Harley wins C.H.P. bid.

[OldMotor]

Well, I hear it's official now. On the 6th H.D. was awarded the C.H.P. contract for police bikes for the next two years. Do not know the bid amounts or specifics yet, but it was announced that H.D. won the contract over B.M.W. and Honda.

 

H.D. has 30 days to present a bike for testing. I hear they are going with the Electra Glide with the 103cc motor because the Road King will not pass the performance test. I also heard the Electra Glide may not pass the test either. But if H.D. cannot meet specs. The 2nd lowest bid will get the contract. Not sure which one that will be.

 

I think the C.H.P. is taking a step backwards in technology and performance.

[Redbrick]

$$$$$$$$$$$

 

Too bad....Bet there are a lot of officers disappointed....Either the ST1200 or RT1200 would be better choices....I think Harley sells them to the agencies and then buys the back (at sales price?)when they are through with them.........Some deal like that.......

 

Phil..........Redbrick

[SkidMark]

Who Can you chase down on a Hardly.. And you surely cant sneak up on anyone with nuts, bolts and mufflers fallen off and that smell of burning oil

 

 

boy am i going to get beat up for this post or what..

[motorman587]

Didn't Harley sue CHP a couple of years ago. Saying the contract was unfair. I would like to see the specs as we modeled our specs using CHP. I remember that the motor had to be liquid cooled, so unless someone changed it there is no way that Harley could've got it.

[JerryMather]

Who Can you chase down on a Hardly.. And you surely cant sneak up on anyone with nuts, bolts and mufflers fallen off and that smell of burning oil

 

This will be great news for the sportbikers, if they pass the test.

 

Rumor has it, the CHP officer that patrols the Mt's above Pasadena has already gone down twice, trying to chase guys with his RT. If he gets a Harley he might as well stay on the flats before he gets himself killed.

 

I just can't see them on Harley's chasing a Hayabusa or a R-1 that has 150+ HP, unless they come visit American Turbo Power to help them out.

[FlyingFinn]

I hear they are going with the Electra Glide with the 103cc motor

 

Wow, CHP must be in real financial crisis, a 103cc Electra Glide.... a 700+ pound motorcycle with a motor from a moped.

Sure, that's probably going to get them over 60MPG but I'm not convinced about the performance.

 

--

Mikko

[baggerchris]

I say: Hooray for Harley!!! I hope they do put the 103 inch motor in the police bikes. Maybe then they will see fit to put it in the regular bikes instead of just the high end models like they do now.

[jgrant]

Who Can you chase down on a Hardly.. And you surely cant sneak up on anyone with nuts, bolts and mufflers fallen off and that smell of burning oil

boy am i going to get beat up for this post or what..

 

First...I think that was a funny post and I know they couldn't catch anyone on a modern bike. Then I remembered that they don't have to. Motorola does all of the chasing for them...hehe.

 

It is also probably pretty good PR for them. It looks good for them to be riding an American machine. You don't see too many Honda patrol cars.

[JerryMather]

First...I think that was a funny post and I know they couldn't catch anyone on a modern bike. Then I remembered that they don't have to. Motorola does all of the chasing for them...hehe.

 

Only if they have backup in the area. When they're in the Mt's on patrol they're usually alone.

[KER]

From what i understand and have heard from one of the dealers, Harley practically is giving away the bikes to the CHP, and honda wasn't making a big push to sell their bikes.. HD wont make much money on the sales, but because the CHP will be using them the public will run out and get one. I agree, they will be very disappointed with them after the BMW's and there will a lot of disappointed officers once this goes threw. Lets just hope they prove to be as safe as the BMW's and that the officers dont get hurt.

[PASSMORE]

I had dinner a few weeks ago with 2 motor officers that were here for the instructor's course. One was with some park authority down in the bay area (rode a Harley) and the other was a motor officer in Allen, TX (rode and RTP). Very interesting discussion as to the merits of the two bikes. Neither guy was blinded by brand. Both seemed to agree that if there were patroling in a close quarter urban environment (read slow speed) they would prefer the Harley with it's longer wheelbase. Everything else (especially highway work) the RTP was the clear favorite for them...

