Paging Bill Ferran..

[Glenn Reed]

Bill,

 

I seem to recall you saying that in the banking at Daytona, you had to look so far forward and to your left that it was almost impossible, so I'll go out on a fairly stout limb and say Daytona.

 

(When I get a chance, I'll take a pic of my Father-in-law's 914 that I had trouble shifting...)

 

Glenn

[Dave_zoom_zoom]

see the little circular plexiglass the roof, it's there for a reason.

 

 

 

 

 

The green flag in the tower at the start???

 

Dave

[roadscholar]

Daytona it is, Glenn wins a lifetime supply of Moet Chandon or beer(s) of his choice on me next time I see him, whichever he chooses. (all explanations/negotiations shall be directed to Moet Chandon headquarters, good luck with that).

 

The steepness (I think is 38*) and curvature of the banking combine so you can't see too far ahead or behind. The reason for the hole is for a roof mounted mirror (convex?) to see behind. Few cars (probably none) could pass a Ferrari 512 or Porsche 917, it was probably just to keep an eye on the competition.

 

The number 6 was always Mark's number and Sunoco blue were Penske colors then. You can see the roof mirrors on the two 512's (David Hobbs is in the yellow car). Hard to tell on that 917 but I know the Gulf-Wyer cars had them.

 

 

 

Edit, Dave zoom zoom not bad, actually the starter's stand was probably 20 feet up at Daytona but the cars were a good 150 to 200 yds out when the flag would fly so it was visible thru the windshield. That reminds me of a different way those cars were started up thru the end of the 60's, The Lemans Start.

 

Sebring circa 1968, the driver's lined up across the track and sprinted to their non-running cars. It's the reason 911's had their ignition key left of the steering wheel until 1999, quicker to get it started.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 23, 2016 by roadscholar

[roadscholar]

...the driver's lined up across the track and sprinted to their non-running cars. It's the reason 911's had their ignition key left of the steering wheel until 1999, quicker to get it started.

 

 

But mainly to operate the key with the left hand and simultaneously the gearshift with the right (it's also why the early gearbox's had 1st over and down, quicker to get into gear). So much for my theory on qualifying not being important in an endurance race : )

 

Having checked, the banking is 31* (it just seems steeper). This gives an idea of sight distance even though it's compressed some with a telephoto lens.

 

 

 

Edited March 23, 2016 by roadscholar

[Indy Dave]

WOW! What exceptional photos and stories!! Speakig of Can Am - I remember the March 817 CanAm car. Paul Newman's team ran Teo Fabi in one and Al Unser jr, then Bobby Rahal in the other. If I remember correctly, Danny Sulivan was also racing in the series for a heir the the Jack Daniels distillery. Maybe it was Jim Beam? Somewhere I have a documentary on VHS of that season. But I digress.

 

The great Mark Donahue! Wow - what a talent! The photos of the "24 Heures du Mans" are wonderful - love seeing those cars again!!

 

The BMW 3.0 coupe is a great car and photo. Just stunning!! As a young teen, I had a hard time wrapping my head around the BMW - I was so biased from my neighbor for Porsche. The car was so different looking from the 911 based racers, I didn't take it seriously!

 

What a diverse and interesting assortment of folks we have here at BMWST! I have some more comments (and questions) tabout what's been shared and the cars you guys have graciously posted - but that will have to wait for tomorrow.

 

Thanks again one and all

[Bill_Walker]

 

What do you get if you cross an elephant with a rhino?

Thrown out of the Zoo?

 

Elephino. (say it out loud, three times, fast).

[KTM Doug]

This one still has the key on the left side.

 

[roadscholar]

That's great Doug, I didn't know they'd gone back. I have to steer clear of Porsche dealerships these days.

