the bars than any other place

 

Good luck and enjoy it.

 

Oh yes, this place is an awesome support group. Just hold on to the Mastercard when the farkle bug hits. I've found its real hard to keep up with the folks here when it comes to toys

[AviP]

The one rule I try to apply to all my riding: I'm invisible to everybody else. It has been my truckful of luck!

[Mike]

Quinn--Welcome to BMWST. If you look at the raw numbers--age, income, etc.--the group here does indeed largely fall into the actuarial group you describe, but it looks to me like you've share the same goal as most here: beating the actuaries.

 

All that has been suggested so far is good advice. One of the basic steps I recommend is picking up a book on riding that will help you understand the dynamics of motorcycle operation that you never bothered to learn about when you were younger. I'd recommend "Proficient Motorcycling" by David Hough and "A Twist of the Wrist" by Keith Code. The latter is actually more about high-performance riding, but Code does a good job of explaining the physics behind motorcycle operation and the psychological impediments to good riding.

[Ken H.]

Some good suggestions here so far (especially the MSF BRC and ERC) but based on your profile, the bike I presume you are talking about is the '04 R1150RT. Which is not all that easy of a bike to learn to ride on. (Which for all practical purposes, is what you are doing.)

 

What a really radical suggestion? Park it for a year. Buy a cheap, used, smaller (400 - 500cc or something) standard style bike and get 10,000 miles/km under your belt on it.

 

In the long run the approach will serve you well.

[Francois_Dumas]

 

How many of y'all fit into my actuarial group and how are you trying to beat the odds?

 

I recognize the nostalgia part of it..... but nothing else. One should have LEARNED something along those past 30 years I would think ? Or have been less 'rebellious' to start with perhaps ?

 

I too fit the 50+-started-riding-again-profile but have no desire to ride a Ninja, Hayabuza or whatever these things- that-belong-on-a-racetrack are called. I also had a very thourough training some 35 years ago, and REPEATED it once more before getting on a bike again....

 

I now ride with all that traffic experience, love for nature, patience and belief that most other drivers and riders are complete and utter idiots.... and am having a good time as a safe rider.

 

I believe that after you have been sucessful once, you don't have to 'prove' yourself anymore and you can enjoy life.....

[OlGeezer]

The one rule I try to apply to all my riding: I'm invisible to everybody else. It has been my truckful of luck!

 

+1

[rdfrantz]

Quinn, I enjoy that you are excising yourself from a 'group' you've been externally assigned to - such assignment most often being a move by folks often motivated by the desire to control them by enforcing senses or perspectives as Reality: You're yellow, therefore you will do X (To my benefit which I the assigner am wanting, or to my detriment which I the assigner am not wanting).

 

That's one of the many kinds of Generalization, an action which is always not as life-serving as other action choices might be. I see one of the more dangerous aspects of that kind of Generalization as a debilitation through limitation: It focuses attention on a small set of characteristics, actions, or most important to me, thought. There is much more available to "group members" than that which the Generalization allots them: For example, the attribution that Demon Horsepower, or Demon Bulk (a sure sign of grossly demeaning, domineering Consumption manifest in Big Bikes... or SUVs) cannot but prevail and "Bring Tragedy to Our August and More Conservative Community".

 

But most happily, I see you've set yourself aside from that Categorization, and its mind-stulting Limitations; You've examined what makes up that environment of The Returning Rider, and set about on a planned path of if not Mastery, at least Considered Responsibility. The growth tasks you have mentioned, and items taken up right after you by Russell and then the other responders are the development of an Individuality that might also coexist with your group membership. Your individuality is born out of, actually created by your personal and individual exercise of Choice about your actions, rather than less reasoned agreement about behavior in that operating environment: Group Thinking.

 

Good for you.

 

I cannot say that your Choice to act and respond based in your independent perception, computation and action will lead to an absence of crashes in your riding or not. But, I do know that should you avoid them entirely, or even just the more serious of them or the more serious potential consequences, it will not be because you "sided with the 'right' sub-group", perchance of mantra-spouting safetynicks. It will arise from the discrete facts that on August 16th, 2007, upon approaching the intersection of Oak and Main, you noticed the proximate bush growth was creating a blind intersection, whereupon you decided to slow down and proceed with caution... just as a crossing driver did not.

