Italian Tune Up - Lugging - What Gear?

[gmcjetpilot]

We have all  heard these sayings: 

 

"Drive it like you STOLE IT."  "

Blow the Carbon Out."

Italian Tune Up"

 

What is your opinion of riding aggressively (Revving above 6,000 RPM to redline), at least on occasion , for engine health? What is your opinion in cruising at lower RPM (less than 3,000 RPM),.....

 

I suppose there is some truth. I tend to drive more sedately., shift early no higher than 4,500 RPM. but typically under 4,000 RPM. The Red line is about 7,600 RPM. I notice 4,500 RPM the exhaust note sound changes like it is "coming on the pipes" (2-stroke term but you know what I mean). I noticed below 3,000 RPM you have to roll on the throttle slowly to accelerate without bogging down engine.

 

Going fast on the freeway at 65 or higher 6th gear is a no brainer. At 55 MPH 6th gear is 2,900 PRM and in 5th gear 3,700 RPM (approx.).  I tend to like 3,000 to 3,500 RPM... For low speed 10 to 20 MPH I find I can LUG it in 1st gear and engine seems happy and not about to stall. 

 

All the above is affected by load. Weight on bike, going up hills, accelerating. Light loaded level ground anything above 3,000 RPM gives you good acceleration when you slowly roll in the throttle. Below that the bike seems to bog down and need to down shift,,,,,,,,

 

My last ride was today. I decided to Rev it out more on upshifting. On freeway 65 - 75 MPH 6th gear no brainer. 

[Jim Moore]

I run mine up to 8000 rpm several times on every ride. Dozens, really. No engine problems over 300,000 miles of oilhead abuse.

[Hosstage]

I'm a firm believer in occasionally running an engine through most of its full range. I do this even with a new bike, after a few hundred miles of "easy" riding (meaning normal don't lug it don't over rev it), I will give it full throttle to near redline at least once before recommended miles are done, just to make sure all is working. (Engine break-in is a whole 'nother subject.)

On a motor that is long past broken in, I like to get close to redline at least once per ride, often more. On my bike when doing a spirited ride, that might mean dozens of times.

My 22 year old bike with 125,000 miles on it has been redlined banging off the limiter thousands of times. I'm seriously mean to that bike. Still runs great, uses little oil, makes as much power as new, near as I can tell.

No need for you to bang the limiter, but running in the upper rpm once in a while won't hurt it. I think lugging a motor hurts it far more than running in the upper rpm occasionally.

Motors have a sweet spot they like to operate, too many people run engines below that spot on a regular basis. At 55 mph, I'm not sure 6th gear is the best for long distance running, especially once the road turns twisty or elevated. Light throttle is fine, but anything that needs a little more acceleration needs a downshift.

Lugging is a dirty word to me. Fine for diesel motors, not gassers.

Think of it this way: in your car with an automatic transmission, when cruising down the road, and you want to accelerate a bit, does your transmission downshift, or at least unlock the converter, to produce more rpm? It does, or should. Eco mode fights it, but if enough accelerator is dialed in, it will downshift. Motor sweet spot.

[dirtrider]

39 minutes ago, gmcjetpilot said:

We have all  heard these sayings: 

 

"Drive it like you STOLE IT."  "

Blow the Carbon Out."

Italian Tune Up"

 

What is your opinion of riding aggressively (Revving above 6,000 RPM to redline), at least on occasion , for engine health? What is your opinion in cruising at lower RPM (less than 3,000 RPM),.....

 

I suppose there is some truth. I tend to drive more sedately., shift early no higher than 4,500 RPM. but typically under 4,000 RPM. The Red line is about 7,600 RPM. I notice 4,500 RPM the exhaust note sound changes like it is "coming on the pipes" (2-stroke term but you know what I mean). I noticed below 3,000 RPM you have to roll on the throttle slowly to accelerate without bogging down engine.

 

Going fast on the freeway at 65 or higher 6th gear is a no brainer. At 55 MPH 6th gear is 2,900 PRM and in 5th gear 3,700 RPM (approx.).  I tend to like 3,000 to 3,500 RPM... For low speed 10 to 20 MPH I find I can LUG it in 1st gear and engine seems happy and not about to stall. 

 

All the above is affected by load. Weight on bike, going up hills, accelerating. Light loaded level ground anything above 3,000 RPM gives you good acceleration when you slowly roll in the throttle. Below that the bike seems to bog down and need to down shift,,,,,,,,

 

My last ride was today. I decided to Rev it out more on upshifting. On freeway 65 - 75 MPH 6th gear no brainer. 