 

 

Here's one more shot I found of the Toad Hall car. It was almost fortuitous the way I discovered this car. I was at Charlotte Motor Speedway with my 910 for a SE Regional autocross (we used the infield course and part of the tri-oval). I kept walking past this old 911 with about 3 shades of yellow on it. The guy with it was unassuming and had towed it there on a rickety looking trailer with about a 70 Ford station wagon, light yellow : )

 

I knew it was a '72 as that was the only year the oil filler was on the outside behind the passenger door (it had to be relocated back to the engine compartment in '73 because too many doofus' were putting gas in it). You gotta be kidding! Every time I walked past it I'd notice something unusual about it, it had rubber hood and rear decklid hold-downs (came on factory racecars), a low Porsche decal across the bottom of the decklid, and black tape on the bumpers instead of trim. Then I peeked inside. It had a 10,000 RPM VDO tach sans redline, no carpet, no undercoating, just black painted floors with visible patina, low back Recaro racing style seats, and a 5-point harness. The door panels were smooth black vinyl with a plastic pull handle and leather strap for opening it. Also what appeared to be an original '73 RSR rollbar with a tech sticker still on it that said Targa Florio '72.

 

I was startin' to sweat a little : ) Most of the weekend the owner was lounging in a lawnchair next to his rig reading a book. About the third pass I started talking to him and asking questions. He was the dean of a small college in N.C. and had bought it from Bruce Jennings, a well known and respected long time Porsche racer. He said it took 7 years to convince Bruce to sell it to him, but he finally did sans engine and original racing seats. Bruce had bought it from Michael Keyser who he'd co-driven with in several pro races. Michael got it from the factory race dept as a special order in '72 while he was racing in Europe that season with Jurgen Barth (he headed up the racing archives dept.) and also made the movie Speed Merchants. Michael was also campaigning the '72 IMSA championship here and his co-driver Bob Beasley lost out to Peter Gregg's co-driver by a half point, Hurley Haywood in a 914/6 2.5.

 

I think I said it 2 or 3 times, Bob if you ever decide to sell it please call me, and left my number. Had no idea what he'd be thinking and was probably a moot point anyway. This was 1985, 10 months later I came home one afternoon and he'd left a message on my answering machine. The price was reasonable but knew I had to act fast, within a day I'd heard locally word of it was getting out, it is a small world. Tried to trade him something, he wanted a used Turbo only in white and I didn't have one so had to turn the couch upside down for any spare change I could find.

 

I raced it until 2000 in many vintage and historic events, it was fast and always appreciated everywhere I took it. Early on SVRA was strict on admitting just purpose-built race cars and 1972 was the cut-off year. There were just 17 or 18 911S 2.5's built so it and one other were the only two 911's (other than a '68 911R) allowed to run. It had 8 and 9" wheels, hand made butt-welded steel flares, and an aluminum rear decklid. In 1973 Porsche built a limited run of 35 2.8L RSR's distinguished by 9 and 11" alloy wheels and a ducktail spoiler.

 

Edited March 24, 2016 by roadscholar

[Marty Hill]

Bill, I take my hat off to you. You have had some serious Porsche fun!

[roadscholar]

Thanks Marty, like any road a few bumps, but mostly a lot of fun. "The older I get, the faster I was" might apply.

[Marty Hill]

Thanks Marty, like any road a few bumps, but mostly a lot of fun. "The older I get, the faster I was" might apply.

 

Something we earned over a very long time.

[roadscholar]

[Dave_zoom_zoom]

The reason for the hole is for a roof mounted mirror (convex?) to see behind.

 

Edit, Dave zoom zoom not bad, actually the starter's stand was probably 20 feet up at Daytona but the cars were a good 150 to 200 yds out when the flag would fly so it was visible thru the windshield.

 

 

 

Hi Bill

 

Of course, the roof mounted mirror. Daa, I should have known that. Thanks for being gentle with my ignorance.

 

Please keep the good stories coming. Very insightful.

 

Dave

 

 

[lawnchairboy]

Quote of the day

 

" Either way, over 900 hp is still plenty in a tiny car that weighs as much as a Chipotle fart."

 

http://blackflag.jalopnik.com/the-new-porsche-919-le-mans-prototype-based-on-the-old-1766732079

 

 

 

 

 

 

[roadscholar]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8w-wGQG0IpA

 

Warning, just under 2 hours.

