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Indy Dave

How to improve when you're having a off day

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Indy Dave

If you're like me, and I know I am, you've had some days where things are just a bit off. Sometimes it's bad enough that you just head home, other times things are just off a bit and other times you're away from home so you don't have a lot of options.

 

What do you do when you find things are not quite clicking the way they should? Do you have a mental list that you run through and work on?

 

Here's a clip from a recent trip. Day 5 on the road with a loaded bike. A previous clip I posted in Ride Tales is from earlier in the day and I felt things were off there too. But there I thought I identified reasons for that and I think I worked it out and got better towards the end. That clip is here:

 

What I do when I decide I want to wick it up some, is to pick it up in increments. I'll twist it up some and see if I can find a rhythm. If I do, and I'm in the mood, I'll twist it up some more and so forth. In this case, I never got past the first step.

 

What do you see and what do you do? There is particularly one glaring trend I note in the clip.

 

Oh yea, I hate it when the sena won't work the audio - I had to fish out my phone to start the Ride Mix.

 

A section of Greyback Rd north of Happy Camp, CA - the beginning of the highlighted section in the linked map.

 

What Say You?

 

https://goo.gl/maps/R5a2NRFvJ8F2

 

struggling to put the pieces together

Edited by Indy Dave

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lkraus

When things don't click, it's nearly always because I'm distracted. Relationships, work, weather, life, lunch, tight undies, whatever. So, I turn off the tunes, look for potential problems with traffic, focus on the basics, smooth throttle-brake-shift, line selection, posture. There's a lot to actively think about, so it tends to drive out distracting thoughts. I keep the speed down to allow more processing time while I concentrate on doing things right, rather than being fast. If things don't start to improve, I'll sometimes pull off, take off the helmet and gloves, stretch, walk around a bit, have a little water from my bag, breathe, and then start out again. If I still feel uncoordinated, it's time to call it a day. If I am beginning to feel the groove, the speed will come on its own, with less effort. Actually, the speed sneaks up on me. :yes:

 

If I'm having trouble on multiple rides, it's time to "hit the books" for a review. "The Pace" and The Pace 2.0 are good goal summaries to refresh brain cells that have been off the bike for awhile, or spending too much time in city traffic.

 

I skipped back and forth through the "Silver Bastard", didn't see much that was really "off". Saw a few course corrections in the curves, maybe you were avoiding something in the road? Otherwise, maybe gripping the bars too tight or perhaps leaning on them? (Review Master Yoda.) It looked like you were picking good, smooth "outside 'til I see the exit" lines.

 

I kinda freaked on the first minute of "struggling". Bumpy, curving road with cracks, patches, some shallow car ruts and subsidence and you are riding no-handed to screw with your phone and gloves?!

:jaw: Distracted, maybe?

I only went through this video once, but my impression was that you were not concentrating on riding. Some turn-in points seemed seemed a little late and more abrupt than the curve warranted, like it was a surprise. Trying to guess your body position from the camera-windshield relationship, it seemed that sometimes you leaned into the curve and sometimes you counter-leaned and sometimes you stayed centered. It's hard to "click" without consistency. Or maybe I'm mis-interpreting what I'm seeing.

 

I'll twist it up some and see if I can find a rhythm.

 

Try finding the rhythm first, then the speed will develop on it's own to match the road and conditions. Trying to "click" when you are not feeling it just means the mistakes come closer together with worse consequences.

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Francois_Dumas

When things 'don't feel right, I tend to 'twist it down' to allow for that extra split second that I am distracted by thinking on WHAT I am doing wrong. Analysis too takes its own bit off the normal riding concentration. So does getting older I'm afraid, so I need to allow for that too.

Also, if I cannot get in to it and cannot stop or return home, I may reroute my ride and opt for straight/less technical roads to just get for my destination and be done with it quicker.

 

Just my .02 cents :dopeslap:

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Chris K

When I am unable to find a good rhythm I slow sown and then start concentrating on the basics.

 

1) Am I riding with the balls of my on the pegs and bending at the hips (MYRP)

2) Brake earlier, slow in fast out

3) Concentrate on picking a turn in point for each corner

4) Pay attention to the vanishing point after the apex as a reference to start back on the gas

5) Exaggerate the Ride Smart body position at these slower speeds in the corners

 

Basically I am forcing myself to pay attention to the fundamentals and usually before I realize it I am back in a good riding rhythm without the increased speed feeling forced.