Afternoon  gmcjetpilot

 

Depends, on a BMW boxer that has sitting in storage for a while I am always cautious to  advise running to redline until it has been ridden for a while with fresh oil in it. If you have a varnished up valve stem you could have a sluggish valve that can hang just enough for a piston to hit it.  

 

Otherwise just ride as you normally do, personally I am pretty aggressive so manage to hit redline quite often. 

 

As far as blowing the carbon out, it's a fuel injected emission era motorcycle probably operating on E-10 gasoline so you shouldn't have a carbon problem from the combustion side. 

 

Some of those old BMW 1150's do burn a little oil & that makes carbon in the combustion chamber. Unfortunately riding the piss out of them, in most cases, just turns that carbon into hard carbon. If you have ever tried to remove that hard carbon it would be quite evident that riding hard & running to redline has no effect  in removing that hard carbon (probably just bake it on harder)  

[Groanup]

Ryan Fortnine put a YouTube video out about this very subject just yesterday.

You're welcome!

 

 

[King Herald]

I have to admit I've never red lined my 1100r, and with 100,000 + miles under its belt it might not be a very good idea to start now. I have noticed that on the odd occasions I do give it a good fistful it starts to hesitate a bit, but if I do it several times in a row it seems to clear its throat and pull cleanly. 

[Hosstage]

35 minutes ago, King Herald said:

I have to admit I've never red lined my 1100r, and with 100,000 + miles under its belt it might not be a very good idea to start now. I have noticed that on the odd occasions I do give it a good fistful it starts to hesitate a bit, but if I do it several times in a row it seems to clear its throat and pull cleanly. 

Hence the reason for running it through its paces on a regular basis. The last thing you want is for it to fall on its face in a situation demanding some getaway power, such as near big trucks.

[gmcjetpilot]

I think happy medium, don't grandpa it and don't Valentino Rossi it on the daily. Don't think ill do anything different.  Ride it normal, and wind it out as needed, but well short of red line.

[Hosstage]

In my case it's a little different. I have one bike that is mostly stock, that one rarely hits redline, but it does get close every now and then. It really doesn't go much faster if run to the limiter.

The other is set up for hot rodding,  cams, heads, etc., it pulls hard to red line, and it is so fun to do it. Every now and then I mis-time the shift and the limiter bangs away. I try to be better next time and shift right at the "pop". One day that motor is going to explode and send shrapnel everywhere, probably including thru my leg. As long as I'm out in front, I'm ok with it. It's been ridden that way for over 100,000 miles, a little over 125,000 total on that motor. Just bragging.

[46nto]

On 8/15/2023 at 3:09 PM, Hosstage said:

In my case it's a little different. I have one bike that is mostly stock, that one rarely hits redline, but it does get close every now and then. It really doesn't go much faster if run to the limiter.

The other is set up for hot rodding,  cams, heads, etc., it pulls hard to red line, and it is so fun to do it. Every now and then I mis-time the shift and the limiter bangs away. I try to be better next time and shift right at the "pop". One day that motor is going to explode and send shrapnel everywhere, probably including thru my leg. As long as I'm out in front, I'm ok with it. It's been ridden that way for over 100,000 miles, a little over 125,000 total on that motor. Just bragging.

Hi Hosstage, at the risk of completely derailing the thread, what do you have for bikes?

[Hosstage]

I'm a Harley guy. I ended up on this forum because I rode an RT for 10 days in the Alps and fell in love with it, started doing some research and ended up here. Learning a lot about BMWs and those that ride them. An RT is still on my short list.

My bikes:

- '01 Roadking that I've been beating like a rented mule for 125,000 miles, substantial motor work at 25,000 miles, set up for 1/4 mile racing, only time it stranded me was with a broken belt. It was not the belt's fault. (Of course it has ape hangers and a loud-ass pipe!) This bike has many many multi day touring miles on it, as well as normal day rides. This motor does not like to be lugged at all, it will cruise at 55 mph in 5th (top) gear, but prefers 4th until about 60 mph. Gas mileage is actually better if run in 4th at 55, less throttle needed to keep speed. If the road starts to climb or turn twisty, downshifting is the order of the day.

- '12 Ultra Classic Limited, mostly stock, coming on 60,000 trouble free miles. This motor will lug better than the other, it makes much better low-end power, but I prefer not to. It just rubs me wrong.

[9Mary7]

The rev limiter on an 1150RT-P does a great job of imitating a quickshifter....( I mean that's what I heard.... preloaded properly and all.)

[Lowndes]

'99 R1100S, '00 K1200RS (and several others) I use the rev limiter as my shift point.  Religiously.  Have to.  It won't go any faster in that gear.

 

Not so much tho, on the '08 K1300S.  It redlines at 11K and scares the BeJesus outa me long before it gets there.