2003 R1150R Sitting for 6 Years

[Imgnr]

Hi All - Instead of starting a new topic for the little annoying questions I might have, I'll just put them all here so that I won't create too many new topics.  I bought an '03 R1150R that was sitting for six years with ethanol in the tank.  The owner said he stopped riding it because of a worn clutch.  I've fixed up an '04 Rockster with the help of this forum so I sort of know my way around this bike and for $600 and $1,000 in back fees, I thought why not?  I've budgeted another $1K for parts.  The Rockster is running well but this bike, although it has 80K miles, is in pretty decent shape visually.

 

I split the bike and took out the clutch pack and indeed, the clutch is completely worn down and the plates have deep grooves in them.  The splines are still fine so instead of getting the upgraded  clutch from Beemer Boneyard like I did last time, I paid $125K for a clutch pack from a 20K mile doner bike.  While I have it apart, I'll change the slave cylinder, replace the rear shocks from the same 20K mile doner, change the rear brake roter and pads, adjust the pivot bolt (wheel is wiggling), wrap all the harnesses due to crumbling rubber sleeve, etc. etc. etc.

 

So, the first question is, I noticed four wires on the left side of the bike and two on the right have been clipped.  I'm guessing two on each side go to the grip warmer?  Unless they've shorted and blown fuses, why would someone cut them?  What about the other two?

 

Thank you

[Mrclubike]

They look like they broke to me

It appears they are at a place in the harness that has been wire tied

[Imgnr]

1 hour ago, Mrclubike said:

They look like they broke to me

It appears they are at a place in the harness that has been wire tied

Mrclubike - I don't think so as the ends are very cleanly cut and not frayed so looks like they've been snipped.  I actually don't think they're grip warmers anymore because I think grip warmer cables are brown and black.  If anyone has a wiring diagram they can share that would be wonderful.

 

Thank you

[dirtrider]

On 5/2/2020 at 9:55 PM, Imgnr said:

Hi All - Instead of starting a new topic for the little annoying questions I might have, I'll just put them all here so that I won't create too many new topics.  I bought an '03 R1150R that was sitting for six years with ethanol in the tank.  The owner said he stopped riding it because of a worn clutch.  I've fixed up an '04 Rockster with the help of this forum so I sort of know my way around this bike and for $600 and $1,000 in back fees, I thought why not?  I've budgeted another $1K for parts.  The Rockster is running well but this bike, although it has 80K miles, is in pretty decent shape visually.

 

I split the bike and took out the clutch pack and indeed, the clutch is completely worn down and the plates have deep grooves in them.  The splines are still fine so instead of getting the upgraded  clutch from Beemer Boneyard like I did last time, I paid $125K for a clutch pack from a 20K mile doner bike.  While I have it apart, I'll change the slave cylinder, replace the rear shocks from the same 20K mile doner, change the rear brake roter and pads, adjust the pivot bolt (wheel is wiggling), wrap all the harnesses due to crumbling rubber sleeve, etc. etc. etc.

 

So, the first question is, I noticed four wires on the left side of the bike and two on the right have been clipped.  I'm guessing two on each side go to the grip warmer?  Unless they've shorted and blown fuses, why would someone cut them?  What about the other two?

 

Thank you

 

 

 

Morning  Imgnr

 

I can't tell a whole lot from your pictures like  where the wires are coming from & going so it is difficult to tell exactly what you have. 

 

I am having a difficult time with the full wire colors also.

 

A couple of those wires  do fit in with heated grips but not in the areas that you seem to be showing.

 

SO--

 

Give me the FULL wire colors (such as Green/Blue or brown, or green/yellow etc), how the colors are paired (what wires are in the same run),   & where the wires are coming from, or where  the ether end is going to (track them in both directions as far as you can).

 

Those wire colors shown are pretty common on BMW motorcycles so we need more info from you. 

 

Also, tell us if anything have been removed the motorcycle (like the ABS system or ?????).

[Imgnr]

DR - No ABS. There are two pairs of green/black and light grey wires with their own connector and sleeve on both left and right sides that were snipped.  The both go into the LH and RH controls right by the levers. If I had to guess it’s the brake and clutch sensors.  I don’t know why someone would snip these other than thinking that they’re snipping the grip warmers if they’re not using them and afraid they will leave them on accidentally. Would snipping the clutch sensor allow someone to start the engine?  See first two pics.

