Harley court case over emissions

[Red]

https://www.visordown.com/news/industry/harley-davidson-new-multi-million-fine-agreement-over-emissions-row

 

I'm sure nobody is allowed to sell after market exhaust products.  But it got me to wondering, do Harleys sold in the EU have the same exhaust systems as US product?  I think the EU has some pretty stringent criteria.

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

On 9/20/2020 at 3:49 PM, Red said:

I'm sure nobody is allowed to sell after market exhaust products. 

 

Certainly not devices that increase criteria-pollutant emissions.  But they do anyways.  The EPA is trying to make it stop. 

 

Tuner kits is one of HD's violations, but they also sold a fair number of bikes that were somehow improperly certified.  Here's EPA's page about the matter.

 

 

[John Ranalletta]

3 hours ago, Joe Frickin' Friday said:

 

Certainly not devices that increase criteria-pollutant emissions.  But they do anyways.  The EPA is trying to make it stop. 

 

Tuner kits is one of HD's violations, but they also sold a fair number of bikes that were somehow improperly certified.  Here's EPA's page about the matter.

 

 

 

Many years ago, leaving upstate NY on my '97 RT, I was caught up in a check point.  The LEO checked the silencer to verify it was stock.  I'd never heard of that before or after.

 

Didn't Colorado recently enact or try to enact regulations re: aftermarket exhausts?

[fourteenfour]

14 hours ago, John Ranalletta said:

 

Many years ago, leaving upstate NY on my '97 RT, I was caught up in a check point.  The LEO checked the silencer to verify it was stock.  I'd never heard of that before or after.

 

Didn't Colorado recently enact or try to enact regulations re: aftermarket exhausts?

 

California does regulated aftermarket exhaust for noise levels  AB1824

 

Noise levels by state

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

15 hours ago, John Ranalletta said:

Didn't Colorado recently enact or try to enact regulations re: aftermarket exhausts?

 

Maybe not new rules, but increased enforcement:

https://kdvr.com/news/golden-police-revving-up-enforcement-of-illegal-vehicle-exhaust-systems/

 

Search this PDF file for "42-4-225", and you'll see the existing state regs:

 

Quote

42-4-225. Mufflers - prevention of noise. (1) Every motor vehicle subject to registration and operated on a highway shall at all times be equipped with an adequate muffler in constant operation and properly maintained to prevent any excessive or unusual noise, and no such muffler or exhaust system shall be equipped with a cut-off, bypass, or similar device. No person shall modify the exhaust system of a motor vehicle in a manner which will amplify or increase the noise emitted by the motor of such vehicle above that emitted by the muffler originally installed on the vehicle, and such original muffler shall comply with all of the requirements of this section.

 

(1.5) Any commercial vehicle, as defined in section 42-4-235 (1)(a), subject to registration and operated on a highway, that is equipped with an engine compression brake device is required to have a muffler.

 

(2) A muffler is a device consisting of a series of chamber or baffle plates or other mechanical design for the purpose of receiving exhaust gas from an internal combustion engine and effective in reducing noise.

 

(3) Any person who violates subsection (1) of this section commits a class B traffic infraction. Any person who violates subsection (1.5) of this section shall, upon conviction, be punished by a fine of five hundred dollars. Fifty percent of any fine for a violation of subsection (1.5) of this section occurring within the corporate limits of a city or town, or within the unincorporated area of a county, shall be transmitted to the treasurer or chief financial officer of said city, town, or county, and the remaining fifty percent shall be transmitted to the state treasurer, credited to the highway users tax fund, and allocated and expended as specified in section 43-4-205 (5.5)(a), C.R.S.

 

(4) This section shall not apply to electric motor vehicles.

 

That's from a 2019 revision, but it's followed by this snippet:

 

Quote

Source: L. 94: Entire title amended with relocations, p. 2260, § 1, effective January 1, 1995. L. 97: (4) added, p. 393, § 2, effective August 6. L. 2000: (1.5) added and (3) amended, p. 1100, § 1, effective August 2. L. 2005: (3) amended, p. 149, § 26, effective April 5. Editor's note: This section is similar to former § 42-4-222 as it existed prior to 1994, and the former § 42-4-225 was relocated to § 42-4-228. 

 

So it sounds (no pun intended) like the law has existed in some form for a long time.

[Red]

18 hours ago, Joe Frickin' Friday said:

 

Maybe not new rules, but increased enforcement:

https://kdvr.com/news/golden-police-revving-up-enforcement-of-illegal-vehicle-exhaust-systems/

 

Search this PDF file for "42-4-225", and you'll see the existing state regs:

 

 

That's from a 2019 revision, but it's followed by this snippet:

 

 

So it sounds (no pun intended) like the law has existed in some form for a long time.

