A pack of HD's 30-40 deep

[GordonB]

What would you do?

I caught up to a group probably 30+.

Obviously a local chapter out for a 'ride'

The road to twisty, to many blind driveways, to many blind hills.

Orchard country, only one lane each direction, call it a 40-50 mph road.

This was going to be a long wait........

The guy in back too busy taking picks of the pack from behind.

Average speed varied from 10mph to 30mph

Every little puddle or patch of sand (tire tracks left clear paths thru the sand), they slowed to a crawl.

I am patient, but this was ridiculous.

Came upon a T intersection and sped up, managed to become #2 in the pack as they turned thru the intersection. The leader had no intention of letting me by, I don't even think he knew I was there.

Passed him when safe to do so......

I've seen this before with a dozen cars stacked up behind, frustrating.

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

Been in similar situations before, beating my head against the dashboard while I wait endlessly for passing opportunities, watching the guy in front of me slow to a crawl for each turn and then nail the throttle as soon as the road straightens out again, making it just about impossible to pass safely. Not clear whether they're unwilling to let me pass, or simply oblivious to my presence, but the bottom line is it's frustrating as hell.

 

The packs I've been behind don't typically number more than a dozen or so; with lots of patience - and an iron will to avoid making the dangerous mistakes that IMpatience sometimes leads us to make - you can work through it. But for a pack of 30 or 40, I suppose I might just pull over somewhere pleasant for twenty minutes, enjoy a granola bar and take a few pics. Let them get far ahead; if you're lucky, they'll turn off from your route at some point; if not, well, at least you'll enjoy the next few miles of road at your own pace, and maybe further on the road will afford more passing opportunities.

 

 

[Deadboy]

Stop and take a break.....have a smoke (if you smoke) or a cold drink.

[kobukan]

The couple times I've experienced this they seemed to be completely oblivious to my presence, and just about everything else but themselves. For that reason I will not pass them. I'm not fond of group riding anyway - there's no way I'm getting into a pack that has no idea what's going on around them.

 

Pull over and take a break. Or, if I'm just out for a ride I'll just take the next turnoff and either head in another direction or take the long way around, which will probably be faster anyway.

[Jack Herbst]

 

Don't be so hard on the Harley group. There are some really good riders and people in those groups. Lets try not to be snobs and put other "groups" down. They are all fellow riders. Just be glad they are out there riding.

In larger groups there are always newbies and safety is always a consideration. Therefore riding as fast as they can would not be using good judgement.

They should breakup into groups of eight to twelve so as to allow safe passing.

 

Jack

[Lmar]

I came up with to a group like that about 10 years ago. I had my K1200RS then, I passed them. I group of Hell's Angels going to a meeting in Saskatchewan?

 

Not sure that was the brightest thing I ever did, I did know that I could out run them if I had to!!

[ragtoplvr]

There are often a few really well built bikes and riders in those groups. Never underestimate the ability of a Harley to accelerate. A good rider on any good liter+ bike can outrun them if you have curves ahead. But a top end run in the flat lands some of those bikes can roll. If you are not good and fast you can get educated.

 

Best to take a different route, or take a break. They know enough to pick their battles, you should too.

 

Rod

[upflying]

Don't be so hard on the Harley group. There are some really good riders and people in those groups. Lets try not to be snobs and put other "groups" down. They are all fellow riders. Just be glad they are out there riding.

In larger groups there are always newbies and safety is always a consideration. Therefore riding as fast as they can would not be using good judgement.

They should breakup into groups of eight to twelve so as to allow safe passing.

 

Jack

Thanks Jack, OP came across as Harley bashing. Any brand is capable of inconsiderate pack riding.

[TEWKS]

Ask Danny how it's

!

 

 

Pat

[skinny_tom (aka boney)]

Stop and take a break.....have a smoke (if you smoke) or a cold drink.

 

Then go the other way, as you're sure to catch them in a few minutes.

[skinny_tom (aka boney)]

I came up with to a group like that about 10 years ago. I had my K1200RS then, I passed them. I group of Hell's Angels going to a meeting in Saskatchewan?

