Beemers too loud for Canada

[Bud]

http://wwwapps.tc.gc.ca/Saf-Sec-Sur/7/VRDB-BDRV/search-recherche/detail.aspx?lang=eng&rn=2017082

[Bob H.]

Edited for political content.

 

--Admin Team

[Marty Hill]

It's their law. Really none of our business. I would assume that they don't think were perfect either. I've enjoyed riding in Canada from the atlantic to the pacific.

[tallman]

Good for them, and the environment.

 

We were sleeping w/windows open last night when some ssahole riding what sounded like a 2 stroke at about 14k decided that he'd do his thing, for a long time.

Lucky for him, Beth persuaded me not to...

 

This 2 nights after some sashole on a HD w/aftermarket pipes decided that midnight was the time to ride through the neighborhood, and his name isn't Paul Revere.

 

This 2 days after some young squids decide the hill around the corner w/curve was meant for racing, again, and again, w/exhaust that could wake the dead.

 

I for one am f'ing tired of it.

They give riders, all of us, a bad name which carries over into how drivers interact w/motorcycles.

Write 'em up, every time, all bikes, all the time.

Flame away.

Edited February 21, 2017 by tallman

[Bud]

I'm a big fan of Canada. We have spent a lot of time on the waters of the North Channel. Last spring went to Desolation Sound. Took our grandkids to Vancouver sight seeing. I've ridden to Nova Scotia.

 

Except for one jerk, I've been impressed by the friendliness of Canadians. They sure enjoyed ribbing me about our upcoming elections last year and threatened to build a wall to keep us out.

 

And I stand with Tim about loud motorcycles. Nothing says "Look at me, look at me" more than loud pipes.

[Bud]

 

We have sound emission standards in the US as well. Doesn't seem different to me.

[Green RT]

Good for them, and the environment.

 

We were sleeping w/windows open last night when some ssahole riding what sounded like a 2 stroke at about 14k decided that he'd do his thing, for a long time.

Lucky for him, Beth persuaded me not to...

 

This 2 nights after some sashole on a HD w/aftermarket pipes decided that midnight was the time to ride through the neighborhood, and his name isn't Paul Revere.

 

This 2 days after some young squids decide the hill around the corner w/curve was meant for racing, again, and again, w/exhaust that could wake the dead.

 

I for one am f'ing tired of it.

They give riders, all of us, a bad name which carries over into how drivers interact w/motorcycles.

Write 'em up, every time, all bikes, all the time.

Flame away.

 

+1

 

I think of my bike as fairly quiet. But I pulled up to a friend's house a couple of days ago, and he came out before I got off the bike and rang the door bell. So he could obviously tell it from the cars driving by. No noise is good noise.

[tallman]

I've ridden sweep/look out for LD bicycle races.

On my oilhead RSL, they were almost always surprised, almost startled when I would swoop upon a group.

 

Sound is one thing, I love the sound of most stock motorcycles, including HD's. Excessive sound is noise is noise is noise...

Who determines?

Like the Supremes said about pornography, "I know it when I hear it."

[John in VA]

http://wwwapps.tc.gc.ca/Saf-Sec-Sur/7/VRDB-BDRV/search-recherche/detail.aspx?lang=eng&rn=2017082

 

The incorrect silencer was installed at the factory that didn't meet Canada noise specs and are ordered replaced. Seems sensible to me, good for them. Vehicle noise should be regulated. Hearing loss is a health hazard.

[temesvar]

 

But talking about loud bikes: has anybody heard of a cop

stopping a loud car/bike and ticket it for it? No? to bad,

they should!

We should respect the neighbor that worked night shift and

is trying to sleep, not to be awaken by your stupid, senseless

noisy bike!The sick people, the children, the baby that is

frightened by a HD without silencers! Nobody has to put up

with unnecessary noise pollution!!Lets be civilized!

Is not so hard, and we will all respect each other!

 

[EffBee]

We've had to edit several posts because of political comments or quotes of previous posts with political comments. None of these are dangerously offensive, but the fact is that we strive to keep this place about BMW's and about Sport Touring. So we wrote the Rules and Guidelines to help keep this place free of those contentious topics. There are hundreds of other places for political comments and discussions.

