R12RT Engine fails to start.

[Don_F]

Purchased an ex demo 05 r12rt with 2500 miles and virtually every option (esa, heated seat/grips, cruise etc.) from the extras list (no alarm). I went to pickup friends for a ride in the Dales (England) and the bike failed to start until I pulled the clutch in. Engine turned over fast enough, tried turning off ignition/ left off until hazard light faded, then on again, allowed the engine to turn over, tried 6 or 7 different attempts. Engine started first time once clutch was pulled in. Bike continued to do the same all day at each (4) stop. Each stop was about 5 minutes to 1 hr duration. The bike hasn't done the same since, and starts first time. Waiting for a day off so I can take the bike back to dealers where they say they will hook up the diagnostic computer and see if anything has been logged. any ideas?

[Boffin]

Purchased an ex demo 05 r12rt with 2500 miles and virtually every option (esa, heated seat/grips, cruise etc.) from the extras list (no alarm). I went to pickup friends for a ride in the Dales (England) and the bike failed to start until I pulled the clutch in. Engine turned over fast enough, tried turning off ignition/ left off until hazard light faded, then on again, allowed the engine to turn over, tried 6 or 7 different attempts. Engine started first time once clutch was pulled in. Bike continued to do the same all day at each (4) stop. Each stop was about 5 minutes to 1 hr duration. The bike hasn't done the same since, and starts first time. Waiting for a day off so I can take the bike back to dealers where they say they will hook up the diagnostic computer and see if anything has been logged. any ideas?

 

First off, welcome to the board - we need more Brits

 

It sounds to me like the bike thinks it is in gear. What does the RID say?

 

I seem to recall some issues with water ingress to the gear position switch on the rear of the gearbox causing some problems.

 

Andy

[Don_F]

Thanks for the welcome. RID? sorry what's that. It was a dry day and the bike had been garaged for 4 days prior to the ride out. Nothing came up on the LCD screen (other than normal stuff. battery etc.) and non of the electrics were sapping power? Funny as it has not happened since (4 days riding). Not overly concerned. Just interested.

Don

[Boffin]

Thanks for the welcome. RID? sorry what's that. It was a dry day and the bike had been garaged for 4 days prior to the ride out. Nothing came up on the LCD screen (other than normal stuff. battery etc.) and non of the electrics were sapping power? Funny as it has not happened since (4 days riding). Not overly concerned. Just interested.

Don

 

Don, sorry about the geek-speak RID = Rider Information Display, or LCD screen.

I just wondered if the gear indicator showed the bike in gear, or if the neutral light was off. There is an interlock to prevent the bike starting in gear unless the clutch is pulled in, hence my question - if a faulty indication made the bike think it was in gear then it would behave as you described.

 

Andy

[JayW]

 

It sounds to me like the bike thinks it is in gear. What does the RID say?

 

I seem to recall some issues with water ingress to the gear position switch on the rear of the gearbox causing some problems.

 

Andy

 

I don't think the bike would crank at all if it thought it were in gear. Could the battery be a bit low, and the pulled in clutch helps it to crank faster by reducing the load on the starter? Puzzling case. Keep us updated.

 

Jay

[Illini]

Get your volt meter out and test the battery. Could be that if you turned the key off without locking the handle bars things were still alive for 20 minutes (Radio, heated seat, grips and any other accy) and it ran down your battery. With the bike sitting it had just enough juice to let it turn over but not enough umph to get it fired up. Rule out the simnple things first. If your volt meter reads anything under 12.75 time to recharge the battery

[Don_F]

I had charged the battery about 3 weeks prior, a week or so after I collected the bike, just incase it was a bit low I have a very good computer controlled charger and It didn't take much. The Battery also turned the engine over fast enough, even after 6 or 7 attempts, if the battery was at fault I would have expected a slowdown on cranking speed maybe. It is worth a check though, thanks, both the green N and gear indicator N were lit.

[FirstHexHead]

This happens to me on occasion on my '05. What I observed is that it seems to be important to keep your hands off brakes and clutch when turning on the ignition. I assume it's part of the "good to go" diagnostic that runs initially. If you experience the problem, cycle the ignition switch with hands off on all controls on the handlebars, and I'm betting it'll fire right up. That's what has worked for me every time. --Neil

[Steve1962]

Could it be a faulty sidestand switch sensor thingy .........I'm sure I read somwhere about a 1200 RT that wouldn't start because the onboard computer thought that the sidestand was down when in fact it wasn't .

 

By the way , welcome to the board .....and you are gonna love that bike [ once the gremilns have been sorted ]

 

Steve

[Ken H.]

1200 RT that wouldn't start because the onboard computer thought that the sidestand was down when in fact it wasn't .

Good thought, but on the hexheads in this condition the bike won't crank. What the OP has is cranks over but doesn't start. This is not a switch issue. (Not that I'm much help at the moment on what it actually is!)

[ShovelStrokeEd]

Engine cranks but won't start with the clutch engaged.

Disengage clutch and engine starts.

 

That sounds to me like a neutral switch rather than a sidestand switch issue. Normally, if the sidestand switch has failed open, the engine won't crank and the RID, at least on the 11xx series, won't display. Obviously the clutch switch is working.

 

In any event, the machine should still be under warranty and should be brought to a dealer for resolution.

[Ken H.]

On the R1200xx hex head series there is no normal crank but no start state. All the switches; clutch, neutral, side stand etc. tell the ZFE module to crank or don't crank.

[Don_F]

Well I've just been to the BMF show in Peterborough UK (Biggest outdoor Motorcycle show in Europe 1000 stalls 60-80,000 bikers) Rained all the way there and back (300 miles) and the bike did it again, wouldn't start until clutch was pulled in. I put this one down to battery being low. I had heated seats and grips on low all the way and it did crank easier with clutch pulled in. I will top up battery and try again. I've a day off on Friday. Will call in to dealer and let them put it on Diagnostic Computer and see if any-thing's logged. will report back.

Don

[Don_F]

Well nothing logged on computer. Suggested it needs a little more running in, 3K miles on clock. Will wait and see. never has trouble at start of day. Usually has trouble an hr or so after a run?

[Dolph]

It sounds to me as if from time to time the computer thinks the bike is in gear. You can start the bike in neutral without pulling the clutch but not if it's in gear. So maybe the computer thinks it's in gear even when in neutral?