The dreaded R1200RT Fuel Pump Leak Strikes Again

[Joe_Rocket]

Hi Gang,

 

It looks like I will be filing a lawsuit. BMW has been really nice to deal with, but they seem to have no sense of urgency. I could use help in two areas:

 

1). I need fire information on any R1200RT, ST, or other models that use this pump assembly. I have one case already.

 

2). File a NHTSA case if you have experienced this failure and encourage anyone you know who has had this failure to file a case. Get the word out...

 

Once I file the case, I'll let everyone know. Once the case is filed and underway, I'll need to remain silent until the trial is done. Wish me luck.

 

Joe

[10ovr]

So Joe,Are you filling a lawsuit to get a recall or for your self ????

[Joe_Rocket]

I'll push for recall.... But I will be doing this pro per, and a recall request may require class action, which I, as a non-lawyer, cannot do. Regardless, a recall request will be part of my prayer for relief.

 

So Joe,Are you filling a lawsuit to get a recall or for your self ????

[Ron Pouch]

I have a similar problem on my 2006 RT Smelled fuel one day and took off plastic and saw problem. Ordered metal fitting and installed with thread seal lasted quite awile. I was installing motoplug on that side and saw seepage again. took out fitting, sealed cracks with a product called plastic fix. put fitting back in, pressurize, leak now worse, gas coming up threads. In my opinion something not right with thread taper as fitting bottoms before it tightens up. My solution put two O-Rings seperated by copper washer under fitting. Results no leaks.

[Joe_Rocket]

I am getting ready to file my case against BMW. I need the following information sent to me via email from anyone who has experienced this failure:

 

Subject: BMW Fuel Pump Failure <---- USE THIS EXACT SUBJECT ONLY

 

Information in the body of the email:

 

Full Name

Year and model of your BMW

VIN of your BMW

What you did to resolve the problem (if anything).

Did you contact BMW of North America?

IF so, what did they tell you?

Was this issue repaired under warranty?

How much money did the total repair cost you (if anything).

Do you give me permission to include your information on a class-action lawsuit if one is filed?

 

Please do NOT reply to this post. Simply send me your information or do not send it. This is a public forum and I'd like to make sure this process is completed professionally as possible. I don't even want people replying to tell me that they sent me their information. Simply send it if you'd like and I will confirm I have received it.

 

Kind Regards,

 

Joe

[Scarver]

The design of this fuel pump assembly is flawed - the engineer responsible should be fired for incompetence!

 

Earlier this year I experienced a leak after installing the metal quick-disconnects. Put the original plastic female connector back in. However, during last week's 1500 mile ride, I had gas leaking on the bike and my riding pants for four days! This week I took another look at the problem area - three cracks! Was reluctant to order a new pump (~$500) because I would eventually face the same problem again because the design is flawed. So decided to strengthen the area where BMW engineering failed their job.

 

Measured the height of the plastic ridge (5 mm - 3/16") and the outside diameter (24 mm). Next I fabricated a collar from a 4cm x 4cm piece of 3/16" aluminum stock. Filed the hole to a diameter of 23.5 mm; the bottom of the hole was flared to about 24 mm. The flare facilitated placing the collar over the plastic ridge and closing the cracks.

 

Applied J-B Weld around the opening and pressed the aluminum collar over it. That also forced epoxy into the cracks. Cleaned excess material with acetone. After curing for a day the gaps are closed.

 

BMW should make these aluminum collars available free to RT and GT owners. New pumps should have them factory installed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

This week I took another look at the problem area - three cracks! Was reluctant to order a new pump (~$500) because I would eventually face the same problem again because the design is flawed. So decided to strengthen the area where BMW engineering failed their job.

 

That, sir, is a brilliant fix! Hopefully the aluminum collar doesn't unseat itself at some point in the future; no particular reason it should, but then miles and years can do unexpected things.

 

My own RT will be out of warranty in four months. If it happens to develop this fuel leak at some point in the future, I will probably do this fix instead of replacing the whole pump unit.

 

BTW, how many miles on your bike? I'm curious to know what sort of mileage tends to develop these leaks.

 

Thanks for posting.

[dirtrider]

Hopefully the aluminum collar doesn't unseat itself at some point in the future; no particular reason it should, but then miles and years can do unexpected things.

 

 

Morning Mitch & Scarver

 

Nice repair Scarver.

 

That is very similar to the repair I have used on a couple of those cracked pump assemblies now.

