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Somebody talk me out of buying this F650 GS


FLrider

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I had been toying around with buying a small urban street bike. In another thread, I got lots of good advice, all based on my representation that it would just be a light weight around town bike.

 

I finally found one that looks to be in great shape and is reasonably priced.

 

Of all the candidates, I really like the single cylinder 650. I actually don't do a lot of "around town" riding. Most of my riding is long distance highway stuff so, the more I thought about it, the dumber that idea sounded.

 

Anyway, lately, the idea of being able to take this bike off road is appealing although I don't know how often I am going to get a chance to do that. Most of the guys I ride with aren't going to take their RT's or K bikes over sand, dirt and wooded areas.

 

How many of you bought an off road bike, thinking you would do that kind of riding, only to find the bike sitting around collecting dust and taking up space?

 

...She sure is Puurty though.....

 

 

 

 

 

 

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The F650GS is more of a dirt-road bike than a true off-roader, though it is better than the big GS in that respect. The F650 is a good reliable bike which sips fuel. I had the CS version as a loaner once which I took on a 500+ mile fairly spirited ride, during which it returned 75MPG, imperial - that is 60MPG US.

 

Does this help....

 

Andy

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I bought a Suzuki DR650 a few years ago. My idea was much the same as yours; ride around town and do some off-roading. The bike was great and I spent a bit of money trying to make it better off road. I fell the first time I road in mud, so I purchased knobby tires which were DOT approved. I wanted to be able to ride the bike at low speeds in the woods and swampy areas, so I replaced the chain and sprockets with different ratios. I added hand guards for warmth and protection. I purchased a small windshield for more protection and soon found that it prevented me from ducking under low tree limbs. I fell, or should I say, got yanked off of the bike by a low limb. I purchased a nice helmet for off road along with padded motocross pants and a jersey. I tried to relive my youth by riding off road in mud, sand, woods, along RR tracks, etc. I kept falling. My body didn't heal as quickly as 30 years ago..........I sold the bike :P

 

Just some thoughts from someone who has been there and done that. :wave:

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I think that all-round favourite for dual sport with some touring and commuting potential is the KLR650. More dirt potential. Been around for years and years. Lots of accessories. Reasonable price new and used.

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A few years ago I bought a F650 Dakar. I had visions of riding it to Hudson's Bay or something and I, too, wanted an around town bike with a good suspension for all the lousy city streets. It was a good bike (pain changing oil though) but was too heavy for any real off road riding.

 

Anyway the trip to the Bay never materialized and I realized what I really needed was a better long distance bike than my Road King so I traded it for my 2008 R1200RT. No regrets. jd

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Good points all.

 

Let me ask you this, for those that have done the BRR an UnRally.. Do you guys stay on paved roads or are there different "groups" that do different rides?

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I bought a Suzuki DR650 a few years ago. My idea was much the same as yours; ride around town and do some off-roading. The bike was great and I spent a bit of money trying to make it better off road. I fell the first time I road in mud, so I purchased knobby tires which were DOT approved. I wanted to be able to ride the bike at low speeds in the woods and swampy areas, so I replaced the chain and sprockets with different ratios. I added hand guards for warmth and protection. I purchased a small windshield for more protection and soon found that it prevented me from ducking under low tree limbs. I fell, or should I say, got yanked off of the bike by a low limb. I purchased a nice helmet for off road along with padded motocross pants and a jersey. I tried to relive my youth by riding off road in mud, sand, woods, along RR tracks, etc. I kept falling. My body didn't heal as quickly as 30 years ago..........I sold the bike :P

 

Just some thoughts from someone who has been there and done that. :wave:

 

This is probably the best advice ever, that I didn't want to hear... :(

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"groups" is a relative term.

Most groups don't end up venturing too far off paved roads.

Not to say that an occasional foray down dirt or gravel isn't an option.

Some incorporate the non-paved option as the way to link the roads together.

"groups" vary from one to more than several at these events but after the first El Paseo I never saw a group larger than 6 or so

unless they were with me in the slow group.

Since BRR started we often just meander around and see other riders but choose our own path.

If you are buying to do the "off-road" rides at these events talk to Matt/Ken/Bill F for some feedback.

Otherwise show up on the RT.

