Took a spill yesterday in Nashville

[RodB]

Crashville, at least that’s how I’ll always remember the city of Nashville. I’ve had a full day now to reflect on what happened and here’s my story.

I arrived there for the 1st time in my life on Saturday early afternoon amongst numerous downpours of rain. While it was not pouring when it happened, there was still a drizzle of rain coming down after a good shower. I took the off ramp from I65 south to head towards US31 south. The ramp goes on a downhill grade and switches from asphalt to concrete. This particular concrete was worn down and smooth. Add the normal big city grime of numerous vehicle lubrication leaks + a lot of water and you get a very slippery surface. Even my brand new Pilot road 3`s with about 1k miles on them could not get a grip on this surface. Here are photos (from Google maps) of where it happened:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You can see in the photos (X shows where we fell) that there is a somewhat short distance from a major Interstate highway and the end of an off ramp with a stoplight. There were something like 6 cars stopped at the red light (approximately to the red line in the photo). My 1st instinct was to stop and when the bike started whiplashing & sliding I let go the brakes (it felt like I was on ice). The bike straightened up, but I still needed to stop so I tried again with the same results; this time it got completely out of control and we dropped. We were probably going about 15MPH when we dropped. The bike made its 3 point contact on the right side (side case, valve cover & mirror area). I fell on my hip & shoulder (nothing serious), my wife took the fall on her right knee and is nursing a very sore knee. A 3 day stop in Little Switzerland will help rest her knee.

What I’ve learned from this is: If I can’t avoid riding in wet weather in unknown areas, then I’m looking for trouble.

So, for all of you attending the Unrally, my bike will be easy to recognize: besides having the only New Brunswick plates, it will also be looking beat up.

One other thing I noticed a few hours after the spill was an oil leak from between the engine/tranny area. I believe that it’s gear lube. I don’t know if the spill caused the leak or if it’s co-incidence, but I may be looking at a tear down of the transmission on top of the other repairs.

 

[lkraus]

I'm glad you are both (mostly) unhurt. Sounds like you were fortunate not to have hit the stopped cars. I'm curious - is your bike equipped with ABS?

[RodB]

Yes, but it did not seem to help in this case; it all happened in about 3 seconds.

[Jaguar]

Sorry to hear about your spill. It's a good way to put a damper on a ride. I hope your wife's knee isn't injured too bad and mends quickly. It sounds like you hit, what we here in Florida, call "Black Ice". I had the exact same type of spill many years ago on an older airhead, slowing down to make a right turn on a four lane highway after a rain storm. Thankfully, like your spill, there wasn't another vehicle involved.

[upflying]

When I ride in the rain my mind set is "gentle". Gentle throttle application, gentle lean angles and gentle braking. More rear brake bias is part of the goal.

Glad you are ok and thanks for sharing a learning expereince with all of us.

[Boffin]

When I ride in the rain my mind set is "gentle". Gentle throttle application, gentle lean angles and gentle braking. More rear brake bias is part of the goal.

Glad you are ok and thanks for sharing a learning expereince with all of us.

 

I agree with all the above but would add to ride in the car wheel tracks, as these are cleaner/less oily than the other parts of the road, especially the strip between the wheel tracks.

 

Andy

[Polo]

ABS did not kick in?

[RTJohn]

Glad you and the missus are OK. Sorry about the bike. Thanks for sharing this kind of thing. I'm very much a new rider with lots to learn. This helps a lot.

[Indy Dave]

I'm sorry to hear of your mishap. Glad it hear it wasn't worse and wish you both a quick and full recovery. Sounds like it had been raining for a while, but looking at the photos, I'd guess there was still oil washing down the ramp from the interstate.

[Deek]

Yes, but it did not seem to help in this case; it all happened in about 3 seconds.

 

Wow, super job of documenting what happened and your analysis. Glad you and your lady do not appear to have serious injuries.

 

However, I am a little concerned about your bike's ABS performance. I would really like to hear more about that. Did you consciously apply the front and rear brakes together, or just the rear? Did you feel that the brakes were "working" before the spill? Any indication you were decelerating at all? Any brake "modulation" felt? When were your tires tracking just prior to the spill? Center of lane or more off to one or the other side. How far were you from any painted lane markers?