 

Everyone's help in keeping BMWST.com free from fractious socioeconomic issues is appreciated.

[Mike]

Does anyone else wonder about the "wrong silencer installed" language? I wonder--just a little--if BMW was possibly trying to skirt the law and got caught.

[dirtrider]

Does anyone else wonder about the "wrong silencer installed" language? I wonder--just a little--if BMW was possibly trying to skirt the law and got caught.

 

Morning Mike

 

The BMW bikes covered by the recall all offer a reduced-noise muffler system for certain countries.

 

The incorrect muffler install could have simply been that the correct compliant mufflers were either not available at time of manufacture, or were not completely certified for that country yet. (muffler needs to have correct certification to be legal)

 

Could be that BMW didn't want to hold up production/shipping/importation due to no compliant mufflers being available at time of build so opted to ship with worldwide mufflers then replace when the correct parts became available (I have seen this happen in the auto industry)-- it is only 122 units involved.

[Oldironken]

I will confess that from time to time in the late 70's i would remove the "baffle" from the 4 to 1 Kerker header on my GS 750 and ride it loud late at night with my helmet off while wearing blue jeans, tennis shoes, and a t-shirt. My apologies to the resident of Brunswick, Ohio. I have since repented of noise and hate loud pipes.

[realshelby]

I wonder if I could get a "Canada" spec muffler? Probably too expensive. I have written before that I think my 2014 RT is a bit loud at cruise. I would like it quieter. That is where I would think the exhaust valve would make a lot of difference, bit more noise at WFO and a bit more flow. But more sedate at other throttle openings. Maybe mine is staying open....

[John Ranalletta]

Had biz in Lake Geneva, WI on Monday. Arrived Sunday. Weather was great and had time for a walk along the frozen shore.

 

Completely unenjoyable due to HDs with aftermarket pipes cruising the main streets, revving engines to impress their simpleton brethren & girl friends.

 

If I were mayor of LG, I'd proffer an ordinance banning bikes equipped with aftermarket mufflers and station inspectors at city limits.

 

Many years ago, we were riding around Newburgh, NY and were stopped at a road block. The LEO checked out the muffler on '97 RT we were riding and let us pass.

 

The message would get out pretty quickly I think.

Edited February 22, 2017 by John Ranalletta

[Chris K]

Does anyone else wonder about the "wrong silencer installed" language? I wonder--just a little--if BMW was possibly trying to skirt the law and got caught.

 

I don't think this was the case as only 122 units are involved. Probably just a mistake at the factory.

[RPG]

I always enjoy it when riding around my neighborhood on my RT or R90s as people are out walking with their kids.

 

The kids instinctively cover their ears as I approach.

 

As Tallman says, we've been given a bad name. Punishment by association so to speak.

 

Driving to work this morning, an older gentleman on a Heritage Softail was next to me for awhile and his bike was so, so quiet. Nice surprise and I wanted to thank him.

 

A lot of sayings come to mind.

 

A quiet machine is a testament to complete engineering.

 

The Louder the Pipes, the smaller the organ.

 

RPG

 

 

[dirtrider]

I wonder if I could get a "Canada" spec muffler? Probably too expensive. I have written before that I think my 2014 RT is a bit loud at cruise. I would like it quieter. That is where I would think the exhaust valve would make a lot of difference, bit more noise at WFO and a bit more flow. But more sedate at other throttle openings. Maybe mine is staying open....

 

Morning Terry

 

The Canadian muffler might not be any quieter at cruise & might even be louder in certain RPM ranges. We don't know why the Canadian specs are different (if they even are). I might just have to do with compliance testing/ muffler badging, or that the Canadian requirements are tested from a different side of bike, or at a different range of RPM's, or different angle, or different distance from the muffler outlet.