 

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Indy Dave

Great, great input and thank you for taking the time to share! I appreciate all of this more than you know!

 

I'm a bit of a walking riding contradiction. Until meeting up with the great folks here, I had no idea how sheltered my riding had been, as my self-taught riding style served me well here in Indiana. By that I mean I generally steered the bike with my lower body. I KNOW!?! :dopeslap: Counter steering came only when I needed to avoid an object in the road. It's not that I hadn't read Hough's books, I did! I only thought i was counter steering. A year or so ago at Maggie Valley, a very skilled rider watched me from behind and once in some technical stuff waved me over. He asked me a lot of questions, both for information for his feedback and I believe also trying to let me realize some things by considering my answers. He was very astute and solid in where I was going wrong. Never judgemental or downgrading. The result, my riding life changed as I continued to work out his advice in my head and on the road. Oh, make no mistake. I rode much WORSE for a good part of the rest of the ride. I had to unlearn all of my years of riding.

 

On the Silver Bastard Clip, as Chris mentions, "Brake earlier, slow in fast out" This was one of the two issues I felt contributed to me feeling sloppy. I was studying the rider ahead of me and would have to restrain my throttle input so I didn't close up through the corner. It took me a while to figure out I felt his entry speed was a touch hot (he was trying out late in for the first time) and I felt it left him fewer correction choices mid and late corner, and therefore, me too. The other thing was in looking through the rider ahead and into the corner, I noted the lean angle at times and this led me to believe the curve was tighter than it was. I felt I sorted this out as the clip moves forward and reduced my following distance.

 

If find if the roads I've been on are not challenging or at a leisurely pace, I can fall back into lower body steering :dontknow:. So that's the first thing I check. A couple of things I notice in the second clip:

 

Lack of consistent body positioning (Ridesmart).

Drifting to the inside before left hand curves or turning in early - this seemed glaring to me.

 

A couple of you mentioned light on the bars, probably this, too. That's one of the last items on my check-list. Typically, when turning up the wick and I get to a speed quicker than I'm going here, I go all in on MYRP and pretty much without fail, everything clicks. Perhaps I need to employ that sooner, it just seems like overkill at times?

 

And yes the road had some significant bumps and imperfections to be sure. At the time, I'd noted that and was on the lookout, but I don't remember at the time feeling they were the root cause of being sloppy. However, going back to Larry's comment - I wonder if this led me to studying the road directly in front of me and not looking far enough ahead. Might be something there.

 

All of this led up to what I consider to be my biggest moment at speed in a long, long time. Looking at it now, it doesn't seem so bad. But I puckered big time and my heart was pounding. Maybe it's the steep drop off, because again, it doesn't look so bad on tape. I saw the gravel pieces on the inside lane, and focused on them and then back to the curve and felt caught out and aborted. Gravel on the inside when the gravel source is on the outside concerned me, but I should be been looking through my section of road.

 

This very short clip also shows the great view and the incline of the road to the top.

 

Aborting a curve

 

This is good stuff, I welcome any and all input!

 

In the coming weeks, I'm going to post a clip from where I felt things were clicking right on beat. Now watch that will be bad too!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Indy Dave

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Bernie

 

Aborting the curve

 

I fully agree with all the advice given by the others.

You may have gotten distracted by the view and you thought the curve is tighter than it was.

It's all a vision problem in my opinion. Between not being able to see further ahead because of the dense growth of trees and tall grass and the constant turning of the road.

You may have to start using the lines more to assist you with the tightness and direction of the pavement. If the outside line and the center line meet, the curve is tightening and if the two lines stay separate or separate further the curve is opening up.

Quote from Ken Condon/Street Savvy August,22 2015:

"Smooth Cornering Clues:

The trick for determining the likely radius of a corner is knowing what to look for. Treetops, power lines, and guardrails are clues you can use to determine general direction, but they don’t always mirror the precise curve of the road. A more reliable way of determining where the road is headed is to identify the visual vanishing point of the painted centerline and fog lines as they recede into the distance. If these parallel lines converge in the near distance, expect the corner radius to tighten up. If the lines meet farther down the road, expect the radius to increase and the turn to become easier. Use the pavement edges as reference points if there are no painted lines."

