Warm up

[MotoGP]

Is it ok to just start up the bike on a cold morning and immediately ride off as the rider manual suggests? Wouldn't a 30second warm up be in order to warm the oil before a load is put on the motor?

Thanks

[JayW]

It wouldn't hurt, but the oil is not going to warm up in 30 seconds. It is fine to ride off as soon as the engine is running smoothly. Be gentle with the throttle inputs until the engine is fully warmed, which takes at least several miles.

 

Jay

[Boffin]

The oil is pumped round in the first second or two. Warming up is specifically warned against in the manual because it can do more ham than good - a few bikes have caught fire due to unattended fast-idle.

In addition, my educated guess is that the nature of an air-cooled motor means that the heads are getting very hot whilst the barrels/block are still cold, so riding away helps to minimise the temperature difference - unlike aero engines we do not have a big fan on the front to provide a cooling breeze.

 

The information in the riders manual is not thought up on the spot - there is a lot of engineering behind it.

 

Andy

[notacop]

What this site do not have is a Agree button.

A giant Agree with Boffin on the proper start and run of a Boxer BMW.

Some do get much out of the manual but he certainly has.

[Ken H.]

There is no justifiable reason to warm up idle any modern vehicle. From all perspectives: environmental to fuel consumption, to life of the vehicle and everything in between; the best thing to do is start it, then gently ride/drive away.

[DaveTheAffable]

If nobody else has given you a warm welcome.... WELCOME. Even though you joined back in October, I thought I'd try to make you feel all fuzzy.

 

Agree with all. "Warm up" not needed. Do I start the engine, pop the clutch, and load it up in the first 2.5 seconds? No.

 

I get on the bike, get ready to go.

 

In the last few moments I start the engine, and then make a check of:

- Warnings on dash?

- Stands up?

- Lights on hi or low?

- Pillon ready?

- Last check for traffic/hazards

- Put in gear and/or release clutch and go

 

That all takes less than 15 seconds. Enough that I have confirmed the engine is running smooth (not that it needs it), and I am ready to go.

 

But "warm up"? No.

 

 

[MotoGP]

Ok Great. Thanks guys for all your input, and yes, now I feel all fuzzy.

I guess I'm just used to warming up a car or water cooled bike. I do know not to rap it up until full operating temp is reached.

Good info.

 

MotoGP

[Jerry Duke]

Call me anal, but I ALWAYS wait until my finger is off the starter button before I ride off....

[Dave_C]

Ok Great. Thanks guys for all your input, and yes, now I feel all fuzzy.

I guess I'm just used to warming up a car or water cooled bike. I do know not to rap it up until full operating temp is reached.

Good info.

 

MotoGP

 

you don't need to warm up a modern automobile or water cooled bike, either. Same thing, drive right away, just keep RPM's low until warmed up.

[Lmar]

With me, it depends on the outside temperature. If its cold and my RT is parked outside, I will warm it up for a couple of minutes. I always take it easy until the temperature is in the operating zone.

[Deek]

There is no justifiable reason to warm up idle any modern vehicle. From all perspectives: environmental to fuel consumption, to life of the vehicle and everything in between; the best thing to do is start it, then gently ride/drive away.

 

I agree except where you said "to life of the vehicle". I don't think warming up the motorcycle, say for 5 minutes, is going to hurt it. That's typically how I use my motorcycles, I warm them up for several minutes as I'm doing some of the pre-ride checks, setting up the Spot, fiddling with the GPS etc. I do take it easy once I set out, even after my extended warm up.

 

Sounds like I'm in the minority letting my bike warm up, but I've never considered that it might actually hurt it. Any comments?

[DaveTheAffable]

Call me anal, but I ALWAYS wait until my finger is off the starter button before I ride off....

 

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

Sounds like I'm in the minority letting my bike warm up, but I've never considered that it might actually hurt it. Any comments?

