More LED Headlights

[spacewrench]

I got a pairs of H1 and H7 LED bulbs from Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0719STVL9

These are fanless, with a chunky heat sink off the back.  I ran an H1 bulb on a battery in still, room-temperature air, and it got quite hot (but not "burn your fingers" hot).  Checking voltage and current suggested that it was drawing about 12-15W.

I installed them in my 2000 R1100S on a trial basis (I left the rubber covers off, and just duct-taped the wiring so it wouldn't snag).  The light color is much whiter than the halogens, but I'm not sure the output is anywhere close.  I used the lux sensor on my phone to check, and it showed 2000/12000 (lo/hi) for halogen, but only about 1500/4000 for the LEDs.  That may be because of the LED's narrower spectrum (?)  I rode around the neighborhood a little last night and didn't notice that the LEDs were dimmer than the halogens (if anything, the whiter color looks more useful).  I'll have a better night road test on the way home after work.

The beam pattern is slightly uneven -- the LEDs have emitters on either side of a flat PCB "paddle," rather than an incandescent filament emitting in all directions.  So you can see some slightly dimmer lines in the LED throw pattern, which change as you rotate the LED through the available range.  It's not terrible (and probably not really even noticeable if you're not illuminating a flat wall) but still not great.

One last thing: the H1 bulb's heat sink will stick out behind the rubber lid/gasket, so it will probably cool as much as it's supposed to, but the H7 bulb rests further inside the headlight housing, so the rubber lid would close everything inside.  I suspect this means I'll need a different and/or fan-cooled H7 for my bike.  Or maybe I'll try an HID bulb for the H7.

 

[wbw6cos]

Most of the headlamps designed to run halogen lighting have lenses and reflectors that direct the light in a way that was designed for that bulb..  The light beam pattern for LEDs will  be different and may or may not get better results.  YMMV.

 

Nice post.    

[AndyS]

Here we go again...

If the LED emitter is as small as, and positioned in the same place as the incandescent filament, then the results will be equal to - or better than, a halogen bulb.

However, most older designs of LED bulbs had very large emitters that dump the light in all the wrong places. That, thankfully is starting to change now as we are getting ever better LED's with greater flux densities. So, for instance, the ones I currently have fitted to my Wethead, out-perform the stock Halogens , giving more light, better cut off. But I really think the buyer needs to be aware that there is a lot of low quality LED's out there.

[wbw6cos]

14 hours ago, AndyS said:

Here we go again...

If the LED emitter is as small as, and positioned in the same place as the incandescent filament, then the results will be equal to - or better than, a halogen bulb.

However, most older designs of LED bulbs had very large emitters that dump the light in all the wrong places. That, thankfully is starting to change now as we are getting ever better LED's with greater flux densities. So, for instance, the ones I currently have fitted to my Wethead, out-perform the stock Halogens , giving more light, better cut off. But I really think the buyer needs to be aware that there is a lot of low quality LED's out there.

 

Sorry, I got that information from an article on the internet.  I was not trying to start an oil thread or something.  He mentioned that "The beam pattern is slightly uneven -- the LEDs have emitters on either side of a flat PCB "paddle," rather than an incandescent filament emitting in all directions.  So you can see some slightly dimmer lines in the LED throw pattern, which change as you rotate the LED through the available range.  It's not terrible (and probably not really even noticeable if you're not illuminating a flat wall) but still not great."   

 

He still had more observations to make and then post his results later.

 

[spacewrench]

Here's some close-up pics of the LED emitters and the corresponding halogen bulb filaments.  H1 and H7 filaments are about 0.5mm long, and maybe 0.14mm in diameter.  Both LED bulbs have 3 LEDs on each side of the paddle.  The array is about 0.625mm by 0.2mm (slightly longer and wider than the filament), and the paddle is about 0.26mm thick.  So the LEDs are close...are they close enough?  I dunno.  Note that the paddle (PCB) is thicker than the diameter of the filament, so the LED emitters must be further from the focal axis of the lens than the filament coils.  Plus the side/edge of the paddle is not emitting any light at all, so that's like 2x90º over which there's no light coming out.