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Lone_RT_rider
5) Exaggerate the Ride Smart body position at these slower speeds in the corners

 

You still remember how to do this? I thought you lost this skill base when you got a GS? :rofl::stir:

 

*he ducks*

 

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Bill_Walker

Vision, vision, vision. If I'm having an off day, it seems that most of the time it turns out it's because I'm not looking where I should be. You've got to look where you want to go, and not where you don't want to go, and you've got to look through the corner, not down at the pavement close to you. And looking through the corner sometimes means looking where you believe a blind corner goes based on the visual clues you've got or your prior knowledge of the road you're on (though I've been know to get a clue on an unfamiliar road by a quick glance at my GPS in between turns).

 

Other issues: stiff arms. Flap your arms like a chicken to make sure they're loose. Failing to weight the inside peg.

 

The absolute best thing you can do, IMHO, is get yourself to a class with Keith Code's California Superbike School. They're mostly at western and eastern tracks, but last May they did classes at the National Corvette Museum in KY and at Barber in AL. I did a 2-day camp at Willow Springs in CA, learned a tremendous amount and had a ball. Not cheap, but neither is crashing because you're outriding your skill set (which I'm not saying you are, not having watched the video).

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Indy Dave

Aborting the curve

 

I fully agree with all the advice given by the others.

You may have gotten distracted by the view and you thought the curve is tighter than it was.

It's all a vision problem in my opinion.

 

Looking at the slow-mo part on the TV (vs my small PC monitor), I think vision is the number one answer and poor bike positioning in this case, also prominently contributing. .

 

The Slow-Mo highlights the left creep I mentioned earlier. What am I doing there?!? The limited sight lines combine with poor bike positioning and a very average corner suddenly had me spooked and puckering. Not being able to see the exit and already positioned to the inside - Bernie is correct - I DID think the curve was tighter than it was - and I opted to scrub speed. There's really nothing much challenging about the curve at all - and you can see my reaction happens just a split second before the curve exit become clear. But self preservation had kicked in.

 

With the road surface a bit unpredictable, I think I was focusing on the road in front of the bike, and not down the road like one should. Doesn't explain the left creep I was having through this section.

 

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Lester V
When I am unable to find a good rhythm I slow sown and then start concentrating on the basics.

 

1) Am I riding with the balls of my on the pegs and bending at the hips (MYRP)

2) Brake earlier, slow in fast out

3) Concentrate on picking a turn in point for each corner

4) Pay attention to the vanishing point after the apex as a reference to start back on the gas

5) Exaggerate the Ride Smart body position at these slower speeds in the corners

 

Basically I am forcing myself to pay attention to the fundamentals and usually before I realize it I am back in a good riding rhythm without the increased speed feeling forced.

 

Thanks Chris, you put into words what I think I try to do.

#6 on your list might be - try to stay center of the lane (or even closer to the outside) in a right hand corner as a car could be over the line coming your way. This positioning gives the rider some wiggle room.

.0025 canuck

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Bill_Walker
...you can see my reaction happens just a split second before the curve exit become clear. But self preservation had kicked in.

 

Read Keith Code's "Twist of the Wrist" about survival reactions, and how they're usually not our friends. It's hard to learn to fight them.

 

Edited by Bill_Walker

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Twisties

First of all, unauthorized advertising of our private backyard roads is not permitted! LOL Second of all, wish you had called. The Brookings is crew is always up for Happy Camp and Graysback.

 

It's hard for me to answer what do I see, but I think in many of the turns your upper body is not leaning into the turns much and I don't think you are really looking through the turns. The early part of the clip when you are fussing with your gear is not something I would ever do while in motion. That road has mostly nice surface, but like all roads in this area, some serious discontinuities... we call them slides. It can have gravel. I guess the snow is gone by now.

 

Yes, I have had some off days and it's rough when you are out on the road. I try to take a lot of breaks, stay hydrated and maintain focus. I'll run myself through the basics of:

 

Line: late apex

Slow, Look, Press, Roll

Light on the bars,

Kiss the mirrors.

Balls of toes on pegs,

butt back,

elbows loose

Really look through the turn.

 

Sometimes nothing works. Once I made Sharon stop after lunch and we got a hotel. Once I dropped my Super Tenere in a parking lot on a day like that. I shouldn't have been on a bike that day.