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From what you describe, the F650 is not a good choice. The KLR is only marginally better (and slower), but cheaper to find used. If you want to dabble off road, find something much lighter and dirt worthy, like a DRZ400. It will be slow on the highway, but will be off road-able way more so than the KLR or F650. The best part is it's lighter when you have to pick it up off the ground :/

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it would just be a light weight around town bike....I really like the single cylinder 650....

Anyway, lately, the idea of being able to take this bike off road is appealing although I don't know how often I am going to get a chance to do that.

 

 

He is not really looking for a dirt oriented bike.

More like a zing around the city and some dirt roads.

I think he had a 85-15% bike in mind.

I still say KLR. it can get up and go when traffic starts to move.

I had a DRz400 (not the S model) it was great doing trail riding (even technical ones)was even good for small jumps, but it was a dog on the street (lack of power)at speeds and was wiggly with a DOT approved knobby tire.

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it would just be a light weight around town bike....I really like the single cylinder 650....

Anyway, lately, the idea of being able to take this bike off road is appealing although I don't know how often I am going to get a chance to do that.

 

 

He is not really looking for a dirt oriented bike.

More like a zing around the city and some dirt roads.

I think he had a 85-15% bike in mind.

 

 

E yup. You got it right.

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If you find yourself riding rough roads with your RT, then buy it because you're riding roads that the F650GS is appropriate for. Highway travel to get to your destination, then some rough road riding. If you're not already doing that, then why will you do it with a GS?

 

The RT does just as good on rough roads as a big, heavy, twin GS. It has more plastic and the wheels are cast... but it does the job just fine.

 

I just got a F650GS thumper, because I ride my RT on too many rough roads, and it's time for a lighter, tip over bike.

 

 

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roadscholar

The 650GS is a great bike, it'll go almost anywhere a KLR will and is more powerful, far more sophisticated, and much better on the road (ask Jaqueline, she went from Fla. to the Artic Circle on one). It's a good dual-sport to explore off-road on and travel with when you want to keep heading in one direction, even on dirt and gravel roads. It's not good in sand because of it's weight and possibly rake and trail. For continuous sand riding you need a DRZ400, XR650, or 640Adv and that's not even getting into the more expensive and less roadworthy dual-sports. There's always a trade-off, probably moreso than any other category of m/c.

 

Then there's the rider, some people can ride almost anything anywhere, and others need the perfect tool for the job, it's all relative.

 

Here are two videos, the first is of average riders on a variety of 650's on some sandy but scenic sections in Ocala NF (Fla. is mostly sand). The second is part of a 3 day trip on dirt and gravel roads from Fla. to N.C. that six of us did last weekend. It may be the most fun I've had on a bike to date. It could easily be done on a 650GS and is probably what I'll use when I ride it again pretty soon two-up w/luggage.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Good points all.

 

Let me ask you this, for those that have done the BRR an UnRally.. Do you guys stay on paved roads or are there different "groups" that do different rides?

 

Sometimes....

 

Lawnchairboy, RoadScholar, Kinsley those guys are real animals offroad. Chris and I did an easy day off road and I went and rode down Heintooga Ridge Road on my GS. It was fine with the pressures down.

1032854594_43KgH-M.jpg

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i am now on my second f650 single, the first was a 1998 model with carbs, took it to Inuvik on the Dempster highway (see sig), and also ran it around the city as a commuter bike, much lighter than the r1100 and a hoot to hoon around on. sold it , really missed it bought a 2006 f650 dak, same basic ride but the fuel consumption on the FI model is way lower, in the city getting at least 60mpg, and on the highway better than 70mpg.

 

i am now planning to do some back road and trail rides, there is much to see when you go off highway...

 

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I bought a new F650GS in 2001. I put a lot of miles on it but it seemed like most of the miles were on the highway so I sold it a couple of years later and got the RT which I thought was much closer to my riding needs.

 

I have regretted selling it ever since because it was so great around town and on bad roads plus it was the stingiest fuel miser I have ever owned. I just didn't have a place for two motorcycles but in hindsight, the 650 was better on the highway than the RT is around town...at least with me in the saddle. I only took it off road once :-(

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scott r1200rt

FLrider, I just bought the BMW G650GS I love it and there are some really good deals on left-overs. There are some 09 listed at Max for 6200 the KLR is 5900 so for a few hundred bucks you get fuel injection, heated grips, abs, more hp, much better mpg, 3year warranty, it is more road bike than dirt, but for me,that works best. It only weights to the best of my knowledge, 6 lbs more than the klr. You can also get a centerstand, which i did. Go for it, you will not regret it. Good luck.