 

I think the real problem is that the LEDs are only running at 12-15W.  They're certainly more efficient than halogens, but there's only so much light you can get out of 15W.  (How much?  I dunno, I'm not a physicist!)  But between the passive cooling and the inherent efficiency of turning electrical current into photons, I'm not sold on these bulbs.

 

I'd be interested to compare side-by-side with a high-end fan-cooled LED bulb, and I've got a couple of cheap HID bulbs (and cheap ballast) on order from Amazon.  Looking forward to seeing what they do.

[BrianM]

6 hours ago, spacewrench said:

 

I think the real problem is that the LEDs are only running at 12-15W.  They're certainly more efficient than halogens, but there's only so much light you can get out of 15W.  (How much?  I dunno, I'm not a physicist!)  But between the passive cooling and the inherent efficiency of turning electrical current into photons, I'm not sold on these bulbs.

 

The most light you could get out of 15W is 15W. LEDs are about 40 to 50% efficient. So 15W would be 6 to 7.5W of light. Bulb power ratings are power used, not emitted as light. Incandescent bulbs are about 10 to 20% efficient. So the incanescent range for the same output would be 30 to 75W.

 

The problem with LED replacement is putting them in housing which was not designed for LED. Placement is only part, the shape of the output also maters. Also if the LED creates a hot spot (usually what many people interpret as being brighter) it will cause your eyes to see less at the edges of the beam. "Brighter" is not always better.

 

I suggest purchasing additional lights rather than replacing the bulb with a different type.

 

BTW I am a Physicist.

[spacewrench]

Hmm, that's an interesting way to think about it: LEDs are more efficient, but if you're not running them at the same wattage, the amount of usable light may not change (ignoring for the moment the problems with beam shape and light distribution).

I put LED bulbs in my turn signals because I'm running them in always-on, running-light mode, and I think the Kisan instructions mentioned that incandescents get too hot and can damage the signal lenses.  I tried two different types of LEDs (in the same form factor).  One was substantially lower wattage (but just as bright), but the other was the same wattage and mondo bright.  That one also got hot enough that I didn't think it would help with overheating fixtures, so I'm not using it.

Anyway, it sounds like if LEDs could replicate the halogen light emission pattern, you could get 2-5x as much light out for the same power, or some combination of more light and less power.  But if the LED bulb designer uses all the available gains to reduce power rather than increase light, you're not getting the benefit you're probably looking for when you're trying new bulbs.  (Of course, lower power is a good thing too, but it doesn't help you see at night!)

[dan cata]

I think that right now, the OEM LED lights from BMW are the best there is, cost/results ratio. I am thinking about those that get installed on the LC GS/GSA and even LC Rt's

Not that expensive either... but you will also need the harness for them, so that the connector is waterproof.

 

Dan.

[AndyS]

Hi Dan, for me one of the best options (after fitting Clearwater Darla's), was converting my high and low beams to LED. My lights were SO much better. Brightness, frontal throw, hotspot position, cut off and useful width spread. All better. Can't think of one downside.

[spacewrench]

Sample video of low & high (both) beams

 

[dirtrider]

9 minutes ago, spacewrench said:

Sample video of low & high (both) beams

 

 

Evening Spacewrench

 

Those things have a serious hot spot, what brand are they?

[spacewrench]

They're the Beamtech lights listed in the first post in this thread.  I have 1x H1 and 1xH7 that I'll sell to anybody who wants to try them, $38.  (Actually, I was going to return both H7s because the bulb position & size leaves the heatsink completely inside the headlight housing, so I don't think it'll cool adequately.  But if somebody wants one of each, I'll split 'em up and keep one H7; I think my Futura takes those too, so maybe it'll work better on that.)

 

I'm not sure this video is all that accurate: it's in a sort of dark parking garage, against a dark brown brick wall, and the camera has auto gain control.

 

The thing that bothers me about the high beam is the X-shaped streaks of light going out from the center -- I suspect they're pretty glare-y to other drivers.  You can sort of see the streaks when I rock the bike back & forth a bit.

[AndyS]

8 hours ago, spacewrench said:

The thing that bothers me about the high beam is the X-shaped streaks of light going out from the center -- I suspect they're pretty glare-y to other drivers.  You can sort of see the streaks when I rock the bike back & forth a bit.

 

 

You won't be blinding drivers with the high beams because they should ONLY be on when there are no other vehicles in front of you!