[BMWHP]

Wow. That sucks for A&S BMW. They were the supplier to the CHP, and one of the biggest dealers in the country because of it.

[PASSMORE]

From what i understand and have heard from one of the dealers, Harley practically is giving away the bikes to the CHP, and honda wasn't making a big push to sell their bikes.. HD wont make much money on the sales, but because the CHP will be using them the public will run out and get one. I agree, they will be very disappointed with them after the BMW's and there will a lot of disappointed officers once this goes threw. Lets just hope they prove to be as safe as the BMW's and that the officers dont get hurt.

 

That you Kyle?

 

 

Hiya! I thought I reconized that RTP in your avatar!

[JerryMather]

Very interesting discussion as to the merits of the two bikes. Neither guy was blinded by brand. Both seemed to agree that if there were patroling in a close quarter urban environment (read slow speed) they would prefer the Harley with it's longer wheelbase. Everything else (especially highway work) the RTP was the clear favorite for them...

 

When I decided to look at the RT as a replacement bike from years of being on Harley's, I started asking CHP's about their impressions of the RT compared to the other bikes they had ridden. They all told me to buy one, they were that impressed with them and a few, had Harley's in their garages for the weekends.

[SkidMark]

I may beat up on hardly Canmakeits but I can vouch for them. At one time for a few yrs I was employed by Harley to test ride them. because of confidentiality reasons I can't be specific but CHP should not have a dependablity problem. The only thing I believe is there set back is weight and agility. Turning radius without scraping the boards sucks.

 

They will easily run in the 120 mph range all day but fuel mi is not so great even cruzing around. I guess ther ok if CHP don't mind riding 2 ton chunks of iron. Made in the USA is a plus I have to admit.

[TowJam]

It is also probably pretty good PR for them. It looks good for them to be riding an American machine. You don't see too many Honda patrol cars.

A riding buddy of mine who happens to own a Honda dealership was campaigning to get one of our local LEO agencies off of the 1150RT and on to the ST1300. It looked to be all but a done deal until the last minute. According to my buddy, between Honda's program requirements and the agency's purchasing demands, there was no longer any financial incentive for the dealership to try push for the conversion. As a result, he withdrew from the campaign. I've since learned that the agency in question is sticking with the RT and in fact, will be upgrading to the 1200RT at some point.

[RFW]

I hear they are going with the Electra Glide with the 103cc motor

 

No, the motor is a lot bigger than that. The bike only performs like it has a 103cc motor!!

 

This has little to do with what is the best bike, and almost everything to to with the mentality that Harleys are "big and bad" and thus will supposedly result in more respect from mere citizens.

 

Wait until these anemic excuses for motorcycles get outrun by a few ordinary touring bikes

 

Bob.

[chadhargis]

The police department here in Nashville uses Harleys. Sadly, I've been stopped by one. There seems to be no decrease in the performance of the ticket book and pen.

[Tasker]

This has little to do with what is the best bike, and almost everything to to with the mentality that Harleys are "big and bad" and thus will supposedly result in more respect from mere citizens.

 

Sorry, but the fact is that the decision is all about the finances. Period. The check writers (the city, county, state) rarely could care less about anything else.

 

In Indy, where we use H.D. exclusively, Harley has us on a $1.00 per year lease. After three, or maybe four years, the bikes are exchanged for new ones. At least this is how it was a few years ago.

 

The Indy Police bike squad is one of the elite squads in the country, winning hundreds of competitions over the past several years, and H.D. wants them on their bikes, so they make the financial portion very easy to swallow.

[scottd]

The Electa Glide over the Roadking makes no sense from a performance standpoint because they are the same bike. The EG has the batwing fairing instead of just the windshield. If anything the RK would be a few pounds lighter. Either one can be 88ci, 95ci, or 103ci. A slightly larger bore to get to 95 and then a slightly longer stroke to 103. Even at 103 they are grossly underpowered compared to any non-cruiser. They handle slow speed stuff well except tight u-turns. For a metro force doing mostly in town work they would work pretty well. Open highway high speed, better use the radio.

