2007 R1200RT-P will not start - fuel supply issues?

[Viator]

Hi

Thank you for your kind consideration and reading through this rather long post:

2007 R1200RT-P

Problem:
Bike will not start or sometimes I can get it running for a minute or two, but the moment I touch the throttle, it dies.

History:
The bike started cutting out and was taken to BMW dealer. They found various faults:
1. ABS faulty (this was a know issue for years and did not stop the bike from running)
2. blocked fuel vent
3. faulty KOMBI
see attached report and wanted to replace:
1. whole fuel pump
2. whole ABS
3. new KOMBI
They want my kidney plus other organs and also my extended family's plus future rights on all kidneys of future generations, plus all of our money as well.

Work that I have done since then:
1. Replaced the ABS motor - error gone now.
2. Cleaned the "invisible" fuel filter as per this video https://youtu.be/xdyHT3pGm_A
3. I've got a GS-911 and there are no errors present. (It is a old version with not all the new functions)

Tests performed:
1. With GS-911 I tested all the injectors, idle servos and fuel pump. All works. There is no option to test fuel pressure.
 BUT - I do not get fuel returning to the fuel tank while the fuel pump is running. It streams out at velocity when I push down on the one way valve on the outlet port,
 but no fuel returning when I manually open the stop valve.
2. The vent that BMW says is blocked (indicated on diagram attached) is open - they talk rubbish!
3. I do have a very short log run saved from the GS-911 until the bike died that I'll attach as well.

Questions:
1. Am I correct to assume that there must be fuel returning when the fuel pump is running, but the engine is not running?
2. Are there any parts in the attached diagram that I've marked that could be the problem? What is item # 2?

Again, thanks for any help.

 

Dealer report.pdf log 2021-04-02.xml

[dirtrider]

11 minutes ago, Viator said:

Hi

Thank you for your kind concideration and reading through this rather long post:

2007 R1200RT-P

Problem:
Bike will not start or sometimes I can get it running for a minute or two, but the moment I touch the throttle, it dies.

History:
The bike started cutting out and was taken to BMW dealer. They found various faults:
1. ABS faulty (this was a know issue for years and did not stop the bike from running)
2. blocked fuel vent
3. faulty KOMBI
see attached report and wanted to replace:
1. whole fuel pump
2. whole ABS
3. new KOMBI
They want my kidney plus other organs and also my extended family's plus future rights on all kidneys of future generations, plus all of our money as well.

Work that I have done since then:
1. Replaced the ABS motor - error gone now.
2. Cleaned the "invisible" fuel filter as per this video https://youtu.be/xdyHT3pGm_A
3. I've got a GS-911 and there are no errors present. (It is a old version with not all the new functions)

Tests performed:
1. With GS-911 I tested all the injectors, idle servos and fuel pump. All works. There is no option to test fuel pressure.
 BUT - I do not get fuel returning to the fuel tank while the fuel pump is running. It streams out at velocity when I push down on the one way valve on the outlet port,
 but no fuel returning when I manually open the stop valve.
2. The vent that BMW says is blocked (indicated on diagram attached) is open - they talk rubbish!
3. I do have a very short log run saved from the GS-911 until the bike died that I'll attach as well.

Questions:
1. Am I correct to assume that there must be fuel returning when the fuel pump is running, but the engine is not running?
2. Are there any parts in the attached diagram that I've marked that could be the problem? What is item # 2?

Again, thanks for any help.

 

 

Dealer report.pdf 2.78 MB · 0 downloads log 2021-04-02.xml 150.95 kB · 0 downloads

Morning   Viator

 

Is the fuel pump getting full voltage?  Or put another way, have you tried by-passing the FPC (Fuel Pump Controller) by running 12v directly to the fuel pump???????????

 

If the FPC is not working correctly (somewhat common on the older 1200BMW's) then the fuel pump will not put out enough pressure to start the engine or give you fuel return.

 

You should have SOME fuel return coming out of the fuel return line but a properly working FPC does limit that amount as it's purpose is to adjust/control excess pump output.

 

If by-passing the FPC doesn't get you good fuel return then look for an internal fuel pressure leak, or a still plugged (non replaceable) filter,   or the pump not getting full power, or a pump problem. 