 

I have only felt my ABS "work" once - in sand, going very slowly in a straight line. It seemed to work, but that was under ideal test conditions. I've ridden a lot in rain and the wet, but generally NOT in high traffic areas like your situation, mainly on controlled-access highways. I feel good about my gear (brakes, tires) and my ability at highway speeds where the chance of a sudden stop is not expected, but less so when I'm on an off ramp, city streets, etc.

 

I am very nervous around traffic areas in the rain, it's one of the things that gets my heart rate up, along with tail-gaiters, gravel and ice.

[beemerman2k]

The garage floor in the Los Angeles apartment building I lived in was virtually impossible to navigate when it was wet. I went down a couple of times in there. Fortunately, it was always at walking speeds. When I arrived home in a rainy day, I had to literally idle to my parking spot, and if I even thought about using the front brake -- POW! Down I'd go.

 

I concluded from that time that ABS assumes a certain level of wheel tension (friction with the ground) when it applies it's stopping pressure. Usually, that tension is sufficient to stop the motorcycle, but if there isn't sufficient tension, then the braking effect will be as though there is no ABS at all.

[upflying]

X2 on Beemerman's assessment of ABS.

It is a braking aid but it cannot overcome physics..

 

[RodB]

I agree, ABS needs a certain amount of coefficient of friction to enable its function. Upon reflecting on the spill some more, I have realized that what would have probably saved me was if I had veered to the left lane while gently braking to the red light. The left lane was open. My brain just did not compute this fact fast enough (maybe if I still had all the brain cells that got annihilated back in the 70's, it would have made a difference, but who knows).

North Americans who regularly ride/drive on the 'right' side of the road do not have the instinctive reflex to veer left to get out of dire traffic situations like (for example) the Aussies or Brits. Our 1st instinct is to stop or veer right (In this incident the right side was a narrow strip of wet grass then a rock cliff).

2-3 seconds to make all those important decisions were just not enough on this Saturday in Nashville, so although the drop happened at maybe 15 MPH, I have to conclude that I was going too fast for the conditions & that I ran into the bad luck of worn down concrete on a short off-ramp with an unusual amount of cars stopped at the red light (after the drop, we stayed on the side of the ramp there to recuperate for close to an hour and during this time I never saw more than 2 cars stopped at the red light)

 

This brings up another question: If we (motorcyclists) have to slow down so much to safely ride in wet weather, are we then contributing to unsafe situations on the road?

[RT66Rider]

When I ride in the rain my mind set is "gentle". Gentle throttle application, gentle lean angles and gentle braking. More rear brake bias is part of the goal.

Glad you are ok and thanks for sharing a learning expereince with all of us.

 

I agree with all the above but would add to ride in the car wheel tracks, as these are cleaner/less oily than the other parts of the road, especially the strip between the wheel tracks.

 

Andy

I agree with all the above but would add to ride in the car wheel tracks, as these are cleaner/less oily than the other parts of the road, especially the strip between the wheel tracks.

 

Andy

I almost always ride in the car tracks, in wet or dry weather.

The only exception might be if the car tracks are deep and full of water, and I cannot see whats in them.

 

For one thing, I don't like positioning myself directly behind cars that are ahead of me.

Being on their left or right side makes it easier for me to avoid hitting them should they make an emergency stop.

And as you said, it's usually cleaner in the car tracks, and smoother too.

[beemerman2k]

I don't know that I agree with your assumption that riders tend to look to the right lane rather than the left lane. That may be true for some riders, but I don't believe it to be true for enough riders that I am aware of to make such a generalization.

 

I make it my responsibility to know what's going on in all the lanes around me. The lane I'm in, the lanes to either side of me, and then some. I am always prepared to change lanes in either direction at a moments notice. Then again, I am quite at home lane splitting in LA traffic, too. This kind of awareness could be the difference between those who love to lane split and those who feel it should be illegal. When lane splitting, you must see yourself not unlike water flowing down a creek. You are always ready to flow where you need to in order to stay safe and to keep away from potential trouble.

