New R1100RT owner.

[VitSports6]

Hi all,

I was pointed in this direction from a fellow on ADV, anyhow, I was given a 1996 R1100RT with 53,xxx miles on it about 10 days ago, it hasn't been on the road since about 2009.

 

 

It's not the nicest thing out there, but it was free! My brother in law said it needed a fuel pump, but a leakdown test had good results, but, it needs a little more than that, as you can see.

Yesterday I tackled the checking the Final Drive, I had never seen one first hand, so I wasn't sure what to expect, however it well, Luckily I had a heat gun at work, but I managed to get everything torn down in short order, maybe two hours, including a trip to the parts store for a 12mm hex socket, WTF?!?

 

I thrilled to say it looks like this RT has been lightly used.

 

 

There was maybe a tablespoon of gear oil or something in with the drive shaft, but everything else looked great, I thought.

 

 

The splines look brand new!

 

 

I lubed them up with some EP Moly grease and fit it all back together, I had to check to see if the driveline needed to be in phase or not, I'm glad I checked, I got it as close as I could, hopefully dead on, but we shall see... I also drained and refilled the R&P with some Hypoid 90 weight.

Today I replaced the rear brake pads, now to blend the brakes.

Here is a family photo

 

 

My parts arrived this afternoon, so I was able to replace the dual pump, I hope I did it right, I didn't put the tank back on yet, I still want access underneath the tank.

With this long weekend, I should be able to take full advantage and hopefully have a running motorcycle at the end.

 

Things I still need to do...

 

Check front brake pads.

Bleed the brake system

Adjust the valves

Replace the belt

Change oil and filter

Transmission oil change

Spark plugs

 

Have a great weekend!

 

[MT Wallet]

Free bike! Nice. Sounds like you're handy with a wrench. You'll have that running in next to no time. Don't forget to examine the HES unit wires for deterioration.

[Drakas]

Glad to see you made it! Told you to get ready for the HES.

 

Best of luck.

[roger 04 rt]

Looks like you've got yourself a good project bike. If it were mine, I'd add the following to the list:

 

--Check and see what coding plug is installed and whether there's an O2 sensor or CO pot.

--Replace the HES or require it now.

--Replace all the hoses and filter in the tank now, since splitting hoses are not uncommon and happen without warning.

 

Have fun!

[kalali]

On any bike, especially with some heft, I'd also replace the tires if its been sitting for that long. And if it were me, I'd also inspect the brake lines closely for bulging particularly near the joints while a helper operates the brakes. Cheap insurance all around. Congratulations. That bike will shine up nicely after a good bath, hand wash not power wash. Old time biker but I'm new to the Boxer world as well.

[VitSports6]

Thanks for the welcome!

I am still learning about these motorcycles, so I appreciate the thoughts on checking the HES.

I will also check into the coding plug, that's a new one to me.

I replaced the fuel filter as well as the hoses when I replaced the fuel pump, so I should be good to go for a little bit.

Tires are definitely on the list, I just don't know if it will be this season or not, I asked about Bridgestone Battleax tires elsewhere, but only got one reply about how they better be a good deal and to check the MFG. date, so any tire recommendations are welcome.

[VitSports6]

Oh and I hope you don't mind, I like to post pictures

[dirtrider]

Oh and I hope you don't mind, I like to post pictures

 

Morning Brian

 

Pictures are nice but please keep in mind that some readers here are using I phones & Tablets or small screen computers so your BIG pictures make reading a thread difficult for them.

 

From this sites Board Rules-- (see Board Rules below)

 

Folks with smaller screens or dial-up will thank you if you don't post pictures wider than 800 pixels.. You'll find help with this in the Discussion Board Support Forum.

 

 

[AndyS]

Hi VitSports6, good to have you around.

 

Curious question, but why did you take the Final Drive off?

 

I am still learning about these motorcycles, so I appreciate the thoughts on checking the HES.