 

Instead of that larger aluminum plate I machine up a smaller concentric ring that simply presses over the cracked boss then use a larger machined ring (like sort of a washer) installed on the threaded part of the quick disconnect fitting to push down & hold positive retention on the ring when the fitting is lightly tightened down. So far the ones I have repaired are holding up good with quite a few miles since repair. (neither bike my own)

 

As Scarver discovered, installing aftermarket metal quick disconnect fittings is about as good a way as any to crack those pump bosses. On one of the repairs I made the guy had installed metal quick disconnects just prior to the cracking problem. On the other one the cracks developed on their own at around 35,000 miles. Been more than few riders reporting cracked bosses shortly after installing metal quick disconnects. (I'm not sure if it is due to over-tightening or different thread angles)

 

Neither of my 1200's have cracked yet which is surprising given the many fuel strips I have gone through on the 1200RT. I'm sure the service tecs are none too gentle in horsing those quick disconnects apart.

 

My plan has been to machine up a couple more metal rings then press those on my bikes before the cracking shows up but it hasn't been a priority. Maybe as a temporary measure I will install a couple 15/16" or 7/8" snap rings on that boss to give it a bit more support until I get around to making some press on sleeves.

 

Scarver, please keep us updated on how your repair holds up long term.

 

[RedMac]

VERY interesting..

 

One of the projects I was planning on my RT over the winter was to replace the plastic disconnects with metal ones. I think I'm going to rethink that now based on Dirtriders comments.

[Scarver]

Mitch and dirtrider,

 

Thanks for your kind words! And Mitch, thanks for re-ordering the pictures - have a wide monitor and didn't think about horizontal scrolling.

 

Odometer shows 97,425 miles. Installed metal disconnects on 19 Nov 2010 (75,076 miles); put original female plastic fitting back on tank on 3 June 2011 (85,070 miles.)

 

Will update on effectiveness of fix.

[10ovr]

This week I took another look at the problem area - three cracks! Was reluctant to order a new pump (~$500) because I would eventually face the same problem again because the design is flawed. So decided to strengthen the area where BMW engineering failed their job.

 

That, sir, is a brilliant fix! Hopefully the aluminum collar doesn't unseat itself at some point in the future; no particular reason it should, but then miles and years can do unexpected things.

 

My own RT will be out of warranty in four months. If it happens to develop this fuel leak at some point in the future, I will probably do this fix instead of replacing the whole pump unit.

 

BTW, how many miles on your bike? I'm curious to know what sort of mileage tends to develop these leaks.

 

Thanks for posting.

Joe,,I would bet ya that you have cracks starting already, You should check it and if there is a crack get it replace under warranty ,,All the one's I have found had the stock quick disconnects.

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

Joe,,I would bet ya that you have cracks starting already, You should check it and if there is a crack get it replace under warranty ,,All the one's I have found had the stock quick disconnects.

 

After reading about Scarver's fix, I planned to pull the Tupperware sometime in the next couple of months to make my own measurements so I can fabricate a similar collar as a preventative upgrade; that will be a good opportunity to check for existing cracks, and if it is cracked, yes, I'll get a warranty replacement before the 3-year anniversary in April (and then I'll put the collar on the new unit ).

[OoPEZoO]

I've picked a couple of really strong gas odors the last few times I've been on my GS. Its bad enough for me to start looking around for who is driving the clunker that is running rich. Sometimes there is a good candidate, sometimes not. Now I'm starting to wonder if its my own freaking bike. I guess it was inevitable that I would have to figure out how to take this damn thing apart one of these days *sigh*

 

Did a search over on ADV, and it looks like the GS's and ST's have the same issues. I'm guessing this is something EVERYONE with a R1200 will have to watch out for

[Limecreek]

...and it looks like the GS's and ST's have the same issues. I'm guessing this is something EVERYONE with a R1200 will have to watch out for

 

And the K bikes. It is exactly the same pump assembly and yes, mine is cracking too. I noticed mine when I was switching over to the metal disconnects. So far no leaks, but I'll bet I am on borrowed time.

 

 

[OoPEZoO]

I was just out in the garage and decided to give it a look. Mine is cracked in at LEAST 3-4 spots. I didn't look too closely. As soon as I glanced and saw the cracks, I came back upstairs to get the camera. Of course the battery is dead, so I have to wait to get any pics. It still has the factory plastic quick discos, and as far as I know, has never been touched. Bike has just under 26k miles on it. This is disappointing. I'm not sure how I'm going to address it, but I won't be riding it again until I can get it fixed.

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

I was just out in the garage and decided to give it a look. Mine is cracked in at LEAST 3-4 spots.

 

File that report with the NHTSA.

[OoPEZoO]

I didn't clean anything up, so the pics aren't the best. But then again.....it is a GS

 

Two of the cracks are almost completely through the flange. It it wasn't leaking already, it can't be far off. Looks like I have at least 5-6 total that can be seen as is. I'm assuming there will be more once I remove the connecter.

 

 

 

 

[Paul Mihalka]

Stupid thought: It looks like a nice smooth circular surface. Would it be stupid to put a tight hose clamp around it?

