Side stand switch questions

[dduelin]

Bike is a 2007 R1200RT. I bought it last month with 89,000 miles and have put 3000 miles on it. No problems.

 

Yesterday I took a long ride and was documenting specific items at each gas stop like odometer mileage, both trip meter mileages , and time displayed so for this situation I stopped at the gas pump, cut the engine off with the key, then turned the key on and off 2 or 3 times to get data before pulling the key out before leaving the bike 10 to 30 minutes. As I went to leave the first such stop the engine cut off when I engaged first gear as if the side stand was down although it was not. I cycled the side stand down and up thinking the switch might have stuck in the down position. This did not work. I became very deliberate with the side stand cycling but after 6 or 7 attempts the engine continued to stop when I engaged a gear ( I tried to engage second from neutral with the same result). After thinking this through a moment, I lifted the bike on the center stand (key off), then retracted the side stand, then turned the key on and let it cycle completely through diagnostic checks. Only then did I start the engine and engage first. It operated normally and I pushed off the center stand and rode away. At the next stop I did the same key on and off thing before pulling the key out and leaving it out a few minutes. Again, engine cut off with engagement of first. I shortened the chinese fire drill of before and turned the key off. Side stand was up, I'm supporting the bike upright with my legs. Key off, waited 15-20 seconds, turned key on and let it cycle diagnostic checks, then started normally and rode off. The rest of the day I did this and had no further problems. I also did not cut off the engine before getting the data checks I needed.

 

I assume the side stand switch is operating correctly and it was me turning the key on and off multiple times and not letting the onboard computer do it's thing that created this "problem?"

[dirtrider]

55 minutes ago, dduelin said:

Bike is a 2007 R1200RT. I bought it last month with 89,000 miles and have put 3000 miles on it. No problems.

 

Yesterday I took a long ride and was documenting specific items at each gas stop like odometer mileage, both trip meter mileages , and time displayed so for this situation I stopped at the gas pump, cut the engine off with the key, then turned the key on and off 2 or 3 times to get data before pulling the key out before leaving the bike 10 to 30 minutes. As I went to leave the first such stop the engine cut off when I engaged first gear as if the side stand was down although it was not. I cycled the side stand down and up thinking the switch might have stuck in the down position. This did not work. I became very deliberate with the side stand cycling but after 6 or 7 attempts the engine continued to stop when I engaged a gear ( I tried to engage second from neutral with the same result). After thinking this through a moment, I lifted the bike on the center stand (key off), then retracted the side stand, then turned the key on and let it cycle completely through diagnostic checks. Only then did I start the engine and engage first. It operated normally and I pushed off the center stand and rode away. At the next stop I did the same key on and off thing before pulling the key out and leaving it out a few minutes. Again, engine cut off with engagement of first. I shortened the chinese fire drill of before and turned the key off. Side stand was up, I'm supporting the bike upright with my legs. Key off, waited 15-20 seconds, turned key on and let it cycle diagnostic checks, then started normally and rode off. The rest of the day I did this and had no further problems. I also did not cut off the engine before getting the data checks I needed.

 

I assume the side stand switch is operating correctly and it was me turning the key on and off multiple times and not letting the onboard computer do it's thing that created this "problem?"

 

 

Morning Dave

 

It sure points to a side stand switch issue. Might not be the switch itself but a very loose side stand at the pivot area. (the side stand ears & bracket tend to wear allowing the side stand to have a lot of side play). This play is more trouble when the motorcycle weight is placed on the side stand, or if the rider sits on the motorcycle with side stand down. 

 

The BMW 1200 side stand switch is a 3 wire affair that runs a checksum.

 

The easy test is to just by-pass the side stand switch to see if your problem goes away. 

 

If your side stand has a lot of side movement then that should probably  be addressed. 

 

You might want to read this thread --     https://www.bmwsporttouring.com/topic/94751-error-10111/

 

[dduelin]

After discussing this with Bernie on the phone I hooked up the communal GS-911 and the code 10111 Side Stand fault was present. I believe it recorded 40 instances. I attempted to clear the code and it would not clear stating the code was still present. Entering into real values I selected Side Stand 1 and it appeared to work correctly as I extended and retracted the stand. Side Stand 2 was not working correctly. The switch did not consistently show extended or retracted values as it should when the side stand was extended or retracted. My stand stand has a lot of play and at one point in this exercise I could get the values to change extended/retracted by simply moving the foot of the side stand in and out to the limits of play. I also found that with the stand extended I could wiggle the switch and get the values to indicate correctly or incorrectly. Holding the switch in the 'correct' position with one hand, with the other hand I cleared the fault code and then extended and retracted the stand a number of times with the appropriate values showing. Then I checked the code again and it was clean with no fault present.

 

Clearly I need to reduce the side stand play and also switch play to see if it fixes the problem. Today a new switch was  listed NA on Max BMW Parts. Does this mean the switch is no longer available new?

 

[Hati]

The thread dirtrider linked is my experience with the very same issue. I can confirm that the fix worked successfully because to this date and a few thousand kilometres under the bike now since the fix, the error has not returned.