 

Loud air compression brakes don't seem to be covered in 42-4-223 or 42-4-225.  Hay trucks and livestock trucks in my neighborhood are equally bad as passenger vehicles.  The trucking industry seems to have been given a pass on noise.

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

4 hours ago, Red said:

Loud air compression brakes don't seem to be covered in 42-4-223 or 42-4-225.  Hay trucks and livestock trucks in my neighborhood are equally bad as passenger vehicles.  The trucking industry seems to have been given a pass on noise.

 

 

Found it under 42-4-225(1.5):

Quote

Any commercial vehicle, as defined in section 42-4-235 (1)(a), subject to registration and operated on a highway, that is equipped with an engine compression brake device is required to have a muffler.

 

 

On a national level, the EPA has required trucks to be reasonably quiet for decades:

Quote

The United States Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) requires all trucks manufactured since 1988 to produce 80 db(A) of noise at 50 feet (15.2 meters). This range includes the exhaust system. The EPA also prohibits removing noise-reducing equipment from any vehicles [source: Jacobs Vehicle Systems].

 

So the rules are in place.  If you are bothered by the noise and feel it may be a violation, it's worth bringing it to the attention of local LEOs.  Even if they don't act on your single complaint, chances are you're not alone in your frustration; the more people speak up, the more likely it is that the rule will end up getting enforced.

[RTinNC]

While I agree with the annoyance of loud exhausts on bike, cars and trucks I suspect the LEO's has so many bigger fish to fry that the enforcement will be minimal.   I used to ride with a motor officer and asked about loud pipes and he said he never in his career stopped anyone for loud exhaust.   Kind of like the texting laws.   I sold my 2006 RT to a NC police officer and while waiting in line at DMV asked him about texting enforcement and he said it is so hard to prove that officers don't enforce it.   Sad and I agree it work being the squeaky wheel and reporting to local officials ... if more complain maybe they will at lest do a spot enforcement.   The latest thing here in Charlotte area seems to be diesel pick truck that have loud exhausts and they blast down the street rattling windows along with the race type systems on late model Mustangs.   Some Mustangs sound fine but there must me one or 2 systems that sound like a NASCAR car.  

[John Ranalletta]

10 minutes ago, RTinNC said:

I suspect the LEO's has so many bigger fish to fry

 

Haven't seen a traffic stop in Indy forever.  Stop signs are useless.  Red lights are run at will - with squads at the intersections.  Time for GATSOs.

 

Legislators keep piling on laws that won't be enforced such as not using cell phones in hand while driving.  It isn't enforced.

[Red]

"So the rules are in place.  If you are bothered by the noise and feel it may be a violation, it's worth bringing it to the attention of local LEOs.  Even if they don't act on your single complaint, chances are you're not alone in your frustration; the more people speak up, the more likely it is that the rule will end up getting enforced."

 

Here's the rest of my story.  I live in the county.  On my street is the local small airport which includes a wildland fire suppression unit.  Lots of water tenders and support vehicles for helicopter ops.  Further down the road is a hay brokerage with the only certified scales within 70 miles.  So lots of hay trucks and livestock trucks coming and going.  The road is about 3 miles long and is perfectly flat.  No need for compression brakes.  Yet big truckers with small genitalia have to make big noises.  I went to a county court meeting and made a case for signage.  They not only agreed to prohibit compression brakes, they also agreed to post a lower speed limit.  After signage there was probably a 10% increased compliance with speed and a 70% compliance with noise.  I then asked for deployment of a mobile radar sign.  They agreed.  It was one of those  Speed limit is X, you speed is Y blinking jobs.  They left it up for a month.  No change in noise of course and maybe another 10% increase in speed compliance.  There has never been any traffic stop enforcement of the new signage.  Now circling around to the comments above about enforcement, I agree.  People aren't stupid.  We learn by the age of two what we can get away with up to the point of enforcement.  No enforcement, no (little) compliance.

[Hosstage]

In a neighborhood that I drive thru, underneath the speed limit sign is another that says "Strictly Enforced".

I do not speed in that neighborhood.

[RTinNC]

On 10/21/2020 at 3:15 PM, Hosstage said:

In a neighborhood that I drive thru, underneath the speed limit sign is another that says "Strictly Enforced".

I do not speed in that neighborhood.

 

[Hosstage]

Now that's funny!