2002 R1150RS Surging

[Dobes]

My bike is a 2002 and suffers from the "surging" problem that is sometimes mentioned. On my bike it happens at slow speed in traffic. I have read about replacing the "pink" module in the fusebox with a tan one that changes the fuel mapping. I have also read about a product from Denmark called the Booster Plug, which also says it changes the fuel mapping. The Booster Plug is about $150. I don't know how much the other module is or where you get one. Comments would be appreciated.

[dirtrider]

Evening Dobes

 

It depends of when it’s surging & how bad it’s surging.

 

If it is surging at “steady” throttle at light load then neither a cat code plug change or a booster plug will help as neither can override the 02 sensor at light load steady throttle. The 02 is top dog at light throttle steady load as the system fuels only to the 02 sensor feedback in steady throttle closed loop.

 

Try disconnecting the 02 sensor then ride it to see if that helps the surging.

 

Might be an 02 sensor getting lazy, or your bike needs a TB balance, or it needs valve adjustment, or something else. Start with the 02 disconnect as a test.

 

 

Added: if you want to spend some money to cure that surging & your 02 sensor is working correctly then spend your money on a Techlusion 259 unit.

If the engine is healthy & the fueling system is up to par those Techlusion units can make a BIG difference in eliminating surging on the single spark 1150’s.

 

 

 

[Linz]

DR, can you explain something to me please?

 

My 2002 RT was fitted with either a Techlusion 1031, or 1032 ( I can't remember) but it involved disconnecting the 02 sensor.

 

If disconnecting the 02 sensor works, why would I need the Techlusion?

 

The dealer here in OZ only stocks the 103* series for our bikes and not the 259. It's years ago now, but I recall them saying that for Aussie bikes, the 259 wasn't suitable for some reason...

 

Linz

[dirtrider]

Morning Linz

 

I really don’t know what the dealer was getting at on the 2002 1150RT. As far as I know that bike came with an 02 sensor & cat. all over the world.

 

Maybe the dealer was basing his info on the earlier 1100 bikes as some of those were exported without 02 sensors or catalytic converters (all “non gray-market” to the US had cats & 02’s).

 

The 1031 needs the 02 sensor disconnected as it doesn’t use or control the 02 input. That unit works great on the non 02 bikes & works OK on the 02/cat bikes but you are giving up some 02 based fuel economy & idle converter protection.

 

 

I guess it comes down to what a person wants. If the bike came with an 02 sensor & it still works good then the FI- 1032 or FI-1033 (259 unit) is a superior unit as far a remaining mostly stock with just enough fuel add in the surging range to eliminate most of the light steady throttle surging & enough fuel add a WOT to improve acceleration a bit.

 

I guess if a person has an 02 equipped bike & doesn’t want to install the 259 unit then try an 02 disconnect first. You would have to if using the 02 disconnect 1031 unit anyway & in a lot of cases just disconnecting the 02 sensor significantly improves the light throttle low load surging.

 

There is a LOT of info floating around on improving the 1100/1150 fueling control. The thing to keep in mind is the 1100 Ma2.2 system is different than the later 1150 Ma2.4 system. A lot of people don’t understand that so TRY TO apply the 1100 tuning info to the 1150 systems. Some things work some don’t.

 

[Peter Parts]

BMW added the O2 sensor feedback to try to better preserve the cat converter from carbon poisoning. It is a first try and generally lousy in all its functions. Fortunately, it hardly raises its authoritarian head except during periods of VERY steady speed. I think someday DR will agree to that statement.

 

These sporty bikes run better by attending just to the fueling table (AKA map) and ignoring the O2 sensor. Which is what your dealer and Techlusion are trying to tell you. It is sort of insensitive to say "toss it out" as we have, but that's the truth.

 

One thing you definitely don't want to do is play mix-and-match games by substituting different colour code plugs made for other machines and other countries. The colours are not some kind of sequence of richness: they are different 2D maps. If you like games, pick ones where there are rational solutions.

 

Ben

[ragtoplvr]

I have a 2002 RS and there is only very slight surging now.

 

Here is how to fix, if you can wrench yourself a bit.

