Helluva Camera Meets Helluva Motorcycle

[beemerman2k]

Today, Nikon introduced their new D800 full-frame DSLR. There's only 1 stat you need to know about this beast: 36 mega-pixel resolution! Yes, it's sick.

 

But wait, there's more! The camera also apparently has some fairly high end video capabilities. I think what happened is that Nikon had a fine camera in the predecessor to this model, the D700, but they were losing lots of business in the wedding, fashion, architectural, and video markets to the Canon 5D Mk II. Therefore, they had to go back to the drawing board and engineer a super-duper 5D Mk II competitor, thus the D800.

 

So I go to NikonUSA.com to read about this new marvel and I see they have a video you can watch that was "filmed" (why do we still use that term?) entirely with the D800. Aside from the far fetched fantasy this video presents (riding a sweet BMW SS1000R in a major city with no cars and no cops), and aside from the type of racial imagery that brings back memories of the bad old days of Hollywood (good news, black actors got jobs. Bad news, they're the usual drug dealers, pimps, crooks, and gang trash), and aside from the reason this guy is riding in the first place (wait'll you see what he does for a living ) what the movie is really showing off is the capability of this camera to produce fine quality video even in low light conditions. Very impressive

 

So there you have it, two of my favorite passions: photography and motorcycling, all rolled in one. Enjoy!

 

For the record, Nikon kinda blew it with this camera in my opinion. The plus behind the D700 was that it excelled at excellent image quality, but also excelled in high performance situations. Supporting a 51 point autofocus module and 8 frames per second, it was excellent in contexts where speed mattered, namely sports and motorsports. The D800 pretty much abandons that arena to take on the Canon 5D Mk II at it's own game. But if Nikon shooters wanted 5D Mk II capability, they would have simply bought a 5D Mk II! Nikon should have given the D800 Canon like qualities without abandoning what made the D700 appealing in the first place. A 5D Mk II clone that also has a 51 point auto focus engine and yields 10 frames per second plus excellent video capabilities. That would have done the trick right there.

 

Oh well, I plan to stick with my D7000 for some time now, so it's not really my problem in any case.

 

Oh, almost forgot, here's a link to the Nikon D800 home page, where you will also find the video featuring the BMW SS1000R.

[Tony_K]

That was one messed up video.

 

A baby born into a world with outlaw bikers, homeless drug addicts and crack whores... oh and don't forget the run away teen trying to avoid being sexually assaulted, again.

 

But hey, Doc rides a BMW!

 

Weird choice Nikon, weird.

 

Camera is way cool though.

[RichEdwards]

Very cool video. Still love my Nikon D90 and won't be buying the new $3000 Nikon, but I sure would love to own one.

[beemerman2k]

That was one messed up video.

 

Yet it's entitled, "Joy Ride". What's so joyous about it? Very depressing environment. Maybe it's the baby, I dunno, but "joy" isn't the word that came to my mind watching this thing.

[beemerman2k]

but I sure would love to own one.

 

I'm not so sure I feel the same way. I definitely wanted a D700, but this camera would only have very limited usefulness to me. First of all, who wants to edit files the size that this camera produces? Weddings? Sure. High end fashion? Yup. Kids running around the yard and Aunt Bee coming over for dinner? No way!

[ka5ysy]

I upgraded a D70 to the D7000 last year when it was announced. It has all the options I could possibly want at this point, and pretty good video in addition. I still have the D70 and use it in an Ikelite underwater housing for dive photos, which is does well.

 

The pro cameras have the advantage of using all the 35mm lenses a lot of us have without the lens factor of the consumer class cameras, not that it is a big deal for me anyway.

 

Nice camera anyway, but will not be spending that kind of money.

[Kathy R]

It looks like all or much of that was filmed in Chicago. Let me set the record straight; the hookers are not that pretty in Chicago.

[Glenn Reed]

Let me set the record straight; the hookers are not that pretty in Chicago.

 

[texasaggie97]

Wow crazy video and I have to admit the quality was killer. Thanks for sharing.

[beemerman2k]

Let me set the record straight; the hookers are not that pretty in Chicago.

 

 

 

And yet they're so expensive!

 

No wait...strike that

[Huzband]

Let me set the record straight; the hookers are not that pretty in Chicago.

 

 

 

And yet they're so expensive!

 

No wait...strike that

 

 

Do tell.

 

 

[Burt]

But if Nikon shooters wanted 5D Mk II capability, they would have simply bought a 5D Mk II! Nikon should have given the D800 Canon like qualities without abandoning what made the D700 appealing in the first place. A 5D Mk II clone that also has a 51 point auto focus engine and yields 10 frames per second plus excellent video capabilities. That would have done the trick right there.