 

You will survive that individually arising potential encounter through individual conception of it, and your individual response... or succumb because of lack of those. Which 'group' you belonged to doesn't and won't matter. How you Choose to be acting at the time will.

 

 

Best wishes.

[Rags]

The one rule I try to apply to all my riding: I'm invisible to everybody else. It has been my truckful of luck!

 

+1

 

+1

 

In addition do a lot of freeway riding (which is safest) and change lanes now & then. I got a new bike and had to relearn the equipment. Like where is the horn , lights/brights etc.

 

And those *#**@@/[ servos, damn near rolled the bike on an freeway entry ramp.

 

Using the tools to ride when thinking about it will strengthen your positive reactionary responses.

 

My .02

[wbrissette]

Before September, I hadn't ridden a motorcycle in almost 20 years! My last bike was a Honda SilverWing (got my Rider magazine yesterday and they have it featured in the retro section at the back -- brought back loads of memories). In September, I sold my work truck and my wife allowed me to purchase another motorcycle. I found a 2004 RT here, and ended up flying out to AZ to pick it up. In retrospect, it wasn't the brightest thing I've ever done, but what's done is done. I drove it 1000 miles back to Texas. The best thing I ever did was get in lots of highway driving to learn about the bike. But, honestly it driving it in the city was still a scary experience for a while. Due to prior commitments (soccer coach), I couldn't take the MSF course right away. I did take it and while I wouldn't say I learned a lot, it was refreshing to get brush up on some things that you tend to overlook (and after riding the RT, it was fun riding and throwing around those 125cc Kawasaki's they used.

 

They did mention to the two people in the class (yep, me) that were re-entering the pool, that we were the people most likely to have serious accidents according to the accident data.

 

Anyhow, I would say practice, practice, practice. Take the MSF course (even if you don't think you need it), and remember everybody else is an idiot out there on the roads and prepare for the unexpected at every turn.

 

Wayne

[keithb]

Hello Quinn. I am a former neighbor having lived in Cary, Raleigh, and Garner from '82-'89. I too was out of riding for over 15 years having cut my teeth on dirt bikes in the suburbs of Richmond in the woods and on trails. My first bike was purchased from a N.C.H.P. officer. A Yamaha Maxim 750. 3 months later I moved to California. Big difference from the Raleigh area. I really missed the rush of riding and I kept the Maxim for 3 years when I bought my 93 K1100RS. I never took the MSF course but did take the ERC to get better rates on insurance and hopes of picking up some tips. I won't say I learned a lot from it but did start practicing more defensive driving so I guess it was beneficial. Later in '96 I took a Keith Code school and to this day I practice what I learned from that class. ie. braking, corner entry speed, hitting the apex correctly, etc. The only way in my mind to become a better rider is seat time. Just 5 months ago I took a refresher MSF course. I am glad I went but I did not really learn anything new. My feeling is that it needs to be more real world. In other words on real roads in real scenarios. Would I recommend you take the course, you bet. A track day would be even better. A few posters mentioned getting a smaller bike. That is a good idea in my opinion. Heck you buy a small bike for next to nothing and turn around and sell it for almost what you paid for it to another novice. No harm no foul there. If you drop something small no worries. You drop your RT and it could easily be thousands of $$$$ in damage. Take your time, get to know your bike, get as much seat time as you can and enjoy the Parkway. I spent quite a bit of time on the Skyline Drive and B.R. Parkway (ASU grad) as a kid and in college. Maybe one of these days I will get to ride it on a bike. Enjoy and have fun.

[Mr_Ed]

Quinn, I enjoy that you are excising yourself from a 'group' you've been externally assigned to - such assignment most often being a move by folks often motivated by the desire to control them by enforcing senses or perspectives as Reality: You're yellow, therefore you will do X (To my benefit which I the assigner am wanting, or to my detriment which I the assigner am not wanting).

 

That's one of the many kinds of Generalization, an action which is always not as life-serving as other action choices might be. I see one of the more dangerous aspects of that kind of Generalization as a debilitation through limitation: It focuses attention on a small set of characteristics, actions, or most important to me, thought. There is much more available to "group members" than that which the Generalization allots them: For example, the attribution that Demon Horsepower, or Demon Bulk (a sure sign of grossly demeaning, domineering Consumption manifest in Big Bikes... or SUVs) cannot but prevail and "Bring Tragedy to Our August and More Conservative Community".