Generally speaking, the wiring of the HES loom fails in the area inside the front alternator cover. The loom is clamped with a P clip underneath this cover. Normally you will NOT see a problem until you cut back the outer sleeve.

Advice is really just to replace it with a new one...There are folk who will rebuild them with suitable upgraded high temp cable.

 

 

 

I replaced the fuel filter as well as the hoses when I replaced the fuel pump, so I should be good to go for a little bit.

When you did the hoses, did you replace the 'U' shaped hose as well? This is normally the problem item.

Also did you use Fuel Injection system rated hose clips?

Finally did you use hoses rated for constant immersion in fuel?

 

any tire recommendations are welcome.

Tyre recommendations generally are worth nothing as we all ride differently, have preferences to how a tyre feeds back to us and the roads we ride on can be considerably different. Just choose a reputable brand.

[VitSports6]

Thank you Dirtrider, I will certainly keep it in mind, I use photobucket to host pictures, that seems to be the favored way to post pictureson other sites, as it keeps the site storage down, thanks again.

 

Hello AndyS,

The bike has an unknown history, to my brother in law, I felt it was best to check the splines to make sure they were in good shape and lubed.

I will certainly get my chance to have a look at the inner workings once I replace the belt.

Yes, I replaces the U shaped hose as well, Beemerboneyard has a pump kit that has all the needed hoses, clamps and wiring, so hopefully it's all on the up and up.

I figured as much on the tires, around here we can and have ridden our motorcycles in sub freezing temps as well as over 100(38c. )degrees.

Have a great Thursday all!

[dirtrider]

I felt it was best to check the splines to make sure they were in good shape and lubed.

 

 

Morning VitSports6

 

You checked the drive shaft splines-- those never seem to fail on the BMW boxer-- It's the clutch hub/trans input shaft splines that are the problem area on the BMW boxer bikes not the drive shaft splines .

 

Fortunately you have an 1100 (5 speed) & those seem to have a lot less input shaft spline issues than the later 1150 (6 speed) bikes.

 

The weak link on the 1996 1100RT's seems to be the transmission bearings/shifting dogs, the final drive crown bearing, & the HES.

 

The other thing to keep an eye on is for any signs of a hiss as you open the fuel filler cap as that means the Evap system is plugging up & will eventually crush your fuel gauge (in-tank) sender tube due to fuel tank suck-in.

[VitSports6]

Ah, thanks!

Like I mention, I'm new to this whole thing.

So far I've gotten more action here than on ADV and I really appreciate that!

[AndyS]

...I felt it was best to check the splines to make sure they were in good shape and lubed....

 

Thanks for the response.

Like DR says, the splines you really want to be checking are the ones between the engine and the gearbox - the gearbox input shaft where it interacts with the splines on the clutch.

 

The FD ones never fail. However, what can fail is the actual drive shaft that runs down inside the swing arm to the FD. The metalastic bushes have been known to let go occasionally.

 

What is good is that you have checked the phasing of that shaft and that is a good thing.

 

It is good to see someone keeping these old girls on the road. Keep up the good work, and feel free to ask questions. That is, after all, what this group is for.

[Drakas]

Its those of us who ride motobricks who have to worry about FD splines. Motoboxers don't let you off so easily.

[VitSports6]

Here is the code plug, if I have the right one.

 

 

I'm unsure what the difference is between plugs, once again, more research is needed.

[VitSports6]

Minor update tonight.

Rear brakes bled.

Charcoal canister was missing, so I pulled the tubing and plugged ports as per Gary Wasserman

Couldn't bleed the front brakes, cracked open the front MC and it was dry, had some jelly looking stuff in there, I cleaned it out, I added fluid to see if it would break down anything, but I think I might need to rebuild the the MC as there is zero action, not even through the ABS module.

I need to locate a thinner walled spark plug socket, none of mine work.

I installed the tank with new pump, just to see, No joy... Pulled it off again, rechecked the wiring, everything looked good, but it was getting dark.