 

The more slowly a warm-up takes place, the longer you are feeding over-rich mixture (and unvaporized fuel) into the combustion chamber. Droplets of unvaporized fuel can settle on the cylinder walls during the intake stroke and early part of the compression stroke, diluting/contaminating engine oil. I suspect this is more of a problem on carburetted engines where the fuel is just drizzled into the airstream (particularly those with 1-2 cylinders, where flow through the carb is very intermittent), but it's likely still there even on fuel-injected engines.

 

The solution is a quicker warm-up, by getting the engine to make some power. Not a lot, but get away from an idle condition: head down the road, using light load (throttle) and low-to-moderate RPM.

 

In addition, my educated guess is that the nature of an air-cooled motor means that the heads are getting very hot whilst the barrels/block are still cold, so riding away helps to minimise the temperature difference - unlike aero engines we do not have a big fan on the front to provide a cooling breeze.

 

I recall having a cylinder barrel off of my 1100RT, and observing that there is an oil squirter blasting engine oil against the exterior of the cylinder bore (where it protrudes into the crankcase interior). In addition, oil is being delivered through the cylinder barrel walls up to the valve train area and then draining back to the crankcase, and there's a pretty solid thermal connection between the cylinders and the crankcase.

 

I don't fret too much either way. Riding solo, I'll let the engine idle for about 10-15 seconds before riding away. If there's a group ride and someone else is still gearing up, I don't mind idling for a couple of minutes while they finish.

 

The hexheads have completely automatic mixture control, which means they tolerate an idle warm-up better than the oilheads. Oilheads have a manual fast-idle lever, and some folks tended to leave this lever on and let their oilhead bike warm up for several minutes, often resulting in glowing red exhaust headers, warped/melted tupperware around the cylinder heads, and occasionally an outright fire that damaged/destroyed the bike.

 

As Andy has noted, the best bet is to follow the advice provided in the owner's manual.

[Ponch]

I would think that with the advent of fuel injection that the oil dilution problem with cold starts would have been eliminated. Wet intake systems, particularly those with a carburetor and choke will do as you say.

 

Sounds like I'm in the minority letting my bike warm up, but I've never considered that it might actually hurt it. Any comments?

 

The more slowly a warm-up takes place, the longer you are feeding over-rich mixture (and unvaporized fuel) into the combustion chamber. Droplets of unvaporized fuel can settle on the cylinder walls during the intake stroke and early part of the compression stroke, diluting/contaminating engine oil. I suspect this is more of a problem on carburetted engines where the fuel is just drizzled into the airstream (particularly those with 1-2 cylinders, where flow through the carb is very intermittent), but it's likely still there even on fuel-injected engines.

 

The solution is a quicker warm-up, by getting the engine to make some power. Not a lot, but get away from an idle condition: head down the road, using light load (throttle) and low-to-moderate RPM.

 

In addition, my educated guess is that the nature of an air-cooled motor means that the heads are getting very hot whilst the barrels/block are still cold, so riding away helps to minimise the temperature difference - unlike aero engines we do not have a big fan on the front to provide a cooling breeze.

 

I recall having a cylinder barrel off of my 1100RT, and observing that there is an oil squirter blasting engine oil against the exterior of the cylinder bore (where it protrudes into the crankcase interior). In addition, oil is being delivered through the cylinder barrel walls up to the valve train area and then draining back to the crankcase, and there's a pretty solid thermal connection between the cylinders and the crankcase.

 

I don't fret too much either way. Riding solo, I'll let the engine idle for about 10-15 seconds before riding away. If there's a group ride and someone else is still gearing up, I don't mind idling for a couple of minutes while they finish.

 

The hexheads have completely automatic mixture control, which means they tolerate an idle warm-up better than the oilheads. Oilheads have a manual fast-idle lever, and some folks tended to leave this lever on and let their oilhead bike warm up for several minutes, often resulting in glowing red exhaust headers, warped/melted tupperware around the cylinder heads, and occasionally an outright fire that damaged/destroyed the bike.