 

The third set of wires is brown/yellow and blue/green. It goes into the big connector. Near the top of the ECU. The other end goes into the LH control. 
 

Thank you. 

[dirtrider]

23 minutes ago, Imgnr said:

DR - No ABS. There are two pairs of green/black and light grey wires with their own connector and sleeve on both left and right sides that were snipped.  The both go into the LH and RH controls right by the levers. If I had to guess it’s the brake and clutch sensors.  I don’t know why someone would snip these other than thinking that they’re snipping the grip warmers if they’re not using them and afraid they will leave them on accidentally. Would snipping the clutch sensor allow someone to start the engine?  See first two pics.

 

The third set of wires is brown/yellow and blue/green. It goes into the big connector. Near the top of the ECU. The other end goes into the LH control. 
 

Thank you. 

 

 

 

Evening  Imgnr

 

green/black and grey are definitely the colors used for front brake switch.  

 

Did that bike have ABS at one time???

 

If so & it was removed from the motorcycle maybe someone used pressure switches at a brake line banjo bolt to turn the brake light on.  Some used to do that rather than make up a relay system to reverse the factory brake switch operation.

 

Will the engine crank when in gear with the clutch lever out? If so then the  clutch safety switch has been by-passed (probably by cutting the wires going to the  switch then twisting the chassis side wires together).

 

The third set of wires is brown/yellow and blue/green-- I'll have to look into this one for you. 

 

 

[Imgnr]

57 minutes ago, dirtrider said:

Evening  Imgnr

 

green/black and grey are definitely the colors used for front brake switch.  

 

Did that bike have ABS at one time???

 

If so & it was removed from the motorcycle maybe someone used pressure switches at a brake line banjo bolt to turn the brake light on.  Some used to do that rather than make up a relay system to reverse the factory brake switch operation.

 

Will the engine crank when in gear with the clutch lever out? If so then the  clutch safety switch has been by-passed (probably by cutting the wires going to the  switch then twisting the chassis side wires together).

 

The third set of wires is brown/yellow and blue/green-- I'll have to look into this one for you. 

 

 

DR - First of all, thank you again!  The bike never had ABS.  The speedo is gear driven.  I actually never tried cranking it.  So from what you describe, it seems safe to hook the wires back up.  I'll wait for your input on the third set.

 

[dirtrider]

12 hours ago, Imgnr said:

DR - First of all, thank you again!  The bike never had ABS.  The speedo is gear driven.  I actually never tried cranking it.  So from what you describe, it seems safe to hook the wires back up.  I'll wait for your input on the third set.

 

Morning  Imgnr

 

I'm kind of striking out on finding  those brown/yellow and blue/green wires in the same connector (or related). But easy to miss something as I have to go over every circuit then track it back to wire colors. 

 

The brown/yellow is commonly used in the horn circuit but no blue/green (that I can find) used in the same circuit on the R bike. The horn does have a blue/brown related to it.  

 

Is you (R)  bike an original  U.S.  motorcycle? 

[Imgnr]

DR - Thank you for looking. I’ve already reconnected the wires but will open up the hand controls to verify since I plan on installing a small push button on/off switch for the fog lights. They may very well be for the horn since the button on the LH controller. As far as I know this is a US model bike. 
 

I did also notice that the factory zip ties were extremely tight so perhaps another poster was right that they cut into the wires rather than someone consciously cutting them. 

[Mrclubike]

12 hours ago, Imgnr said:

 
 

I did also notice that the factory zip ties were extremely tight so perhaps another poster was right that they cut into the wires rather than someone consciously cutting them. 

Yes they can be very clean breaks

I have seen wires fail like this and not even  break the insulation

 

That is why one needs to know how to use a voltmeter

[Imgnr]

Mrclubike - a voltmeter would work only if there’s a battery hooked up and since I thought someone had done it purposefully, I wanted to see if there’s an underlying reason. ; )
 

Here’s a shot of where the wire goes into. 