[gordiet]

I enjoy the noise level of my 2015 RT. It's just right 💥

 

GT

[mickeym3]

Before retiring I'd catch the 5:50 AM ferry out of Kingston WA heading to Edmonds (Wade will know the culprit I'm referring to) and would invariably get behind a straight pipes HD who would blap/blap/blap his way through the peaceful Edmonds community at 6:20 AM. It was always hard to (legally) get around him for a few miles and every morning I grimaced at what I'm sure were curses hurled from sleepy beds at ALL the inconsiderate motorcycle riders off the ferry. It is amazing how motorcyclists are frequently painted with the same brush so I always show extra courtesies to cagers, hoping to defeat whatever ill stereotype may reside there.

[rxcrider]

I will confess that from time to time in the late 70's i would remove the "baffle" from the 4 to 1 Kerker header on my GS 750 and ride it loud late at night with my helmet off while wearing blue jeans, tennis shoes, and a t-shirt. My apologies to the resident of Brunswick, Ohio. I have since repented of noise and hate loud pipes.

 

Being below the age of 10 at that time, I'm sure I didn't mind. My mom on the other hand... I think she was most annoyed by Clay from across the street on his Suzuki dirt bike.

[Dave_in_TX]

I wonder if I could get a "Canada" spec muffler? Probably too expensive. I have written before that I think my 2014 RT is a bit loud at cruise. I would like it quieter. That is where I would think the exhaust valve would make a lot of difference, bit more noise at WFO and a bit more flow. But more sedate at other throttle openings. Maybe mine is staying open....

 

+1. I feel the same way about my 2014 R1200GS.

[Rougarou]

Hmmm, I generally leave for work between 0500-0545 depending on how I feel and also, depending on the bike, it could be a quiet morning (RT), a bit louder morning (HP4) or cobra pipe loud (shadow). Warmer weather brings the HP4 three out of five days of the week to work. Yes it revs, yes it revs loud and yes, I ride it like its stolen. Inconsiderate,....meh, loudness is subjective,...some of the local rednecks run straight pipes from their big blocks.

[Bud]

Loud isn't subjective. Inconsiderate is the correct term indeed.

 

The fact that others run straight pipes doesn't make any difference.

[Rougarou]

Loud isn't subjective. Inconsiderate is the correct term indeed.

 

The fact that others run straight pipes doesn't make any difference.

 

Sorry, but it is,...it may be loud to you, but not to the person next to you, it may be loud to me, but not to you,....isn't that by definition "subjective"? No matter what the decibel meter reads a person's tolerance and acceptance of the noise level makes it a subjective thing.

 

 

[Bud]

Only if you believe "Loud Pipes Save Lives"

[Rougarou]

Only if you believe "Loud Pipes Save Lives"

 

I don't follow that mantra.

[TEWKS]

Only if you believe "Loud Pipes Save Lives"

 

I don't follow that mantra.

 

Loud Guns Save Nuns?

 

Pat

[Rougarou]

Only if you believe "Loud Pipes Save Lives"

 

I don't follow that mantra.

 

Loud Guns Save Nuns?

 

Pat

 

Now that is true

[TEWKS]

 

Pat

[Rougarou]

 

Pat

 

Come by my place on a weekend and you'd swear you were in Fallujah sometimes. All around rifles, pistols and some questionable "rapid fire" weapons going off. Man I love living in the boonies!!!!

[TEWKS]

Believe it or not, (Massachusetts) sounds like a blast to me! I guess pun was intended!

 

Pat

[taylor1]

I put an after market muffler on my RT [Laser] over ten years ago. It does have a different sound than stock ,which I like, but in my opinion is not load or obnoxious. Over time I have asked at least fifty people and fellow riders what they thought. I can honestly say that only one person told me it could be toned down. Very subjective indeed

[Bud]

While any persons definition of "loud" may be subjective, sound is not. It is easily measurable using proven scientific methods. In our society, the decision has been made that sound from a vehicle is subject to regulation. There are standards for motor vehicles. One can disagree about the regulations and can lobby their representatives to get it changes, it is what it is.

 

 

 

 

[tallman]

While any persons definition of "loud" may be subjective, sound is not. It is easily measurable using proven scientific methods. In our society, the decision has been made that sound from a vehicle is subject to regulation. There are standards for motor vehicles. One can disagree about the regulations and can lobby their representatives to get it changes, it is what it is.

 

Yes.

