Bleeding Clutch Fluid 2009 R1200RT

[Bigfish]

Couple Questions please:

Clutch Reservoir on Left Handle Bar Cap Reads: "Use Only Mineral Oil" Is there a specific mineral oil to use that needs to be purchased from BMW? Is it the Mineral Oil Brake Fluid meant for hi performance bicycles? Or is it the mineral oil people use to acquire a good suntan?

 

I purchased speedbleeders for both Front Calipers and the rear and those were easy to convert with minimal fluid loss.

 

When I try to get clutch bleed screw out the mineral oil flows out quickly. To make it worse, the area the valve is only allows a single wrench and will take a lot of turns to get out then a lot of turns to put in speed bleeded.

Any recommendations to better attack this with less mess?

If I zip tie the clutch lever in will that make for less pressure and less flow when changing to spleedbleeder?

 

Thanks for any help.

[dirtrider]

11 hours ago, Bigfish said:

Couple Questions please:

Clutch Reservoir on Left Handle Bar Cap Reads: "Use Only Mineral Oil" Is there a specific mineral oil to use that needs to be purchased from BMW? Is it the Mineral Oil Brake Fluid meant for hi performance bicycles? Or is it the mineral oil people use to acquire a good suntan?

 

I purchased speedbleeders for both Front Calipers and the rear and those were easy to convert with minimal fluid loss.

 

When I try to get clutch bleed screw out the mineral oil flows out quickly. To make it worse, the area the valve is only allows a single wrench and will take a lot of turns to get out then a lot of turns to put in speed bleeded.

Any recommendations to better attack this with less mess?

If I zip tie the clutch lever in will that make for less pressure and less flow when changing to spleedbleeder?

 

Thanks for any help.

Morning Bigfish

 

If you ziptie the clutch lever in that will (eventually stop most of the flow) but it will still leak (a lot) until ALL the pressure created by pulling the clutch lever in is released. If you plan on replacing the clutch fluid then just remove the master cylinder cover then suck most of the fluid out. It will still leak a little but not for long. 

 

On the clutch fluid?, it is basically a hydraulic mineral oil type fluid but there are some differences between fluids.  Probably most mineral oil based fluids will work but according to the fluid experts at the company I work for they don't always mix together without possible issues.  

 

On the BMW 1200 bikes I typically don't try to mix any other brand of fluid with the factory fluid. But I do use (& have used) the "blue" Magura "Blood" Hydraulic Clutch Mineral Oil. That seems to work as well as anything & I do have a long history in using that with no issues. (you can usually find that fluid on-line, or from BeemerBoneyard). Plus BeemerBoneyard usually gives a discount if you mention being a member of this website) 

[dduelin]

Bicycle shops are another source for Magura Blue Blood brake fluid. I found one in my neighborhood with a small container in stock.

[Oldrider51]

I ordered the Magura Blue Blood mineral oil from Cycle Gear : Magura Bicycle Royal Blood Mineral Oil - Cycle Gear  

[IdahoArtie]

What's the difference between the blue and the orange Magura  oil?  I can only find orange locally and want to do a bleed as part of my spring maintenance.

 

??

[dirtrider]

13 hours ago, IdahoArtie said:

What's the difference between the blue and the orange Magura  oil?  I can only find orange locally and want to do a bleed as part of my spring maintenance.

 

??

Morning IdahoArtie

 

You will probably have to ask the Magura tec help for the full answer. Myself & most of my riding  friends have discussed this a little & about all we could figure (without research) is that the red is for clutches & the blue is for brakes (non BMW motorcycle usage).

 

In just casual looking the "blue" seems to be a slightly thinner viscosity & seems to more closely match the BMW hexhead original fluid viscosity (at least seems that way to some of us Magura fluid users).

 

In any  case -- I (& a lot of my riding friends) have had no issues in using the "blue"  for years now so that is well vetted. Most credible  on-line motorcycle parts sellers (like BeemerBoneyard  & Cycle gear, etc) sell the "blue" for BMW hexhead usage so that right there tells us something. 

 

Will the red work?-- Possibly, especially in hot weather climates but with the "blue" being known to work good in the hexhead bikes & usually being available on-line or in some bicycle shops why try an unknown? If you ride in cold weather then the red could (my guess) lead to a sluggish clutch operation & cause some clutch/to/shift timing issues on very cold days. 

 

 

[IdahoArtie]

Excellent reply, Oracle.  Thanks.  I will round up the tried and true blue.

 

This bike already has a sluggish start, especially two-up, and I'm hoping a bleed will do.  Only 34k on it so I can only assume the clutch plates, etc are good and that the fluid is the place to start.  I've only put 3k on it myself so it's still a new experience compared to my 97.  The fuel strip has been the biggest disappointment, but the overall maintenance has been similar to the older bikes and pretty straight-forward.

 

Onward...

[IdahoArtie]

Update:

 

Couple of interesting things to note.  First, the level was over the MAX line so I pulled some out.  It looks neither blue nor orange/red.  Also, the cap is from Wunderlich.  Has this bike been upgraded or is that a part of the Premium Package?  Dunno.  

So, now I don't know what to bleed it with.  Is it animal, vegetable, or mineral...oil?  Wunderlich is closed right now, but I can call them tomorrow.

Just adjusting it to the proper  level seems to have helped the starting from a stop and on incline issue...at least on one short test ride.  The fluid in the reservoir doesn't look too bad since there's no gunk in the bottom like I usually find on a DOT 3/4 system so I might just ride this way until the next maintenance interval.