[Imgnr]

Here’s the tank. I did the Apple vinegar treatment. There’s some surface rust left but I think it’s ok. I’ll put some gas and shake it up and dump it out before I use it. 

[Imgnr]

So that’s why the rear wheel was wiggly. 
 

I ordered Nushings. Install seems straight forward. So no lube required!

[Imgnr]

Help please!  I reinstalled the clutch pack and replaced the pivot bushings with Nushings.  When I put the wheel back on and tried shifting, none of the gears will engage.  The wheel just spins freely.  When I try to shift the gears, it doesn't seem to shift all the way through to 6th gear.  Seems like it only goes a couple of gears.  I also cannot get the neutral light to come on.  The PO did not mention anything about a transmission issue although I did try shifting the gears when examining the bike and it seemed like this was happening before and I figured it was because of the clutch.

 

Any thoughts on what can be causing this? 

[dirtrider]

3 minutes ago, Imgnr said:

Help please!  I reinstalled the clutch pack and replaced the pivot bushings with Nushings.  When I put the wheel back on and tried shifting, none of the gears will engage.  The wheel just spins freely.  When I try to shift the gears, it doesn't seem to shift all the way through to 6th gear.  Seems like it only goes a couple of gears.  I also cannot get the neutral light to come on.  The PO did not mention anything about a transmission issue although I did try shifting the gears when examining the bike and it seemed like this was happening before and I figured it was because of the clutch.

 

Any thoughts on what can be causing this? 

Evening Imgnr

 

You are going to have to dig & check until you find the place that you are losing drive. Maybe remove the starter  so you can view the clutch then put trans in a gear then turn the rear wheel. See if the clutch disk is spinning, or if you are losing drive farther back in the trans or drive shaft. 

[Imgnr]

After taking off the starter, drive shaft housing, and the pivot arm, I found the problem and I’m embarrassed to admit that when I reinstalled the pivot arm the spline somehow slipped out from the end of the drive shaft. 
 

New questions:

 

1) I found this pin underneath the starter/kick stand area. There’s a hole in the end for a retaining pin. Any idea what it is?  
2) I didn't mark the end of the driveshaft and where the spline came off and just reinstalled randomly.  How important is it to "rebalance" the shaft?  I don't want to pull the drive shaft out and align the two ends (match the u joints).

 

Thank you

[MontanaMark]

Looks like a brake pad retainer pin.  Check your rear brake caliper.

 

Cheers,

Mark

 

[Imgnr]

4 minutes ago, MontanaMark said:

Looks like a brake pad retainer pin.  Check your rear brake caliper.

 

Cheers,

Mark

 

Thanks!  I bet that's what it is.  I took apart both front and back brakes to change the pads and rotors.  I thought I put it away somewhere safe.

[Imgnr]

I think it’s the front brake pin.

 

Question:  when putting the rear swing arm back on, there is a considerable gap between the housing and the arm. Is this normal?  I’ve torqued the pins. 
 

thank you. 

[dirtrider]

23 minutes ago, Imgnr said:

I think it’s the front brake pin.

 

Question:  when putting the rear swing arm back on, there is a considerable gap between the housing and the arm. Is this normal?  I’ve torqued the pins. 
 

thank you. 

 

 

Evening Imgnr

 

Probably, how many threads do you have showing outside the nut on the L/H side (post a picture if unsure).

[Imgnr]

1 hour ago, dirtrider said:

Evening Imgnr

 

Probably, how many threads do you have showing outside the nut on the L/H side (post a picture if unsure).

Hi DR picture was posted. Thank you. 

[dirtrider]

4 minutes ago, Imgnr said:

Hi DR picture was posted. Thank you. 

Evening Imgnr

 

Sorry I can't see it, I only see the pictures of the inside. I am talking about the threads showing outside of the pivot pin retaining nut.

[Imgnr]

1 hour ago, dirtrider said:

Evening Imgnr

 

Sorry I can't see it, I only see the pictures of the inside. I am talking about the threads showing outside of the pivot pin retaining nut.

DR - I see. From the outside. Here’s the pic. Thank you. 

[Miguel!]

3 hours ago, Imgnr said:

DR - I see. From the outside. Here’s the pic. Thank you. 