[Paul Mihalka]

Who Can you chase down on a Hardly..

Literal quote from a Maryland State Trooper I know well: "These darn Harleys. All I can catch on it is a cold!" That was a couple of years ago. Now he happily rides a RTP. I may have influenced his opinion that privately he rode a BMW K1.

[soboy]

I think an American motorcycle cop should be riding an American motorcycle. In fact, I think all U.S. national, state and local government branches should only purchase American made vehicles. I am always amazed that many people who are critical of American made vehicles conveniently forget that the governments of Germany, Japan and Korea actually support their home-based vehicle manufacturers and help them to thrive. Here in America, that seems to have become a foreign idea. No wonder our auto industry is floundering.

[TowJam]

I think an American motorcycle cop should be riding an American motorcycle. In fact, I think all U.S. national, state and local government branches should only purchase American made vehicles. I am always amazed that many people who are critical of American made vehicles conveniently forget that the governments of Germany, Japan and Korea actually support their home-based vehicle manufacturers and help them to thrive. Here in America, that seems to have become a foreign idea. No wonder our auto industry is floundering.

When an American manufacturer builds a bike with the performance, handling and technology of a BMW/HonSuzKawYam/yada yada yada, I'll buy one. (I've owned a Buell and 2 Harleys. They just don't compare.)

[Art..]

I think an American motorcycle cop should be riding an American motorcycle. In fact, I think all U.S. national, state and local government branches should only purchase American made vehicles. I am always amazed that many people who are critical of American made vehicles conveniently forget that the governments of Germany, Japan and Korea actually support their home-based vehicle manufacturers and help them to thrive. Here in America, that seems to have become a foreign idea. No wonder our auto industry is floundering.

 

 

Honda makes motorcycles in Marysville, Ohio.

 

Harley buys parts from Japan, Korea, and probably China at this point.

 

Do you have a TV? Where was it made?

 

"Americans" better get their head out of the sand. The marketplace is global.

[SkidMark]

I think an American motorcycle cop should be riding an American motorcycle. In fact, I think all U.S. national, state and local government branches should only purchase American made vehicles. I am always amazed that many people who are critical of American made vehicles conveniently forget that the governments of Germany, Japan and Korea actually support their home-based vehicle manufacturers and help them to thrive. Here in America, that seems to have become a foreign idea. No wonder our auto industry is floundering.

When an American manufacturer builds a bike with the performance, handling and technology of a BMW/HonSuzKawYam/yada yada yada, I'll buy one. (I've owned a Buell and 2 Harleys. They just don't compare.)

 

I have to agree with both of these post...It seems odd that the US doesn't build better rides, its not like we dont have the technology.

[cranezilla]

I think an American motorcycle cop should be riding an American motorcycle. In fact, I think all U.S. national, state and local government branches should only purchase American made vehicles. I am always amazed that many people who are critical of American made vehicles conveniently forget that the governments of Germany, Japan and Korea actually support their home-based vehicle manufacturers and help them to thrive. Here in America, that seems to have become a foreign idea. No wonder our auto industry is floundering.

 

 

 

And you don't own a forign bike or a forign car, or a forign TV or wear Levis made in Shri Lanka????

 

You seem to be on the wtong web site?

[Jim VonBaden]

I think an American motorcycle cop should be riding an American motorcycle. In fact, I think all U.S. national, state and local government branches should only purchase American made vehicles. I am always amazed that many people who are critical of American made vehicles conveniently forget that the governments of Germany, Japan and Korea actually support their home-based vehicle manufacturers and help them to thrive. Here in America, that seems to have become a foreign idea. No wonder our auto industry is floundering.

When an American manufacturer builds a bike with the performance, handling and technology of a BMW/HonSuzKawYam/yada yada yada, I'll buy one. (I've owned a Buell and 2 Harleys. They just don't compare.)