 

As Andy has noted, the best bet is to follow the advice provided in the owner's manual.

[SuperG]

I too let the engine warm up or idle for about a minute or so, specially in the colder weather.

Usually just go out to the garage, fire up the bike, put on riding gear then ride off.

 

I simply want to let the oil warm up a bit, circulate at idle rather then getting forced through the oil pump at higher rev.

 

Last time i wanted to take off right after startup at around 30-35 degrees in the morning, (the bike started and idled) when trying to ride off it died, after restarting it required a bit of revving and clutching to get going.

I would imagine that cold stiff oil puts some strain on the oil pump and oil seals.

[mig]

New to the Beemers, but in the morning ( especially these last few where its been 33 degrees, yeah sunny california ) I start the bike then throw on the thermal bandana the helmet and the gloves, back out of the garage and wait for the door to close. About 2 minutes. I have oil temp indication by then. I guess thats good enough aside from easy does it the first few miles.

[Deek]

"...The solution is a quicker warm-up, by getting the engine to make some power. Not a lot, but get away from an idle condition: head down the road, using light load (throttle) and low-to-moderate RPM. ....."

 

Sonofagun, thanks for that information. But old habits die hard, and I suppose I won't change my procedures much (start about 4 minutes prior to shifting into first). However, that is good to know that I can shorten my "warm up" time down to under a minute without causing related damage.

 

 

[Dave_zoom_zoom]

"...The solution is a quicker warm-up, by getting the engine to make some power. Not a lot, but get away from an idle condition: head down the road, using light load (throttle) and low-to-moderate RPM. ....."

 

Sonofagun, thanks for that information. But old habits die hard, and I suppose I won't change my procedures much (start about 4 minutes prior to shifting into first). However, that is good to know that I can shorten my "warm up" time down to under a minute without causing related damage.

 

 

Well good on you DEEK!

 

Sounds like you'er starting to get a little more flexable here!

 

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

I would think that with the advent of fuel injection that the oil dilution problem with cold starts would have been eliminated. Wet intake systems, particularly those with a carburetor and choke will do as you say.

 

with port FI there's still a good portion of the intake tract that gets wetted with fuel; until the cylinder heads and intake valves warm up, one can expect to see unvaporized liquid fuel droplets being ingested into the combustion chamber. It'll be to a far lesser degree than with carbs, but no doubt it is still there.

 

There is also the problem of blow-by during the warm-up period, when the rings and piston are poorly fitted to the cylinders. Combustion products end up in the crankcase, contaminating the engine oil. There are of course additives in the oil to deal with this stuff, but they don't last forever; this cold-start blow-by is the big reason that vehicle service manuals recommend a more frequent oil change schedule if you take a lot of short trips (less than 5-10 miles) in cold weather). The sooner you can get those parts up to operating temperature, the sooner you can reduce blow-by to normal operating levels, and the sooner you can warm the oil up and start cooking that junk out of it.

[Deek]

".....Sounds like you'er starting to get a little more flexable here! grin...."

 

 

Shhhhush yourself man ....don't want to ruin an old sailor's reputation do you?

[Deek]

"....The sooner you can get those parts up to operating temperature, the sooner you can reduce blow-by to normal operating levels, and the sooner you can warm the oil up and start cooking that junk out of it......"

 

I see you're an engineer....so nice to get informed information for a change!

[notacop]

I'm willing to bet the RT-P I had that went 122000 miles before I traded up never got your warm up while the LEO's rode it. Didn't when I had it. Never used oil, coughed or farted in an unseemly manner.

What do the book say? I think it says start and go. If that's good enough for the engineers that built it, it's good enough for me. I find life easier if I don't try to think for a machine.

If one were in Siberia or Alaska, you might consider an oil warmer. Otherwise the battery wouldn't be enough to crank it over frozen. That was engineered into the bike too. Clever those Germans....