Use of synthetic

[MotoGP]

Since this forum seems to be filled with lots of knowledgeable folks about the gs bikes, I have yet another question.

I'm a big fan of synthetic oils, yet the consensus seems to be that these should not be used until the bike has 10-20K miles.

Mobil oil Co. says this is not true and can be used from day 1.

Has anyone switched to syn before 10K miles? Any problems? Any other oil recommendations?

Thanks again for the opinions.....

MotoGP

[Jerry Duke]

Before someone jumps you for asking an oil question, I'll answer.

You can switch to synthetic as soon as you want to. On 2 of my last three BMW's when I switched too soon, the bike used oil. But on those 2 and my current bike, once broken in, all three engines use less than 200 ml of oil between oil changes at 5,000 miles.

My 94 R11RS would use oil until about 25,000 miles and would use maybe 100 ml between changes. My 01 R11S used a little oil until about 27,000 miles, then maybe 100 - 200 ml, depending on how hard I ran it. My 05 R12ST went to synthetic at 9,000 miles and doesn't use a drop.

[dirtrider]

Afternoon MotoGP

 

The BMW Cop bikes switch at first oil change.

 

Mileage really isn’t the issue it is the amount of oil the engine is using. If your engine isn’t using any oil then switch whenever you want to. If your engine is still using oil then maybe wait a little longer until it quits using oil.

 

Even then there is Synthetic oil then there is REAL synthetic based oil. In the U.S. about any oil that can meet some pretty lax Synthetic specs can be marketed and sold as Synthetic oil. That is so close to conventional oil that there isn’t much different between that and conventional oil. In fact a lot of the U.S. synthetics are based on conventional oil stock.

The ground up PAO based synthetics are a little different but there aren’t many of those left as they cost so much to make.

 

[Paul Mihalka]

Now you did it! . You will get as many opinions as you'll get answers. From "as long as it says OIL on the can it's good" to "only use the most expensive BMW brand oil and change it every 3.000 miles".

My own personal opinionated opinion: These engines are so robust and last so long that they don't need any extra help. I am closer to the first opinion than the second. Idea to delay synthetic usage is that it prolongs or inhibits proper break-in and the engine will use more oil. For proper brake-in don't baby it, read the instructions in the manual and you'll see the factory don't want you to baby it.

Just to validate my opinions: I had one BMW bike with over 200K miles, one 175K, one with 135K, my current R1200GS has 128K. non of them had any engine overhaul.

[JayW]

The answer depends upon what kind of riding you do, at what temperatures, how regular you are with maintenance, and how long you intend to keep the bike. If you ride in extreme temperature, then the synthetics can be helpful. If you are likely to keep the bike for decades, then synthetic oil may also help it to last the duration. If you tend to neglect oil changes, then definitely go with a synthetic. Otherwise, regular oil will work very nicely.

 

If you do go with a synthetic oil, then the ester-based ones are a good example of a "true" synthetic oil, though there may be others. I don't use the "blends" because who knows how much of each is in there. IMHO those are mainly on the shelf to satisfy an unfathomable marketing demand for them.

 

We BMWST-ers tend to have strong thoughts about oil. You'll get all kinds of other opinions equally as valid, or invalid as mine. It has been several weeks since our last oil thread, so it is time again. Resistance is futile.

 

Jay

[MotoGP]

Yikes! I opened up an "oil can" of worms alright.

I think I'll let 'er go with dino oil until the 2nd service at 6K miles and switch over then. As for break in, I do run it fairly hard but not until completely warmed up.

Synthetics seem to me to be a better choice in the long run with an air/oil cooled bike.

IMHO

Thanks for the comments....

[JayW]

Yikes! I opened up an "oil can" of worms alright.

Thanks for the comments....

 

Your effort is noted and appreciated, but there is no way that an oil thread is going to die in just one and a half hours.

 

Jay

[sardineone]

I switched at 5,500 miles. My R1200ST wasn't using much oil from mile one, so I went for the better flow at start up and a bit of hypothetical reserve protection at high temps. My engine definitely didn't develop full power until past the 12k mile mark. Actually of late at 22k miles has never run better. So you'll have to be patient for your motor to fully run in. As others have suggested, I recommend not babying the motor after the manual says you don't have to.

[MotoGP]

I'll be patient, I guess. Now I'm thinking about sticking a neodymium rare earth magnet on top of the oil drain plug. Has anyone done this? These are super strong but I wonder if heat will affect them enough to come off the top of the plug.

[terryofperry]

I switched both 1200's over at 2400 (hundred) miles. Neither uses any oil.

 

Terry

[racer7]

I happen to like magnetic drain plugs because I get a strangely reassuring (but nearly worthless) sense that stuff is OK inside when I do an oil change and see nothing but a little gray film on it. And they've been known to be handy for retrieving the odd nut dropping in the wrong place, sometimes.