 

scott

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FLrider, I just bought the BMW G650GS I love it and there are some really good deals on left-overs. There are some 09 listed at Max for 6200 the KLR is 5900 so for a few hundred bucks you get fuel injection, heated grips, abs, more hp, much better mpg, 3year warranty, it is more road bike than dirt, but for me,that works best.

scott

 

Just be aware that the new "G650GS" bikes are not made in Germany or Austria. The motor is no longer made by Rotax. They are now made in China. This is just meant to be informational so you aren't "surprised" to find this out if you buy one.

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baggerchris

I bought Pepper the 06 GS to commute 15 miles each way down a winding mtn road before I retired. It was to be a counterpoint to my 97 Harley, Smokey. When commuting I got an average of 65 mpg. Living up here in the Sierra Foothills, I found it a plus to have a bike that can handle all sorts or roads, unlike the HD which does not like dirt roads. Anyway, I found that I started taking Pepper on overnight camping trips to places like Bodie; Virginia Lakes; Masonic and Aurora (ghost towns) and when on those trips over the Sierra's I got over 70MPG. Pepper has Givi bags; Cee Baily screen; Wolfman tank bag; Happy Trails rock screen and hwy bars, and the thing that made all day riding possible for me, a Sargent Seat. I take her fishing; camping; shooting; whatever. I dislike not having tubeless tires and only a light for coolant temp. (although she has never even been close to overheating, I still like to see what is up). Many folks have taken these bikes round the world. Google it yourself. All in all, she has been a real eye opener and with her under seat gas storage, has a very low center of gravity. All in all, probably the best over all bike I have owned in 42 years of riding. I sold a 97 RT to get her as I was just not comfortable with the weight; width and high center of gravity of the RT.

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Haven't sold my DR650 yet (it's a couple years in now). In the summer when I take the R11RT down for maint the DR is a commuter (big trunk on the back). It's a hoot, will keep up with highway traffic and gets 50mpg (but feels like a superfast bicycle). Also have a set of knobs that have yet to go on. My son has a KLR250 that hasn't run in a year, if we ever get it going we'll go dirt donking, nothing serious.

 

Never hurts to have a muli-role back-up bike.

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I bought Pepper the 06 GS to commute 15 miles each way down a winding mtn road before I retired. It was to be a counterpoint to my 97 Harley, Smokey. When commuting I got an average of 65 mpg. Living up here in the Sierra Foothills, I found it a plus to have a bike that can handle all sorts or roads, unlike the HD which does not like dirt roads. Anyway, I found that I started taking Pepper on overnight camping trips to places like Bodie; Virginia Lakes; Masonic and Aurora (ghost towns) and when on those trips over the Sierra's I got over 70MPG. Pepper has Givi bags; Cee Baily screen; Wolfman tank bag; Happy Trails rock screen and hwy bars, and the thing that made all day riding possible for me, a Sargent Seat. I take her fishing; camping; shooting; whatever. I dislike not having tubeless tires and only a light for coolant temp. (although she has never even been close to overheating, I still like to see what is up). Many folks have taken these bikes round the world. Google it yourself. All in all, she has been a real eye opener and with her under seat gas storage, has a very low center of gravity. All in all, probably the best over all bike I have owned in 42 years of riding. I sold a 97 RT to get her as I was just not comfortable with the weight; width and high center of gravity of the RT.

 

I have a similar story. I own a 2002 F650GS. It is a great bike for riding around town and on local country and forest roads. I often get 65 MPG riding it around with luggage. If keep the speeds to around 45 MPH on country roads, I can get 75 MPG. The bike has been very reliable and fun to own.

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baggerchris

I named her "Pepper" because her paint color is a bright, bright RED, and reminded me of a Pepper that I ate in the back of a Van way south of Ensenada on a skin diving trip about 1965. I was sixteen and they had sweet peppers in the front and threw me a red hot one in the back. I almost died I swear with no water but had to "man up" or face ruin. I remember the color of that red hot pepper as the same color as "Pepper", my bike.

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roadscholar

I like it.

