2005 1200RT Fuel smell

[JPA]

Hi all,

 

Have a 2005 RT1200,  best bike I've ever had and it's not even close.   Absolutely love it.    Recently, have been smelling gas and am unsure where this could be coming from.   There are no visible signs of a leak at the fuel pump, no drips on the floor, nada. Looking at the gas cap seal, it looks a little worn and is probably the original.   Could this be the issue?   Anyone else have any experience with this issue?   I appreciate anyone weighing in on this.

 

Thanks.

[dirtrider]

2 hours ago, JPA said:

Hi all,

 

Have a 2005 RT1200,  best bike I've ever had and it's not even close.   Absolutely love it.    Recently, have been smelling gas and am unsure where this could be coming from.   There are no visible signs of a leak at the fuel pump, no drips on the floor, nada. Looking at the gas cap seal, it looks a little worn and is probably the original.   Could this be the issue?   Anyone else have any experience with this issue?   I appreciate anyone weighing in on this.

 

Thanks.

Afternoon JPA

 

You might look for the fuel tank evap/vent hose being pulled loose. 

 

I have also seen the fuel cap seal leaking  so that could be it. 

 

You might also look at the fuel regulator/distributor for the possibility of a seep or leaking.  

 

What I usually do when tracing fuel smells on the hexhead (after examining the obvious areas)  is to unplug the fuel tank vent hose (coming out of the top of fuel tank the running to right front evap can). There should be a connector in that those about half way between the fuel tank & the evap can that you can just get to without removing the fuel tank. 

 

Then hook a longer hose on that fitting (the end going back to the fuel tank) then blow air into that hose with my mouth. Then in a quiet area listen for air escaping at the fuel cap or other tank areas.

 

There is also a possibility that your fuel pump pass-through plate high pressure hose fitting (the one that is screwed into the pass-through) is seeping due to an "O" ring issue or a cracked pump pass-through fitting boss. (A number or problems with that plastic boss cracking)  

 

 

 

 

[JPA]

Thanks for the quick reply dirtrider.   Now I have something to do this weekend besides sit on the couch watching football.   Much appreciated.

[JPA]

Just thought I'd follow up to close this one off.   I ended up pulling off the left-side plastic to look at the fuel pump area and there she be........................a small 'seep' coming out of the plastic quick-disconnect fitting.   Ordered the metal replacements from beemer boneyard and presto........no more fuel leaking.    

 

I have to say this forum is kick-ass for weekend wrenchers like myself.   $100 in parts (give or take) and a few hours of my own labor VS $100/hour + parts + shop fees.   Probably saved $500 or more doing it myself.

 

Thanks again dirtrider.

 

 

[Dave P]

Motorcycle stuff is always better than football stuff...

[John Ranalletta]

On 9/21/2023 at 3:43 PM, dirtrider said:

Afternoon JPA

 

You might look for the fuel tank evap/vent hose being pulled loose. 

 

I have also seen the fuel cap seal leaking  so that could be it. 

 

You might also look at the fuel regulator/distributor for the possibility of a seep or leaking.  

 

What I usually do when tracing fuel smells on the hexhead (after examining the obvious areas)  is to unplug the fuel tank vent hose (coming out of the top of fuel tank the running to right front evap can). There should be a connector in that those about half way between the fuel tank & the evap can that you can just get to without removing the fuel tank. 

 

Then hook a longer hose on that fitting (the end going back to the fuel tank) then blow air into that hose with my mouth. Then in a quiet area listen for air escaping at the fuel cap or other tank areas.

 

There is also a possibility that your fuel pump pass-through plate high pressure hose fitting (the one that is screwed into the pass-through) is seeping due to an "O" ring issue or a cracked pump pass-through fitting boss. (A number or problems with that plastic boss cracking)  

 

DR, how does one check if the canister is plugged? 

 

With the plastic off, I can hear/feel what I believe is the valve on the canister opening/closing. 

 

I'm almost certain vapors are coming from the filler cap area. 

 

I've inspected the connections on the pass through plate with engine running and there's no leak of any kind. 

 

I know there's another thread here about the filler cap gasket which could be the source.  Would vapors still escape from the filler with good gasket if the evap system is blocked.  BTW, it seems the vapors are more intense after a fill up if that's germaine.

 

Thanks...

[dirtrider]

2 hours ago, John Ranalletta said:

DR, how does one check if the canister is plugged? 

 

With the plastic off, I can hear/feel what I believe is the valve on the canister opening/closing. 

 

I'm almost certain vapors are coming from the filler cap area. 