 

No matter how much rationalization one eats for breakfast, NO, it is not subjective.

In most cases it IS illegal.

Either due to the actual modification not being street legal, legal at all, or for violation of a noise ordinance.

 

Funny how it is OK if it is me and what I want to do...

Anyone who truly believed this crap would silence their muffler almost to zero,

then add a big amplifier to helmet speakers and blast away, so they they,

and only they, could truly enjoy "the subjective" sound.

 

Just like riders who jeopardize others safety on public roads, it is an expression of "f" you,

I'm all that matters...

Defense of the behavior is almost always, well, "someone else does it or worse", right...

[Rougarou]

So let's pick and choose which regulations/laws we wish to follow.

 

Let the person that never exceeds the posted laws of speed on public roads, rural or otherwise, speak up about "obeying" everything else.

 

 

[Green RT]

Loud isn't subjective. Inconsiderate is the correct term indeed.

 

The fact that others run straight pipes doesn't make any difference.

 

+1

[Paul De]

Living in the hometown of HD, their anniversary celebrations leave plenty of folk turned off. It always amazed me that the HD dealers will install Screaming Eagle mufflers with a stamp right on them that they were not compliant. but I think the that the DOT just fined either corporate or a bunch of dealers for altering the exhaust. Either way, WTF.

 

From time to time I get the nonsense comment that my RT is too quiet. My response is always that I like a quiet motorcycle and my neighbors like it even more than I do.

 

Leave you with some wise cracks

 

The loudness of ones bike is inversely proportional to the size of ones manhood (family version)

 

For my Ducati buddies loud clutches save tickets! (those dry clutches are loud when not engaged)

 

Loud pipes save public acceptance.

 

If loud pipes save lives, why do people pull out in front of an ambulances with the siren blaring?

 

 

[tallman]

So let's pick and choose which regulations/laws we wish to follow.

 

Let the person that never exceeds the posted laws of speed on public roads, rural or otherwise, speak up about "obeying" everything else.

 

 

Sure, haven't broken speed limit in months.

And it isn't as simple as "pick and choose". but you know that.

That's merely verbage to rationalize and justify, without addressing the facts that loud, illegal noise from a motorcycle does absolutely no good for anyone.

So, the question begs, why do it?

[Rougarou]

So let's pick and choose which regulations/laws we wish to follow.

 

Let the person that never exceeds the posted laws of speed on public roads, rural or otherwise, speak up about "obeying" everything else.

 

 

Sure, haven't broken speed limit in months.

And it isn't as simple as "pick and choose". but you know that.

That's merely verbage to rationalize and justify, without addressing the facts that loud, illegal noise from a motorcycle does absolutely no good for anyone.

So, the question begs, why do it?

 

It is as simple as pick and choose. So "in months", you haven't sped, so you "chose" not to break this law/reg, but prior to that, you "chose" to break the law,....which does absolutely no good for anyone except the "me" in you.

 

In this noise instance, you are picking a law that affects you in an offensive way, nothing more. It doesn't hurt you, it can't knock you down, it's just offensive to you.

 

Change it around and put speeding in its place. Change it around and put any law that you have broken for the "me in you" and someone, somewhere will have that as a pet peeve.

 

My bikes came with the exhaust they have already installed. The shadow was new from the dealer with the cobras installed, the HP4 with the Akro installed. I'm not going to tiptoe around riding them as they are my means of commuting to work daily. This is how the bikes came, I live in a rural area and I ride fairly spirited all the way to work (55 mile one way).

 

Cheers, enjoy

Edited February 24, 2017 by Living the Dream

[taylor1]

I most certainly agree that noise is subjective among me and you, our laws are not. Having said that, I googled motorcycle noise laws. I was truly shocked. 17 states have no noise laws at all, and many more are so vague that they are subject to interpretation.

[tallman]

taylor,

Many states have no noise ordinances/statutes/laws because of the cost to enforce and potential subjectivity, time of day wrt complaints.

But, still no one chooses to answer "why?", why ride an obnoxiously loud machine that damages hearing, disturbs the environment, annoy people, creates negative steroetypes, etc.

Why?

 

AFA "speeding", I'll respond, when you answer the query, "why?"