 

Hey, four of us were surfing and camping out of a van near Ensenada in 1965, I was 17. Up on the cliffs at K39.5 I believe. The 8-track kept playing Herb Alpert's Tijuana Brass over and over, I'll never forget it. :grin:

 

Small world. :wave:

 

 

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I had been toying around with buying a small urban street bike. In another thread, I got lots of good advice, all based on my representation that it would just be a light weight around town bike.

 

I finally found one that looks to be in great shape and is reasonably priced.

 

Of all the candidates, I really like the single cylinder 650. I actually don't do a lot of "around town" riding. Most of my riding is long distance highway stuff so, the more I thought about it, the dumber that idea sounded.

 

Anyway, lately, the idea of being able to take this bike off road is appealing although I don't know how often I am going to get a chance to do that. Most of the guys I ride with aren't going to take their RT's or K bikes over sand, dirt and wooded areas.

 

How many of you bought an off road bike, thinking you would do that kind of riding, only to find the bike sitting around collecting dust and taking up space?

 

...She sure is Puurty though.....

 

Sorry Larry, she's sold! But if you ever do get a DS bike and bring it up this way, give me a shout if you want a "guide" to some of the fantastic forest roads we have up here. 3 words: Pisgah National Forest. :clap:

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I bought a Suzuki DR650 a few years ago. My idea was much the same as yours; ride around town and do some off-roading. The bike was great and I spent a bit of money trying to make it better off road. I fell the first time I road in mud, so I purchased knobby tires which were DOT approved. I wanted to be able to ride the bike at low speeds in the woods and swampy areas, so I replaced the chain and sprockets with different ratios. I added hand guards for warmth and protection. I purchased a small windshield for more protection and soon found that it prevented me from ducking under low tree limbs. I fell, or should I say, got yanked off of the bike by a low limb. I purchased a nice helmet for off road along with padded motocross pants and a jersey. I tried to relive my youth by riding off road in mud, sand, woods, along RR tracks, etc. I kept falling. My body didn't heal as quickly as 30 years ago..........I sold the bike :P

 

Just some thoughts from someone who has been there and done that. :wave:

 

This is probably the best advice ever, that I didn't want to hear... :(

 

I have tried a couple of other bikes for around town that do not go off-road. The first was an old 1985 Honda scooter that I restored. 150cc would do 65mph, got like 80mpg and I used it to run errands like the post office, doctors appts., groceries, etc. I even road it to work a few times, but had to avoid the faster hwys. The scooter was fun!

 

I currently have a 1972 Suzuki T500 Titan 2 stroke. I run errands and really enjoy making short runs on this bike. It is fast enough to travel on any hwy. I love the sound (expansion chambers with baffles!) The bike WAS relatively cheap. I restored her to original with the exception of the chambers. I'm keeping this one :clap:

ExpChambers001.jpg

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I bought a Suzuki DR650 a few years ago. My idea was much the same as yours; ride around town and do some off-roading. The bike was great and I spent a bit of money trying to make it better off road. I fell the first time I road in mud, so I purchased knobby tires which were DOT approved. I wanted to be able to ride the bike at low speeds in the woods and swampy areas, so I replaced the chain and sprockets with different ratios. I added hand guards for warmth and protection. I purchased a small windshield for more protection and soon found that it prevented me from ducking under low tree limbs. I fell, or should I say, got yanked off of the bike by a low limb. I purchased a nice helmet for off road along with padded motocross pants and a jersey. I tried to relive my youth by riding off road in mud, sand, woods, along RR tracks, etc. I kept falling. My body didn't heal as quickly as 30 years ago..........I sold the bike :P

 

Just some thoughts from someone who has been there and done that. :wave:

 

This story sounds sooooo familiar except my KLR is still in my garage.

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  • 1 month later...

So, if I bought the little GS (F or G650) and 85% of my riding was asphalt but 15% was fire roads, hard packed dirt and maybe some gravel roads, would the stock tires be the best solution?

 

If I wanted to ensure better traction on the fire roads et., would a tire better suited for that purpose be less safe on the asphalt?

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So, if I bought the little GS (F or G650) and 85% of my riding was asphalt but 15% was fire roads, hard packed dirt and maybe some gravel roads, would the stock tires be the best solution?