 

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Twisties

I am concerned by what you say about the other rider throwing you off. Drop back and catch up, or pass, but always ride your ride.

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Indy Dave

Thanks one and all for your valued input. I think we've identified the underlying issue I was having and I really appreciate those of you who in all humility acknowledge that you have these days too, and what your routine is to try to get things right. Will you indulge me while I make a few observations?

 

1. Every single ride is unique - even your favorite road that you ride every day. It's never the same. Never. The road may generally be the same, but the many various inputs we employ along with our varying body and bike position are never the same. I've done some track time in cars ranging from Formula Renault's in France to Formula Fords in the US and in my aging 80's vintage 5 series. Not to mention my favorite roads for the car or bike. I have never been able to duplicate a single lap or stretch of favorite road, no matter how many times I've done it. And for me, that goes the same for any given corner. Always searching for improvement and perfection and something is always different. More so on a bike.

 

2. Can we also acknowledge that group riding is by definition, a compromise? For me, there are one or two guys that I ride with from time to time that are 'ideal' riding partners. That mostly means we ride at the same pace. And even then, we may approach a series of curves or whatever differently. One is always looking trough the person ahead in relation and conjunction with looking down the road. Their presence and their dynamic movement in relation to our other visual considerations is one of the many inputs our mind uses to determine all of the actions we employ while riding. And while these inputs are constantly changing, there is also a sort of predictable order to things one could say, so that factoring in the next few seconds isn't as complicated as having to recompute every little detail change over the last 15 yards. Obviously, there are exceptions.

 

When I'm riding with my ideal partner, we have enough miles that not only would I follow him anywhere, I know I don't have to study his lines to 'figure out' how he rides. This has been done and settled. No doubt I take my own lines and they do not always match his, but our techniques are quite similar. I guess what I'm saying is that because I know him well and how he rides, I put less focus on him and his bike position and study the road more. That's the opposite of what one might think - that I'd just follow him.

 

Conversely, when I'm riding with someone who I ride with seldom (once a year or less in this case) and who seldom ever leads, I'm watching them closely and put more emphasis on their riding as I look down the road and make my mental calculations. Even more so in this case, as he was trying to delay apex for the first time and I wanted to capture him on video to share with him. If you watched "Chasing the silver Bastard", my riding wasn't terrible and was competent, and so was his. But it left me wanting. So like we've discussed, while I'm riding, I'm trying to analyze what is different and why. The primary reason I was a little off is that I couldn't accelerate through the corner like I needed to to counter my desired lean angle without crowding the rider ahead. Wanting to have him on video, I made some adjustments and if you watch closely, I dropped back a touch a couple of times, but still wanting to keep him in camera view. So I made some adjustments to my preferred style to suit the situation. But isn't that what we as riders do constantly? Which circles back nicely around to the question I was originally asking.

 

3. The RIDE WELL section here seems like it's been on life support for a couple of years or more. I mourn this. I have learned so much over the years through this section. I've even contacted a few members who posted something that 'turned on the light' for me to personally thank them for their input. So, just as I have benefited in the past from this section (and hope to in the future), I wanted to start a thread about RIDING BETTER and addressing something humble folks can admit they deal with too. While I spend a lot of time laughing at myself (there's a lot of material!) - that's why I can show me addressing a minor equipment issue on a distant road with zero traffic - because I can also put others comments in the proper context. But not everyone can.

 

And that's why in many of my videos, I include real world happenings like shown here in the first 20 secs:

 

 

No doubt someone will say they would never stop on the side of the road and take a picture. Well, good. And that helps how? According to a book I'm reading "Idiot Brain" (Fitting title, I know - that's why I bought it!), our brains are egotistical. "Your memory often tweaks and adjusts the information it stores to make you look better."

 

When I posted my original question, I sent the link to several riders who are not in our community, knowing I was asking a question we all ask at times, and hoping they would click over and gain from the wonderful collective knowledge this board offers. Thank you again for your valued and humble input!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Indy Dave

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tallman

Bernie,

Your description reminds me of a post here, long ago, in a board far far away.

It was replete with pictures and captions about "reading" the road

using trees, power lines, road paint lines, and more.

Probably '03-'05 vintage.

 

If you're thinking about doing it before doing it you aren't doing it.

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Jake

I chalk it up to "Not a good day for this" and respond accordingly.

