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10W40 or 20W50 in Summer?


Michael B

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Forgive me as now I have sinned and replied to an oil thread. I know you are are asking about a different engine, but here is what is in the owners manual of our new broken down 2014 1200RT LC's

 

Engine oil, capacity max 1.1 gal (max 4 l), with filter replacement

Specification SAE 5W-40, API SL / JASO MA2, additives (e.g.

on a molybdenum basis) are not permitted, as

they will attack coated engine components, BMW

Motorrad recommends Castrol Power 1 Racing

4T SAE 5W-40, API SL/JASO MA2

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OMG, they've changed the oil specs AGAIN!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

 

I bought a case of the BMW-branded 15W50 for my 2013 RT and have been working my way through it -- there's enough left for the upcoming 9K intermezzo change, but I was hoping to go full synth at the 12K service, on the assumption that the engine will be pretty well broken in by then. As the '13 RT manual calls for 15W50, I've been looking for a high quality synth in that viscosity (range), and so far, have only come upon Motul 300V Ester Synthetic here in the States. Unfortunately, Motul's website draws a blank when clicking through to its specs, so I can't tell if it has appropriate ZDDP (zinc) and other additive levels that approximate the elusive "ideal".

 

FWIW, I've been running Amsoil in both my wife's and my cars (both are 3.2 VR6's -- one 'Dub, one A3), as well as in my 848... for years now, with very good results. I would stick with Amsoil if they made MC oil in the exact viscosity spec called for in my owner's manual, but they don't (though I think someone mentioned that Amsoil says their 20W-50 will work fine in our boxers). Since I don't want to go even a little astray of the viscosity specs but DO want full synth, has anyone gotten sufficiently up close & personal with the Motul 300V Ester to determine whether it has the right balance of additives and achieves all the required ratings? And is the new oil spec just for the '14 RT, or has BMW changed the oil spec -- yet again -- for ALL late model camheads? Maybe we should petition the admins to run a ticker tape across the top banner that tracks the manufacturer's current oil specs... in 15-minute intervals...

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Now this, from the Bob is the Oil Guy forum (though the thread seems to focus on high performance auto/racing applications)...

 

spoke with joey at motul.i found out alot about the new ester core oils.

1.the oil contains low amts of zinc and phos

2.very little moly

3.uses multiple esters

4.you definitly can mix with other oils

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  • 2 weeks later...

Has anyone used any of the several diesel rated 15w-40 oils, such as Shell Rotella?

 

My thought is a compression ignition application should be a harder service since the pressures associated with the ignition process would place greater stress levels than a spark ignition would.

 

Just wondering...

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Morning Tom

 

Yes, in the OLD days a person could pretty well depend on the CD, CE, CF & even some of the C-4, C-4 plus diesel rated 15w40 motor oils to have plenty of Zinc & Prosperous to protect about anything that spun, compressed, or rubbed in an engine.

 

Not so much anymore--there are still some decent 15w40 diesel rated motor oils with good Zinc & Prosperous protection but with some of the newer diesel emission controls a person just can't depend on that as a fact anymore.

 

You really need to RESEARCH about any oil you intend to use these days. What was good a year ago might be totally changed & lacking for your intended usage now.

 

 

 

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JerryMather
Has anyone used any of the several diesel rated 15w-40 oils, such as Shell Rotella?.

 

Yep used it on both my RT and KRS for years. Master Yoda turned us on to this when people around here were actually sending their old oil in to be analyzed. We both ran our bikes way past the 100,000 mile mark without any internal motor problems.

 

Could we do that on today's bikes? Not sure but I do know that a lot of us did, not so many years ago.

If you have an older ride I don't see why not if the oil is the same blend as years ago.