If it came from the dealer, why buy it that way?

We sold bikes that had loud pipes, trade ins, didn't care for them then, don't now.

But again, "why"?

There are some potentially obvious answers, most, as above, unflattering to that rider.

Are they correct?

Same goes for cars/trucks/airboats etc.

I hate being on a river in the kayaks when an airboat intrudes, can hear 'em for miles.

There are places they make practical sense AFA use and the water/land conditions, still don't like the noise.

But, a mc with nasty loud obnoxious sound? Not because the road required that type.

So skip the "but Mikey does it, or worse...", someone, please,

an honest response because all I can come up w/is "I don't give a rat's tale about anyone else."

Not trying to be personal towards LtD as you're the only responder on that side, just can't fathom riding any distance, let alone 5-6-7-800 mile days listening to that noise.

Edited February 24, 2017 by tallman

[taylor1]

Greetings tallman,,

As to your question "why" I truly cannot answer that as I am not on that side of the fence. I find any motorcycle with straight pipes or removed baffles extremely obnoxious . As far as taking sides apparently I did not realize that I was doing that. I do believe though that there are aftermarket pipes that have good advantages without deafening my neighbors ears or waking the baby next doors.

[Rougarou]

taylor,

Many states have no noise ordinances/statutes/laws because of the cost to enforce and potential subjectivity, time of day wrt complaints.

But, still no one chooses to answer "why?", why ride an obnoxiously loud machine that damages hearing, disturbs the environment, annoy people, creates negative steroetypes, etc.

Why?

 

AFA "speeding", I'll respond, when you answer the query, "why?"

If it came from the dealer, why buy it that way?

We sold bikes that had loud pipes, trade ins, didn't care for them then, don't now.

But again, "why"?

There are some potentially obvious answers, most, as above, unflattering to that rider.

Are they correct?

Same goes for cars/trucks/airboats etc.

I hate being on a river in the kayaks when an airboat intrudes, can hear 'em for miles.

There are places they make practical sense AFA use and the water/land conditions, still don't like the noise.

But, a mc with nasty loud obnoxious sound? Not because the road required that type.

So skip the "but Mikey does it, or worse...", someone, please,

an honest response because all I can come up w/is "I don't give a rat's tale about anyone else."

Not trying to be personal towards LtD as you're the only responder on that side, just can't fathom riding any distance, let alone 5-6-7-800 mile days listening to that noise.

 

Why 'cause nothing beats the sound of a Ducati exhaust, since I don't have the primo Ducati termignoni sound, I'll take the sound of the HP4 with the titanium akrapovic.

 

I don't have my exhaust the way it is because "mikey" does it, I have my exhaust the way it is because it is a pleasant sound to me.

 

When I drove my truck, I wouldn't listen to the radio, I'd listen to the purr of the diesel for 14-16 hour drives. On the HP4, it's the same thing, long rides are enjoyable because the sound is soothing to me. BTW, I don't like the shadow rumble (contemplated putting stock pipes on but don't want to waste the money) nor that of a harley, but I'm not going to point the fingers and ask why because likely, the Harley rider finds a kinda peace in the sound, just as many enjoy the sounds of silence. I don't ride by you to annoy you, that's just a by product of something comforting to me.

 

When I ride the RT, music through the Sena because RT doesn't have the same feeling sound.

[tallman]

Taylor

Was just following your post

No sides

Best wishes

[gordiet]

I like to hear the engine when I ride. If I wanted it quite I'd drive my car! Geeeez...give it a break.

[Dave_in_TX]

A few years ago, while on a ride in the Texas hill country, I stopped for gas and a break at a small country store in a popular riding area. There were two hunters there who I thought were looking at me a bit strangely. Shortly after that, one of them came up to me and said "I'd like to thank you for riding a quiet motorcycle. I live live in paradise and have to listen to loud motorcycles all weekend.".

 

Even in rural area, there are many people who are going to be disturbed by loud pipes.

[mickeym3]

Think environmentally small footprint....

Edited February 25, 2017 by mickeym3

[Bud]

Think environmentally small footprint....

 

Requires one to be concerned about others.