 

Not sure that was the brightest thing I ever did, I did know that I could out run them if I had to!!

 

Don't be so sure. I've seen some really fast bikes under patch wearing 1%ers.

[TEWKS]

Yeah, not sure if i'd need to pass

I do know the frustration though. RevRay and I got behind a pack on the Million Dollar HWY last summer. Funny thing though, they were riding BMWs!

 

 

 

Pat

[ShovelStrokeEd]

There are often a few really well built bikes and riders in those groups. Never underestimate the ability of a Harley to accelerate. A good rider on any good liter+ bike can outrun them if you have curves ahead. But a top end run in the flat lands some of those bikes can roll. If you are not good and fast you can get educated.

 

Best to take a different route, or take a break. They know enough to pick their battles, you should too.

 

Rod

 

You are joking, right?

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

Don't be so hard on the Harley group. There are some really good riders and people in those groups. Lets try not to be snobs and put other "groups" down. They are all fellow riders. Just be glad they are out there riding. In larger groups there are always newbies and safety is always a consideration. Therefore riding as fast as they can would not be using good judgement.

They should breakup into groups of eight to twelve so as to allow safe passing.

 

The issue here isn't particularly Harley riders. Rather, it's large groups of motorcyclists riding in tight packs at slow speeds and not making any effort (or in some cases deliberately making it difficult) to allow other motorists to pass them. If you have a pack of 30-40 bikes riding so close together that they afford no passing opportunities, The bikes are almost certainly cruisers; given that HD sells far more cruisers than anyone else out there, the vast majority of such bikes can reasonably be expected to be Harleys.

 

Having said that, I don't wish to bash on Harleys/cruisers, or their owners, or their riding pace. The issue here is how to deal with the situation when you come up on the back end of such a group.

 

If you are not good and fast you can get educated.

 

Can you elaborate on this?

[GordonB]

Thanks Jack, OP came across as Harley bashing. Any brand is capable of inconsiderate pack riding.

 

I should've left the HD part out, did not intend to bash HD, I was more frustrated with the size of the group, the too close for comfort formation, and the lack of a steady speed. 30mph dropping to 10mph then up to 30.

 

I should've taken a break........

 

Thanks all.

[Dundee387]

If they are a biker gang, I would take a break, or alternate route. Your actions that may seem innocent enough to you, or others, may be taken as a challenge, or disrespect to them.

 

If they're not flying colors, etc., then I would pass when safe to do so.

 

[notacop]

What a shame one cannot call a spade a spade or a pack of slugs...slugs.

Plain and simple, cruisers are a blight on the highway. Doesn't matter how much fun they are having or what really moralistic cause they are riding for. If they are blocking a public road they should all be castigated in the most egregious way.

If you disagree with this reasoning. suck eggs!

 

[Jack Herbst]

What a shame one cannot call a spade a spade or a pack of slugs...slugs.

Plain and simple, cruisers are a blight on the highway. Doesn't matter how much fun they are having or what really moralistic cause they are riding for. If they are blocking a public road they should all be castigated in the most egregious way.

If you disagree with this reasoning. suck eggs!

You might want to check you cylinder head temperature. Throttle back a bit I think your in the red!

[Skywagon]

There was a BMW ride this weekend out of Houston. I joined it with some 30 other riders...It looked like what you described....slow group taking up lot's of space. It is just a function of large groups of bikes, cars, golf carts, etc no matter the brand. Better to break off into two or three smaller groups....IMO

[Dave39]

I see it a lot out here on the Delta. I just wait till we come to the next bar. They'll stop. Sorry if it sounds like HD bashing, but that's the only thing I see out here parked in mass at the bars on weekends.

[Matts_12GS]

I came up with to a group like that about 10 years ago. I had my K1200RS then, I passed them. I group of Hell's Angels going to a meeting in Saskatchewan?

 

Not sure that was the brightest thing I ever did, I did know that I could out run them if I had to!!

 

Don't be so sure. I've seen some really fast bikes under patch wearing 1%ers.