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Can I take us on a brief detour into transmission/final drive oil for a minute? I'm due for a fresh fill on both counts, and have ordered up a liter of Motul Gear 300 75W90 Gearbox oil on Amazon, and the required O-rings, crush washers & a spiffy filler / spout bottle from beemer boneyard. The Motul is spec'd for "non- wet clutch / non hypoid rear axel" applications. As my clutch is dry and my rear axel is hollow, it sounds like it could be a good bet in my 2013 R1200RT, and every consumer review I've seen -- albeit in other vehicles -- raves about it. What say you all -- any issues, or better recommendations? Yes, I know: "BMW recommends Castrol..."

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Evening Fathom

 

I'm not familiar with that gear oil but the "non hypoid rear axel" applications bothers me as your final drive DOES HAVE a hypoid gear set.

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I ended up ordering the Liqui Moly full synth racing gear oil from Beemer Boneyard. The guys there helpfully suggested waiting until after break-in to start adding moly to the Moly. It hasn't arrived yet, so in the meantime, I had the 1-year brake fluid flush & fill done, and changed the oil & filter when I got home. She's purring right along...

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Morning Fathom

 

Are you planning on adding additional moly to something?

 

If so then keep in mind that any good (GL-5) gear oil has plenty of additives to protect the gear sets from scuffing (that is how it gets it's GL-5 rating).

 

If you have gear tooth contact wear then adding moly can (possibly help that a little) but excess moly (especially moly not originally blended in the oil) can build up inside the unsealed bearings causing issues there.

 

Seeing as BMW's seem to have little to no gear tooth contact wear but have a history of bearing failures, adding extra moly can cause more problems than it solves.

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Thanks, dirtrider -- that is mighty helpful. I wasn't crazy about the idea of ballparking the amount to add, anyway. On a much (much) more basic level (pun semi-intended), I'm guessing that when changing the gear & final drive oil, I want my '13 RT on the center stand on a level surface (just like doing a regular oil change), correct?

 

And I know the drain & fill bolts get 30 Nm on the gearbox and 20 Nm on the final drive, but does anyone know off the top of their heads what the torque values are on the 2 clamp bolts that hold the muffler onto the header? I don't wants to be crushing up any shiny bits, since chrome is still a fairly new phenomenon in my garage and repairing or replacing those parts doesn't seem like it would be a cheap date.

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The clamp that attaches the muffler to the pipe is 28nm or 168inch/lbs or 21ft/lbs. The bolt for the muffler support bracket is 19nm or 168in/lbs or 14ft/lbs. The rear wheel bolts are 60nm or 44ft/lbs. Proper torquing is critical especially for parts made of Aluminum.

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Ah -- this is of great use, as I'm planning to have at it today. Thanks very much for posting up the useful values.

 

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Done -- both gear & final drive oil change (did the engine oil last weekend). All bolts torqued to spec (it feels good). Noticed that someone (factory or dealer) installed the muffler clamp too tight -- there's a small hole and cracking along about a 1/3 of the circumference of the connector pipe (to muffler). What say you all -- warranty issue? It was there when I removed the muffler, and looked like it had been there for awhile. Bike has 9500 miles at 14 months. Will likely be a problem later on, as it's already starting to rust a bit. Grrrr.

 

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Morning Fathom

 

That "crack" is probably normal. The pipe has a factory cut in it to allow the pipe to tighten on the inner pipe correctly so it doesn't deform & leak.

 

1200muffler_zpsbdd73830.jpg

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  • 2 weeks later...

 

No, that's not what I was seeing / talking about at all. The shop has asked me to take a pic (wouldn't it have been clever of me to do so when the can was off the bike?!?!?), but in the meantime, what I saw was a fairly deep crease / near split that runs circumferentially around the pipe, ending in a small hole where I'm guessing the edge of the clamp has actually worn or bitten through. Nothing about what I've seen/described resembles the nice clean factory cut shown in the pic -- I'd certainly recognize that for the clever engineering it is.

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Afternoon Fathom

 

Yes, if it's something different than shown then a picture would go long ways towards identifying what you are dealing with.

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