[TEWKS]

Bill, was poking around and came across this Cool pic!

 

 

My brother owned & raced a Super Modified for quite a few years. I saw him get bumped up at Star Speedway, hit the wall and rolled it, luckily he wasn't hurt. The intensely and the amount of money he was throwing at it made me sick. Feel bad but I never went to another race after that.

 

Pat

[Indy Dave]

Quote of the day

 

" Either way, over 900 hp is still plenty in a tiny car that weighs as much as a Chipotle fart."

 

http://blackflag.jalopnik.com/the-new-porsche-919-le-mans-prototype-based-on-the-old-1766732079

 

 

"Tiny prototypes are nothing new, however, I think we tend to forget just how small these things are until someone digs up that photo of a 917 being dwarfed by Porsche’s tiny 914 road car, or sees one in person. "

 

WOW - never would've guessed this!

 

"The 919's turbocharged two-liter 90-degree V4 engine has been lightened and made more efficient to suit the WEC’s mandate that all LMP1 hybrids use less fuel per lap this year—eight percent less, in the Porsche 919's case. This drops the energy output of the combustion engine down below 500 hp, whereas last year’s engine had well over 500 hp. Porsche estimates that the drop in power could cost them up to 4 seconds more a lap on the 8.47-mile Circuit de la Sarthe"

 

So what/s holding BMW back on the R model boxer!?!

Edited March 26, 2016 by workin them angels

[roadscholar]

 

So what/s holding BMW back on the R model boxer!?!

 

Good question Dave and one I've long asked myself. Air cooled Porsche's have always basically been multi-cylinder BMW Boxer motors (yep they came first), and both have sourced parts from a lot of the same companies.

 

The last Porsche pushrod motors were in 356's in 1965 (and 912's), by '64 the 911 had a single overhead cam in each bank. BMW made the change in 1994 with the Oilhead. Porsche had mechanical fuel injection on racecars by '66 and production cars by '69 and electronic fuel injection on prod. cars by '74, Oilheads had it in '94. Porsche had Bosch Motronic on racecars by '77 (I think) and production cars by 1980. Again Oilheads got it by 94. Porsche was using water-cooled heads on racecars by the early 80's and full water cooling by '97, BMW Wetheads came along in 2013.

 

I know emission and noise laws are different for cars and bikes plus motorcycles weren't the primary revenue source for BMW, but all that stuff was available usually decades before. Oh, forgot one. Porsche used twin plug heads on all racing engines starting in 1966. It was for a somewhat different reason than BMW finally went to in 2004, but BMW engineers all along knew it made for a cleaner, better burn in the head. And in fact quite a few Airheads were being modified to dual-plug heads by tuners and racers.

 

 

[roadscholar]

Bill, was poking around and came across this Cool pic!

 

 

My brother owned & raced a Super Modified for quite a few years. I saw him get bumped up at Star Speedway, hit the wall and rolled it, luckily he wasn't hurt. The intensely and the amount of money he was throwing at it made me sick. Feel bad but I never went to another race after that.

 

 

Pat

 

Yep the money part was life-altering and once in it was hard to leave. I knew the tire guy for years and he'd usually give me take-offs (some of the rich guys would use them only one session and discard) and for the most part it was a shoestring operation. That was one of the appeals to endurance racing you could split it up among two or three others.

 

I've never seen that pic before pretty gnarly, we'd just had a hairy 2 hour enduro against those guys in the middle at Road Atlanta, I'd remembered Jack (Lewis) and I winning that race but it sure looks like we came in 2nd. They were in an early 60's Lotus sports racer and I was co-driving with Jack in his 1960 356 coupe. The tall guy next to me was David Whiteside an attorney from Birminham, super nice guy and a lot of fun. It was his Lotus and he had a 6 or 7 Lotus racecar collection from the 50's to 70's. He always towed an enclosed trailer behind a red 1970 Oldsmobile 98 convertible with a 455 in it. Not long after cell phones appeared he was talking/driving in Birmingham, ran off the road hit a tree and died, he was an excellent racer and even moreso a gentleman. I think most if not all of his cars are in the Barber Museum now.