Any thoughts or experience out there is always appreciated.

[dirtrider]

31 minutes ago, IdahoArtie said:

Update:

 

Couple of interesting things to note.  First, the level was over the MAX line so I pulled some out.  It looks neither blue nor orange/red.  Also, the cap is from Wunderlich.  Has this bike been upgraded or is that a part of the Premium Package?  Dunno.  

So, now I don't know what to bleed it with.  Is it animal, vegetable, or mineral...oil?  Wunderlich is closed right now, but I can call them tomorrow.

Just adjusting it to the proper  level seems to have helped the starting from a stop and on incline issue...at least on one short test ride.  The fluid in the reservoir doesn't look too bad since there's no gunk in the bottom like I usually find on a DOT 3/4 system so I might just ride this way until the next maintenance interval.

Any thoughts or experience out there is always appreciated.

Evening  IdahoArtie

 

That being over max is typically due to the reservoir being overfilled then the clutch disk wears. Unlike brake systems, when the BMW clutch disk wears thinner the fluid level in the reservoir increases.  

 

That cover in not a stock BMW item, someone put it on there. 

 

Your fluid looks like stock BMW clutch mineral oil with some time & heat cycles on it. Getting darker but not dark brown/black yet. 

 

What is in the master cylinder usually  isn't a problem with mineral oil clutch systems as moisture doesn't mix with the mineral oil so most moisture & wear crap settles into the lower slave cylinder area. 

[IdahoArtie]

Good to know.  Sounds like the blue stuff and a bleed will get any sludge out of the lower end then.  

Hmmm.  Wunderlich caps.  Nice extra.

[Bigfish]

Getting back to adding a speed bleeder to my 2009.

 

Pull in the clutch and zip-tie it to reduce the flow pressure at the bleed valve.

Hopefully all the fluid on the handlebar clutch reservoir doesn't work through and introduce air into the system whilst the bleeder screw upgrade is being performed.

 

or is it not as big a deal with air entering the clutch system like it is with brake bleeds?

 

Once Speedbleeder is installed, I will syringe out any old fluid still in the clutch reservoir then hook up my bleed bag and crack open the speedbleeder. New fluid to reservoir and start pumping the clutch until new fluid comes out into the bleed bag.

 

Make reservoir on handlebar as level as possible and fill to center of clutch reservoir window then screw cap back on and tighten bleed screw.

 

Am I thinking this correctly?

[dirtrider]

3 hours ago, Bigfish said:

Getting back to adding a speed bleeder to my 2009.

 

Pull in the clutch and zip-tie it to reduce the flow pressure at the bleed valve.

Hopefully all the fluid on the handlebar clutch reservoir doesn't work through and introduce air into the system whilst the bleeder screw upgrade is being performed.

 

or is it not as big a deal with air entering the clutch system like it is with brake bleeds?

 

Once Speedbleeder is installed, I will syringe out any old fluid still in the clutch reservoir then hook up my bleed bag and crack open the speedbleeder. New fluid to reservoir and start pumping the clutch until new fluid comes out into the bleed bag.

 

Make reservoir on handlebar as level as possible and fill to center of clutch reservoir window then screw cap back on and tighten bleed screw.

 

Am I thinking this correctly?

Morning Bigfish 

 

Getting back to adding a speed bleeder to my 2009.

 

Pull in the clutch and zip-tie it to reduce the flow pressure at the bleed valve.

Hopefully all the fluid on the handlebar clutch reservoir doesn't work through and introduce air into the system whilst the bleeder screw upgrade is being performed.--- Pulling in the lever & tying it there should close off the fluid port so that should stop the reservoir from emptying. But that will put pressure in the slave cylinder that you will have to deal with. 

 

or is it not as big a deal with air entering the clutch system like it is with brake bleeds?--- It is different than the brake system but air in the system can still be a pain to deal with. 

 

Once Speedbleeder is installed, I will syringe out any old fluid still in the clutch reservoir then hook up my bleed bag and crack open the speedbleeder. New fluid to reservoir and start pumping the clutch until new fluid comes out into the bleed bag.--- Well, this sort of works but remember that air likes to move UP in the fluid & you will be trying to force it down with the fluid bleed. The factory fills the clutch system from the bottom (slave fitting) to the top so that pushes the air UP out the top as the new fluid fills the system. 

 

Make reservoir on handlebar as level as possible and fill to center of clutch reservoir window then screw cap back on and tighten bleed screw.--- Yes, this is good.

 

Am I thinking this correctly?--- You don't have much choice if you are going to add a speed-bleeder. Personally I don't like speed bleeders on the hydraulic cultch slave so I just suck as much fluid out of the master cylinder reservoir as possible, then add the new fluid & bleed using a hose on the slave bleeder with the open end of that hose terminating inside a bleed bottle well under/in  the fluid in the bleed jar. (hose ending under fluid level top acts as a check valve). This way I never introduce air INTO the clutch system to begin with.   

 

No matter what you do with the master cylinder lever you will probably get some air into the slave when you swap that speed-bleeder for the factory bleed screw. 

 

The good news is: If you can get all the air out of the slave cylinder (sometimes difficult to be sure) then from the clutch line fitting up to the master cylinder that will usually self-bleed the air up into the master cylinder reservoir as you ride & use the clutch as the air likes to move up in the fluid column.