 

Perhaps there is a physiological reason for not feeling it on a particular day. It could be lack of deep sleep, dehydration, or failure to wear my tin hat. I have those days when I pick up the guitar, the tennis racquet, or straddle the moto thinking that today isn't going to be one of those great days. When I'm not on, I get off. If you are far from home, you're screwed!

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R65_Steve

I can't seem to open the videos where you're concerned...only the following the silver bike and the Beartooth Pass vid. (are the links broken?)

 

I am a track driving (car) instructor and I find it hard (not impossible) to assess from a video a bad line. I have FAR less experience on a bike so I'm curious to review this as I am looking to improve my riding.

 

I did see you mention group rides. It's tough, you have to ride you own ride. Just as I instruct in the car, follow YOUR line. Of course that's a closed circuit and this is an hour long trip through unfamiliar territory so I guess you need to take some cues from the guy in front. Still, I did a ride with an old friend the other day. We swapped lead/follow. I have no idea what he's looking at or concerned with, but I'm constantly considering the upcoming intersections, where deer might pop out, etc. etc. He actually mentioned that he'd honk if I was too fast for him, but when he led, it seemed that HE was faster/more aggressive.

 

Anyhow, are the links broken?

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Francois_Dumas

Here's one more thought to add to this wonderful discussion (thanks Dave!)…. because maybe even more dangerous or worrying than not having a good day, is when not having a good day and NOT BEING AWARE OF IT !

 

Like I had 2 years ago in Colorado..... I did an analyses afterwards, like Dave is doing in this thread. Had I KNOWN I was not having a good day, I would have taken some of the actions discussed above. But I just didn't realize things were going south.

So sometimes we need to be even more aware of our situation and act accordingly.

 

Alas, experience shows that it just isn't always possible :-(

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Indy Dave
I chalk it up to "Not a good day for this" and respond accordingly.

 

Perhaps there is a physiological reason for not feeling it on a particular day. It could be lack of deep sleep, dehydration, or failure to wear my tin hat. I have those days when I pick up the guitar, the tennis racquet, or straddle the moto thinking that today isn't going to be one of those great days. When I'm not on, I get off. If you are far from home, you're screwed!

 

Those are helpful observations and I'd never thought about the same thing happening in others areas of activity. Also didn't know you played tennis. I think that makes it love-40.

 

 

I can't seem to open the videos ... are the links broken?

 

In a word, YES. I felt they were more of a distraction to the "How to improve when..." question. That being said, I will probably do a screen grab or two and post those, because I think others can learn from my mistake(s). I'm confident we've zeroed in on the culprit - not looking down the road/vision. I'll get more into that and the other significant factor in a later post.

 

 

Here's one more thought to add to this wonderful discussion (thanks Dave!)…. because maybe even more dangerous or worrying than not having a good day, is when not having a good day and NOT BEING AWARE OF IT !

 

Like I had 2 years ago in Colorado..... I did an analyses afterwards, like Dave is doing in this thread. Had I KNOWN I was not having a good day, I would have taken some of the actions discussed above. But I just didn't realize things were going south.

So sometimes we need to be even more aware of our situation and act accordingly.

 

Alas, experience shows that it just isn't always possible :-(

 

Francois - Actually, if memory serves, I think our situations were fairly (if not strikingly) similar. We're traveling right now, but I plan to revisit this notion when we get back home, if not before.

Edited by Indy Dave

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Francois_Dumas

 

Francois - Actually, if memory serves, I think our situations were fairly (if not strikingly) similar. We're traveling right now, but I plan to revisit this notion when we get back home, if not before.

 

At least you didn't crash !!

:grin:

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Bill_Walker
And that's why in many of my videos, I include real world happenings like shown here in the first 20 secs:

 

 

So, how long did it take you to figure out you'd forgotten to put your glove back on? And was it before or after it blew off the tank bag? And in hindsight, it's easy to think that stalling the bike ought to have led you to ask yourself "What's different here?", but that seldom happens in the heat of the moment.

 

Because I don't need them for distance vision, I've forgotten to put my glasses back on a few times after putting on my helmet (although it's been a few years). Luckily, I always hang them in a relatively secure place on the bike, so I've never lost them.