[dirtrider]

8 hours ago, dduelin said:

After discussing this with Bernie on the phone I hooked up the communal GS-911 and the code 10111 Side Stand fault was present. I believe it recorded 40 instances. I attempted to clear the code and it would not clear stating the code was still present. Entering into real values I selected Side Stand 1 and it appeared to work correctly as I extended and retracted the stand. Side Stand 2 was not working correctly. The switch did not consistently show extended or retracted values as it should when the side stand was extended or retracted. My stand stand has a lot of play and at one point in this exercise I could get the values to change extended/retracted by simply moving the foot of the side stand in and out to the limits of play. I also found that with the stand extended I could wiggle the switch and get the values to indicate correctly or incorrectly. Holding the switch in the 'correct' position with one hand, with the other hand I cleared the fault code and then extended and retracted the stand a number of times with the appropriate values showing. Then I checked the code again and it was clean with no fault present.

 

Clearly I need to reduce the side stand play and also switch play to see if it fixes the problem. Today a new switch was  listed NA on Max BMW Parts. Does this mean the switch is no longer available new?

 

 

Morning Dave 

 

My parts book shows that side stand switch  61312305950 was superseded by switch 61318526970. 

 

Probably nothing wrong with your present switch, remove the side stand excess play "then" see if your problem goes away.

[dduelin]

I followed the suggestions and removed the side stand play which also tightened up the switch. The washer I used was pretty thick and needed a bit of grinding down in order to be able to fit the circlip retainer. Afterwards I was not able to trigger a side stand switch 2 fault by wiggling the switch during repeated retraction/extension cycles. I'll ride it a while and recheck for the 10111 codes. Thank you everyone.

[dirtrider]

8 hours ago, dduelin said:

I followed the suggestions and removed the side stand play which also tightened up the switch. The washer I used was pretty thick and needed a bit of grinding down in order to be able to fit the circlip retainer. Afterwards I was not able to trigger a side stand switch 2 fault by wiggling the switch during repeated retraction/extension cycles. I'll ride it a while and recheck for the 10111 codes. Thank you everyone.

 

 

Morning Dave

 

Sounds good, give us a follow up update after you ride it for a while. 

[dduelin]

My only misgiving at this point is retention of the circlip retainer. After the reduction in exposed bolt length from the added washer the stud barely exposes the groove the clip fits in and as the stand "ears" or frame tab wears in the future it could pop the clip off or perhaps damage the switch. I'll probably source or make a thinner washer in order to give the switch a millimeter or two of breathing room.

[dirtrider]

23 hours ago, dduelin said:

My only misgiving at this point is retention of the circlip retainer. After the reduction in exposed bolt length from the added washer the stud barely exposes the groove the clip fits in and as the stand "ears" or frame tab wears in the future it could pop the clip off or perhaps damage the switch. I'll probably source or make a thinner washer in order to give the switch a millimeter or two of breathing room.

 

Morning Dave

 

How tight are the stand ears on the frame tab now? If you can tighten the stand to frame ear a bit more by removing more from the bushing end that will give more circlip groove protrusion. (just don't go too far & make the stand too tight)

 

I did one last summer that I just hit the back of the side stand inner ear (where added washer contacts) a few strokes with a file & that gave about another 1/2 turn in on the pivot bolt. (seemed easier at the time than trying to thin the washer out)

 

 

[dduelin]

13 hours ago, dirtrider said:

 

Morning Dave

 

How tight are the stand ears on the frame tab now? If you can tighten the stand to frame ear a bit more by removing more from the bushing end that will give more circlip groove protrusion. (just don't go too far & make the stand too tight)

 

I did one last summer that I just hit the back of the side stand inner ear a few strokes with a file & that gave about another 1/2 turn in on the pivot bolt. (seemed easier at the time than trying to thin the washer out)

 

 

Evening DR,

 

The ears are a snug slip fit now. I'm surprised how much play was removed by shortening the bushing. Virtually no play and the resistance to up and down seems just about right. I'll leave it awhile before taking it apart again.

 

 

[Rougarou]

Ok, so, the RT has had a recent spat of I can start it, flop the side stand up, put in gear and it dies.  So naturally, I assume the side stand switch is hiccuping.  Giver 'er a kick and it works.  This has been going on for a few weeks and I finally got around to searching for the "fix" and come upon this thread.

 

After reviewing the thread, I crawl down and take a look, my '06 doesn't have a bushing, so, I feel around and find the bolt is a bit loose, like finger loose, but the little clip is still holding it on until I continue to unscrew and "pop" goes the clip.  Heart drops 'cause I don't know where that little thing flew, but I musta had some luck, cause outta the corner of me eye, I spot something odd about three feet away on the opposite side of the bike and it's the clip, that crisis is averted.

 

Anyway, back to the hiccup.  I screw the bolt fully tight and notice that there is a bit of room between where the clip resides and the top part of the switch.  Maybe the slop in the sidestand and the space is causing my issue.  So, I find a little washer and get the bolt all snugged up tight again, and put the little clip on.  Give her a few ups and downs and drops heavy on the side stand and it's holding, so, I guess I'll see over the next few rides if this little trick does it.