I will try again in the morning!

[dirtrider]

Couldn't bleed the front brakes, cracked open the front MC and it was dry, had some jelly looking stuff in there, I cleaned it out, I added fluid to see if it would break down anything, but I think I might need to rebuild the the MC as there is zero action, not even through the ABS module.

 

Morning VitSports6

 

Did you remove the rubber membrane that goes under the cover but above the fluid? If you didn't remove that rubber membrane & just put fluid in on top of it then you will never get it bleed.

 

If you can definitely see the bottom of the fluid reservoir then there is a small hole (or holes) in the very bottom of the reservoir centered over the piston. This is the take-up port hole-- IF it is plugged then fluid can't get into the piston bore. Try cleaning that hole (or holes) with a very small soft wire (personally I use a copper wire strand removed from a good thickness multi-strand like a lamp cord)-- actually mine came from a 1/2 hp electric motor multi-wire-strand supply pig tail not a thin lamp cord. (well you get the idea here anyhow). Just use a single strand, or if real small, try 2 strands twisted together.

 

[VitSports6]

Thanks DR, the black rubber membrane came out with the lid, my thoughts was to soak it overnight and revisit it today with a fresh mind.

Thanks for the wire idea as well.

[kioolt]

I recently changed the brake lines on my R1150RT. The front brake was a lot more difficult to bleed then the rear. Each time that I pumped the front brake lever I could see a couple of bubbles come up through the master cylinder into the reservoir. I slowly pumped the front lever a bunch of times until the bubbles quit. After the bubbles quit the lever started to get a little resistance to it. It then started bleeding like you would expect it to.

 

I'm just saying be patient. Don't assume that you need a new master cylinder.

[VitSports6]

Thank you kioolt, I'm going to take it apart at the very least, clean out the ports, see where it gets me.

 

Last night when I tried to bleed the front, I was able to get suction between the left caliper and ABS, but not from the MC to ABS, there is a banjo bolt under the MC that could be plugged as well.

 

I'm just about coffee'd up and ready to head out for another day of wrenching.

I appreciate all the comments and thoughts.

[VitSports6]

Valves adjusted

Oil and filter changed

New spark plugs

 

I pulled the fuel,pump again yo check the wiring, everything looked good, then I started checking the wiring outside of the tank, there is a 4 pin connector under the tank on the RH side, it doesn't have power to it, I checked the fuses, they have power, I'm unsure how to check the relay as of yet.

 

I was able to get a little fluid through the front brake MC, but it leaks a little from the front, where the rubber plunger boot is, once I figure out how to dismantle it I will see what's going on with it.

The brake lever doesn't rebound mush at all, I don't know if it will get better once it has some pressurized fluid or not.

[dirtrider]

Afternoon Brian

 

There should be a set screw holding the master cyl piston in.

 

Remove the lever, clean ALL the crud out from behind the piston, remove the set screw, hold your tongue just right & the piston should come out (might take some twisting, wiggling, & pulling to get it out if crudded up inside)

 

CAUTION!!! put plastic garbage bags & old newspapers over all the front panted surfaces & dash plastic as brake fluid a great paint remover & plastic ruin-er (sp).

 

 

[dirtrider]

Valves adjusted

Oil and filter changed

New spark plugs

 

I pulled the fuel,pump again you check the wiring, everything looked good, then I started checking the wiring outside of the tank, there is a 4 pin connector under the tank on the RH side, it doesn't have power to it, I checked the fuses, they have power, I'm unsure how to check the relay as of yet.

 

 

Afternoon Brian

 

Unless the engine is cranking over you only have power to the fuel pump for about 2 seconds at key-on. After 2 seconds then no power to the fuel pump until you key-off for a short time then key back on (then you get about 2 seconds on again).

 

OR-- you should have continuous 12v power to fuel pump while the engine is cranking over.