 

I've inspected the connections on the pass through plate with engine running and there's no leak of any kind. 

 

I know there's another thread here about the filler cap gasket which could be the source.  Would vapors still escape from the filler with good gasket if the evap system is blocked.  BTW, it seems the vapors are more intense after a fill up if that's germaine.

 

Thanks...

Afternoon John

 

There are a few ways to verify a fully plugged canister, but about the only way to verify any plugging (short of fully plugged) is to cut the evap can open & look inside. 

 

As for that valve on the evap can, that is just for purging the hydrocarbons trapped by the canister back into the engine. The fuel tank vents through the evap can at all times.   

 

You can remove the canister then put a vacuum source on the canister fuel tank vent line fitting then see if it will pull a vacuum, if it will then the canister is plugged.  

 

What year 1200RT are you working on? I have seen a number of the later 1200 hexheads leak fuel fumes at the filler cap gasket area. It doesn't seem to be an actual gasket problem but more a problem of poor fit of the cap to the  filler neck. (might even be on the filler neck side not the cap side). As I have put on an entire new cap assembly & still had the leak at the cap gasket. 

 

I usually add an "O" ring between the top of the cap gasket & the cap. The "O" ring is just slightly smaller on the OD than the OD of the cap gasket so it sits inside the OD of the cap gasket when installed. That "O" ring pushes the gasket farther out so it contacts the filler neck with a tighter fit.  

 

There is a tank vent hose coming from the top front of the fuel tank running to the evap canister. Part way between the tank & the evap canister is plastic fitting (the vent hose is a 2 piece hose).

 

I usually pull the vent hose apart at that fitting  (with difficulty you can get to it without removing any plastics) then I attach a longer hose to the tank side of that hose. Then I use my mouth to blow as much air pressure into that hose as I can while listening at the filler cap for escaping air. If you still have decent hearing (I sure don't) you should be able to hear the air escaping.  With my poor hearing if I can't hear air escaping  (big leak) I blow air pressure into the tank then pinch the hose closed with a needle nose pliers or (brake hose clamp). Then after about 1 minute I put the open end of the hose up to my ear then release the pliers. If I hear air escaping then the fuel cap gasket isn't leaking. If no air pressure remaining then the tank has an air leak (probably at the cap gasket area).    

 

 

[John Ranalletta]

10 minutes ago, dirtrider said:

Afternoon John

 

There are a few ways to verify a fully plugged canister, but about the only way to verify any plugging (short of fully plugged) is to cut the evap can open & look inside. 

 

As for that valve on the evap can, that is just for purging the hydrocarbons trapped by the canister back into the engine. The fuel tank vents through the evap can at all times.   

 

You can remove the canister then put a vacuum source on the canister fuel tank vent line fitting then see if it will pull a vacuum, if it will then the canister is plugged.  

 

What year 1200RT are you working on? I have seen a number of the later 1200 hexheads leak fuel fumes at the filler cap gasket area. It doesn't seem to be an actual gasket problem but more a problem of poor fit of the cap to the  filler neck. (might even be on the filler neck side not the cap side). As I have put on an entire new cap assembly & still had the leak at the cap gasket. 

 

I usually add an "O" ring between the top of the cap gasket & the cap. The "O" ring is just slightly smaller on the OD than the OD of the cap gasket so it sits inside the OD of the cap gasket when installed. That "O" ring pushes the gasket farther out so it contacts the filler neck with a tighter fit.  

 

There is a tank vent hose coming from the top front of the fuel tank running to the evap canister. Part way between the tank & the evap canister is plastic fitting (the vent hose is a 2 piece hose).

 

I usually pull the vent hose apart at that fitting  (with difficulty you can get to it without removing any plastics) then I attach a longer hose to the tank side of that hose. Then I use my mouth to blow as much air pressure into that hose as I can while listening at the filler cap for escaping air. If you still have decent hearing (I sure don't) you should be able to hear the air escaping.  With my poor hearing if I can't hear air escaping  (big leak) I blow air pressure into the tank then pinch the hose closed with a needle nose pliers or (brake hose clamp). Then after about 1 minute I put the open end of the hose up to my ear then release the pliers. If I hear air escaping then the fuel cap gasket isn't leaking. If no air pressure remaining then the tank has an air leak (probably at the cap gasket area).    

 

 

Thanks.  It's a '10 R1200RT. 

 

If one were to blow into the tube attached to the tank, should it flow freely?  I did so and it seemed blocked or at least not flowing very freely.

 

I'll try the 0-ring as I wrote, the filler area is emitting the vapors.