 

But I'd never just pop in a magnet. When I make my own, I drill a plug and epoxy the magnet in place. They can be purchased so cheaply its barely worth the time to make one. I actually prefer aluminum bodied ones with small wrench fittings when I can find them - it ensures that in the rare cases I let someone else near one of my motors, that some idiot won't strip the pan threads because the plug will strip first.

[racer7]

And BMWs 15-50 synthetic is a good one. Made for BMW by Spectro from Exxon/Mobil PAO base stocks.

 

There are other good ones, of course.

 

Generally I agree with Paul that these motors (amd many other modern motors) are so robust that synthetic is overkill for most purposes. But the stuff is more heat resistant in many ways- even the viscosity is not as dependent on additive packages. A lot of my stuff (but not my bikes) are either track toys or see periodic duty on track for teaching purposes. Syns also provide better cold weather cranking and better shifting in automatic transmissions for some vehicles. Just be sure to stick with viscosity grades and ratings recommended for your use- experimentation outside of that can be costly. (I've worn out side seals in rotary engines, gouging a lot of metal out of the end plates, running very low viscosities in track use, for example. I've also ripped teeth off tranny gears. But in those cases the engine gets rebuilt regularly anyway, a little hp gain can be a big deal, and stock trannies will have limited lifespans when exposed to a lot more power and abuse on track than their makers contemplated).

 

[tchap]

My question is, what brand of synthetic is everyone using? I've been using Mobil-1 V-Twin in my Harley Evo and Buell for a long time and plan to make the synthetic switch in my '07 R1200RT with 25K miles. Is Mobil-1 V twin still a good choice?

[moshe_levy]

Regular changes per the manual recommendations and proper level is infinitely more important than what brand you choose to use.

 

-MKL

[JayW]

My question is, what brand of synthetic is everyone using?...Is Mobil-1 V twin still a good choice?

 

I use Motul 7100, but there are lots of great synthetic choices, and probably no bad ones for use in the RT. I'm sure the Mobil-1 V Twin would work very well.

 

Jay

[Dave_in_TX]

My question is, what brand of synthetic is everyone using? I've been using Mobil-1 V-Twin in my Harley Evo and Buell for a long time and plan to make the synthetic switch in my '07 R1200RT with 25K miles. Is Mobil-1 V twin still a good choice?

 

The Mobil should be a good choice. A while back on another forum, an Amsoil dealer stated that Mobil reformulated theur oil just before Amsoil was ready to introduce their reformulated oil and the Mobil was good enough that Amsoil want back and did another reformulation.

[Ponch]

I would think the Mobil 1 15w-50 automotive oil would be good as well, and cheaper.

 

My question is, what brand of synthetic is everyone using? I've been using Mobil-1 V-Twin in my Harley Evo and Buell for a long time and plan to make the synthetic switch in my '07 R1200RT with 25K miles. Is Mobil-1 V twin still a good choice?

[Redbrick]

I switched to syn at around 12,000 miles and use Amsol....Buy it by the case for about $12/qt delivered to the door.....I've never heard of an oil quality related engine problem here.....Pick an oil that meets the standards required and change it and the filter at the correct intervals and ride........

[ADulay]

Why did I go to synthetic at 6000 miles?

 

South Florida traffic in August, among other things.

 

Sturgis traffic. Daytona Bike Week traffic.

 

If it's hot and you're sitting in traffic with the oil temp climbing nicely, you'll be very glad you put the synthetic in as you start to smell your buddie's HD next to you cooking off his dino oil.

 

HEAT is the only reason I made the switch (and sometimes I'm kind of out on the road for a long time when a normal oil change is due).

 

AD (50,000 miles down, 50,000 to go on this one)

 

[g_frey]

Does anyone remember when synthetics came out and the big oil companies trash talked them? Particularly Mobil as I remember. How times change. I devotedly changed oil at 2 to 3K for over 40 years. I tried synthetic in my 04 RT after it stopped burning oil and noticed that the bike did not get nearly as noisy at 3 thousand miles as before. At oil changes, now 5,000 miles, the synthetic seemed thicker than the dino oil at 2,500 miles too. All subjective, but an added advantage was that I rarely/never have to change oil on my trips anymore. It is always harder to do this and tires in unfamiliar places. This is perhaps the main reason I use synthetic exclusively now and with the extended life filters available now I do not change filters at 2500 miles with synthetic anymore either. Over 90,000 miles now and counting.

[Fubar]

Yikes! I opened up an "oil can" of worms alright.

Thanks for the comments....

 

Your effort is noted and appreciated, but there is no way that an oil thread is going to die in just one and a half hours.

 

Jay

Or one & one-half weeks apparently.