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lkraus
So, how long did it take you to figure out you'd forgotten to put your glove back on? And was it before or after it blew off the tank bag? And in hindsight, it's easy to think that stalling the bike ought to have led you to ask yourself "What's different here?", but that seldom happens in the heat of the moment.

 

I experimented with using my phone as a GPS, but it did not respond consistently to gloves and I was stopping frequently to adjust the settings. My understanding of the app was still poor, so I ended up riding in ten mile loop, which proved to be fortunate. About the time things started looking familiar, I came upon a glove in the middle of the lane, and thought "Someone lost a motorcycle glove, it looks a lot like mine. Oh....wait." The other glove was still on the tank near the speaker.

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Francois_Dumas
So, how long did it take you to figure out you'd forgotten to put your glove back on? And was it before or after it blew off the tank bag? And in hindsight, it's easy to think that stalling the bike ought to have led you to ask yourself "What's different here?", but that seldom happens in the heat of the moment.

 

I experimented with using my phone as a GPS, but it did not respond consistently to gloves and I was stopping frequently to adjust the settings. My understanding of the app was still poor, so I ended up riding in ten mile loop, which proved to be fortunate. About the time things started looking familiar, I came upon a glove in the middle of the lane, and thought "Someone lost a motorcycle glove, it looks a lot like mine. Oh....wait." The other glove was still on the tank near the speaker.

 

 

:rofl: :rofl:

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Indy Dave
And that's why in many of my videos, I include real world happenings like shown here in the first 20 secs:

 

 

So, how long did it take you to figure out you'd forgotten to put your glove back on? And was it before or after it blew off the tank bag? And in hindsight, it's easy to think that stalling the bike ought to have led you to ask yourself "What's different here?", but that seldom happens in the heat of the moment.

 

Because I don't need them for distance vision, I've forgotten to put my glasses back on a few times after putting on my helmet (although it's been a few years). Luckily, I always hang them in a relatively secure place on the bike, so I've never lost them.

 

I guess its a good thing I didn't include the footage of my daily routine of putting in my contacts each morning as I ride to work.

 

Good questions, Bill.

 

1. I generally try to be all set when the kick stand goes up. We had stopped for lunch, and about 5 miles into the ride, I tried to activate music with my Sena. But as happens at times, it wasn't playing well with my phone. So what happened was, I removed my glove, which sticks wonderfully on my RKA tank bag and fished out my phone and activated the music player. And I did all of that on the lonely road with the help of reduced speed and cruise. The clip you saw does not show the entire sequence, and I should have left it out as it's been quite the shiny object distraction.

 

2. The stalling of the fully loaded bike on a inclining road was fully 10 days after the day I felt I was having an off day.

 

BTW, on my videos in the description (along with the music credits), I try to include a google maps link to show the road and area. [and the dates]

 

Does anybody read that stuff? ;)

 

Maybe they should? :old:

Edited by Indy Dave

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Bud
I am concerned by what you say about the other rider throwing you off. Drop back and catch up, or pass, but always ride your ride.

 

I still remember the time I tried to stay with a more experienced rider and realized that I needed to wick it down a couple of clicks. I wasn't skilled enough to keep up. Plain and simple. Hard to do. What startled me was the voice in my helmet (mine) screaming "Lean, Lean, Lean" as I was watching the wood post/steel guard rail rather than where I wanted to go. :dopeslap:

Edited by Bud

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sardineone

I have lots of experience riding with some awesome riders. Not a bad place to be just like learning tennis from a better player, but I always stay in my comfort zone. Bad days staying in ones' comfort zone will be the best option even if it seems well off your best days when you feel in your zone. In most company I think I wouldn't be considered a slow rider, but I have let a faster rider by on a 650 single BMW on my 1200ST. His comfort zone was higher than mine on that road that day. We both got to enjoy the road that day without any mishaps! :clap:

 

PS. Awesome video of Beartooth Pass Dave!

Edited by sardineone

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Green RT

2. Can we also acknowledge that group riding is by definition, a compromise?

I haven't spent much time riding in groups, maybe three group rides in 60 years of motorcycling. And maybe another three trips where there was one other bike with me. I find the distraction of even one other rider detracts from both my safety and my enjoyment of riding. And riding with a group multiplies the danger and distraction immensely. Given how frequently I see groups of riders versus lone riders, I suspect my opinion is not a common one.

Edited by Green RT

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