 

I told this once before, in vintage races they made us do a mandatory 5 minute pit stop with the engine off so nobody would rush and spill fuel everywhere. Jack started and after about 40 minutes he didn't come around one lap. After a minute or so he came coasting under the bridge and down the hill to our pit, engine off. He jumped out yelled a few instuctions to the crew (jack up the rear, put it on jackstands and put fuel in), and he told me to get in and buckle up. He ran off up the hill to nearly the back of the paddock where his trailer was and was back in about a minute. He laid under it popped the valve cover off, replaced the broken rocker arm, adjusted the valve (the motor was probably 200 degrees), got it back together, let it down and said Bill fire it up. It sounded good, he looked at his watch and said, GO! Exactly 5 minutes, we didn't lose 10 seconds. In the years I raced Porsche's I've come across only 3 people that were really good drivers and equally good mechanics if not better, Jack was one.

Edited March 27, 2016 by roadscholar

[Indy Dave]

Bill - No fair posting the movie on early Sat evening!! I got about 5 mins into it, and I was already holding up my wife's plans! Haven't seen that since I was 13 or so! Funny - the lady buying the flowers at the start of the movie: When she started to dig for her COIN purse, my mind automatically thought she was fiddling with her CELL PHONE! I'll get back to the movie tomorrow.

 

Great story about the 5 min fuel/rocker change/valve adjustment/driver change. Must have been so exciting . . Sorry to ask, which are you in the photo?

 

Old 98. My dad had a 72' 4 door with the "Rocket" 455 4 barrel. I snuck it out a few times (before I got my license) loved hearing the mechanical quadrajet open up!

 

So sorry to hear about your friends accident - tragic. How things have changed safety and otherwise today. It seems so odd seeing a car pull a large trailer nowadays.

 

[roadscholar]

Sorry about the timing Dave : ) Jack knew what it was immediately, he shut it off and luckily was able to coast thru the dip and up under the bridge. He could do that blindfolded but still pretty amazing in about 3 minutes with a hot engine. Far right. It might've been a '72 Olds. Thanks..

 

 

Edited March 27, 2016 by roadscholar

[roadscholar]

 

This is a 67 911S 2.0 eng, it's an S because of the red fan shroud, and 67 was the only year S with carbs, 40IDS Webers.

 

 

Another S eng, has to be a 69-71 (2.0 or 2.2), mechanical f.i. with metal air cleaner, 72 and 73 S's had a plastic air cleaner. 911E's had a green shroud and T's yellow or black depending on the year. The 66 thru 73's are now the most desirable of all 911's because of their lightness, no frills, and direct connection with the road.

 

 

Factory racing engine, opaque shroud, twin plug Marelli distributor (from a 12 cyl Ferrari), high butterfly injection, 73 or 74 (2.8 or 3.0). One other visible element, RSR motors had a smaller fan (blades and housing) because they never ran slow enough to need to push a lot of air across the cylinders. Oh, and a swiss cheese engine mount bar and header bracket.

 

All this stuff was at a party I went to the other night, it was a 20 year celebration of finishing 10th overall at Sebring in 1996 by some old buds against strong odds. Grew up with David and Chapman in Daytona, David is probably the best Porsche mechanic I've ever known (he's had some famous jobs, but before that used to coax some serious hp out of our 356's in the early 70's). Chapman's great grandfather invented the Coke bottle so it's basically a match made in heaven : ) They did have one pro driver on board, David Murray, and another guy I didn't know.

 

For me it was trip down memory lane, there were people I hadn't seen anywhere from 10 to 50 years!