 

Reminds me of a story I heard about a west coast fireman passing a bunch of 3 patch guys coming home from Diamond Springs a few years back...

 

Hi Tom!

[RevRay]

Yeah, not sure if i'd need to pass

I do know the frustration though. RevRay and I got behind a pack on the Million Dollar HWY last summer. Funny thing though, they were riding BMWs!

 

 

 

Pat

yes indeed I remember it well and I also have fond memories of passing them, and later referring to them as sightseers.

[ddlewis]

 

The issue here isn't particularly Harley riders. Rather, it's large groups of motorcyclists riding in tight packs at slow speeds and not making any effort (or in some cases deliberately making it difficult) to allow other motorists to pass them. If you have a pack of 30-40 bikes riding so close together that they afford no passing opportunities, The bikes are almost certainly cruisers; given that HD sells far more cruisers than anyone else out there, the vast majority of such bikes can reasonably be expected to be Harleys.

 

 

When's the last time anyone here has seen a pack of 15+ exclusively metric cruisers riding in a parade formation? yeah - never. Face it, there's a reason some of these stereotypes come to be.. It's a case of the 95% giving the 5% a bad name.

 

Open 4 lane highway, I say more power to 'em. When I'm behind them on the Blue Ridge parkway I say other things..

 

 

 

[racer7]

Around here cruiser riders are nearly all "summer sunny day" types. There are a few guys who ride all year (and we even have a couple cruiser riders who come to our BMW club events) but they're 5% at best, more likely only 2-3%. Got used to my RT being the only bike in the company lot during the winter. But our BMW local club gets its highest turn out at WINTER events- folks are off riding some place else in the summer. All of us put together wouldn't make enough for a summer cruiser event but we do pick "ride to eat" places that serve beer- about 1/4th of us have 1 with the meal.

 

The cruiser guys do lots of fund raiser group rides around here - firm support for the troops is never even a debate. But generally you will see courtesy and waving faster riders through. Maybe its just a southern hospitality thing- AND most of us acknowledge each other on the road. No brand snobbery while riding.

On the Dragon you can expect to be waved by in a lane share if you catch up to most of them. Not a big issue around here.

 

Have only met 1 Harley rider who wanted to play (in SC). His highly modified machine had decent accel at moderate speed but was no match for my buddies K1200 or even my RT once turns appeared and speeds climbed. He was into a brief burst while we'd been hauling butt all Sunday morning before anyone was on the road heading to church. Was fun while it lasted...

[ragtoplvr]

 

You are joking, right?

 

I am serious. I have seen 150 HP on dyno Harleys, all it takes is Money. With the right primary ratio, they can go. They can accelerate faster than my slow oilhead Beemer, I have seen that happen with an X wedge powered built Big Dog, in a straight line there was no contest, and I pulled the oil head to redline in 6th fully tucked and still got left. They can't corner or brake but if I was in a flat area it could be an issue. On twisties, let them chase me, and I have had a few try in my dumber days. Not worth it anymore. Maybe I am not that good a rider, so be it, I still smile when I ride.

 

Rod

[ShovelStrokeEd]

150 HP? Come on, that will barely get you into the liter bike category these days. Most of the choppers and performance bikes I have seen will have a huge traction problem with that level of HP anyway. Hell, my Aprilia Tuono only makes about 140 at the crank but it only weighs in the 450 lb range. Doubt many street ridden HD's will be able to hang with its 10.34 second 1/4 mile, or the 160+ mph top speed.

[CoarsegoldKid]

I wouldn't think many 150 horsepower infused HD are out there and have the rider, suspension, tires and brakes to have a heads up go against a liter sportbike. I know someone who boasts of a rather special big inch motor in his chopper. It does make lots of noise and accelerates rather quickly. In the mountains I'm somewhat impressed by his desire to corner the thing. Metal parts on that bike have been known to scrape. He can make up ground in the short chutes while I maintain a constant speed. We have never tried to make a competition out of it, straight line or twisties. But it's no match for either my RT or S2R1K in the twisties that's for sure. Straight line I'm sure it could maintain a sighting for a few miles and sooner or later traffic and traffic controls will make for parity. What I'm saying here is if that HD rider has a bone to pick with a passing maneuver he might be able to catch you depending on the road. If he or his 30 deep group is of the 1%'er category I would rather park and pick gravel out of my tires then create something perceived as disrespect and experience their BS.