Look like two threads to me (just incase DR can't see this photo either). Miguel

[dirtrider]

11 hours ago, Imgnr said:

DR - I see. From the outside. Here’s the pic. Thank you. 

 

Morning Imgnr

 

OK, that picture helps. You are good to go as that looks to be about right as far as adjustment goes. 

[Imgnr]

Oh oh.  Hope this is isn't something bad.  I adjusted the valves, changed all the fluids, changed the spark plugs, slackened all the cables and it started up.  Idle is ok but what is that clacking on the right cylinder???

[dirtrider]

Morning Imgnr

 

Difficult to tell from the video, definitely doesn't sound good. 

 

Please explain this in more detail  "slackened all the cables". 

[Imgnr]

Morning DR,

 

Ugh. This is the last time I'm buying a dirt cheap bike.  Should've used it for parts.

The cables I'm referring to are the throttle cables.  I was about to adjust the idle and sync the throttle bodies.

 

The PO had already upgraded the chain LS chain tensioner.  The sound here is definitely from the RS.  I'll take the right cover off and inspect the rocker and push rods.  Hope it's one of those two.  I have not check the compression yet.

 

I'll put everything back together and take a short ride in the neighborhood and see if this goes away.  I have not warmed the bike up to operating temperatures yet.  I don't think there's more harm that can be done by riding it.

 

Thank you!

[Imgnr]

I took the bike out for a spin in the neighborhood and the rattling / whacking / clacking sound is very loud.  Well beyond being annoying.  It's at the point where it sounds like something is lose and whacking around inside the cylinder.  I checked the rocker arm float, push rods, and valve clearance and tried it again but the sound is still there.  I looked for the cam chain rail and I can still see the black plastic edge.  

 

- Could this be a due to a bad cam chain tensioner?  The PO replaced the LH side.  But the sound is there even after the bike has warmed up.

- How do I inspect the rail to see that it's not cracked / broken beyond just the tip that I can visually see?

 

Should I pull the head and inspect the valves?

 

Thank you,

[dirtrider]

Morning  Imgnr

 

I took the bike out for a spin in the neighborhood and the rattling / whacking / clacking sound is very loud.  Well beyond being annoying.  It's at the point where it sounds like something is lose and whacking around inside the cylinder.  I checked the rocker arm float, push rods, and valve clearance and tried it again but the sound is still there.  I looked for the cam chain rail and I can still see the black plastic edge. -- You might buy a cheap mechanics stethoscope to probe around to sees if you can locate the area the noise is coming from. You can use it with the stinger to hear noises coming through the engine metal areas then remove the stinger & amplifier to use just the hose part to pinpoint air-born noises.

 

You can also use a piece of garden hose held  to your ear to probe around for noise location  but an actual mechanics stethoscope works much better as that allows both hands free to probe & work.  

 

- Could this be a due to a bad cam chain tensioner?-- Could be, that noise is not good but the video doesn't do much to help us identify it over the internet.

 

The PO replaced the LH side.  But the sound is there even after the bike has warmed up. -- The R/H side tensioner can also sort of fail but usually doesn't get that loud unless parts are missing. 

 

- How do I inspect the rail to see that it's not cracked / broken beyond just the tip that I can visually see?-- You need to remove the valve cover then use a very bright light to look in the cam chain area. (compare existing cam chain guides to a picture of good ones)

 

Should I pull the head and inspect the valves?-- Not yet, do a compression test first, check cam chain guides, check R/H tensioner, look at spark plug, etc. Save cylinder head removal until that is all that is left to check.  If you remove the cyl head & don't find an issue inside then you have lost other options to identify the problem. 

 

Is the throttle body balance close???????-- if the engine isn't running evenly on both cylinders they can hammer a bit & make noises. 

 

Does the noise change if you short out the R/H spark plug to kill that side cylinder??

 

With ALL the work that you have done to that motorcycle you might make sure that you didn't partially pull the R/H spark plug wire out of the ignition coil (easy to do when working up front).

 

 

 

 

[Michaelr11]

Imgnr - Don't be insulted if this question is silly to you.  You say you adjusted the valves.  Did you rotate the motor to the compression stroke TDC on the right side before you adjusted valves on the right side?  If you adjusted the left side valves and then went over to the right side and adjusted those without rotating the motor then your right side valve clearance would way too large and they would clatter.