 

My friend Ann holding her beer and my wine : ) and a buddy from high school. And yes that is a purple Countach, Chapman was known to have a slight eccentric streak now and then : )

 

 

This is called Copper Metallic Brown, I had a '76 Turbo the same color from about '79 to 83, loved it, Mercury Morris was the 1st owner. The black '77 Turbo in the background was given to Hurley Haywood by Ferry Porsche for winning the '76 24 Hours of Lemans, Chapman bought it a few years later. There was a rest area coming into Jax on I-10 where a state trooper used to nab speeders on radar. Some Saturday nights for kicks Hurley would drive the black Turbo to the exit beyond and come back by the trooper at 160mph with his lights off, true story.

 

 

 

[KTM Doug]

Geez, All this talk of racing around in a bunch of over-priced Volks Wagons on little tracks is getting to me.

 

Back in the sixties I was driving and racing real cars, "American Muscle" in a straight line. I also kept the economy going.

 

So here's a few:

 

'67 GTO

 

 

'68 SS396 El Camino

 

 

'69 Z28 Camaro

 

 

But the best was this '66 442. With some work on my part, and some from GOD (this car should not have gone this fast and no others were) it held 3 strip records and had bettered the national record in it's class. A dailey driver that turned 12.83 - 111mph. It never lost a race in class. And I only weighed about a buck 40 which helped.

 

 

 

 

 

[roadscholar]

Wowee Zowee, I love it Doug, some classic stuff right there!

 

 

Don't make me dig my trophies out ok?

Edited March 29, 2016 by roadscholar

[KTM Doug]

Aren't you up a little late? This was also fun.

 

[roadscholar]

Bad to the bone Dougie..

Edited March 29, 2016 by roadscholar

[Guest Kakugo]

Look what I spotted in my backyard a while back.

 

 

Is that rare and exotic enough?

 

What, too recent? Then how about this?

 

 

My BMW dealership presently has a 1800ti, which they sold back in the days and are presently finishing restoring. It was the cheaper cousin of the famed 2002ti/tii pictured above.

 

I should really make a visit to the historical rally which is held once a year not far from here. Plenty of old racers, from Alpine A110's to Lancia 037's.

[Marty Hill]

All of the cars are beautiful.

I believe the story about HHH in the turbo. That's who he was/is!

Thanks to all the posters/wonderful pics and memories.

[roadscholar]

Back to the party for a minute.

 

team photo

 

 

 

Bill Warner (center) is head of the Amelia Island Concours and came down to give David an award for the Momo 935 that they'd run out of time for at the show a few weeks ago. The 1970 911T on the lift is Bill's since new and he ran it in the original Cannonball in the early 70's. On the right is Albert, a long time HS buddy, we used to terrorize Volusia County on Honda 50's. The guy on the left was belting out some excellent Pink Floyd, David Bowie, Jimmy Buffet, etc. on the organ/synthesizer.

 

Speakin' o music, there were a lot of good bands/musicians coming out of Daytona in the 60's and 70's, not to mention some of us went to high school with Greg and Duane Allman. I was talking to Sylvan Wells a local retired attorney who makes guitars now, about his band then the Nightcrawlers and how great they were. We were talking about all the good guitar players around and he said something interesting. Said there were 9 good lead players in town then and Duane was about number 7. I found that hard to believe but it was a few years before he picked up the slide..

 

One other quick one then I'll go away : ) My friend Ann used to date Peter Gregg before I met her and was in the 928 with he and Frank Stella when they were run off the road by an oncoming car on the way to the track at Lemans 1980. Peter hit his head hard and never really recovered, unable to race again. Much to her chagrin I kept introducing her as Peter Gregg's girlfriend.

 

As we were leaving the music guy was playing Margaritaville and she said "I dated him too" I said who, Buffet? she says yeah I dated him a long time : ) Wish I'd known that earlier when I was telling some racing story and a guy's wife said, "are you famous?" I shoulda said, heck no but she is..

 

I think the contents have long since departed this one...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 30, 2016 by roadscholar

[roadscholar]

Look what I spotted in my backyard a while back.

 

Is that rare and exotic enough?

 

What, too recent? Then how about this?