[Pilgrim]

Don't be so hard on the Harley group. There are some really good riders and people in those groups. Lets try not to be snobs and put other "groups" down. They are all fellow riders. Just be glad they are out there riding.

In larger groups there are always newbies and safety is always a consideration. Therefore riding as fast as they can would not be using good judgement.

They should breakup into groups of eight to twelve so as to allow safe passing.

 

Jack

 

That's kind of you, Jack. Speaking as a former BMW rider who repented and went back to the one true faith, HD , I have to admit that Harleys form the commonest big group rides (for the reason Mitch alludes to; there are sooo many of them.)

 

IMHO, they are typically bad news from a rider safety standpoint and a general nuisance on the road for the reasons described. The big groups are generally a weekend run by the local chapter of the Harley Owners Group (HOG; get it?) the dealer sponsored club. Harley corporate sponsors rider training. What I don't get is why the HOG chapter meetings apparently don't teach how to ride in a group, and why there appears not to be a real road captain and designated sweep rider to maintain some discipline in how the group shapes up. I've been around a few of their runs (not on; I don't do group rides any more) and it seems the road captain is just the guy who knows the way to wherever they're headed.

 

I'll give the 1%ers this: they know how to do a group run. From what I've heard from a few of them, the first rule is ALWAYS THE THROTTLE; NEVER THE BRAKE. That's really a better rule than it seems at first hearing, as long as everyone abides by it.

 

FYI, and I wouldn't want to suggest this to anyone, but I have passed a couple of 1% groups AFTER checking in with their sweep rider and getting the go-ahead from him. Ain't gonna happen if it's a funeral run though, and if he says, "Go!" then Go! the whole dang way; don't try to get into their pack even if there's a truck coming.

 

Pilgrim

[Penforhire]

I agree the stereotype has some truth in it. By far, the majority of these rolling roadblocks are HD riders. Some vanishingly small percentage I ran into have been Wing'ers but those are usually smaller groups, five or six seems common.

 

Those cruiser packs are dozens of bikes. Any solid slow moving group larger than about five bikes is, to me, a blight on the highway. Similar pack of local Ducati club riders? Not such a blight, lol.

[skinny_tom (aka boney)]

I came up with to a group like that about 10 years ago. I had my K1200RS then, I passed them. I group of Hell's Angels going to a meeting in Saskatchewan?

 

Not sure that was the brightest thing I ever did, I did know that I could out run them if I had to!!

 

Don't be so sure. I've seen some really fast bikes under patch wearing 1%ers.

 

Reminds me of a story I heard about a west coast fireman passing a bunch of 3 patch guys coming home from Diamond Springs a few years back...

 

Hi Tom!

 

Lucky for him it was a 4 lane freeway and nobody made chase.

[Jon_M]

As irritating as it will be, I agree that you should just let them have it. In my view there is nothing in their behavior that is about safety, and there is nothing about club cohesion that justifies their style. It's about attitude and possession. They know you are there and they will not cut you any slack. You can't beat them, so just let them go on in their great flatulent cloud. There are other roads and much better company.

[Twisties]

I guess you could call the police.

[JOHNNYWISHBONE]

10.5:1,forged domed arias, andrews gear drive cams, killer pipe w/quiet riot. that's just the beginning. i avoid slow. i also have newer rt type. true love.

even the H.O.G. people don't want to ride with me. maybe switch deoderant?

 

 

[racer7]

The guys who are reminding you that there are modified Harleys with very solid acceleration (for a road bike) have got it right. They're not common but you'll know when you see one. They're no match for an S1000RR or many of the K bikes, of course- a V twin isn't going to do the high revs despite being able to put out a lot of lower rpm torque. Remember that the whole intake system of the Harley is basically, from an engineering viewpoint, a kludged compromise to fit in a defined space. The cylinder intake flows interfere. The Harley riders have to work too hard on those things that don't handle or brake at all well- its no contest once the turns appear no matter how much money they've spent on engine bits.