[malcolmblalock]

Stupid thought: It looks like a nice smooth circular surface. Would it be stupid to put a tight hose clamp around it?

 

My thought exactly...

[OoPEZoO]

Stupid thought: It looks like a nice smooth circular surface. Would it be stupid to put a tight hose clamp around it?

 

No Paul, it wouldn't be stupid. I think it would be fine for a temporary fix, but I'm thinking I would want a more permanent solution. The aluminum collar posted above seems to be the best solution to me. The only way I think I would improve on it would be to add a thin washer between the flange and threaded part of the disconnect. That way the collar would hold it together and the pressure from the threaded insert would guarantee to keep it seated. Or maybe machine a piece of aluminum that would accomplish both. I have an idea in my head, but can't explain it very well.

[M249Joe]

Here is what I did to my 07 R1200R for insurance.

 

No cracks yet

 

 

 

Made a ring

 

 

 

The ring has a cut out for the dimple to clear

 

 

 

 

Installed it after sanding lightly for the epoxy to adhere

 

 

 

 

The ring has a counter bore so the epoxy doesn't run everywhere. I decided to fill up the counter bore

 

 

 

 

 

Need one, I can make more.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[OoPEZoO]

Thats a really nice solution. Is that machined from Aluminum or something else? I think you would have a long sign up sheet if you decided to start making them.

 

BTW......has anyone thought to check the disconnect on the other side of the tank? If I'm not mistaken, I think there is another flange on the other side for the fuel return line. Have to check it out tonight.

[w2ge]

M249Joe.. Nice work... "Start churning em' out!" ;-)

[BMWED]

I plan on making one this winter on my unimat. Curious, what is the inside diameter of yours? Im thinking around .925".

 

Thanks

Ed

[Bob_Minor]

M249Joe.. Nice work... "Start churning em' out!" ;-)

 

I'll second that and take two.

[Dundee387]

I'd also be interested in two. I think my K bike uses the same pump.

 

[M249Joe]

 

The aircraft aluminum rings are .935" inside diameter. The ring is a slip fit over the molded boss. Slip fit allows epoxy to take up any molding taper or out of roundness of the boss. You do not have to remove the quick change fitting to get the ring on.

 

They are sand blasted to help the epoxy adhesion.

 

$33.00ea delivered USPS with signature required

 

More than one ordered at once $28.00ea after the first one of $33.00

 

PayPal +3.5% to r1200rfuelring at zoominternet dot net

 

Email me (email above) for address to send money order

 

Delivery is 1-2 weeeks

 

Looking for Viton O Rings:

 

Go here www.mcmaster.com

 

9464K16 1 Pack Viton® Fluoroelastomer O-ring, As568a Dash Number 011

 

 

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

The ring is a slip fit over the molded boss. Slip fit allows epoxy to take up any molding taper or out of roundness of the boss.

 

I think a slip-fit is not going to be helpful in cases where the fitting is already cracked. You need the aluminum ring to squeeze the cracked plastic pieces firmly back together, so wouldn't a slight interference fit be more desirable?

 

In fact, on parts that are not already cracked, wouldn't you also want the aluminum ring to induce some compressive preload in the plastic? That way the aluminum bears more of the hoop stress that would otherwise be induced primarily in the plastic.

[M249Joe]

I can make them either way. Specify what you want. If your boss isn't round not sure how it's going to fit unless you sand the boss or the ring where it's tight. Beating the ring on with a hammer might cause the boss to crack.

[10ovr]

Im at my buddies shop designing a tapered billet clamp that I can make on his C&C machine ,Should have a prototype out in a week or so,,,I well post pix when it's done,,,,No epoxy needed,,,,

[10ovr]

Here is a picture of my design ,Had to order 2 hard tools,,Should start making them next week or so,,,

[malcolmblalock]

Great design! How can I order one?

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

Here is a picture of my design ,Had to order 2 hard tools,,Should start making them next week or so,,,

 

A clamp is a great idea: it allows for good compression of the plastic boss in spite of variations in size and roundness that might occur from bike to bike.

 

I assume the elevated purple/blue feature on the flats is so that you can accomodate a larger screw?

[10ovr]

Here is a picture of my design ,Had to order 2 hard tools,,Should start making them next week or so,,,

 

 

 

I assume the elevated purple/blue feature on the flats is so that you can accomodate a larger screw?

You got it,,I well drill,Tap and counter sink it,,More pix to come,,,,

[w2ge]

10ovr,

 

Is the idea to only use the clamp, as is, or along with JB WELD, etc... to fill in any cracks that may have developed?

[10ovr]

10ovr,

 

Is the idea to only use the clamp, as is, or along with JB WELD, etc... to fill in any cracks that may have developed?