 

I have to agree with both of these post...It seems odd that the US doesn't build better rides, its not like we dont have the technology.

 

The problem is, there is no incentive to do it. HD holds the largest share of bikes sold in the US. A new manufacturer, or even HD, would have to compete not only with the HD cruisers, but with very well built foreign bikes.

 

The cost of starting a company from scratch, building bikes in the US under union rules, and then competing successfuly in areas from sport bikes to long distance tourers would be so high that the company would very likely never make it to production.

 

Just my $.02.

 

Jim

[soboy]

You've missed my point. There is no doubt that the marketplace is global. I am not talking about private citizens making purchases for their own use. We as private citizens, are entitled to the benefits that a global economy can offer us. However, I am talking about out government and its support or lack of support of American industry. Other governments support their national industry to a much greater extent than the U.S. does. I believe that the least we can do as a country is for our own government to support our American industry. It is sad that this point would even be debated here, I can guarantee you that Japan, Germany and Korea's governments give a lot more support to their national industry than the U.S. does.

[cranezilla]

The Government buys with tax dollars, I pay part of those tax dollars, and if I expect to get the best for my personal money, why would I not expect the Government to do the same thing.

 

It is Ok for the Government to piss away the tax dollars if it says made in America on it???

 

I support enough layabouts with my taxes as it is, with no return.

[David]

You've missed my point. There is no doubt that the marketplace is global. I am not talking about private citizens making purchases for their own use. We as private citizens, are entitled to the benefits that a global economy can offer us. However, I am talking about out government and its support or lack of support of American industry.

 

God Bless America, but you scare me to death.

 

I ought to try and get the most for my money, but it's okay if a police department doesn't?

 

You've got some real thinking to do on this point.

[soboy]

The United States became a powerful and successful nation primarily due to its economy, which produced wealth through capitalism, i.e. the maufacturing of goods. The U.S. can not continue to be successful unless it supports its own manufacturing base. Our national, state and local governments have imposed so many restrictions on manufacturing (that do not exist in other countries) that U.S. - based companies have moved their manufacturing facilities overseas. How long do you think our economy can thrive with a government that does not support its manufacturing base? I think it goes without saying that when an American product is available, the government should purchase that product. In a global economy where every other nation's government supports its own industry, we need to do the same.

[jgrant]

The United States became a powerful and successful nation primarily due to its economy, which produced wealth through capitalism, i.e. the maufacturing of goods. The U.S. can not continue to be successful unless it supports its own manufacturing base. Our national, state and local governments have imposed so many restrictions on manufacturing (that do not exist in other countries) that U.S. - based companies have moved their manufacturing facilities overseas. How long do you think our economy can thrive with a government that does not support its manufacturing base? I think it goes without saying that when an American product is available, the government should purchase that product. In a global economy where every other nation's government supports its own industry, we need to do the same.

 

As a taxpayer I want my taxes going for whatever product is the best value. Value for me is based on price and quality. If that product is American then great. If it is not then great. I don't care. If the American industries want to compete for my tax $$$ then they need to find out how to make a good product cheaply. I think they have in many cases and there is no reason why the MC and Auto industry can't too.

[motorman587]

I am glad that I live in a city and work for some open minded people and that money isn't everything. I work for a goverment "thank god" that believe in safety first then money.

 

I understand that america is important however this country has been made up by other countries. I am half German and mother is a proud German. My father is a proud American, fought in wars etc.......... However they too believe that I should be riding a motorcycle at work that is safe. Period.

[David]

However they too believe that I should be riding a motorcycle at work that is safe. Period.

 

[baggerchris]

For those of us that subscribe to Motorcycle Online, there is a nice 2800 mile road test of a 2006 Harley Electra Glide thru Ariz; Utah; Monument Valley; and Zion.

(and no, they didn't die riding it) LOL!

[DiggerJim]

The U.S. can not continue to be successful unless it supports its own manufacturing base.