If a Nikon owner already had a collection of Nikon lenses it wouldn't really make sense to buy the Canon, and have to replace all the expensive lenses they own.

[pbharvey]

Could this be the end of the video camera?

[beemerman2k]

Maybe, but given that the D700 debuted in the summer of '08, if anyone is still hanging on to their D700's, it must be because of the many attributes that make it unique. If you want to do DSLR video, you have no choice but to trade it in as the D700 doesn't support that capability at all. How difficult is it to sell expensive Nikon lenses? Given the high prices and demand for them, I can't imagine it would be too difficult.

 

Again, however, why not honor the current market for speed applications and give the upgrade a higher res sensor (like the one in the D3x for instance), and focus on keeping the speed and low light capability (although ISO 25,600 should be enough for 99% of us :smirk:).

 

Canon must be making a killing off that 5D Mk II for Nikon to do an about face like this.

[chrisd]

A really sweet thing about the D800 is the E version, which comes without an anti-aliasing filter. I'm curious to see how sharp the photos are straight out of the camera.

[CoarsegoldKid]

Let me set the record straight; the hookers are not that pretty in Chicago.

 

 

 

And yet they're so expensive!

 

No wait...strike that

Come on. You know what you pay for is less expensive than that which you don't.

[Burt]

Canon must be making a killing off that 5D Mk II for Nikon to do an about face like this.

I've been thinking about upgrading my camera body. I currently have a Canon 30D. In talking to the guys at the camera store near us, the 7D and 60D are selling better than the 5D MkII. Except for the full frame feature, they have more to offer than the 5D MkII at a lot lower price. Here is a site that compares the three bodies.

 

http://www.dpreview.com/products/compare/side-by-side?products=canon_eos7d&products=canon_eos60d&products=canon_eos5dmkii

[beemerman2k]

The 5D MkII has outstanding image quality that no APS-C sensor could ever match in my opinion, but for most of us, we don't really need a camera that high power or that expensive (let alone that heavy, try carrying that brick around all day!). I have long been an admirer of the 7D. That camera has all the functionality anyone could ever ask for regardless of the application: sports, photo journalism, fashion, weddings -- you name it the 7D nails it. The 60D is basically the same camera with fewer features, but it's outstanding as well.

 

In short, I agree with this article, the 7D and 60D are a lot more real world camera than the 5D is. For the pro whose money depends upon exceptional IQ, sure, the 5D Mk II and don't even think about anything else, but for the rest of us, probably not the best option.

 

I own the Nikon D7000 (which I upgraded from a Nikon D70s), which is probably comparable to the Canon 60D. I love my D7K in that it has all the features I could ever ask for, and more besides. I rarely ever use my camera's Live View or video recording capabilities; video, for the most part, bores me before long.

[AviP]

The 5D MkII has outstanding image quality that no APS-C sensor could ever match in my opinion, but for most of us, we don't really need a camera that high power or that expensive (let alone that heavy, try carrying that brick around all day!).

My 5DII does not feel like a brick at all. I have chucked that puppy attached to a 70-200mm f/2.8 all day (not even slung) and feel quite fine.

 

+1 on FF v/s APS-C.

 

If you thought 36Mp was bad, check out this Mamiya.

 

[chrisd]

The 5D MkII has outstanding image quality that no APS-C sensor could ever match in my opinion.

 

Check out the Fuji X100. It has a fixed 35 equivalent lens with an APS-C sensor. The images from my X100 are clearly better in quality than those from my 5D MkII with a 24-70 L lens set at 35mm.

[beemerman2k]

Check out the Fuji X100. It has a fixed 35 equivalent lens with an APS-C sensor. The images from my X100 are clearly better in quality than those from my 5D MkII with a 24-70 L lens set at 35mm.

 

OK, I hear arguments such as this one that suggest that at ISO 100, or even anything less than, say, ISO 800, such and such APS-C camera can compete with the big boys. In the real world, that may be true in the sense that no human could ever detect the fine gradations the FF has over the APS-C image. I just wonder what happens when the sun gets low in the sky, or even sets, or when the lights are low. My money is on the 5D *consistently* getting excellent images in all manner of varying conditions.

 

Now maybe you're correct in your assessment, technology does indeed march on, but I'm skeptical. I'm a Nikon guy, but images from that 5D MkII knocks my socks off!

 

Imagine what the 5D Mk III is going to be like? BTW, anyone check out that new 1Dx? That camera is the undisputed King of the DSLR's in my opinion.

