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A Star is Born


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Being in the energy business it's always so great seeing someone walk the talk. Awesome stuff Jaime and thanks for sharing Leslie!!

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Excellent.

I was going to debate the zero emissions statement, but watching the video I see you are using solar for the car.

So it is true and total zero emissions, on the car, and at the power recharging source.

Now, who posted up there without knowing about the electric motorcycles out there. There are several available.

I know of someone in Pacifica who rides one around that area, and even over to the manufacturer/dealer that is

nearby.

http://f800riders.org/forum/showthread.php/77946-I-bought-a-Zero

Look for some of them on the internet.

dc

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That's pretty cool! I'll imagine that you're now fielding phone calls from lonely women looking for a firefighter with an electrifying personality.

 

But, here's a serious question: None of this stuff is particularly cheap. Have you figured out how long it'll take to break even, as compared to a dino-fuel approach?

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Glenn Reed
That's pretty cool! I'll imagine that you're now fielding phone calls from lonely women looking for a firefighter with an electrifying personality.

 

But, here's a serious question: None of this stuff is particularly cheap. Have you figured out how long it'll take to break even, as compared to a dino-fuel approach?

 

He covered a lot of the underlying factors here when he bought the Leaf.

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That's pretty cool! I'll imagine that you're now fielding phone calls from lonely women looking for a firefighter with an electrifying personality.

 

But, here's a serious question: None of this stuff is particularly cheap. Have you figured out how long it'll take to break even, as compared to a dino-fuel approach?

 

He covered a lot of the underlying factors here when he bought the Leaf.

 

Thanks for referring me back there (I forgot about my own thread :dopeslap:). Pretty interesting stuff, really. It looks like Jamie is in that sweet spot where you can make a pretty compelling argument for it being a financially savvy move. The fact that the Hoon family is generating electricity and can buy juice back at a preferred rate certainly helps.

 

My contention has long been that we'll start to see a wholesale migration to EVs only after it makes financial sense for a large number of people. Until then, only those dedicated environmentalists with enough money to be able to take on the additional financial burden of an EV will make the leap. It's interesting to see how it's working in this instance.

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moshe_levy
Until then, only those dedicated environmentalists with enough money to be able to take on the additional financial burden of an EV will make the leap. It's interesting to see how it's working in this instance.

 

Not just environmentalists, as we've gone over before Mike. Also those of us who see the need to reduce our usage of foreign oil sources to the highest degree possible a matter of a national security. In other words, the political reasons, which drive many people (myself included) far more than the environmental reasons do.

 

-MKL

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moshe_levy

Leslie-

 

Since we run similar setups (my dad's Volt is also charged primarily with solar) can you go over some details re your Leaf's charging? Specifically, I presume most charging is done at your home where the panels are - is it charged mostly during the day, or at night? If at night, where does the primary electricity source come from (meaning, where is your utility getting it) - unless in CA you are allowed to take your solar and put it into batteries, and then feed that into the Leaf.

 

Here in NJ that's a no-go if you're on the grid, which the news report said you guys are on.

 

-MKL

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Until then, only those dedicated environmentalists with enough money to be able to take on the additional financial burden of an EV will make the leap. It's interesting to see how it's working in this instance.

 

Not just environmentalists, as we've gone over before Mike. Also those of us who see the need to reduce our usage of foreign oil sources to the highest degree possible a matter of a national security. In other words, the political reasons, which drive many people (myself included) far more than the environmental reasons do.

 

-MKL

 

I understand your argument and your concerns, but I truly am unconvinced that this will drive change. There's ample oil available from friendly sources and a tremendous reserve within the territory of the United States for well into the foreseeable future. In 2010, the United States was the third largest oil producer in the world. The Bakken Reserve alone is predicted to be capable of producing 10% of domestic oil consumption (and, yes, I understand the environmental concerns).

 

The production of oil is a highly diffuse industry. Some producers are our friends. Others are our enemies. Others are ambivalent, but there remains an ample, though admittedly not unlimited, supply of oil. The transition to the next generation of technology does not have to be a wrenching experience fueled (forgive the pun) by fear. And even if you're right, I just don't see it as being a huge motivating factor for a sizable number of Americans.