 

But most happily, I see you've set yourself aside from that Categorization, and its mind-stulting Limitations; You've examined what makes up that environment of The Returning Rider, and set about on a planned path of if not Mastery, at least Considered Responsibility. The growth tasks you have mentioned, and items taken up right after you by Russell and then the other responders are the development of an Individuality that might also coexist with your group membership. Your individuality is born out of, actually created by your personal and individual exercise of Choice about your actions, rather than less reasoned agreement about behavior in that operating environment: Group Thinking.

 

Good for you.

 

I cannot say that your Choice to act and respond based in your independent perception, computation and action will lead to an absence of crashes in your riding or not. But, I do know that should you avoid them entirely, or even just the more serious of them or the more serious potential consequences, it will not be because you "sided with the 'right' sub-group", perchance of mantra-spouting safetynicks. It will arise from the discrete facts that on August 16th, 2007, upon approaching the intersection of Oak and Main, you noticed the proximate bush growth was creating a blind intersection, whereupon you decided to slow down and proceed with caution... just as a crossing driver did not.

 

You will survive that individually arising potential encounter through individual conception of it, and your individual response... or succumb because of lack of those. Which 'group' you belonged to doesn't and won't matter. How you Choose to be acting at the time will.

 

Yeesh! Someone needs to keep something other than a thesaurus in the bathroom

[Quinn]

Thank you all for your positive suggestions and encouragement. Does look like I'm in a pretty large herd. Hope we can all beat the demographic odds with constant attention and learning. In my own defense, so I don't sound like a total idiot. My last bike was a '73 Yamaha 650 (a Bonneville clone) and I commuted on it in Atlanta traffic. I was a good defensive driver and skilled enough to enjoy week long trips along the Blue Ridge Parkway, camping and exploring side roads. I can't get in a class until March and hope I will be putting off dropping a bike until it can be one of theirs. I don't plan on pushing my limits any time soon; a tentitive nudge in their direction will do nicely, thank you. My only real fear at this point is that I'm going to scare myself out of owning a bike by taking a corner too fast or misjudging my balance and having a fall. I'd Prefer the little positive steps approach.

[Dennis Andress]

.....

...

..

.

I'd Prefer the little positive steps approach.

 

There are two golden rules of long-life motorcycling....

• Anything that moves can, and may try to, kill you.
• Get the f--- out of the way.

[Survived-til-now]

Hi Quinn

 

Welcome back to biking. I had the same questions when I was born again in '97 at the age of 45 and in another few weeks I'll be turning 55.

 

I returned to a 750 VFR - having asked my instructors on a back to biking course whether I should go for a smaller bike first, and their reply was to go for the bike I wanted straight off but to take it real easy until I had fully mastered the bike. Its true over here, as I suspect it is over there, that there is a disproportionately high number of born-again's who write themselves off in "loss of control" accidents with no other vehicles involved. I believe that is down to older riders who under-estimate the power/speed of the bike and over estimate their ability... so take it easy is probably good advice.

 

After a while I found I became too comfortable on the bike and realised that a number of near misses could have been avoided by better concentration and more defensive riding - so I took an advanced riding course and that has helped a lot. I don't know if you have an organisation like our Institute of Advanced Motorists with local groups?

 

Occurs to me that apart from saying take it easy there are some other thoughts I'd offer you:

 

1. Recognise that at over 50 your reactions are not as quick as those of 30-year old and your eyesight may not be as good - so use what you have got and she/he hasn't - experience. It's a proven statistic that older more experienced driver/riders recognise potentially dangerous situations earlier - and that is the strength you can and should use to the full.