 

 

My BMW dealership presently has a 1800ti, which they sold back in the days and are presently finishing restoring. It was the cheaper cousin of the famed 2002ti/tii pictured above.

 

 

Looks like a 1st gen McLaren, I don't think many of those made it here, I might've seen one or two. I really like the rig he brought it there in : )

 

The 2002 was BMW's first big sales hit here and I'm pretty sure is what put them on the map, America could make or break a car or motorcycle company then. They were selling a few Bavaria's and even fewer 3.0Si's and coupes but the 2002 took off with the boomer's. What it really did was allow them to develop the first 3-series which was huge and then move up-market with the 5 and 7's but the 3 was, and still is their bread and butter. It took MB awhile to catch up with the 190 and C-class and they're still chippin' away at it : )

 

In the previous post I mentioned Frank Stella, he's an American artist commisioned by BMW to do one of their Art Cars in the 70's. The first four were probably the most important.

 

Alexander Calder, Frank Stella, Roy Lichtenstein, and Andy Warhol in that order.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[OoPEZoO]

Not much of a story here, but the before and after pics are pretty dramatic

 

Restored '71 911 2.5 S/T

 

[roadscholar]

Great find Keith, thanks for posting that. My car was a detuned and barely street legal sister to that one, Michael Keyser (who's family owned the Baltimore Sun) used it to get from race to race in Europe and as the camera car for his film Speed Merchants during the '72 FIA season. And why it was in amazingly original shape when I found it, never seeing the heat of battle.

 

The thing about 911 race cars was you almost couldn't kill them, they were like Marty Hill (the energizer bunny) they just kept going and going and going. Consequently most of them were updated with bigger wheels, flares, strengthened chassis, and more powerful engines as the rules changed. Many were still competitive long after technology moved on and other brands were in the scrap heap. Which brings us to this..

 

Not much of a story here,

 

You can bet your arse there's a helluva story there (and I'd like to know it), much of which will probably never see the light of day. First off, I can just about promise that blue streetcar turd is not the original, that car was never yellow, the dashboard is wrong for the year, and I really doubt it ever had a roll bar or cage. It could well be the donor tub they used to build the racecar from but 99% sure it's not The Car. Or likely something they just trotted out for the public to see. You've probably heard the story about George Washington's axe. Someone, somewhere has the original, never mind that George went through three different handles and four blades chopping down all those cherry trees.

 

I was actually on the trail of that car sometime in the late 80's, (having two cars from the same team could've been a minor coup), and came close to locating it. Through a guy that knew a guy (really) : ) it was supposedly a battered and nearly unrecognizable hulk in someone's backyard in Oklahoma. Described as being unrestorable at the time, that term later vacated the lexicon as values kept rising, anything and everything with history eventually became restorable.

 

The one thing that can make it all true is the serial number. There were several spots on a 911 where it's located, a 2x6" stamped aluminum plate pop-riveted under the carpet on the left inner fender, a heavy stamping in the monocoque behind the spare and in front of the wiper motor (viewed by Porsche restorers as the holy grail), and spots deep under the dash and fore of the engine compartment used by law enforcement in recovery of stolen cars. The little aluminum plates can be purchased blank and duplicated but if you have the stamped semi-structural piece from the original car it can easily be welded onto another tub and voila, it's now THAT car. I know that comes across as deceptive but in some cases is how it's done and is traditionally accepted among the cognescenti.

 

Don't kill the messenger, I didn't make the rules : ) but I've been involved with two cars like that, both long stories (maybe later). One, a 911 my partner and I brought back from Puerto Rico, I knew the owner and the car's entire history since new. And a 906 that after possessing for a few months eventually turned down because a few things just seemed fishy, one being the serial number stampings on the frame tubes. But, before that my accountant thought I was the dumbest person he'd ever met when I told him I was thinking about trading my house and a couple other cars for this Porsche racecar. Well it's worth 5 or 6 times what the house is now, so c'est la vie..

 

 

Teaser, remember the POS Camaro I rented a ride in for the 1980 24 Hours? It was a practice session for this, what we'd been working on and preparing for all Winter, Sebring.