I have a pump that leaks bad,,,Im thinking of installing the clamp and just using normal tread seal and see if it leaks,,,My buddies have new pumps on there RT's so I well put clamps on them to prevent them from cracking,,Once I get one done I well just have to play around with and see what works,,,,

[w2ge]

Gotcha, newb question... How fast does this seem to develop? I have a 2010 RT, should I be concerned? ANd is their some sticky some where that has pics of how to get to the fuel pump.. i.e. I know their are some pics for taking off the tupperware, but I don't recall getting off and to the bottom of the tank?

[10ovr]

The fuel pump is on top of the left side of the tank,,,My bike is an 07 with 45k miles,,Howard's bike is an 07 with 48k miles,,Craig,s bike is an 06 with 24K miles,,,,All cracked and leaking,,So you have a year or so before yours cracks,,LOL

[w2ge]

The fuel pump is on top of the left side of the tank,,,My bike is an 07 with 45k miles,,Howard's bike is an 07 with 48k miles,,Craig,s bike is an 06 with 24K miles,,,,All cracked and leaking,,So you have a year or so before yours cracks,,LOL

 

Great! I like "looking forward" to things...

[OoPEZoO]

My GS is an '06, but under 26k miles. Between mileage and age, it still looks like it can happen quickly. Lots of variables in there.......heat, age, mileage, how many times the disconnect has been removed, how tight the threaded insert was installed from the factory.....etc.

 

I think this should be a top priority #1 preventative maintenance issue for everyone with a bike that may be effected. Its a much easier problem to address before it cracks. Once it starts to crack, then you are only putting a band-aid on it versus actually preventing the problem all together.

[M249Joe]

Do it your selfers can buy clamps here www.mcmaster.com Look for shaft collars $7.00ea and just bore out to fit.

 

 

[Dave_in_TX]

I just took a look at my 07 RT with 133K miles. I have cracks too although suprisingly not as bad as in any of the pictures posted. This thread occurred at a good time - I still have about three weeks remaining on the extended warranty. I have never noticed any leaks or smelled gas (except while refueling).

[RedMac]

I find it amazing that we had to go through all this and jump though these hoops to solve what is obviously a design issue by BMW. If everyone is starting to see this, it should be something that is addressed by BMW for a recall if it involves fuel.

 

Anyone who has these cracks, I URGE you to file a complaint with the NTSB and let's see if we can get them to force BMW to own up to the problem and fix it.

 

I was all set to change my plastic fittings over to metal this spring but won't be doing that now. My bike is all covered up for the winter, but first thing in the spring I'll be pulling the covers and inspecting closely where the fuel fittings are.

 

In all honesty, I love my R1200RT and have been thinking of moving over to a GS. I had planned on a R1200GS, but things like this make me look harder and harder at alternative Japanese bikes (the new Yammy, or a Wee Strom). It's not the fact so much that the failures occur, it's the attitude from BMW that they cannot make a design mistake nor will they rectify it.

[OoPEZoO]

Do it your selfers can buy clamps here www.mcmaster.com Look for shaft collars $7.00ea and just bore out to fit.

 

 

Great thought, but all of the shaft collars that would fit the diameter are 1/2" thick or larger. The bung is only 5mm (0.197") tall. The collars would interfere with the quick disconnect. You might be able to grind it down to something usable, but it would be difficult and involve quite a bit of trial and error.

[w2ge]

Does anyone have a pic of the fuel pump... but, not up close.. that is, a few feet away so I can see exactly where it sits at? I was looking at the tupperware removal thread and never are there any final shots of the bike stripped? Thought maybe I'd see the bare tank.. but NO!!!!

 

or a linky? TU in advance.

[10ovr]

Does anyone have a pic of the fuel pump... but, not up close.. that is, a few feet away so I can see exactly where it sits at? I was looking at the tupperware removal thread and never are there any final shots of the bike stripped? Thought maybe I'd see the bare tank.. but NO!!!!

 

or a linky? TU in advance.

I Opened up the left panel for ya to see the pump,, Now you well sleep good tonight knowing where it is,,,,

[w2ge]

It's different on the 2010+... My tank cover goes completely over to the side... I don't have a "left panel"?

(Not the greatest pic.. from my iphone, flash reflection)

 

[Bernie]

That is the same panel, his is partly removed and yours is installed. There are 2 pieces.

 

[w2ge]

That is the same panel, his is partly removed and yours is installed. There are 2 pieces.

 

What I photographed is a solid piece... after that is removed, it will look like his? So that is the "two pieces", they "overlap". Correct?

[99Roadster]

That is the same panel, his is partly removed and yours is installed. There are 2 pieces.

 

What I photographed is a solid piece... after that is removed, it will look like his? So that is the "two pieces", they "overlap". Correct?

 

Correct. If it's the same as the 2005-2009 models there should be four screws holding the side panel. Two underneath and two at the front. There's actually three underneath, you'll want to remove the two outer-most ones.