 

2. The R1150RT is a real good bike to own. It is planted on the road, surprisingly agile, forgiving and with amazing handling. It cannot defeat the laws of adhesion and gravity but a couple of bits of wisdom handed down to me have stood me in good stead. First - A bike that is under positive drive (as opposed to declerating) will lose its rear end first - so when you get into trouble don't be too quick to slam on the brakes - you can control an 1150Rt when the back steps out. Second - If you have gone into a corner a bit quicker than you should and cannot lose speed well before you lean - it is more likely that you can ride it than brake it round the corner. It is quite possible to scrape the cylinder head covers on an 1150RT and still get round. Until you do it you won't believe just how far that bike will lean before the pegs warn you that you are about to lean too far. Find out how far you can lean the bike - in dry conditions and with no traffic around. Third - find out what your 1150RT can do and feels like in emergency braking - don't wait until someone drives out in front of you to find out. The 1150 RT has fantastic brakes, the brake booster and ABS work well - and it is another proven statistic that too many riders could have/should stopped but didn't use the full potential of their brakes. In short - you have in my opinion one of the best engineered bikes in the world and a lot of the design has gone into getting you out of trouble.

 

So armed with your expereince and the 1150RT - you should be OK. Have faith in the bike and I wish you happy and safe riding.

[flatbutt]

Well I hope I'm not being discouraging but after 15 years of not riding the RT is not what I'd recommend as a re-entry bike(IF in fact that is what you have chosen). Something smaller, less powerful and more agile in the hands of a beginner might be more appropriate.

 

It is a very different riding world Quinn, rodes are more crowded, car drivers are far more distracted AND far less courteous than they used to be. You will learn how to handle the bike technically if you take your time(and it sounds like you will), but many of us have evolved along with the changing reality of the driving world. Just knowing the bike is one thing but knowing the road and how to survive it on a bike is very different. The RT is a forgiving bike but it is a powerful machine with some quirks that take time to know.

 

Be more than careful Quinn. We are old guys on powerful machines in a dangerous environment.

[NEOHMark]

I'm living proof that you CAN be a MUCH better rider at middle-age than in your 20s. I'm much like you, Quinn - only a decade younger and about three years ahead of you on the 'second time around'. I rode a small Kaw 440LTD in my youth (early 20s) for about 5 years.

 

Point blank - I was stupidly ignorant about riding skills at that tender age and it's a miracle I didn't kill myself nor my (now) wife. I'm a FAR better rider today than then - for two reasons. 1) I'm more cautious about riding and am highly familiar with the statistics that define the 'hotspots' of motorcycle crashes. Read the Hurt Report Study to learn what you probably SHOULDN'T do on a bike - and to be acutely aware of where trouble is likely to exist. ibmwr.org's summary of the Hurt Report. And 2) Because I take seriously the responsiblity of improving my riding skills and actively do so. 'Proficient Motorcycling' by David Hough is a good read and I intend to read 'Total Control' soon. Next summer - an on-track cornering course at Mid-Ohio racetrack is on my list of things to-do. I'd have never considered any of this 25 years ago.

 

So take heart. You CAN be a better rider than ever. It'll just take a little work. But that's 90% of the fun of it IMHO. Best wishes to you. It sounds like you have your head screwed on straight.

[Redbrick]

Hi Quinn and welcome......

I too rode dirt bikes in my 30's (the 60's and 70's) and when the kids grew up and we quit going to the desert to ride I quit....No street bikes for me!...Too dangerous....So I waited until I was over twice that age to start with the street....Took a 2 day riding school, read the books like Proficient Motorcycling, worked my way up to a 1200RT starting with a Honda 750 Spirit and continue to learn and practice....This forum is a great place to do that as there is a whole lot of experience represented here....

I am always concerned (best moderate word I can think of) when I ride but I love to do it....I don't think you are any different than a whole bunch of us...It's always been dangerous to ride on the street but I believe we are now more aware of the importance of training, protection and practicing riding skills and the problems that we might encounter when riding....

At the riding school I had a conversation with one of the instructors about how do you explain to people why you ride...He said he asks them who they would like to ski or surf to work every day?...Pretty good answer..You can't explain it to people who haven't experienced it..The freedom we get when riding is only experienced in those kinds of activities I believe and I'll contiune to do it until it's time to quit....Hope that's a ways off....

 

Phil..........Redbrick

[Rags]

What do you say to folks that wonder why you ride... Hmmm...

 

I thought it was summed up pretty good by a signature comment by a forum contributer. I paraphrase:

 

"Trying to tell someone why you ride, is like trying to explain an orgasm to a virgin."

 

Ride your ride within your capabilities and enjoy it; just remember the cars are out to getcha.