[DBULL]

John, When I took the bike in for the dreaded fuel strip replacement, they replaced the O ring at the top of the tank, so that shouldn't be the issue-it wasn't that long ago, and fixed the smell immediately.   Not sure what else it could be.

 

Dave

[dirtrider]

18 minutes ago, John Ranalletta said:

Thanks.  It's a '10 R1200RT. 

 

If one were to blow into the tube attached to the tank, should it flow freely?  I did so and it seemed blocked or at least not flowing very freely.

 

I'll try the 0-ring as I wrote, the filler area is emitting the vapors.

Evening John

 

It should flow air back into the tank but it isn't a very large opening. There is also a roll-over valve inside the tank it has to go back through.

 

I haven't chased a fuel cap air leak on the 2010 but I believe the 2010 has the same orange plastic filler neck as the ones I have seen problems with on the later 1200 hexheads.

 

When I was chasing the first cap to filler neck leak I had to deal with I cut a circle out of a piece of gasket materiel with the hole in the center just slightly smaller than the OD of the cap gasket (it needs to be large enough to get it over the cap gasket then under it's back side, it stuck out farther than the cap gasket OD) . That worked good so I then switched to the "O ring as it fit under the gasket farther in & was easier to install (I am only mentioning this in case you don't have the proper sized "O" ring handy).  

[John Ranalletta]

5 minutes ago, DBULL said:

John, When I took the bike in for the dreaded fuel strip replacement, they replaced the O ring at the top of the tank, so that shouldn't be the issue-it wasn't that long ago, and fixed the smell immediately.   Not sure what else it could be.

 

Dave

Thanks, Dave.  Just don't know what else might be causing the vapor emissions; and, there's no doubt they emanate from the filler area.  I checked the gasket under the fill tube and it's intact and falling into place.  All six screws tighten down on the filler tube flange appropriately...

 

So the black gasket on the hinged assembly was replaced before?  That'd be inexpensive to try.  There's another thread around about how that gasket is changed with the posters saying the old one is stretched off and new one warmed up and stretched on.  Any input?

[dirtrider]

On 11/8/2023 at 4:32 PM, John Ranalletta said:

 

So the black gasket on the hinged assembly was replaced before?  That'd be inexpensive to try.  There's another thread around about how that gasket is changed with the posters saying the old one is stretched off and new one warmed up and stretched on.  Any input?

Evening John

 

On the first one I found this problem on I first replaced the cap gasket, no help, I then replaced the entire cap, again no help.  The "O" ring work-around has been in place & working for over 10 years now. 

[John Ranalletta]

Thanks, DR.  I'll try it tomorrow.

[John Ranalletta]

47 minutes ago, dirtrider said:

 .

 

When I was chasing the first cap to filler neck leak I had to deal with I cut a circle out of a piece of gasket materiel with the hole in the center just slightly smaller than the OD of the cap gasket (it needs to be large enough to get it over the cap gasket then under it's back side, it stuck out farther than the cap gasket OD) . That worked good so I then switched to the "O ring as it fit under the gasket farther in & was easier to install (I am only mentioning this in case you don't have the proper sized "O" ring handy).  

My o-ring inventory doesn't have anything big enough.  The gasket O.D. is 50mm.  

 

Thanks again.

[DBULL]

John, I don't remember because they did it in the shop while I waited (this was done in Barrington IL).  We didn't have a dealer in all of WI for a while so went there for the warranty on the fuel strip.  They told me they noticed smell and fixed it.  I'm sorry I can't be more specific.  Not sure if it is gasket or O ring.  

[John Ranalletta]

17 hours ago, dirtrider said:

Evening John

 

On the first one I found this problem on I first replaced the cap gasket, no help, I then replaced the entire cap, agin no help.  The "O" ring work-around has been in place & working for over 10 years now. 

Slipped an o-ring under the gasket.  Cold weather coming and may not get a real opportunity to test.  Thanks, again.

[dirtrider]

2 minutes ago, John Ranalletta said:

Slipped an o-ring under the gasket.  Cold weather coming and may not get a real opportunity to test.  Thanks, again.

Morning John

 

Just blow back through the vent hose then sniff around the fuel filler cap area.  If it is still leaking then you will probably smell raw gasoline fumes.

[SHIMHEAD]

Hello all,

    Just for fun, go to YouTube and search for DIY smoke machine. It can be as simple as blowing cigar/cigarette smoke in a hose, or as elaborate as you care to make it. Baby oil and sufficient heat makes lots of smoke. Getting smoke into a leaking system at low pressure is quite effective in locating a vapor leak source....