[ShovelStrokeEd]

Hey, don't tell my Arpilia it can't manage high revs. I shift just shy of 10K RPM when I'm in a hurry. I know, mid range to a 600 I4 but with a red line at 11K, it does pretty good for a V-twin.

[Dennis Andress]

Large group rides of any brand, type, or genre suck. Passing them probably sucks more (there was a multiple fatality accident near San Diego recently). The OP made a good choice in going to the head of the line at an intersection.

 

There are fast Harleys out there. If you happen to pass one and he gives chase be polite and don't just run away in the curves. Enjoy the ride and then stop and have a talk. You'll learn something, and maybe make a friend.

[4wheeldog]

 

You are joking, right?

 

I am serious. I have seen 150 HP on dyno Harleys, all it takes is Money. With the right primary ratio, they can go. They can accelerate faster than my slow oilhead Beemer, I have seen that happen with an X wedge powered built Big Dog, in a straight line there was no contest, and I pulled the oil head to redline in 6th fully tucked and still got left. They can't corner or brake but if I was in a flat area it could be an issue. On twisties, let them chase me, and I have had a few try in my dumber days. Not worth it anymore. Maybe I am not that good a rider, so be it, I still smile when I ride.

 

Rod

 

150 hp HDs? Possible, but rare........And holding the throttle open would be like pulling the pin on a grenade. Plus, apehangers and forward controls tend to tire out the rider when traveling 100+........Why do you think they are going so slow in the first place?

Would I worry about them catching me, if I passed on my RT? Depends.......On how much gas I had in the tank. Peanut tanks and 150 hp don't make for much range. If I had a 1/2 tank, I am sure I could clear their area.

That said, I would probably just pull off at my earliest convenience, and give them some time to get to the next bar......or gas station. They seem to stop anytime one or the other is available. Just sayin'.

[ragtoplvr]

I will stick with the concept that any 3 patch group out for a ride is not to be passed and should be avoided.

 

I will also stick with the concept of only passing large groups when there are curves ahead unless they invite me to pass.

 

I have had exactly one time when passing a larger group 2 of them gave chase. That group was actively blocking. I slingshot passed them and gave them the universal you are #1 sign. I can vouch for the fact those 2 sure were fast to 110-120. Coming up was a sequence of nice sweepers and they fell far back. Now I was so pissed that I considered slowing down to let them think they could catch me just in time for the upcoming 15 MPH twisties. But I just continued my ride. After all I had a good 5 gallons of gas.

 

Rod

[Fubar]

Don't be so hard on the Harley group. There are some really good riders and people in those groups. Lets try not to be snobs and put other "groups" down. They are all fellow riders. Just be glad they are out there riding.

In larger groups there are always newbies and safety is always a consideration. Therefore riding as fast as they can would not be using good judgement.

They should breakup into groups of eight to twelve so as to allow safe passing.

 

Jack

Thanks Jack, OP came across as Harley bashing. Any brand is capable of inconsiderate pack riding.

I was on the other side of that last fall on the FL C2C ride. 8 bikes, 4 HD's, a Triumph, 2 V-Stroms and my BMW. We were over the posted by 10 but a K1200 really wanted by. He dove into the group after passing 5 of us, stayed there for a full minute then twisted it past the lead three. No signals in or out, not even a wave. I was both saddened and embarrassed. And glad we weren't riding tight.

[leikam]

I recommend honking, swerving and gunning the throttle (oops... wrong brand) with a few hand gestures for good measure. Stand up on the pegs; it makes you look larger and more intimidating.

 

Feel free to improvise. You won't go wrong if you just keep the golden rule in mind: forcing slower riders to accommodate my pace is good for everybody on the road and especially for me.