[Imgnr]

On 6/8/2020 at 6:54 AM, Michaelr11 said:

Imgnr - Don't be insulted if this question is silly to you.  You say you adjusted the valves.  Did you rotate the motor to the compression stroke TDC on the right side before you adjusted valves on the right side?  If you adjusted the left side valves and then went over to the right side and adjusted those without rotating the motor then your right side valve clearance would way too large and they would clatter.

Michaelr - Not insulted at all.  I went back in and triple checked the valve gap.  15 intake and 30 exhaust.  I even turned the engine over  and checked again.  This time everything was tight and couldn't fit blades in.

 

DR - 

 

- The noise seems to be coming from the cylinder.

- The compression (cold) is 150 left and 120 right so this cylinder has some issues although I read that 120 cold may be ok.  The compression is approximate as I have a cheap tester and the needle was rapidly going up and down while I cranked the engine.

- The two new plugs already have a lot of build-up on it even though I only went for a short ride (maybe a mile).  The right one (the one making noise) seems oilier than the left.

- I shined a light down the cam chain and it seems like the guides are there although I can't be 100 percent certain.

- I checked the LH tensioner (updated) but not the right one.  I need to remove the header to get it off.    Do yo think I should still check it considering it might be the low compression?

 

I'm thinking maybe there's something wrong with the valves or the pistons?

 

Thank you!

 

[dirtrider]

10 hours ago, Imgnr said:

DR - 

 

- The noise seems to be coming from the cylinder.

- The compression (cold) is 150 left and 120 right so this cylinder has some issues although I read that 120 cold may be ok.  The compression is approximate as I have a cheap tester and the needle was rapidly going up and down while I cranked the engine.

- The two new plugs already have a lot of build-up on it even though I only went for a short ride (maybe a mile).  The right one (the one making noise) seems oilier than the left.

- I shined a light down the cam chain and it seems like the guides are there although I can't be 100 percent certain.

- I checked the LH tensioner (updated) but not the right one.  I need to remove the header to get it off.    Do yo think I should still check it considering it might be the low compression?

 

I'm thinking maybe there's something wrong with the valves or the pistons?

 

 

 

 

Morning  Imgnr

 

Those spark plugs don't look too bad after a cold start & a very short ride. They will clear up after a 1/2 hour ride at 70mph.

 

I'm still not sure on your noise as  diagnosing an engine noise over the internet is very difficult, as you have found it is difficult enough when hanging over the motorcycle.

 

That compression is way too low compared to the other side (BMW's tend to run higher than the books calls out in most cases)-- It's that side to side spread that bothers me not the actual numbers.

 

Did you remove #5 fuse for the compression test as that kills off the injector fuel squirt, did you hold the throttle wide open for the compression test as the allows all the air available to flow in through the throttle plates then

be compressed. 

 

With your gauge not fitting properly a compression test might not be accurate anyhow.  

 

With it running are both side front exhaust pipes about the same temperature?

[Imgnr]

1 hour ago, dirtrider said:

Morning  Imgnr

 

Those spark plugs don't look too bad after a cold start & a very short ride. They will clear up after a 1/2 hour ride at 70mph.

 

I'm still not sure on your noise as  diagnosing an engine noise over the internet is very difficult, as you have found it is difficult enough when hanging over the motorcycle.

 

That compression is way too low compared to the other side (BMW's tend to run higher than the books calls out in most cases)-- It's that side to side spread that bothers me not the actual numbers.

 

Did you remove #5 fuse for the compression test as that kills off the injector fuel squirt, did you hold the throttle wide open for the compression test as the allows all the air available to flow in through the throttle plates then

be compressed. 

 

With your gauge not fitting properly a compression test might not be accurate anyhow.  

 

With it running are both side front exhaust pipes about the same temperature?

DR,

 

I will do the compression test again.  I did not hold the throttle open nor did I take the fuse out.

 

I'm not sure about the temperature; the right side was getting pretty hot as some oil on the pipes were burning during the ride.

 

Thank you

[Imgnr]

Happy Father's Day!

