Charcoal canister and ABS removal

[plepper]

I've got the bike ready to do the removal of the CC and ABS and have a couple questions. First on the charcoal canister I've watched the Chris Harris video and also read the instructions by Gary Wasserman. In the video Chris shows 2 ways to deal with the vacuum lines and I was thinking of doing the 2nd one back to the tee but after reading the article by Gary he removes all the vacuum lines and installs caps on the vacuum ports eliminating all the vacuum lines.Is there any reason the 2 throttle bodies should be linked? If not removing all the lines seems better as there is little chance of a vacuum leak other than a cap splitting, any thoughts on this?

 

As far as the ABS removal it looks fairly straight forward except for the rear brake line, DirtRider mentions a adaptor for the rear MC/Banjo connection but I don't see a part number or picture of the part. I am replacing all the lines with Spiegler lines and when I talked to them they were at a loss for what the banjo manifold would be, they did say they've only had 1 set of lines returned so something must be working.

[dirtrider]

13 hours ago, plepper said:

I've got the bike ready to do the removal of the CC and ABS and have a couple questions. First on the charcoal canister I've watched the Chris Harris video and also read the instructions by Gary Wasserman. In the video Chris shows 2 ways to deal with the vacuum lines and I was thinking of doing the 2nd one back to the tee but after reading the article by Gary he removes all the vacuum lines and installs caps on the vacuum ports eliminating all the vacuum lines.Is there any reason the 2 throttle bodies should be linked? If not removing all the lines seems better as there is little chance of a vacuum leak other than a cap splitting, any thoughts on this?

 

As far as the ABS removal it looks fairly straight forward except for the rear brake line, DirtRider mentions a adaptor for the rear MC/Banjo connection but I don't see a part number or picture of the part. I am replacing all the lines with Spiegler lines and when I talked to them they were at a loss for what the banjo manifold would be, they did say they've only had 1 set of lines returned so something must be working.

Morning  plepper

 

You can plug the throttle body vacuum nipples or leave the crossover hose between them then plug the Tee going to the purge solenoid. 

 

Some like to leave the crossover hose between the throttle bodies thinking that it can even out the  idle balance a little. I haven't seen much difference either way & BMW doesn't use the hose on the non evap. can equipped motorcycles.

That hose is so small of a diameter & long enough, and with the very pronounced intake pulses on the BMW boxer engine,  I seriously doubt any actual air flow all the way thorough it before it reverses due to the opposed intake pulse. 

 

It is neater without the crossover hose, but just make darn sure that you use quality (fuel resistant)  vacuum caps if you plug the nipples off. (some just use short pieces of the existing hose with machine screws in the open ends as plugs) 

 

On the brake ABS system removal:  On the front I just grind the locating tit off of the "Y" then flip it & use that for the front hose direct connection  (no additional parts needed). 

 

On the rear, I'm not sure what "banjo manifold" you are referring to as I can't remember ever mentioning anything like that. (you might be confusing the front "Y" manifold with the rear). 

 

On the rear, some just buy a longer hose then route directly from the rear master cylinder directly to the rear caliper. (possibly a non ABS (r) bike or (GS) bike hose.

 

Personally I like to keep the rear lines/hoses somewhat stock so just make up a steel line that runs from the rear master cylinder to the stock rear hose bracket. But I have the proper flaring tools. You might find a short line with metric flairs at a good auto parts store or have an auto parts store, or brake shop, build you one from one of your removed (un-needed) steel lines.

[Paddler]

What is the advantage of removing the charcoal canister. or removing the ABS?

[dirtrider]

52 minutes ago, Paddler said:

What is the advantage of removing the charcoal canister. or removing the ABS?

Morning  Paddler

 

First off: removing the charcoal canister is Illegal in the U.S. so that is a consideration for some.

 

But for those that do remove it there is some gain, if the Canister plugs up (and a number of them do) then that black goo enters the fuel tank & plugs up fuel filters & fuel injectors (makes a real mess). 

 

The second thing that happens is that the plug blocks the fuel tank vent so the sides of plastic fuel tank then suck in and crush the fuel gauge sender tube. 

 

Removing the ASB system is a trade off between not having unexpected braking issues  & losing the ABS system. It also typically gives the rider much better feeling & easier to modulate brake control.  

 

[Paddler]

1 hour ago, dirtrider said:

Morning  Paddler

 

First off: removing the charcoal canister is Illegal in the U.S. so that is a consideration for some.

 

But for those that do remove it there is some gain, if the Canister plugs up (and a number of them do) then that black goo enters the fuel tank & plugs up fuel filters & fuel injectors (makes a real mess). 

 

The second thing that happens is that the plug blocks the fuel tank vent so the sides of plastic fuel tank then suck in and crush the fuel gauge sender tube. 

 

Removing the ASB system is a trade off between not having unexpected braking issues  & losing the ABS system. It also typically gives the rider much better feeling & easier to modulate brake control.  

 

What causes the canister to plug up?  I remember many years ago R1100S owners did it to shave weight, which seemed silly to me.  Doing so was sort of de rigueur, they called it a cannisterectomy.  They went to great extremes in order to get what seemed like minor performance improvements. 

 

The tank on the R1100R is steel, so less likely to suck in much.

 

I don't like the idea of removing the ABS, seems it's there for a reason.