 

step one, remove idle bypass screws (BIG BRASS SCREW) and clean with spray carb cleaner, put a drop of motor oil on the oring.

 

Remove the hoses on the bottom of the throttle body, this lets the cleaner run out. Put a rag there to catch the cleaner. Then spray cleaner into the hole in throttle body about 10 seconds, let soak for 15 secnods, repeat 3X minimum.

 

Install BBS screws set out 1.5 turns start bike to burn out the cleaner.

 

Set valves to .006 intake, .012 exhaust, remember, equal both sides is way more important then exactly the setting. Equal feel.

 

Install new Bosch 4417 4 electrode plugs, they are the best I have ever used.

 

Start bike, warm up and use a water manometer to balance idle.

 

The using the manometer, balance the throttle cables, I got best results getting both to open at the same point.

 

The surge will now be minimized, while there it is slight.

 

Rod

[Peter Parts]

I have a 2002 RS and there is only very slight surging now.

 

Here is how to fix, if you can wrench yourself a bit.

 

step one, remove idle bypass screws (BIG BRASS SCREW) and clean with spray carb cleaner, put a drop of motor oil on the oring.

 

Remove the hoses on the bottom of the throttle body, this lets the cleaner run out. Put a rag there to catch the cleaner. Then spray cleaner into the hole in throttle body about 10 seconds, let soak for 15 secnods, repeat 3X minimum.

 

Install BBS screws set out 1.5 turns start bike to burn out the cleaner.

 

Set valves to .006 intake, .012 exhaust, remember, equal both sides is way more important then exactly the setting. Equal feel.

 

Install new Bosch 4417 4 electrode plugs, they are the best I have ever used.

 

Start bike, warm up and use a water manometer to balance idle.

 

The using the manometer, balance the throttle cables, I got best results getting both to open at the same point.

 

The surge will now be minimized, while there it is slight.

 

Rod

 

For the most part, you are reciting the exact factory recommendations, including the old recommendation for spark plugs that many informed people would not recommend.

 

BTW, the very cumbersome, uncalibrated, and sometimes disasterous liquid manometer method provides very accurate readings. In fact, after a ride, if you used the manometer again, you'd have to adjust the settings, again. That's how needlessly accurate it is.

 

Could you please mark those parts of your post, if any, which you have good evidence to think are helpful in reducing surging and those parts which are speculative on your part?

 

Ben

[philbytx]

Ben,

 

Don't be such a pedant.

Not speaking for him, but Ragtopluvr outlined the steps and parts that worked for him and HIS R1100RS. He did not state that his was THE definitive fix for the R1100RS surging. Merely here is how to fix...and, Yes, maybe a small reach there in saying "here is how to fix" .

 

Evidence should not necessary unless his methodology is proven NOT to do as he states for this particular, or indeed any, R1150 motor. And, as we informed people understand only too well, each bike CAN be different !

 

Starting with the book isn't such a bad idea.

 

For your edification, I continue to use NGK BKR7EKC's in my 2003 (7/2002 build) R1150RT and I do not experience any surging. I have always used a Morgan Carbtune.

 

And, again as we all know, YMMV!

 

Keep taking the tablets .

 

[Phil50]

I recon that if you have surging and have to do a lot of travelling in conditions that cause the surging you'll try just about anything to fix it. When I originally read Rod's post I wondered which of the steps he takes are the ones that sort the problem and which don't really give much bang for the buck. For example how essential is it to take out the BBSs and clean them and do all of that throttle body cleaning.

[philbytx]

Remembering that I am entirely anal

 

Accurate Valve clearance settings - Essential.

TB Balancing - Essential.

Spark Plug's - BKR7EKC's, new every 6k. Works for ME!

Cleaning the BBS's and orifices is, IMHAO, a necessary step.

Cleaning the TB's (with a CAT safe cleaner), especially on a higher mileage bike, is IMHAO, a good step.

 

Actually, they will all give you "good bang for the buck", as it is mainly wrenching time we are talking about here.

That is, other than the $4 for the TB cleaner and $15 or so for the plugs !

 

Don't forget your airbox and air filter.....clean out the air box and R&R the filter (in dusty conditions) at 6k. I usually check on mine every 3k and have run them to 12k max.