 

So I reset the valves, checked the RHS cam chain tensioner and they came out fine.  Tried to check the compression but the banging and clanking was so loud I was afraid the engine would be further damaged.  This is not an annoying tapping sound.  This is a "WTF is that and I better hurry up and shut off the engine before something else breaks" kind of sound.

 

I half expected to see a broken valve stem or something that catastrophic but I didn't.  Here are some pictures.  I'm thinking I need to pull the cylinder head and inspect the piston next but wanted to check w/ the gurus first.  What else should I be looking for?  There is quite a bit of carbon buildup.  The camchain guides look good.

 

Thank you!

[dirtrider]

6 minutes ago, Imgnr said:

Happy Father's Day!

 

So I reset the valves, checked the RHS cam chain tensioner and they came out fine.  Tried to check the compression but the banging and clanking was so loud I was afraid the engine would be further damaged.  This is not an annoying tapping sound.  This is a "WTF is that and I better hurry up and shut off the engine before something else breaks" kind of sound.

 

I half expected to see a broken valve stem or something that catastrophic but I didn't.  Here are some pictures.  I'm thinking I need to pull the cylinder head and inspect the piston next but wanted to check w/ the gurus first.  What else should I be looking for?  There is quite a bit of carbon buildup.  The camchain guides look good.

 

Thank you!

Afternoon Imgnr

 

Can't tell a whole lot from the pictures but it looks like the piston might have been lightly kissing the cylinder head in the squish areas. (not much carbon there so it is at least coming pretty close).

 

You have to very careful with that cam chain just hanging out but if you can find a way to roll the crankshaft enough to just start the piston in the down direction (pull the piston in a little), then put a hammer handle on the piston top & give the piston a good solid push with the hammer handle.

 

If you get piston movement, or a load clack, or unusual noise, then possibly a bad rod bearing or a loose piston pin clearance.  

 

Once you start taking the engine apart "before" identifying the noise then you are committed to digging until you find something (hopefully you do as it is very difficult reassembling an engine with a problem without finding anything conclusive). 

[Imgnr]

6 hours ago, dirtrider said:

Afternoon Imgnr

 

Can't tell a whole lot from the pictures but it looks like the piston might have been lightly kissing the cylinder head in the squish areas. (not much carbon there so it is at least coming pretty close).

 

You have to very careful with that cam chain just hanging out but if you can find a way to roll the crankshaft enough to just start the piston in the down direction (pull the piston in a little), then put a hammer handle on the piston top & give the piston a good solid push with the hammer handle.

 

If you get piston movement, or a load clack, or unusual noise, then possibly a bad rod bearing or a loose piston pin clearance.  

 

Once you start taking the engine apart "before" identifying the noise then you are committed to digging until you find something (hopefully you do as it is very difficult reassembling an engine with a problem without finding anything conclusive). 

DR - This is pretty much as far as I've been comfortable tearing down an engine.  If I turn the crankshaft, I'm afraid I would lose the position of the camchain on the sprocket even though I've marked it.  Once I've turned it won't I need to turn the engine over twice to get it to come back to where it was before?  Looks like the piston has indeed been "kissing" the head.  I cleaned up the carbon and it's pretty clear.  Please see photos.  

 

- I think to fix the loose piston pin I just need to pull the cylinder which should be pretty easy.

- What about the rod bearing?  Would I need to split the engine?

- Can I just add another gasket to give the piston some extra room to move?

 

Thank you

[Selden]

On 5/22/2020 at 1:08 AM, Imgnr said:

Thanks!  I bet that's what it is.  I took apart both front and back brakes to change the pads and rotors.  I thought I put it away somewhere safe.

 

Replace the brake pad pins front and rear. They are inexpensive, and fresh pins will allow the pads to slide more easily. I'm cheap, but this was an easy decision the last time I worked on the brakes.

[dirtrider]

10 hours ago, Imgnr said:

- I think to fix the loose piston pin I just need to pull the cylinder which should be pretty easy.

- What about the rod bearing?  Would I need to split the engine?

- Can I just add another gasket to give the piston some extra room to move?