[Burt]

I just wonder what happens when the sun gets low in the sky, or even sets, or when the lights are low. My money is on the 5D *consistently* getting excellent images in all manner of varying conditions.

It seems that under those conditions it would be more a matter of focus than resolution. You might be better off focusing manually with any camera.

[beemerman2k]

I just wonder what happens when the sun gets low in the sky, or even sets, or when the lights are low. My money is on the 5D *consistently* getting excellent images in all manner of varying conditions.

It seems that under those conditions it would be more a matter of focus than resolution. You might be better off focusing manually with any camera.

 

Certainly different conditions will test various components of the camera, but I am referring to varying light conditions. With digital cameras (similar with film) the lower the lights the higher the ISO (sure, if you have a fast lens u can forstall having to crank up the ISO, but assume u don't have that luxury), and the higher the ISO, the more the quality of the picture degrades (colors fade and run, and noise runs amok). Full frame sensors, by design, handle higher ISO better than APS-C or smaller sensors -- in general.

 

Yes, the real issue is the size of the photosites embedded in the cameras sensor, so theoretically, a smaller sensor could have larger photosites, but it will do so at the cost of resolution. The Nikon D700, for instance, was regarded for its stellar low light picture quality, but Nikon limited the sensor to 12mp to give it bigger photo sites than the other brands (5D has 21mp, Sony A900 has 24). In fact, the #1 worry of potential D800 owners is low light performance. 36mp means a ton of photo sites crammed onto the same size sensor which means tiny photosites which means poor low light performance.

 

So that's what I mean when I say varying conditions, I mean changes in the light and how well the camera still captures clean images. Check out images of the Canon 5D at various ISO's such as 6400, 12,800, and 25,600. Compare them with what ur Fuji can do at the same ISO, and ull c what I mean (on my iPhone so I have to hack!)

[Burt]

Certainly different conditions will test various components of the camera, but I am referring to varying light conditions. With digital cameras (similar with film) the lower the lights the higher the ISO (sure, if you have a fast lens u can forstall having to crank up the ISO, but assume u don't have that luxury), and the higher the ISO, the more the quality of the picture degrades (colors fade and run, and noise runs amok). Full frame sensors, by design, handle higher ISO better than APS-C or smaller sensors -- in general.

From what I've been able to find in test reports, and from testing done by the guys at the camera store I shop here, you have to get up over an ISO of 1600 before you start to see a significant difference between the 5DII and the 60D/7D. If you shoot under those condition a fair amount, it might be worth the extra $1500 to get the 5DII instead of the 60D. I just can't justify it since I would rarely shoot in light that low. I guess I'd rather buy another lens with the money. Plus, the 60D has some features I'd like to have. It would be nice to have both. The 60D would be a 1.6 lens extender, and you wouldn't lose an f stop.

[JohnnyJ]

I saw some cool things under the "Learn and Explore" tab but could not find the motorcycle link

 

 

Johnny J

[beemerman2k]

I saw some cool things under the "Learn and Explore" tab but could not find the motorcycle link

 

 

Johnny J

 

You went to the Nikon D800 home page on NikonUSA.COM? you can't miss it, there's a close up of a man's head with a motorcycle helmet mounted. Just watch that video.

[beemerman2k]

By the way, Burt, I love your avatar. Nice work!

 

And yes, a 60D and some nice glass will take you farther than you might have the time or interest to go.

[Burt]

Thanks. That is the south pier at Grand Haven, MI. Unfortunately, I can't take credit for the shot. I got it off a lighthouse site.

[RPG]

beemerman, keep your D700 and appreciate its quality for years to come. I love my D300, (essentially the same camera with DX sized sensor instead of the full frame 700).

 

For HD video, grab a nice cheap Canon or ContourHD for a few hundred bucks. A buddy got me the ContourHD for Xmas and I'm strapping it on my helmet for a BLue Ridge Parkway trip this spring. Doubt I could strap the D800 to my helmet, nor would I want to.

 

Nothing impressive in the Nikon video at all, IMHO. Looks more like a BMW commercial anyway. But hey, he got instant street cred from them ruffian inner city bikers with a nod of the head. Impressive stuff there

 

RPG

[beemerman2k]

RPG: I do not own a D700, although I certainly wish I did. I own the Nikon D7000, which is a D90 upgrade and has the same sized APS-C sensor, except with 16mp.

 

I am not at all into DSLR video. I have taken some video with my D7K, mostly out of curiosity to see how it comes out, but I like stills. What I love about stills and hate about video is that with stills, I can browse through the images at my own pace. Video forces your attention to be placed upon it for the duration of the stream. So I don't do much video at all.