 

[KTM Doug]

My only Porsche story as no one I knew would be caught dead in a foreign car and no one had white interior or white vinyl tops. Black only!

 

So a couple high school friends got married and later they bought a used 70 something 911 I guess it is. They had it for awhile and one day he decided to do a buff and wash. When he was done it would not start. Nothing. So it was towed to a nearby Porsche dealer. Took them several days to find the problem. Cost him a bundle in diagnosis. The problem? A previous owner had installed a hidden aftermarket switch under the carpet. I think he said it controlled a fuel cut-off valve or something. He had pushed on the switch when vacuuming. They had no idea that the car had this option.

[OoPEZoO]

I meant "not much of a story" as in the article itself wasn't much of a story. Anything with that kind of racing lineage ALWAYS has a story.

 

Your VIN number escapades remind me of the days I was immersed in BMW E30's and reading story after story of people welding original M3 pieces together with standard 325 pieces, getting it a Macco paint job on it, and then trying to sell it for $20K+. I remember quite a few fly and buy stories that turned south when the buyers started searching out those well hidden VIN numbers the Germans liked to hide. it was great if you had an all original one, as it was an easy sell. I held onto a 100% original '88 325is until about 18 months ago that I finally ended up trading straight up for my Buell. He probably got the better financial deal, but I'm glad to have something to tinker with that takes up 1/4 of the space

[roadscholar]

My only Porsche story as no one I knew would be caught dead in a foreign car and no one had white interior or Dougwhite vinyl tops. Black only!

 

Had to wait till I was out of high school Doug and def know what you mean about black tops and interior. First real muscle car was a '66 Cyclone GT (390 4/speed) burgundy w/black vinyl roof and int., it was quick but no match for a GT350 or the GM powered stuff. Sold it for enough to get a '65 Vette w/ knockoffs, yellow w/black top. That was a fun car and I drove it from DB to Cape Cod the entire way with the top down : ) Worked on a Coke truck everyday to Falmouth and Woods Hole that summer. One day it rained pretty hard while we were out, the floorboards had 4 inches of standing water when we got back, with the top and windows up! That was it, I knew it was a goner when I got home. I'd paid 3k for it (it was nice) and sold it to a local hot-rodder for 2800. Think they go for a little more than that now : )

 

 

[roadscholar]

I meant "not much of a story" as in the article itself wasn't much of a story. Anything with that kind of racing lineage ALWAYS has a story.

 

Sorry, I knew that, just liked that line as a launching pad..

 

Boy howdy you're right about the stories, amazing all the twists and turns they can take : )

 

 

[roadscholar]

For those interested in sportscar racing and may not have seen the race (I didn't) here's a recap of the 24 Hours of Lemans taking place two weeks ago. Warning, almost an hour long.

 

24 Hours of Lemans

 

 

[tallman]

My car!

With a different paint job.

[roadscholar]

The Porsche or the Yoda? Either way, add some zero's : )

 

Of course I'm happy that Porsche won it's 18th overall victory, even so at the last minute. Mighty Toyota ($ billions and billions) has tried for 20 years and failed but this time gave the Germans more than they asked for and came within 3 minutes of pulling it off (hats off to them!). But that's endurance racing and the old adage, "to finish first you first have to finish" has really never been more appropriate.

[Indy Dave]

SPA 2000

 

I just ran across this 2 lap clip of the old days of F1 Schumacher vs Hakkinen. Pretty impressive and looks like a well sorted chassis for Mika - he makes it look easy. Mike moves over on him (a-la Verstappen . . .the idiot) despite that, Mika fully commits on the next lap - AMAZING.

 

[roadscholar]

That was great, used the backmarker as sort of a pick. Risky but it worked : ) I watched yesterday and it still freaks me out how fast they go thru Eau Rouge (noticed Mika breathed it slightly each lap). I've listened to Brian Redman describe how scary it was in a 917 in the rain, when they couldn't see and didn't lift!