Morning Imgnr

 

- I think to fix the loose piston pin I just need to pull the cylinder which should be pretty easy.-- Yes, you are pretty well committed now with the cylinder head removed. 

 

- What about the rod bearing?  Would I need to split the engine?-- Yes & no, you don't need to split the engine to access the rod bearings (you will have to remove the opposite side cyl head & cylinder). But if it's a rod bearing then it is seldom JUST a rod bearing but usually involves a scored crankshaft journal & THAT does require engine removal & splitting.

 

- Can I just add another gasket to give the piston some extra room to move?-- You could (BMW also made a thick & thin head gasket) but there is a reason that piston is/was  hitting the cylinder head so you need to find the reason that piston is (or might be) kissing the cylinder head. Or at least verify that the piston pin, piston, rod small end, rod bearing, etc are all OK. 

 

You are into it THIS far already so you need to find the problem BEFORE reassembly.  

[Imgnr]

Plot thickens. I stripped one of the bolts. When I got it out there is evidence that someone put on a ton of silicone.  

 

- Did it come from the factory this way?  I’m guessing not?  Wonder what was wrong w the bike that made them have to take the cylinder out. 

- I have the M10 hex bolt remaining that's to the left and above the top cam chain guide.  I've put as much pressure on it as I am comfortable as I'm afraid I'll snap the head off because who ever was in the engine may have also put silicone in it.   How much force is needed?  I used a yard long pipe fitted over my ratchet and applied pretty good force to it.  Since the bolt holding the top cam chain guide is out and the guide has dropped down, there seems to be room to apply heat with a torch.  Should I do that?  What should I use as a heat shield to protect the cam chain guide?

- Can you tell by looking at the marks on the head and the piston how long it was running like this?  I was able to reach the PO and he claims that the bike was running fine other than the clutch problem.  He does seem like the kind of person that would ride the bike to the ground and not notice things falling apart around him.

 

Thank you!
 

btw, a great way to get a stripped hex bolt out is to get a torx bit, one size up and grind down the edge so it starts to fit and then hammer it in using a manual impact driver. 

[Imgnr]

So I cut up a beer can and used that as a heat shield on the cam chain rails and hit the bolt with some heat and the bolt came off pretty easily with a bit of force.

 

The big end seems to be loose.  It moves in and out as well as laterally.  Is this normal?

Do I need to change the bearing inserts?  Do I change both left and right side since I'm in there?

Anything else I should inspect or change?

Also, there is a jagged piece of metal that seems to be rotating around and doesn't pull off.  It's circled in the picture.  Was there a metal ring there? Or is this a remnant of the bearing insert?

Seems like the next thing I need to do is remove the other cylinder and piston and remove the connecting rod?

If you can point me in the right direction I can google it or look it up in the manual.  Thank you!

[AndyS]

Has this bike been run with no oil?

[dirtrider]

Quote

 

So I cut up a beer can and used that as a heat shield on the cam chain rails and hit the bolt with some heat and the bolt came off pretty easily with a bit of force.

 

The big end seems to be loose.  It moves in and out as well as laterally.  Is this normal?

Do I need to change the bearing inserts?  Do I change both left and right side since I'm in there?

Anything else I should inspect or change?

Also, there is a jagged piece of metal that seems to be rotating around and doesn't pull off.  It's circled in the picture.  Was there a metal ring there? Or is this a remnant of the bearing insert?

Seems like the next thing I need to do is remove the other cylinder and piston and remove the connecting rod?

If you can point me in the right direction I can google it or look it up in the manual.  Thank you!

 

Morning  Imgnr

 

First thing-- please post less pictures, only post the picture of the item that you need info on.  (all those other pictures are not needed & just make the thread longer than needed & add confusion )

 

I think the picture that you need the info on in the one with the blue circle (correct?). That jagged piece of metal you are referring to is more than likely the connecting rod bearing that has been beat to death then squeezed out.  My guess is that you will also find the crankshaft journal in pretty bad shape & deeply grooved & worn.

 

Unless that one bearing is an isolated problem (probably not) then you will more than likely find other bearings & journals worn & scored also. 

 

If the crankshaft & other bearings are worn, scored, or damaged then you are probably looking at a good used engine for repair as major parts to repair the old oilhead engines are extremely expensive.