[Dick_at_Lake_Tahoe_NV]

Hi Quinn, and Welcome. Just a couple of additional comments and thoughts that I hope will help. First,sign up for a Motorcycle Safety course--it's a great place to get re-oriented to the street. Then sign up for a track-day--you'll be amazed at what you learn and how comfortable you get in turns on your bike. Go to a Keith Code school or something similar. Read some of the books recommed here--Dave Hough's books Proficient Motorcycling is a great start--as is Kieth Code's book, Twist of the Writst Volume II, and excellent discussion of Counter-steering which you'll need to master. Remember, "Anyone can go fast and ride well in a straight line, the skill comes in being able to corner well--learn that skill!" Go to the outside of the turn as you enter, and understand what it means to "late Apex", it's the safest way to corner, especially when you're learning. Some of the worst accidents happen when you inadvertantly cross over the line while cornering--never, ever do that, but if you do,say to yourself, "I just died hitting an on-coming car" and thank god none was there "this time". Buy the DVD, "Ride Like a Pro IV" as it will give you some practice tips that will make you a much better rider. Subscribe to Motorcycle Consumer News, and read the articles each month on "Proficient Motorcycling" and "Street Strategy" and "Medical Motorcycling. Find someone to ride with, who understands what's it's like to be a "Newby Rider" follow them and pattern your riding after their's. Patterning is a great way to learn to ride well. I hope all the comments you've received on this site will make give a safer, better and more comfortable ride. Only about 1 1/2% of the new bikes sold each year are BMWs. We're a special group and we do the best we can to read and practice to add the extra .9, to the 99.999% safety record we try to achieve. "You don't stop riding because you get old--you get old because you stop riding."

Dick--Age 71.

PS: I started riding street in '99 (when I was 65) and now have nearly 100,000 miles and have done all the things above that I'm recommending to you.

[stewm_21]

Lots of great suggestions here and I've been listening to them for a few months myself. I'm in the same boat as many in this group, had a bike (Kaw 750 LTD) when I was in my early 20's and last year as I turned 40 bought a '05 R1200ST (when my wife finally let me ).

Couple of the big pointers I've learned are

1) Trust the bike, it can do far more than you can.

2) Look where you want to be and you will get there.

3) Brakes are not always the answer; quite often the throttle will save you in a bad situation as the bike will go where you are looking.

4) Ride like your invisible.

5) Take courses, read books, ask questions and practice, that will reinforce all of good ideas.

 

My best ride times are mid-week (man I love shift work) after the morning rush hour, get out into the country, get lost on the back roads and enjoy the day for what it is, a great day on a nice bike.

[stewm_21]

By the way, points 1 thru 5- I've mastered none of these yet.

[Misti]

When I first started riding I used to complain to a friend of mine that cars kept cutting me off. He blatently said to me, "it's partly your fault, you didn't see it coming." Of course I was highly insulted by his comment at first until he added, "riding for me is like playing a video game. I imagine that all the cars are trying to hit me and I always plan for an out."

 

As soon as I intigrated this philosophy into my street riding I started to see things (like cars moving into my lane) before it even happened. I would roll off the gas to let the car in and then honk to let them know they hadn't seen me there. It completely changed the way I viewed riding and suddenly people weren't cutting me off anymore.

 

I also started riding on an old beat up ol 89 CBR 600 RR while all my friends were on fancy smanchy 2000 GSXR 1000's and such and I really believe that starting with an older and smaller model (BMW OF COURSE!!!) is a good way to go, in case of accidental drop for one, and also to ease into it. I also think it helps you become a better rider....

 

Books and training courses are a must too..that was one thing I never did until two years into riding AND racing. I crashed a lot and had no idea what I was doing....

 

Ride Safe!

 

 

Misti

[Bud]

You got it wrong.

 

This is just a bad group.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[eruff]

How many of y'all fit into my actuarial group and how are you trying to beat the odds?

 

I fit the actuarial group you describe. I'm 57 and, recalling how much fun it was to ride my Suzuki 100 in 1968, caved in to the encouragement of a friend and got an '05 RT. Bit of a big bike to learn on, but not impossible. I agree with what the others have said about learing skills from others and taking driving courses

 

When I started riding the RT, I tried to read up on motorcycle safety. One thing that kept popping up was that car drivers seemed to say the same thing over and over after hitting a motorcycllist. "I just didn't see the motorcycle." Others here refer to motorcycles as being "invisible" to cars.