 

(a-la Verstappen . . .the idiot)

 

Yeah pretty dumb trying that after a crappy start but he is young, course everyone knows you don't have to be young to do stupid stuff in the 1st turn.

 

 

[Indy Dave]

Hard to imagine a 917 running that flat out in the dry, let alone wet! Those things handled like a crap wagon - to use the words of AJ Foyt.

 

 

[Indy Dave]

Here we go - a few laps around Sebring in a 1974 Porsche RSR

 

http://www.racer.com/videos/item/134897-video-how-to-drive-a-911-rsr-around-sebring

 

 

[roadscholar]

Fun video Dave, brought back some great memories and Jim gives a good description of a lap. He and I raced at the same time in IMSA in the early/mid 90's. Interesting he keeps mentioning brakes and smoothness, because it's not hard to overcook the brakes on an RSR. They were wonderful racecars and had 917 brakes but they weighed about 500 lbs. more than a 917.

 

I co-drove with Charlie Slater and Murray Smith in the '93 HSR Sebring enduro in Charlie's Jagermeister RSR, We won but when Charlie handed me the car (he started) there were no brakes, he'd overheated them. Of course he didn't tell me this but figured it out in the 1st turn : ) After a couple laps of peddle pumping and using the tranny to slow down they gradually came back.

 

Another quick story, I think one year in the late 80's they changed the track configuration for the last time, you'll notice Jim makes note of a very late apex into turn one. I was there with the yellow Toad Hall car (72 911S 2.5) running in the HSR pre-races. Everyone was early apexing turn one because it was a long and blind turn. My sidekick/crewchief Fred Baker (never got his hands dirty but he knew a lot about racing : )) put a big orange cone on the inside wall at the proper late apex. After the vintage race was over he took it down. When morning warm up for the 12 hours was over, several of the pro drivers/crew chiefs came over and said put that damn cone back up we can't find the apex anymore : )

 

[Huzband]

Want to really enjoy videos like this? Put on a pair of readers & go full screen. It's like a ride along!

[Green RT]

 

Speaking of 1800/2002s:

 

I bought a 1970 2002 in 1978. It sold new for about $4000. I paid about $4000 for it when it was 8 years old. Around 1995 someone rear ended me. The insurance company wanted to call it totaled since the damage was around $4000, but I showed them the then current prices on them, $4000, so they paid for the repairs.I put several hundred thousand miles on it. Around 200,000, I swapped out the engine. I went through several clutches and I don't remember how many times I changed brake shoes (rear) or pads (front). I repainted it once, maybe a dozen color coats then a bunch of clear coats of lacquer. I did all the work on it myself except for a reupholstery job. Once my kids were grown, around 1992, the only use the car got was hauling lumber on a roof rack I had made. Motorcycles were always my primary mode of transportation. I finally sold it in 2007. The buyer gave me, yup, $4000. It was a great car. I would like to have kept it, but I was moving out of the country and it didn't make any sense to keep it.

[roadscholar]

Great story Will, 2002 is the car that put BMW on the map. My younger brother bought a new black one in '76 (last year) and awhile later my race mechanic put a pair of dual side-draft Webers on it. Really woke it up, he used to go out hunting 240Z's to race : )

 

Just came across this pic on ADV, the 356 is identical to the first Porsche I had in 1966, '63 Super90 Coupe slate gray mit rot (red) leder. It was $2k, sure would like to buy it back for that now.

 

https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14732206_10157635310015191_937414738024289799_n.jpg?oh=3add0e9cae71e584565b1b4a4f5d035a&oe=58979D7F

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Marty Hill]

Bill, I'd like to get my RS America back for the 40K I sold it for.

[roadscholar]

10-4 Marty, all that stuff has gone thru the roof now!

 

Btw, I don't know if you were in Atlanta in 1966 but I bought that car from Baker Motor Co, a European car lot about where Lenox Square is now I think.

 

 

[Marty Hill]

Moved up from Miami in mid '82 so not familiar with that dealer. Amazing how much both cities have grown. Assume the same for your area.