 

The current lane is so named because that's where I am currently situated, but all lanes are under my constant surveillance at all times.

[tallman]

Agreed.

Lane space L/R/ahead/behind/shoulder etc.

All allow ingress/egress.

Best wishes.

[Huzband]

 

This brings up another question: If we (motorcyclists) have to slow down so much to safely ride in wet weather, are we then contributing to unsafe situations on the road?

 

No. Riding too fast for conditions or skill levels contribute to unsafe practices on the road. If you're uncomfortable with the conditions, pull off at a safe location.

[ryan_a1982]

Glad you and your wife are ok after the spill. I am curious, is your bike equipped with ASC traction control?

[upflying]

Glad you and your wife are ok after the spill. I am curious, is your bike equipped with ASC traction control?

I could be wrong but I think ASC wasn't available until '07. The OP signature says he has an '05.

[Francis]

Very happy to hear you and your wife are OK and are continuing on with your trip. Hopefully you won't need a teardown while on this trip.

 

We get a lot of wet weather in the summer here in the North East and I have found that progressive braking works well in wet conditions. It takes time for the brake pads to scrape water off the brake disk and then allow you to begin applying increased brake lever stopping pressure to the disk. Progressive braking enables you to apply just enough lever pressure for the brake pads to first engage the disk, clean off the water, and then you slowly increase lever pressure to enable the brake pads to engage the disk without any studdering or "grabbiness". Some times I'll just apply enough lever pressuer that I can feel the brake pads against the disk and run a few seconds this way so the pads heat up a bit and I can be assured they are dry and clean befor applying increasd lever presure to stop (especially for the rear brake).

 

In my experience rain riding also requires more traffic and roadway "anticipaiton" than normally. This anticiaption includes traffic, road surfaces and oncomming traffic that can splash water on you as they pass you. By anticipaiton, I mean looking for all the negative contingencies further in advamce than I might in dry weather and being prepared to deal with them if they should actually arise.

 

Hopefully by the time you read this you and your wife will have had a great time at the UN-rally. Safe trip home.

 

 

 

 

[TN_R_Girl]

Rod,

 

It was nice to meet you and your wife Wednesday night. I had no idea you'd had a mishap of this sort on your way through Nashville. So sorry to hear it, but so glad you're both ok.

 

In response to a much earlier post: no it was most definitely not black ice. The weather Rod was riding through at this time was nothing but wet and hot. Black ice shows up when the temps are cold enough to take the overnight rain/sleet and freeze it on top of the blacktop where you can't see it when you're driving.

 

My bet would be what someone else suggested which was left over oil and water slickness.

 

Either way, glad you both came through with relatively minor injuries. Hope the rest of the trip home is uneventful. And if you ever come back through Nashville, I hope you'll PM me so I can come meet you and show you some better Southern Hospitality!

[Danny S]

I was thinking about this thread the other day.

 

I think the ABS should have stopped it. That's what it's designed for on our aircraft, and I've seen it work on cars driving on a sheet of ice.

 

Do you think engine braking might have been the problem?

[enfoman]

I had the same trouble coming down to the UN on my C. It was in PA on one of the twisties, same type of weather, some of the turns were a bit slick and I felt it, took appropriate action. Came to a decreasing radius left hand and yep, 3 seconds or so, fishtailed and went into a classic 007 slide to the gravel on the right. ABS lights went railroading so it must of been a wheel spin that set it off. The C is built like a tank in many ways. bullet proof they say and no tupperware to scuff or break. No damage to the bike per se, just a tweaked engine guard that did it's job saving the valve cover and a rest of the ABS a few days later (BETA Program) and then I was on my way for a SS1000 to NH after the UN. I rode with it and was a bit shook up but all OK. Just like riding on black ice. It was like i was riding a giant wet tar snake, nowhere to go except follow the line and aim to the safest place your brain can think of in a split second.

 

I am so Appreciative that Armondo was my wingman, riding behind me and was able to critic what he saw.

[marcopolo]

Just saw this Rod. Had no idea at the UnRally that you had had a mishap. Glad it wasn't worse. You and your wife certainly did not seem any the worse for wear. I hope her knee is feeling much better now.