[dirtrider]

5 minutes ago, Paddler said:

What causes the canister to plug up?  I remember many years ago R1100S owners did it to shave weight, which seemed silly to me.  Doing so was sort of de rigueur, they called it a cannisterectomy.  They went to great extremes in order to get what seemed like minor performance improvements. 

 

The tank on the R1100R is steel, so less likely to suck in much.

 

I don't like the idea of removing the ABS, seems it's there for a reason.

Morning  Paddler

 

What causes the canister to plug up? --- Anything from over-filling the fuel tank, to road water being sucked in through the vent hose,  to who knows but they DO plug up & cause issues. 

 

I remember many years ago R1100S owners did it to shave weight,--- Most removed it for looks & for eliminating the possibility of plugging. 

 

The tank on the R1100R is steel, so less likely to suck in much.--- Not as easily but can still cause issues. 

 

I don't like the idea of removing the ABS, seems it's there for a reason.--- If you like the idea of removing it then don't remove it. Some riders have no choice when it suddenly quits, & others (like me) do not like the 1100 ABS system as it is slow to respond & prone to giving a big braking jump when stopping hard on uneven road surfaces, or on chatter bumps, or even with a little gravel on a paved road surface.  

 

 

[Paddler]

1 minute ago, dirtrider said:

Morning  Paddler

 

What causes the canister to plug up? --- Anything from over-filling the fuel tank, to road water being sucked in through the vent hose,  to who knows but they DO plug up & cause issues. 

 

I remember many years ago R1100S owners did it to shave weight,--- Most removed it for looks & for eliminating the possibility of plugging. 

 

The tank on the R1100R is steel, so less likely to suck in much.--- Not as easily but can still cause issues. 

 

I don't like the idea of removing the ABS, seems it's there for a reason.--- If you like the idea of removing it then don't remove it. Some riders have no choice when it suddenly quits, & others (like me) do not like the 1100 ABS system as it is slow to respond & prone to giving a big braking jump when stopping hard on uneven road surfaces, or on chatter bumps, or even with a little gravel on a paved road surface.  

 

 

On our last trip we stopped for fuel on a hot day.  My buddy was on the old bike and filled it up.  When we got back to the bikes after stopping in to a fast food restaurant there was a puddle of gas under the bike.  It ran rough for a bit but returned to normal after a short while.  That's the only time I remember an overfill.

[dirtrider]

3 hours ago, Paddler said:

On our last trip we stopped for fuel on a hot day.  My buddy was on the old bike and filled it up.  When we got back to the bikes after stopping in to a fast food restaurant there was a puddle of gas under the bike.  It ran rough for a bit but returned to normal after a short while.  That's the only time I remember an overfill.

Afternoon Paddler

 

Well, if there was puddle on the ground then that came from the fuel tank vent & THAT fuel back-flowed through your canister charcoal. I don't how many or how often it takes to start to turn the charcoal to mush then ruin the canister but not many.  

[Paddler]

2 hours ago, dirtrider said:

Afternoon Paddler

 

Well, if there was puddle on the ground then that came from the fuel tank vent & THAT fuel back-flowed through your canister charcoal. I don't how many or how often it takes to start to turn the charcoal to mush then ruin the canister but not many.  

Yep, I was pretty worried when I saw the puddle.  But as I said, it seems to be fine now.  We won't fill it in hot weather and let it sit out in the sun.

[Redfoxx]

I just got my 2004 RT in July 63K miles, I was 3rd owner.  I changed the fuel filter likely original. when I had fuel pump out I noticed black almost mouse poop looking material in fuel tank charcoal.. By the time I was down I figured out it was charcoal  from filter. I found out charcoal pack through out vacuum lines line from charcoal filter to throttle bodies was packed solid up to diaphragm valve.  I later cut open used fuel filter and the paper element was completely black. Did not have it tested but guessing charcoal material.  I guess if using a charcoal filter maybe lnline fuel filters in all your line coming from charcoal filter maybe beneficial. 

[dirtrider]

9 minutes ago, Redfoxx said:

I just got my 2004 RT in July 63K miles, I was 3rd owner.  I changed the fuel filter likely original. when I had fuel pump out I noticed black almost mouse poop looking material in fuel tank charcoal.. By the time I was down I figured out it was charcoal  from filter. I found out charcoal pack through out vacuum lines line from charcoal filter to throttle bodies was packed solid up to diaphragm valve.  I later cut open used fuel filter and the paper element was completely black. Did not have it tested but guessing charcoal material.  I guess if using a charcoal filter maybe lnline fuel filters in all your line coming from charcoal filter maybe beneficial. 

Evening Redfoxx

 

Problem with filter or filters in the emission evap vent lines is that they plug up, then the fuel tank can't properly  vent, that allows the plastic fuel tank sides to suck in  & THAT crushes the fuel gauge sender tube. 

 

If a rider wants to keep the evap system intact then they need to do 2 things, one is to not over-fill the fuel tank (as that saturates the evap canister carbon media).

 

The second thing is to cut the canister vent hose (exiting behind riders foot peg) to have a 45° angle on the bottom  as that prevents road water from being sucked into the canister carbon media & gumming it up. 

[Redfoxx]

Hose was already cut at angle,  Looks like that was a warranty item back in the day. Can is gone, fuel cap drain elbow on float plate was plugged solid outside part was rusted off.  When you buy  a 20 year old bike you get to learn alot and alot of surfing.  Last time is saw a dealer was about 20K miles or 11 years ago.