Head gaskets

[Dingo55]

Appreciate any info

Are the left/right head gaskets the same and do they go on a particular way around 

Cheers 

Mark 

[Jim Moore]

11xx Head Gasket Replacement - in photos | Adventure Rider (advrider.com)

[dirtrider]

8 hours ago, Dingo55 said:

Appreciate any info

Are the left/right head gaskets the same and do they go on a particular way around 

Cheers 

Mark 

Morning Mark

 

The same cyl head  gasket is used for both sides so that means they have to be reversible. 

 

Just make sure that you have the correct head gasket for your engine, the  early/late BMW 1100 engine used two different sized cylinder head locating dowels (bushings) a 12.5 mm & a 14.5 mm.

 

Be sure to verify that the matching holes in the head gasket properly fit your cylinder-to-head locating dowel size so the gasket properly centers. 

[Dingo55]

Hi

Thanks for the replies

A couple more ?? if I may

Can the rocker arm adjustment be done whilst the head is on the bench

Mine came back from the machine shop and I was told that I didn't need to worry about it 

( which I know is not correct)

I can get a yellow and white valve feeler guage in which is still sloppy

That's 0.45mm which is outside specs

Have I understood this correctly?

 

At what stage in the head reinstall/torque do the 3 smaller bolts get installed and tensioned

and do they get re torqued at the 1000 km re torque?

Many thanks 

Cheers 

Mark

 

[dirtrider]

1 hour ago, Dingo55 said:

Hi

Thanks for the replies

A couple more ?? if I may

Can the rocker arm adjustment be done whilst the head is on the bench

Mine came back from the machine shop and I was told that I didn't need to worry about it 

( which I know is not correct)

I can get a yellow and white valve feeler guage in which is still sloppy

That's 0.45mm which is outside specs

Have I understood this correctly?

 

At what stage in the head reinstall/torque do the 3 smaller bolts get installed and tensioned

and do they get re torqued at the 1000 km re torque?

Many thanks 

Cheers 

Mark

 

Morning Mark

 

Sort of, you can do a preliminary rocker arm end play adjustment on the bench then tighten the smaller bearing bolts but don't rely on that as being 100 % correct after the head is installed & torqued.

 

One of the cylinder head studs goes through the  lower bearing so that can change the adjustment when

tightened.

 

Just re-check it after cylinder head installation, you definitely don't want to end up with a tight rocker arm that is  below minimum specs or you could stick a valve & bend one or more of your valves.

 

You are better off with them a little loose than a little tight. 

[Dingo55]

Hi.

Thanks for that

So far so good

R/H head back on

L/H head off and in for clean up

Had the 'O' ring at rear of TB issue

How important an item is that?

Ended up doing the 90/90 torque procedure by eye (is that acceptable?)

I noticed on the fiche diagrams there is a exhaust gasket ring

No sign of anything like that on my bike (Do they burn up?)

At the top end of the exhaust prior to the three hole plate on each pipe there is a rotatable collar (30mm long)

Curious as to its purpose

Thanks again

Cheers 

Mark 

[dirtrider]

1 hour ago, Dingo55 said:

Hi.

Thanks for that

So far so good

R/H head back on

L/H head off and in for clean up

Had the 'O' ring at rear of TB issue

How important an item is that?

Ended up doing the 90/90 torque procedure by eye (is that acceptable?)

I noticed on the fiche diagrams there is a exhaust gasket ring

No sign of anything like that on my bike (Do they burn up?)

At the top end of the exhaust prior to the three hole plate on each pipe there is a rotatable collar (30mm long)

Curious as to its purpose

Thanks again

Cheers 

Mark 

Morning Mark 

 

Had the 'O' ring at rear of TB issue-- What "O" ring problem are you having? Anything rear of the throttle plate has little effect on engine running but can effect dirt entry into the engine.

 

How important an item is that?-- Important enough to replace if it's missing or damaged.

 

Ended up doing the 90/90 torque procedure by eye (is that acceptable?)-- As long as you started at the correct low "initial" torque then got the 90°/90° fairly close  it will be OK.  You are going to have to (should anyhow) re-torque after riding a short time anyhow.

 

I noticed on the fiche diagrams there is a exhaust gasket ring

No sign of anything like that on my bike (Do they burn up?)-- No they don't burn up but sometimes they can still be in the cyl head exhaust ports & not look like they are there. Did yours get removed when the head was worked on?  Look in each exhaust port "VERY CLOSELY" for an exhaust ring being present.  They are usually seated it there pretty tight & not very noticeable.