Substitute "farming" for "manufacturing" and you're right there in the 1890s. Funny thing but we seem to have weathered that little transition okay. Probably gonna weather this one as well. The $64,000 question is what we'll transition to.

[SkidMark]

I am glad that I live in a city and work for some open minded people and that money isn't everything. I work for a goverment "thank god" that believe in safety first then money.

 

I understand that america is important however this country has been made up by other countries. I am half German and mother is a proud German. My father is a proud American, fought in wars etc.......... However they too believe that I should be riding a motorcycle at work that is safe. Period.

 

Just so you know John, your one of my Heros....Thanks Man!!!

[BULLman]

Just so you know John, your one of my Heros....Thanks Man!!!

 

ditto

[codinn]

History has shown that when the home industry is "protected" price goes up, quality goes down and innovation grinds to a halt. Harley has all the engineering tools it needs to compete on a global basis. It simply choses not to emphasize what most of us on this board would consider "performance".

 

If a law enforcement organization decision maker puts image, price or some misguided sense of patriotism before safety or performance, shame on them. And shame on Harley for not offering a better tool for those who lay their lives on the line for us every day.

[soboy]

History has shown that when the home industry is "protected" price goes up, quality goes down and innovation grinds to a halt.

 

Really? Then how do you explain the Japanese automobile industry, which is, in fact, very protected by the Japanese government? Why is Japanese quality and innovation so high in a protected industry?

[SWB]

Supply and demand: The most immediate, practical impact to most on this forum will be on the resale price of BMW RT's. I would think that the next year or so will find lots of CHP turn-ins selling at increasingly higher prices. I'm assuming that the existing lease terms mean that the CHP RT's will be turned in at the existing 3yr/60K mile intervals, but its possible that when the new contract kicks in, ALL the RT's come back to BMW. In that case, the market for used RT's might hit the skids.

 

Either way, the 2002-2004 RTP's should become classics The overall decline in used Beemers should increase the resale price of the civilian RT's over the next 3-4 years. Plus, with the market gone for that many new bikes, I'd imagine it's going to hit BMW hard in Germany. What will they do? Close plants? Build more civilian RT's, and drop the prices? Transfer building capacity to the USA to get back into the native market for RTP's?

 

It's an interesting development. I've just never taken to Harley's the same way that I gave up on GM American cars when the dash on my 1979 Camero fell off, and the doors shook to pieces. I know the new Harley's are much improved, but I like my street bikes to purrrr... not gasp and grump and bang and thump.

 

As far as HD is concerned, all they need now is a hot, sexy new Hollywood TV show featuring CHiP's on HD's to pump up their market. Every LEO running around in CA on a HD will be a billboard for the show, and the show will have guys running out to buy their cool Harley EG's.

[codinn]

History has shown that when the home industry is "protected" price goes up, quality goes down and innovation grinds to a halt.

 

Really? Then how do you explain the Japanese automobile industry, which is, in fact, very protected by the Japanese government? Why is Japanese quality and innovation so high in a protected industry?

 

Hence the use of the term "home" industry. Since export is a big part of Japan's automobile business they still need to be competitive globally. And maybe their quality and innovation only seem high when compared to Ford and GM

[TowJam]

As far as HD is concerned, all they need now is a hot, sexy new Hollywood TV show featuring CHiP's on HD's to pump up their market. Every LEO running around in CA on a HD will be a billboard for the show, and the show will have guys running out to buy their cool Harley EG's.

Actually, that's not beyond the realm of possibility. CHiPs is being made into a movie and I'm betting there'll be a bidding war between the manufacturers (sans BMW) to get their bikes prominently placed.

 

And that's your Hollywood Minute for Friday, December 9th.

[Jeff98362]

Can you imagine rolling out on a 35 degree morning WITHOUT the RT fairing and heated grips? (I can)

 

Can you fathom the cost of re-training all those RT riders on a non-telelever bike with completely different manners?

 

Would you want to do the standstill - 110MPH - standstill drill running radar for a few hours per day on a 850 pound V-twin?