 

The F650 has a tendency to plow the front end in sand and gravel. I have used Tourance and Distanzias on the front. Both performed poorly off of pavement. The bike has a Mefo Explorer on it now.

LINKY

 

Much better trail manners and still a good highway tire.

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So, if I bought the little GS (F or G650) and 85% of my riding was asphalt but 15% was fire roads, hard packed dirt and maybe some gravel roads, would the stock tires be the best solution?

 

The F650 has a tendency to plow the front end in sand and gravel. I have used Tourance and Distanzias on the front. Both performed poorly off of pavement. The bike has a Mefo Explorer on it now.

LINKY

 

Much better trail manners and still a good highway tire.

 

So what did you use on the rear? Did you still like the Tourance on the rear?

 

 

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So, if I bought the little GS (F or G650) and 85% of my riding was asphalt but 15% was fire roads, hard packed dirt and maybe some gravel roads, would the stock tires be the best solution?

 

The F650 has a tendency to plow the front end in sand and gravel. I have used Tourance and Distanzias on the front. Both performed poorly off of pavement. The bike has a Mefo Explorer on it now.

LINKY

 

Much better trail manners and still a good highway tire.

 

So what did you use on the rear? Did you still like the Tourance on the rear?

 

 

Of the rear tires I have used on this bike, the best was the Distanzia. Much better in dirt and gravel than the Tourance. It also went about 3K more miles than the Tourance. The Tourance was the best street tire. On this bike the Tourance worked worst in all off road situations. I currently run a Shinko on the rear as it was about 1/3 the price of the other two, and I see no negative handling difference either on or off road using it.

 

 

I have found the front tire to be far more critical to handling off road situation than the rear tire on this bike.

Hope that helps.

 

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Outpost - Thanks for your observations. Well done. I think it also confirms what the other posters were saying and that is that the Tourance does well on asphalt.

 

I guess that since most F,G650 riders use it mostly on the street, it would make sense that people like the Tourance.

 

However, I'm thinking that if I am going to go on fire roads, etc., I want a tire that favors those environments. I think.

 

Again, thanks for your input.

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If you go offroad and ride in the woods/rocks what ever, you will fall, just the nature of the deal. All offroad bikes have bash plates, crash bars for the engine what have you. This should be a clue, we are gonna fall, picking the spot is the most important thing to work on.

 

Group rides off road are fun, but sooner or later, you will need to drink, eat and get off and be able to walk again, so keep that in mind when you go flailing around on your dirtbike.

 

Oh, and yeah, the dirtbike sits a lot and gets rides in a trailer for most of its miles. But, it is fun going places where only people on horse back or hikers go, sometimes. Rocks in the mountains are more fun than mud in the swamps, but you may find otherwise.

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Outpost - Thanks for your observations. Well done. I think it also confirms what the other posters were saying and that is that the Tourance does well on asphalt.

 

I guess that since most F,G650 riders use it mostly on the street, it would make sense that people like the Tourance.

 

However, I'm thinking that if I am going to go on fire roads, etc., I want a tire that favors those environments. I think.

 

Again, thanks for your input.

 

You are certainly welcome.

 

You may also wish to try a couple of other "tricks" on this bike if you buy it. I don't know what you weigh? I weigh about 195 with gear (maybe a little more after this winter ;) ) . The stock suspension, particularly the forks are WAAAAY too soft for anyone over about 140 lbs. I solved this by putting a 3/8" spacer (machined aluminum) under the stock fork preload spacers. You can also just cut a piece of PVC pipe (I think 1" sch40 would be the correct size) to use instead. This set the "sag" just right for my weight. I also drained (several times) the stock 7w fork oil and tried many different oil weights. I ended up blending 10w and 15w BelRay fork oil and to make 12 1/2 weight. This made the forks respond well to off road bumps without the constant bottoming the stock settings would do. Also the forks now do not have as much "fork dive" when cornering on the street.

 

The biggest help is to lower your tire air pressures when riding off road. If you are in a rocky area, all bets are off as you may pinch a tube. I usually run about 18 psi front and 22 psi rear when off road. I carry a small air inflater to pump the tires up when I hit the highway again.

 

These small improvement can make a world of difference when riding off road.

 

Oh, and before you buy a replacement seat, the stock seat can be modified for about $8.00 and give all day comfort. The stock seat slants forward and makes life for men very uncomfortable :/

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Peter Parts

Interesting.