 

Nonetheless, I understand that a transition to different power sources is inevitable and desirable. I think it's absolutely great that people like Jamie are exploring the current boundaries of available technology, because this sort of adventuresome thinking will ultimately illuminate the paths to a revised way of looking at the world and how we meet our demands for mobility. But, I don't think the concerns of national security are a very powerful sell. It's a legitimate matter of debate, perhaps even concern, but I don't think you'll find many people (even hardened military retirees like me, who are highly focused on security issues) convinced that the adoption of electric cars has much of an impact on the complex geopolitical landscape in which issues of national security are played out.

 

But, if it's what drives your personal decisions, that's fine with me. I think we're all moving, albeit somewhat glacially, in the same direction. But it seems pretty clear that as individuals and families see a positive impact on their family budget, those considerations will be the most powerful agent of change. Regardless of where you lie in the spectrum of personal ideology, affluence, or devotion to the allure of the internal combustion engine, it's exciting to find ourselves on the cusp of another technological revolution. For the capitalists among us, this can't help but be exciting--there's a huge potential to create enormous wealth for Americans. Or, we could blow it.

 

That's what I really find interesting and invigorating. My grandparents lived through a series of technological revolutions, taking them from the horse and buggy, to the widespread adoption of the internal combustion engine, to air travel, and, ultimately, to reaching the moon! My parents lived through an revolution in the advent of a unprecedented availability of personal transportation that could take them almost anywhere. I have lived through a revolution in the way in which we obtain and disseminate information. Big things are about to happen again and I may be fortunate enough to live long enough to experience the blossoming of a new technological age. Damned cool.

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moshe_levy

Mike, I agree with most of this.

 

As we've discussed many times before, the prime motivators of "early adopters" like Jamie and my dad are not the same as prime motivators of the great middle buyers (middle adopters, late adopters, etc.).

 

bell2.gif

 

The great mistake made in so many articles on ths subject is the very faulty premise that what drives a Jaime or my father drives a late adopter. So the articles proceed to go into "break-even" on when an EV, or solar, or hybrid, etc. etc. will "pay off." No. That is NOT the thinking of the early adopter. That is the thinking of a far more conservative buyer. His time will come as the technology becomes widespead and economies of scale take place and prices drop, but it is not here yet. And so he waits on the sidelines, for now.

 

The early adopter does list environmentalism as a concern. His does also list national security as a concern, and doing his part to personally reduce household consumption. He lists a love of cutting edge technology. He even lists the HOV lane.

 

Somewhere WAY down the list is break-even. The early adopter is spending alot to get these benefits he cares about. His income in much higher than average. The average Volt buyer's annual income, for example, is $175,000.00. That's average. At this level you are less concerned with "break even" and more with getting what you want, and paying for it. My dad is a good example of this - he can afford any car he wants, and has been driving 7-Series BMWs since I was a boy. Now he drives a Volt. At that level, do you think he is calculating some break even? No, he isn't.

 

Jamie's post and news report indicates he has thought this through on a financial basis that makes sense for him, and that is great. No matter what drives him to do what he did, it is great IMO. He may have similar or different reasons entirely from mine, but that doesn't matter at all. We're on the same side, doing the same thing.

 

But it's important to remember purchases are made with a great variety of criteria in mind, and the early adopter for this type of technology, according to all market research on the subject and anecdotal data at your fingertips (just ask us - we'll tell you!) is not using "break even" as even a top-10 factor of why we buy and use what we buy and use.

 

-MKL

 

 

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The guy in the news looks familar....I think I saw him hanging around at some ST events years ago. Wonder what happened to him?

:/

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Freakin green do-gooders! Go burn some good old 'merican oil!

 

(nice color choice by the way....)

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Les is more

I should say that Jamie and I have to consider the break even point since we are essentially a family of 4 living on one firefighter's income. However, that break even point is really more of a nice side benefit when it comes to a listing of what's important to us.

The solar and the car are the best way we have at this time to actually do something with what we believe to be important. Being early adopters and diving into it with enthusiasm and high involvement is our way of walking the walk for ourselves, yes, but also for showing others that this is a viable option. Every time we are out in the car we have at least one extended conversation with someone about it.

We map all of the charging stations in the county on the carwings map so that they show up for others. We stop at hotels to ask whether they have charging facilities. If not, we explain how to get them. Jamie spoke passionately at a Coronado City Council Meeting and swung a vote to make the decision unanimous for a charger on city property. That has opened the door for more infrastructure there and has led to conversations between the city, the chamber and the hotels about getting the Car2Go program into Coronado. Ecotality, who sells Blink Chargers and Car2Go treated us to lunch in appreciation for all we have done to help their momentum. I could go on but I think you have an idea now about our motivation.

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