 

Remove the other side cylinder & piston then you can reach in & unbolt the connecting rods from the crankshaft (THIS will probably tell the story on if you want to repair that engine or look for a good used engine)

 

That rod  bearing being that worn & beat to death would have  allowed the connecting  rod & piston to move out far enough to hit the cylinder head.

 

Added: With all the pictures in this thread  I haven't gone back to the top in a while (long thread) so I just went back to the top to read the original complaint.   I see this motorcycle had sat for 6 years?-- That could explain the bearing issues, if an engine sits long term with old oil in it,  or stored with acidic oil in it, or was  started a few times in cold weather but not ridden,  then acidic oil,  or oil with moisture in it  can etch the crankshaft & bearing surfaces enough to cause bearing destruction when it's finally put back in-service.   

[AndyS]

2 hours ago, dirtrider said:

you are probably looking at a good used engine for repair as major parts to repair the old oilhead engines are extremely expensive.

 

 

Sounds like a really good plan!

[Imgnr]

I went ahead and cut up a beer can and used it as a heat shield over the chain guide and put a flame on the bolt and it came off. Looks like there was some thread lock on it. 
 

The rod is very loose. Maybe the bearing inserts are done?  I noticed a ragged piece of metal sticking out on the right side of the big end. It rotates around and I can’t pull it out. Should there be a ring there as well?

 

Can you please point me in the right direction as to what I need to do to get this fixed?

 

Thank you 

[Imgnr]

Ugh. Ok. I’ve started looking around. Will all r1150 single spark engines fit?  Can I reuse the top end?  There is an engine w just the bottom end that’s reasonably cheap. 

[dirtrider]

41 minutes ago, Imgnr said:

Ugh. Ok. I’ve started looking around. Will all r1150 single spark engines fit?  Can I reuse the top end?  There is an engine w just the bottom end that’s reasonably cheap. 

  

Afternoon Imgnr

 

For the most part the 1150 engines are similar but there are some outliers so you REALLY- REALLY- REALLY need to do the research before buying. 

 

 There is an engine with just the bottom end that’s reasonably cheap. -- This would scare the He!! out of me, WHY is there only a bottom end, how bad are insides torn up, is the crankshaft all scored up, this sounds like an expensive pig-in-a-polk. 

 

Personally I would be looking for a guaranteed runner that is all there.

 

On using your top end, possibly but what if you install all  those expensive gaskets  &  small parts then  it still won't run right or knocks. 

 

Again, my suggestion it to buy a known good running engine. Just figure the parts needed to reassemble a questionable lower engine (just the parts alone will probably cost you more than the difference between that lower engine & a decent running engine.  

[Imgnr]

DR - will do. What would I need to do to get a dual spark engine to work?

[dirtrider]

11 hours ago, Imgnr said:

DR - will do. What would I need to do to get a dual spark engine to work?

Morning Imgnr

 

That is a good question: Technically you really need nothing as the twin spark will run as a single spark engine using your current Motronic & fueling system. (the question is: how good will it run as a single spark engine?)

 

How good will it run as a single spark, how difficult is it to convert a single spark to a twin spark  --- This I don't know. I have helped a few riders with technical questions & electrical questions when installing a twin spark engine in a single  spark motorcycle.   What I didn't  have was the option to ride the motorcycle after the engine conversion or witness all the small problems they had to deal with during the conversion.  

 

So the basic answer is, I really don't know, if you just want to bolt an engine in & ride then I would strongly suggest that you stick with a single spark engine. 

 

If you want to bolt an engine in then have an ongoing project for a while then bolt a twin spark engine in that bike. (you will have some problems to solve or work through).

[Imgnr]

I just bought a running (with video) 2003 single spark engine from an RT with about 60K miles on it for $600 (may be a bit more when I tell them I need a lift gate truck for delivery).  My bike has 80K something something.  There was another engine that had only 16K with a transmission for $900 but there was no video of it running.

 

I'm doing this by myself.  Can I take the tank and plastics off, unplug all the electrics to the engine, and strap the frame to the garage ceiling with ratchet tie downs, unbolt everything from the engine and lift everything off and lower it on top of the new engine/transmission?