 

So I am trying to increase the odds with being conspicuous in traffic. I use a white helmet, because I read somewhere that was the most visible color. I just got one of these outrageous jackets (it's much brighter in person):

made by Olympia Motor Sports in the hopes that I will be less invisible.

 

Here's my theory about cars pulling out in front of motorcycles and bicycles: No one pulls out in front of a cement truck. The cement truck might not be able to stop, even if the driver wants to. The car would be crushed! Same goes for not pulling out in front of trucks hauling logs, etc. But any car driver will pull out in front of a bicycle. What's the worst that can happen to me in the car? The bike bounces off my car! Pretty much the same thinking goes for a motorcycle.

 

So I think that car drivers subconciously make this sort of "danger to me" analysis all the time. Even nice people do it. So, it's not so much that motorcycles are invisible -- it's just that they don't represent the kind of danger that car drivers are looking out for. What we motocycle riders want is for car drivers to be concerned not only with their own welfare, but OTHER PEOPLE'S WELFARE too. Well, human nature is working against us here. Folks worry about themselves first and others a distant second. So, I use conspicuity as a means of trying to puncture the mist that surrounds the non-threatening motorcycle. As a result, I look like a clown fish going down the road. I am not cool at all. I have motolights, hyperlights, reflectors, optic yellow jacket. I am hoping this forces the other drivers to notice me... and take my presence into consideration.

[Ken H.]

No one pulls out in front of a cement truck. The cement truck might not be able to stop, even if the driver wants to. The car would be crushed! Same goes for not pulling out in front of trucks hauling logs, etc.

Want to bet? Ask a fire engine driver some time.

I am hoping this forces the other drivers to notice me... and take my presence into consideration.

Well here's to hoping, but I wouldn't count on it.

 

Do everything you can, to make yourself as conspicuous as you can, then ride knowing none of it works. Your life depends 100% on you avoiding them, not them avoiding you.

[Bud]

No one pulls out in front of a cement truck. The cement truck might not be able to stop, even if the driver wants to. The car would be crushed! Same goes for not pulling out in front of trucks hauling logs, etc.

Want to bet? Ask a fire engine driver some time.

I am hoping this forces the other drivers to notice me... and take my presence into consideration.

Well here's to hoping, but I wouldn't count on it.

 

Do everything you can, to make yourself as conspicuous as you can, then ride knowing none of it works. Your life depends 100% on you avoiding them, not them avoiding you.

 

Best statement in the whole thread. IMO

[ADulay]

Quinn,

 

I don't quite fit the "returning hippie" picture as I started riding in the early 60's and never gave it up!

 

45 years later still riding almost every day that I'm at home and still see things that just amaze me in the stupidity of cage drivers, especially down here in Florida.

 

Most of this thread has given some excellent advice but just remember to watch everybody around you all the time. The double decaf, cell phone, DVD watcher is NOT looking at your bike when they make that left turn without the signal!!

 

 

AD

[ncsonderman]

Quinn,

 

glad to see you have gotten back on the horse, and yes it is true that you are the demographic that is involved in most fatal motorcycle crashes.

 

I seem to get the feeling that you will be getting familiar with your bike in order to actually ride it. Not just to jockey it to Carolina Ale House and back with a couple of buddies.

 

Heed the advice so many have given and get into an MSF course. Maybe next year you can head up to VIR for a track day or school as well. I am comforted to know that your are in a helmet mandatory state.

 

Let me know when you'd like to start fiddling with your bike. We have a growing number or BMW riders in the Piedmont area that have regular maintenance sessions. They fall short of a tech day, but they are a start.

 

Ride safe Quinn and we'll see you around sometime

 

Joe

[BerryG]

I took some time off from bikes as well but during that period I was usually driving a car at the limit. So, when I came back to bikes I did take it easy for a bit, mainly because I had never had anything as heavy as my KRS, but I must confess I do wick it up a bit in the hills. I have put about 15K on the bike in the last year and I think I am much more careful in traffic that I used to be. I am considering some sort of UJM for a track bike to save the KRS for the long hauls.

At 58,I do drive/ride much futher ahead than I did in my youth. I sometimes wonder how I survived those bygone days.