Replacing camshaft WITHOUT bmw CCT tool

[dmsantam]

I am still waiting on the CCT tool from BMW, but have everything else for cam and follower replacement. The CCT tool puts a little more pressure on the cam chain when compared to the CCT that is on the bike when it's not running. If i set the timing with the CCT only, it will be slightly off. My question is how far off is it, and is it rideable? or do I have to leave the bike sitting until i get the tool?

 

When i checked the timing before i removed the camshafts (timing had never been done on this bike since new) at 33,000km on the clock, i could ALMOST get the timing jig on to the end of the cams (i didn't want to force it) with the stock CCT. 

 

I've heard of many bikes being slightly out of time from the factory, so I wonder if it's a problem to be slightly out until i get the tool. 

 

cheers,

[LAF]

You can not do a cam timing without the CCT tool.  It will never be accurate.  It puts an amazing amount of pressure on the cam chain.  Enough your bike may be in time once the CCT reaches it's tension.

 

IMHO if it is just a hair off it is not going to make a difference.  A lot of the 1200's were a hair off that I found,  but many were out really far.

 

So if you have everything back together and at TDC it is just a hair off with the jig, then no issue riding it.  As I said many 1200's came from the factory this way and started off the Cam Timing flurry that has made tools scarce and dealers scratching their heads as to what the hell was going on.

 

Of course I have no idea on 1250's as I just did 1200's free trying to see how bad they were off.  I traveled around to peoples houses to do it for them.  The guy who started the thread on Adventure Rider Forums asked me to start running a nail over cams to see if they were found failing.  I never found any in all the cam timings I did.

 

So IMHO the bike is safe to ride but since your there, you should try to find a CCT tool.  Any local BMW clubs?  I bet if you found the Dinner they meet up at for breakfast you could borrow one of the club member tools.  Or they would meet up with you and use the tool.

 

I also road to RI from PA and back in one day, with my tools to meet Boxflyer (Brad) for a 1200 cam timing.  He then helped me go DarkSide with my RT and a car tire.  He sold me a rim and mounted a car tire on it and I rode it home to PA.  So we all know how much Boxflyer has contributed to the BMW community as he picked up the Cam Timing for 1200, 1250's and his service videos are just great resources.  Also I think he has the tools available that he manufactures, so you may want to shoot him a PM and ask.  I am sure if your willing to pay expedited postage costs, he can get that tool to you in a few days.

[Cap]

You removed your camshafts, presumably to check and set your valve clearances.  So, you will have also removed your timing reluctor.  As long as you have set your valve clearances properly, and reset the position of the reluctor properly, then your bike should run OK.

 

I found, on two separate bikes, that there is a very noticeable difference after a 12K service during which the spark plugs are replaced, and the cam timing is reset, and all the valves are set to about the same clearance, and the timing mark is precisely adjusted.  Before that the bike runs OK.  And after, it runs super smooth.

 

Cap

[dmsantam]

5 hours ago, LAF said:

You can not do a cam timing without the CCT tool.  It will never be accurate.  It puts an amazing amount of pressure on the cam chain.  Enough your bike may be in time once the CCT reaches it's tension.

 

IMHO if it is just a hair off it is not going to make a difference.  A lot of the 1200's were a hair off that I found,  but many were out really far.

 

So if you have everything back together and at TDC it is just a hair off with the jig, then no issue riding it.  As I said many 1200's came from the factory this way and started off the Cam Timing flurry that has made tools scarce and dealers scratching their heads as to what the hell was going on.

 

Of course I have no idea on 1250's as I just did 1200's free trying to see how bad they were off.  I traveled around to peoples houses to do it for them.  The guy who started the thread on Adventure Rider Forums asked me to start running a nail over cams to see if they were found failing.  I never found any in all the cam timings I did.

 

So IMHO the bike is safe to ride but since your there, you should try to find a CCT tool.  Any local BMW clubs?  I bet if you found the Dinner they meet up at for breakfast you could borrow one of the club member tools.  Or they would meet up with you and use the tool.

 

I also road to RI from PA and back in one day, with my tools to meet Boxflyer (Brad) for a 1200 cam timing.  He then helped me go DarkSide with my RT and a car tire.  He sold me a rim and mounted a car tire on it and I rode it home to PA.  So we all know how much Boxflyer has contributed to the BMW community as he picked up the Cam Timing for 1200, 1250's and his service videos are just great resources.  Also I think he has the tools available that he manufactures, so you may want to shoot him a PM and ask.  I am sure if your willing to pay expedited postage costs, he can get that tool to you in a few days.

Thanks for the reply LAF. I am in Australia and have not had any luck borrowing the tool. I'm a member of a BMW club and sadly they don't have that tool. Once I get one, I'll be providing others with access to it. 

 

I ordered the tools back in November, and have received everything except the CCT tool. A few weeks ago, BMW was contacted by my dealer and the ETA on the tool is a week from now, although I'm unsure if their ETA can be trusted!

 

I will certainly correctly retime the cams when the tool arrives but in the meantime was hoping that the difference in cam timing between using the CCT tool and the CCT itself would be insignificant enough to not cause any serious issues. 

 

cheers,

[dmsantam]

5 hours ago, Cap said:

You removed your camshafts, presumably to check and set your valve clearances.  So, you will have also removed your timing reluctor.  As long as you have set your valve clearances properly, and reset the position of the reluctor properly, then your bike should run OK.

 

I found, on two separate bikes, that there is a very noticeable difference after a 12K service during which the spark plugs are replaced, and the cam timing is reset, and all the valves are set to about the same clearance, and the timing mark is precisely adjusted.  Before that the bike runs OK.  And after, it runs super smooth.

 

Cap

Hi Cap,

 

I removed the cams to replace them and the followers due to wear. I also reset valve clearances while I was in there. Timing reluctor has been aligned. I just don't have the tool to put the extra pressure on the cam chain to time the cams accurately. 

 

cheers 

[dmsantam]

Can confirm that the bike runs fine with the cams timed with just the factory CCT. Of course I will time it correctly once the tool arrives, as it's likely a little bit off.