 

Let me take a step back.

 

With a bike set up and shod essentially for paved roads and longer distances, I get a terrible itch to ride off-road, even just time on dirt roads. Having a little junker around keeps the itch in check without needing a major commitment to a second machine. But basically, I find biking more coherent when I have only one bike to fuss around and love.

 

Most of my trips are daily use around town (Toronto) but in terms of miles, more on longer scoots. Therefore, I try to reconfigure my bikes to my purposes. Getting more grunt power out of my high-strung Oilhead S and revalving the stock shocks really helps around town. On the other hand, adding a lot of height to my windscreen helps on touring.

 

I suppose it is harder to make an RT a fun bike for city use than a more naked machine.

 

Ben

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Oh, and before you buy a replacement seat, the stock seat can be modified for about $8.00 and give all day comfort. The stock seat slants forward and makes life for men very uncomfortable :/

 

OK.Talk to me. I just bought this bike yesterday and already I can tell the seat isn't going to work for me. What's the secret?

 

PS. I'm about 195 as well.

 

5677486885_182bebb0fb_m.jpg

 

 

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If you go offroad and ride in the woods/rocks what ever, you will fall, just the nature of the deal.

 

Oh, I hope not....I don't bounce as well as I used to when I was a younger man....

 

I will be doing some very civilized, easy riding on fire roads. Slowly...... :grin:

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Richard_D

The Dakar seat is much better and fits just the same. I bought one new from BMW of Chicago for $150 about 4 years ago.

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outpost22

 

 

Oh, and before you buy a replacement seat, the stock seat can be modified for about $8.00 and give all day comfort. The stock seat slants forward and makes life for men very uncomfortable :/

 

OK.Talk to me. I just bought this bike yesterday and already I can tell the seat isn't going to work for me. What's the secret?

 

PS. I'm about 195 as well.

 

5677486885_182bebb0fb_m.jpg

 

 

The dirty little seat secret is to turn the seat over and pull out the staples in the front half of the seat pan. There are about 4000 of them. Yes, it is ponderous to do, but costs only your time to do it. My seat had about 2 1/2" of extra fabric under the pan to work with. Make sure that there is enough extra covering so that you will be able to add foam and still secure the seat cover back to the pan.

Next, go to any shop that does upholstery work and buy a good quality high density foam of about 3/8" thickness. This is where the $8.00 cost comes in play.

 

Next take the foam and cut some wedges to slip in under your stock foam. Start building from the bottom of the pan, NOT over the existing foam. This will insure that you have a nice smooth seat when you are done. I just started slipping in a layer, and set the seat on the bke and "test sat" it. Just keep working at it until it gets where you want it. Mine took several layers of 3/8" foam and a little trimming of the foam to get a good fit.

The stock seat slopes forward and is super uncomfortable. I made sure that I made the front come up and made the entire front half of the seat level.

 

In the picture you can see the original staple marks on the seat cover. They have been like this for 4 years now.

 

seat.jpg

 

The hard part is re-stapling the seat cover down. You MUST have a power stapler or air stapler for this part. I own an air stapler and it is strong enough to staple to the seat pan.

 

If you want a little more additonal leg room, you can spend about $120 on Fastway foot pegs and reverse them. They will give you about 1 1/2" more leg room. You will loose some ground clearance if you are "peg dragging".

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[

 

In the picture you can see the original staple marks on the seat cover. They have been like this for 4 years now.

 

seat.jpg

 

 

 

 

??? You mean the holes are still visible in the seat? Is that because, by building up the seat, you ran out of seat cover to fully tuck and staple?

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outpost22

If you build the seat up high enough, that is true. This is built up about 2". It leaves about 1" of seat cover overlap on each side, making some of the original staple marks visible.

 

The other option is to buy material to recover the seat with. I wanted to see how this worked first, and frankly after getting scratches, etc. from off road riding, a few staple marks never bothered me. I figured if the cover started to tear, I would just re-cover it. 17,000 miles and a trip to Mexico later, the staple marks have never changed. I think there are about 6 "marks" per side that I couldn't hide. If the seat were about 1/2" lower, the marks would be under the seat pan. I wanted the extra height.

 

You just have to decide what you want in the end.

 

 

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