[VitSports6]

Yes, I realize the fuel pump is only on for a couple seconds, it's not turning on at all, I don't hear it, there is zero power to the pump.

I checked the relay, it doesn't seem to be working as it should, it's either bad or the wiring between it and the fuse is bad, when I had the cover off, I installed the relay, powered it and nothing, I manually made a connection and the fuel pump worked.

Off to the parts store to see about a really!

 

Thanks again for the thoughts Dirtrider.

 

[dirtrider]

Afternoon Brian

 

It might not be the relay it might just be that the Motronic isn't calling up the relay (is the side stand UP?????)

 

If Motronic doesn't call up the pump relay then it won't even think of triggering.

 

Added: Pump relay pull-in coil is powered (from) the ign switch, through the kill switch, then through the side stand switch, then supplies 12v to the relay pull-in coil.

 

The Motronic grounds the low side of the pull-in coil to make relay work.

 

[VitSports6]

Side stand is up, I head an audible click of the switch, to make sure it's doing its job, it also will not let it crank over when it's down, same with the kill switch.

Where and how can I check about the Motronic grounding?

[dirtrider]

Evening Brian

 

If the bottom of your relay has the terminals marked then the #85 should be grounded by the Motronic when it calls up the relay for fuel (12v test light on bat + post & probe in socket (#8) of relay socket. Relay terminal #8 is the same as relay terminal 85.

 

socket # 6 = 12v B+ (relay pin # 30)

 

socket # 10 = 12v @ key on (relay pin # 86)

 

socket # 8 = Motronic pull to ground when call for fuel pump (relay pin # 85)

 

socket # 7 = to fuel pump (relay pin # 87)

 

[VitSports6]

Ok, electrical is my bane...

 

Fuel pump relay.

Batt + to relay socket #8 does not light up, grounding and probing socket #8 lights up

 

Motronic relay

Batt + to relay socket #8 lights up.

 

 

[dirtrider]

Ok, electrical is my bane...

 

Fuel pump relay.

Batt + to relay socket #8 does not light up, grounding and probing socket #8 lights up

 

 

 

Morning Brian

 

Then check fuse #6 (not just look at it but manually verify 12v TO the fuse & 12v OUT OF the fuse.

[VitSports6]

I am getting 12 volts at the fuse socket and on both sides of the fuse.

 

I really appreciate you helping me out of this.

[dirtrider]

I am getting 12 volts at the fuse socket and on both sides of the fuse.

 

I really appreciate you helping me out of this.

 

Afternoon Brian

 

My fault as I steered you wrong. I was going from memory & as usual it failed me.

 

Socket #8 is grounded by Motronic to close relay contacts & power fuel pump.

 

IF socket #8 is not going to ground for 2 seconds as key is turned on, or not staying grounded during engine cranking then the problem is either a broken wire between socket 8 & Motronic, or the Motronic is not getting proper 12v input from battery (large red wire) or 12v from ign (green wire), or the Motronic is bad, or Motronic grounds are bad, or the Motronic is locked out.

 

Try removing fuse 5 for about 1 hour ,then reinstall, then re-try the socket ground test (that should unlock the Motronic (IF) it was somehow locked out.

 

 

[VitSports6]

I removed the fuse and it's still the same, I guess I will start looking at wires.

Thanks again!

[VitSports6]

Good morning all!

After taking a well deserved day off and away from this R1100RT, I had been doing some reading, I haven't replaced the HES, should I consider replacing this before I tear into the wiring?

I have a spark plug light and remember it seemed like its not getting a spark either, which brings me back to reading about the HES possibly causing a no spark issue as well, or is this after the HES has been heated to running temps?

Is there a way to test the Motronic unit if I get that far? Quite honestly, I don't think I would like to spend nearly a $1,000 for a part, which seems to be the typical asking price.

Thanks again for any and all help.