[Viator]

I actually forgot to measure the voltage while I did the fuel pump test with the GS-911. I only got the GS-911 yesterday.

I have not done the FPC bypass as discussed in multiple forums - I just assumed that the GS-911 would throw an error if there is anything wrong with the FPC or pump.

I'll test the voltage tomorrow - it's night now here in OZ.

Thanks for the quick reply - much appreciated mate.

[Viator]

The voltage blips to 14V and then 9V when I do the fuel pump test on the GS-911 with the FPC connected to the pump.

I've done the FPC bypass and the bike started and ran for about 2 minutes again. Again no fuel returning to the tank with the bypass in play. The GS-911 did throw an error now - I left the FPC connected to the harness, just unplugged from the pump obviously.

I'm going to order a new Quantum fuel pump from the US (no parts available Down Under) https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Quantum-Intank-EFI-Fuel-Pump-for-BMW-R1200RT-2003-2010/162798852577 and see if that solves anything.

[9Mary7]

13 hours ago, Viator said:

new Quantum fuel pump

I have used them on Ducati's with good results.........

[dirtrider]

14 hours ago, Viator said:

The voltage blips to 14V and then 9V when I do the fuel pump test on the GS-911 with the FPC connected to the pump.

I've done the FPC bypass and the bike started and ran for about 2 minutes again. Again no fuel returning to the tank with the bypass in play. The GS-911 did throw an error now - I left the FPC connected to the harness, just unplugged from the pump obviously.

I'm going to order a new Quantum fuel pump from the US (no parts available Down Under) https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Quantum-Intank-EFI-Fuel-Pump-for-BMW-R1200RT-2003-2010/162798852577 and see if that solves anything.

Afternoon  Viator

 

What does the pump intake strainer sock look like? Those can plug up with fine dirt. They can also suck in like collapsing soda straw & block fuel flow when they start to plug up. (engine usually starts OK then shuts down after running for while, or can shut down at a demand for higher fuel flow)   

 

Same with the non-replaceable fuel filter, I know you said that you cleaned it but did you back-flush it thoroughly?    Then verify that it would pass enough fuel flow in the forward direction?????? 

 

There is also some type of check ball deal in the pump outlet quick disconnect   (on the pass-through side of the connection) is that working correctly? 

 

 

 

 

[Viator]

I ordered the Quantum fuel pump kit and it comes with that strainer sock - so that will eliminate that as an issue. Fuel did flow through it easily though, but it was a bit flimsy. I've spent about two hours cleaning the fuel filter as per the video. I think it is pretty clean and it was pretty easy to blow through in the forward direction, compared to when I started.

The ball valve in the outlet quick disconnect is working, because when I press down on it when testing the fuel pump with the GS-911, fuel absolutely sprays out of it at velocity.

I can get one second hand complete fuel pump here in OZ atm and I'm tempted to order it, just to drop it in and see what happens.

I've seen there used to be a fuel filter elimination kit available for R1200GS LC and G650X from Guglatech and bestrestproducts.com might still have some stock. I wonder if that plate is the same as the R1200RT? I would love to do that kind of conversion. Maybe with the second hand pump, I can do my own DIY and bypass the internal filter. Would need to find stainless fittings to go through the bulkhead and find a good spot to drill the hole...

https://bestrestproducts.com/shop/guglatech-fuel-and-air-filters/guglatech-bmw/bmw-r1200gs-lc-g650x-fuel-filter-elimination-kit-guglatech-mrt090/

 

I just had a thought as well - when I rebuilt the ABS I pulled out clip # 5 in the fuel line diagram as I thought it held the fuel pressure regulator housing unit in the bracket. I wonder if I did not unseated the actual fuel pressure regulator in the process. I'll go and have a look - whole tank off again to get to it 

[Viator]

Nope, the fuel regulator was stuck in the housing so tight, I had a lot of problems getting it out. There is a little filter on top and that was quite dirty. I will replace the regulator as well. Just waiting on an answer from a seller in OZ if the Quantum HFPPR9_WH3 for the GS or the HFPPR9_WH2 for the R1200R will fit the R1200RT.