[Paul Mihalka]

I recommend honking, swerving and gunning the throttle (oops... wrong brand) with a few hand gestures for good measure. Stand up on the pegs; it makes you look larger and more intimidating.

 

Feel free to improvise. You won't go wrong if you just keep the golden rule in mind: forcing slower riders to accommodate my pace is good for everybody on the road and especially for me.

Watch it, don't bite your tongue!

[leikam]

Blood in the water, Paul. Blood in the water.

[RevRay]

 

Light these up and watch em let ya pass.

[4wheeldog]

It is not necessarily the passing that folks find difficult....It is the pissed of 1%er that are now behind you.

[RT Russ]

A few years back in our modified Z-28, I got behind a rather large group of cruisers on Hwy 88 in the Sierra, a beautiful twisty mountain road. It was very Cold out and they were going so slow that I became increasingly frustrated. When they got to a passing lane.....they ALL SPED UP until the end of the passing lane and then slowed back down. I was irate after a few cycles of this. I have never understood that mentality. Yeah, enjoy your ride, keep your group together, whatever, but speed up so others can't pass and then slow down again?

Last year on I-80 West bound coming home from A&S Cycles in Roseville on a Saturday evening going about 80MPH minding my own business, 2 3-patch, Ape-Hanger types pulled alongside and started gunning the noisy motors and giving me "the stare". Foolishly, I accelerated away from them. They of course accelerated as well, passed me then slowed down! Foolishly, I blew past them and continued my ride and again they passed me and then slowed down. Adrenaline? Ego? Idiocy? I blew past them and kept going. We ended up well over triple digits, from lane to lane around traffic for at least 10 miles before they gave up. I'm sure it was the cold that finally got to them and made them slow down. They were at least wearing full face helmets and some kind of heavy jacket with their jeans, chaps and vests.

As I sit here typing this I can hear my neighbor revving his 110" Screaming Turd outside. I know, we shouldn't bash HD. Really, it's the riders, not the machine. But I have to say, I'm so sick of their noise and attitude that I can't even admire the machines anymore!

 

Hawk

[Lmar]

By RT Russ

I know, we shouldn't bash HD. Really, it's the riders, not the machine. But I have to say, I'm so sick of their noise and attitude that I can't even admire the machines anymore!

 

Speaking about noise, my has brother Heritage Classic Softail. Every summer we take a 5 day trip through the mountains of British Columbia. There is no way I can ride behind him. I always lead, because of his loud pipes.

 

I wonder if the HD groups of 20 or 30 use ear plugs when they ride?

[Paul Mihalka]

"I wonder if the HD groups of 20 or 30 use ear plugs when they ride?"

No, I think they are deaf by now...

 

[Jim Moore]

I was on the other side of that last fall on the FL C2C ride. 8 bikes, 4 HD's, a Triumph, 2 V-Stroms and my BMW. We were over the posted by 10 but a K1200 really wanted by. He dove into the group after passing 5 of us, stayed there for a full minute then twisted it past the lead three. No signals in or out, not even a wave. I was both saddened and embarrassed. And glad we weren't riding tight.

 

Why not just move to the right and let him by?

[Dave39]

I encountered some of those dirt bags on I-80 as couple years back right after I had bought my first BMW and first big bike. I was cruising along about 70 in a nearly empty interstate. About 15-20 of them came roaring up behind me. Instead of passing on my left in an empty passing lane, they went right though me in my lane, passing right and left as close to me as they could. They were all wearing leathers and patches. I guess I was just naive and unknowing of my place. I was expected to get out of the way.

[Jon_M]

Instead of passing on my left in an empty passing lane, they went right though me in my lane, passing right and left as close to me as they could.

 

I've had that same experience. When I see a pack approaching me from the rear, I either decide to take a break or accelerate away from them and stay away from them. Nice thing about the RT is that very few of those groups can stay with you. It's more unsettling when I'm on the 42hp R69S. There's nothing to do except get out of the way if possible.

 

It would be interesting to eavesdrop on their conversations about solo riders or other makes of bikes. They must have a great sense of offense and it would be good to hear it spelled out. Can anyone translate grunts?