[dirtrider]

Afternoon Brian

 

It could be the HES & there is no real way to test it for being good. You can probably make a tester to verify it is REAL bad though.

 

The problem is: your HES might very well test good by putting on the tester lights but that won't show the cross-talk between wires that effect real life operation.

 

A failed HES will not produce any spark & might not allow the fuel pump to operate during engine cranking but should allow the Motronic to give you that 2 seconds of key-on fuel pump.

 

BUT!!!- if there is a lot of crosstalk in the cracked insulation of the HES then it might not allow the Motronic to even give you that 2 seconds of fuel at key-on.

 

You can T-R-Y unplugging the HES pig tail from the bike-side harness then see if you can get 2 seconds of key-on fuel pump run. If you THEN get the 2 seconds of fuel at key-on you probably have a very degraded wire pigtail just above the HES.

 

 

[Drakas]

And GS Addict will be happy to rebuild your HES for less than half the cost of a new one, or a third the cost of one from BMW parts department. So don't think replacing is your only option.

If you get it off and see cracks in the insulation, I'd say start there before you tear into the Mototronic. You might also check those links I sent you to some bikes being parted out and see what you could get a MT box from a breaker for.

 

My HES failure resulted in loss of spark AND injector signal. THAT reminds me: If your battery is putting out less than 10.9 volts, I was told that you also won't get spark or injector signal.

[VitSports6]

Thanks!

I have been in contact with the gentleman parting the RT, but it was mainly for body parts, I will start at the HES, which makes me much happier than trying to track down a specific wire in the bundled up harness.

My battery is a brand new Gel battery, it is putting out 12V, it's one of the things I checked over the weekend.

[dirtrider]

Thanks!

I have been in contact with the gentleman parting the RT, but it was mainly for body parts, I will start at the HES, which makes me much happier than trying to track down a specific wire in the bundled up harness.

My battery is a brand new Gel battery, it is putting out 12V, it's one of the things I checked over the weekend.

 

Afternoon Brian

 

That better be closer to 12.6v-12.8v, 12v from a new Gel battery is just about a dead battery .

[VitSports6]

It was on an old Radio Shack analog volt meter, I didn't look at the exact number, but it was at 12V, 13V was about a millimeter farther along, however the meter read up to 20V!

[VitSports6]

I had a little time tonight, I think there might be an issue with the HES wiring, similar to some maybe different than others.

The wire melted to the case behind the alternator.

 

 

Then there is the typical issue just below the alternator.

 

 

BMW or someone used some sort of sealer at the top where the square plug piece was, it didn't want to budge!

 

 

I've been reading http://users.rcn.com/dehager/service/oilhead_hall_sensors.pdf for information on how to repair it, I'm not going to replace the sensors, just the wiring.

Then we will go from there.

This was a quick removal, only took me about 20 minutes.

 

 

[dirtrider]

Evening Brian

 

Both of those damaged areas look like the belt might have contacted the pig tail. Possible pulley contact on the lower one but usually the belt.

 

In any case be sure to use HIGH TEMPERATURE wire for your repairs.

[Hoseman39]

Brian,

 

How did the Hall Sensor repair turn out! Was that the problem??

[VitSports6]

Brian,

 

How did the Hall Sensor repair turn out! Was that the problem??

 

I apologize for the delayed response, I haven't touched the BMW since the weather has changed.

Rewiring the Hall Sensor didn't work, however, it may have been user error...

I will revisit it again soon, once money and time are a little more abundant, we've have a crazy first quarter here at casa de VitSports6, with car accident, vehicle and insurance BS, ultra training... You know the usual stuff

Thanks for asking

[Hoseman39]

Brian,

Hope you were't hurt! If so we hope you recover quickly. That thing called "life" sometimes gets in the way of RIDING.

Please keep us posted on any progress.

[VitSports6]

Not really hurt, only my ankle, my wife is still going through some PT, I was more irritated by the whole thing.

Looking forward to getting back to the 1100.

Thank you.