 

If I did own a D700 and I wanted video, I would have done exactly what you suggest: go out and buy a device that specializes in making nice videos.

 

Hell, I'd love to see pictures of a D800 strapped to someones helmet :smile:

[Burt]

While I was in the camera store the other day I was told that an entire episode of the TV show House was shot with Canon DSLRs.

[beemerman2k]

While I was in the camera store the other day I was told that an entire episode of the TV show House was shot with Canon DSLRs.

 

That's not a first, the Canon 5D Mk II has been used on several such occasions for several media productions. This is obviously the market Nikon is targeting with the D800.

[longjohn]

Most people get full frame cams because of the increased iso capabilities and the background separation when using fast lenses, like an 85mm f1.2, or a 50mm f1.4. Film makers particularly like the low light capability of the 5d2, and the relatively small size of it.

 

36 megapixels is great but doesn't diffraction come into the equation at some point? see here: http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/diffraction-photography.htm

[BerndM]

If you want to be impressed (I was) at what a Nikon D800 DSLR is capable of, check out this gorgeous video shot entirely with that camera.

WOW....it left me speechless

 

Be sure to go full screen

 

[beemerman2k]

Bernd, I guess you haven't read the thread from the beginning. The link you provided is the same one that launched this discussion. That's the awesome camera, the Nikon D800, that meets the awesome motorcycle, the BMW SS1000R!

[JohnnyJ]

Bernd, I guess you haven't read the thread from the beginning. The link you provided is the same one that launched this discussion. That's the awesome camera, the Nikon D800, that meets the awesome motorcycle, the BMW SS1000R!

 

 

I don't understand why... but I could not access the link you refer to. It did not even show up as an option.

 

 

Johnny J

[beemerman2k]

Bernd, I guess you haven't read the thread from the beginning. The link you provided is the same one that launched this discussion. That's the awesome camera, the Nikon D800, that meets the awesome motorcycle, the BMW SS1000R!

 

 

I don't understand why... but I could not access the link you refer to. It did not even show up as an option.

 

 

Johnny J

 

Whose link, mine in the initial post to this thread, or Bernd's link directly above my last entry? My link is on the Nikon D800 home page. Go directly to NikonUSA.com Find their page on the D800 model, and you'll see the video control directly on that page. All you do is select "play" to watch it.

 

Bernd's link takes you to a website that likewise, all you do is "play". Both play the same video entitled, "Joy Ride". Or, I suppose you can simply Google "Joy Ride Nikon D800" and no doubt you'll get a lot of links from which to choose :smirk:

[tallman]

Bernd, I guess you haven't read the thread from the beginning. The link you provided is the same one that launched this discussion. That's the awesome camera, the Nikon D800, that meets the awesome motorcycle, the BMW SS1000R!

 

 

I don't understand why... but I could not access the link you refer to. It did not even show up as an option.

 

 

Johnny J

 

Look for

but bigger

[Burt]

Here is some information on the 5D Mark III that is coming out.

http://tinyurl.com/7n26t5q

[beemerman2k]

Although I am a Nikon guy, this camera is far more practical for real world shooting than the Nikon D800. For the 1% who need the kind of resolution only 36mp can give you, the D800 will be a great camera. For the rest of us, I think 22mp and an ISO that can reach all the way up to 102,600 brings tons of real world flexibillity. No doubt video is stellar on both cameras.

 

Strange, but it appears Nikon set out to build a better Canon 5D MkII than what Canon had, and Canon built a better Nikon D700 than what Nikon brought to market! This 5D MkIII is the real upgrade to the Nikon D700 in my humble opinion.

 

Love the dual card slots, too

[Burt]

Here is Canon's link to it.

http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/products/cameras/slr_cameras/eos_5d_mark_iii

[beemerman2k]

This is an outstanding camera. This is what D700 owners were hoping for in the D800 -- simply more of the same (ultra versatile, high quality, fast and bulletproof camera more than capable in a variety of contexts). This new 5D will be at home in the hands of a wedding & fashion shooter and in the hands of a photojournalist as well.

 

The only area where I think this camera underachieved just a bit is in the sports context where maybe 8+ frames per second would be more appreciated. But the Nikon D800 wouldnt have a prayer in this context, this is where the D700 still shines. Sure, the pro sports guys will have D1x and D4 cameras, but the less well heeled sports guy would have to sport one of these OR a sweet Canon 7D or the coming Nikon D400.

[tallman]

My Nikon Cool Pix 100 can do 15-30 frames per second (13+ feet per second) in sport mode.

That works.