 

What a step backwards in technology. It would be like switching out the 2005 Crown Victoria for a 1975 model because it was cheaper. What next...back to the 38 special? Call boxes on the corner? First generation body armor? It's all cheaper!

 

 

[ericfoerster]

Harley has had a strong presence in police motorcycling since the early 1900’s.

Most of the police style training was developed by and for Harley Davidson. To say they are unsafe is a joke. Again, it is the rider and not the bike that create these unsafe situations. We put thousand of miles on them and our officers don’t think they are unsafe. An average bike here gets about 25-30K per year just in the city. I think if they were unsafe at least one of our 15 traffic guys would say something about it.

Harley’s actually handle very well in a slow speed city environment. They also have plenty of torque to catch up to speeders from a dead stop. A low saddle also makes for an easy mount and dismount, important for those long radar days.

 

I have been on the duty side and the administration side of this battle. I can tell you that Harley offers a fine deal for the dollar spent.

As for the duty side of things, I still think the Police KZ was the best suited bike for city law enforcement. We rode them like dogs and our city shop kept them running for cheap. We got a solid 60,000 miles out of them and then sold them at auction for a few thousand. Funny, I’ve got time on all of them and I like the Kawasaki best of all for duty and it was the cheapest one out there.

 

Maybe the bike selection should be left to those who actually ride them at work.

[X_BamaCop]

I am a Police Officer in Alabama. I too am amazed at what the C.H.P. is doing. Here in my state most agencies have Harleys including mine. I have no real knowledge of what we pay for the Harleys other than too much! I say this because until recently, I rode escorts off duty and purchesed a 04 RT-P for the job. There is no comparing the two brands at all. The RT is much faster, much safer, much more reliable and most importantly STOPS much faster and smoother. The only advantage of the Harley is being able to slip the clutch to turn figure eights in a parking space, this really does not have to many real world uses. Since the State Troopers took over my off duty job I could not afford the motorcycle, kids, wife, and two cars. I could not ever get rid of the wife and kids so I sold my cars and got a mini van for the wife and kids. I have been riding my RT-P all over the Southeast. I am in the doghouse with the wife though. She says no more riding without taking her. So, I made the mistake of test riding the R12RT. Now I am looking forward to the tax return and am going to give it my best effort to trade/sell my RT-P for the R1200RT. The RT-P has the radio box. Its not very comfortable and kind of slippery for the wife. Between selling my car and the tax returns I should be able to pull it off. If not I will at least have enough money to aircondition the dog house.

Enough of that though. We are not too far from The Talladega Superspeedway which is also home to the Harley Davidson test track. I work the NASCAR races (off-duty) twice a year, every year. It is a blast getting on the test track and completing the various courses while passing up Harley's test bikes. A few years ago I was speaking to some of them. Was surprised to see some of them sticking there nose in the air. (Unfortunatly in the motorcycle world this is said to be a trait best exibited by BMW folks) Several of these test riders were very intrested and when the gates opened to the big fence you could not see through that surrounded the building, I feared what was to come of my bike and promptly left. It was intresting though. It seems the job of Law Enforcement is becoming harder every day. It seems it is going to get a lot less enjoyable for some C.H.P. Officers not to mention a whole lot more dangerous. If this true, I can only say I am sorry to all the C.H.P. and that you have had a oppurtunity most Officers will never experance. As with every officer stay safe C.H.P. P.S. know anyone who wants a 04 RT-P?

[Motorrad4fun]

Just like the space shuttle the guy with the lowest $$$ wins the bid. The rider is second to that, safety is also on the list????

 

Harley has ABS????

[ericfoerster]

Harley has ABS????

 

Yes, it is on the website.

 

Maybe this will save those poor CHP guys from the imminent fiery death

[David]

Maybe the bike selection should be left to those who actually ride them at work.

 

You mean like all the other officers who've weighed in on this thread and said the RTs are a much better choice?

[TowJam]

Harley has ABS????

Yep. Except they apparently don't feel it warrants being made available to their "average" customer. It's currently only available on their LEO models.