 

At the top end of the exhaust prior to the three hole plate on each pipe there is a rotatable collar (30mm long)  Curious as to its purpose-- Those are there to allow the 3 hole plate to clamp the pipe tight to the gasket rings up inside the cyl head pocket.  

 

 

 

 

[Dingo55]

Thanks for your reply

Working the intake manifold back onto the TB disturbed the 'O' ring on the rear of the TB

I remember reading somewhere that it was fairly common as the 'O' ring expands or something

I will have another look but don't recall anything resembling a gasket on the exhaust or in the head exhaust port 

Would you happen to know what mechanics use to mark items that have been torqued? Some sort of marking pen?

Appreciate all your help

Cheers

Mark

[dirtrider]

9 minutes ago, Dingo55 said:

Thanks for your reply

Working the intake manifold back onto the TB disturbed the 'O' ring on the rear of the TB

I remember reading somewhere that it was fairly common as the 'O' ring expands or something

I will have another look but don't recall anything resembling a gasket on the exhaust or in the head exhaust port 

Would you happen to know what mechanics use to mark items that have been torqued? Some sort of marking pen?

Appreciate all your help

Cheers

Mark

Morning Mark 

 

Yes, those "O" rings can expand when removed.  If you have decent "hot" sun still shining in your area then just put the "O" ring out in the hot sun for a few hours, that usually dries out the hydrocarbons & reduces the swelling.

 

On marking (indexing) the bolts or nuts? I use a special commercial indexing marking paint (we use it where I work),  otherwise just find a  "Security Check Paint Marker".  Possibly available at your local auto-parts store or at a machinists supply company. Also available on-line.  

[Dingo55]

Morning all

Some more queries if I may

Got my R/H ( burnt valve) head back on 

Took L/H head in but the guy is too busy to get to it so he quickly did some air pressure tests of some sort

All good 

Came home decided to pre set valves and rocker arm clearances on the deck before install (checking after head torqued down)

Absolutely no gap/movement at the rocker arm. None Zero Zilch

Unfortunately I didn't check that on the R/H head before it went to the machine shop

No idea how that has come about 

Does that part tighten up to that extent simply through use?

 

Are the rocker arm bearing caps torqued to  15nm?

Appreciate all the help

Cheers

Mark

 

 

[Dingo55]

Hi

I've asked about the rocker arm torque figure because I have seen

9nm, 15nm and 20nm as being the correct figure

Confused 

Cheers

Mark

[dirtrider]

11 hours ago, Dingo55 said:

Morning all

Some more queries if I may

Got my R/H ( burnt valve) head back on 

Took L/H head in but the guy is too busy to get to it so he quickly did some air pressure tests of some sort

All good 

Came home decided to pre set valves and rocker arm clearances on the deck before install (checking after head torqued down)

Absolutely no gap/movement at the rocker arm. None Zero Zilch

Unfortunately I didn't check that on the R/H head before it went to the machine shop

No idea how that has come about 

Does that part tighten up to that extent simply through use?

 

Are the rocker arm bearing caps torqued to  15nm?

Appreciate all the help

Cheers

 

MOrning Mark

 

What parts tightened up, the rocker arm end play or the valve lash? 

[dirtrider]

10 hours ago, Dingo55 said:

Hi

I've asked about the rocker arm torque figure because I have seen

9nm, 15nm and 20nm as being the correct figure

Confused 

Cheers

Mark

Morning Mark 

 

Tightening torque__

 

M-8 screws in rocker shaft bearing cap= 15 Nm

 

M-8 screws for camshaft bearing cap= 15 Nm 

[Dingo55]

Morning DR 

The rocker arm had no up/down movement at all

The last time this bike had major work was when the clutch was replaced (professionally)

and was serviced at the end of that process

So the 3x T45 torx head bolts on the rocker arm bearings are torqued to 15nm?

Thanks for your help

Cheers

Mark

 

 

[dirtrider]

4 minutes ago, Dingo55 said:

Morning DR 

The rocker arm had no up/down movement at all

The last time this bike had major work was when the clutch was replaced (professionally)

and was serviced at the end of that process

So the 3x T45 torx head bolts on the rocker arm bearings are torqued to 15nm?

Thanks for your help

 

Evening Mark

 

Yes, service manual calls for 15nm on the 1100, I usually go just slightly higher as the 1150 manual calls for 18nm (about the same setup between 1100 & 1150).