What! No BMWs?

[Little_Brit]

A survey of 12,000 readers of Motor Cycle News was published this week (17th March) listing the UKs top ten "most reliable motorcycles". The top 4 were all Honda as were the lower 4. That's 8 out of the 10 listed being Honda! And surprise surprise not one BMW...

 

The complete list was:

 

1. NTV700V Deauville (coming to the US I believe)

2. CBR600RR

3. ST1300

4. CBR1100XX (Super Blackbird)

5. Suzuki GSX1400

6. Yamaha FJR1300

7. CBR1000RR

8. VFR800 (98-01)

9. VFR800 (01 on)

10. CBF1000

 

As a life long Honda lover that makes me smile but as an owner of multiple BMWs (one at a time mind!) it saddens me that they do not figure at all.

 

It should be noted that MCN is a weekly journal and is unfortunately more "tackie tabloid" than "quality broadsheet" in its journalism!

 

Food for thought all the same. (NB: if I were not in the fortunate position that I find myself in I'd be on a Deaville without a doubt)

 

Derek

R1200GS 2009 + Ducati S2R800

Gone - R1200GS 2006, Yamaha T-max, R850r, CBR600FL, K75s, XBR500, CX500B x 2, MZ TS250 x 2, R600/7, R750/6, CB350K4, Ducati Sebring 350, CD175

 

 

 

[Firefight911]

And surprise surprise not one BMW...

 

Don't get me started!! This comes as absolutely NO surprise!

[Paul Mihalka]

And surprise surprise not one BMW...

 

Don't get me started!! This comes as absolutely NO surprise!

Yes Phil, please don't start!

[Firefight911]

To be "balanced and fair" they are all running great right now! New tanks will be in next week for the F bikes, recall parts are on order for the F8GS, and the K13GT is churning up the miles as it was intended with a nice 300 miler last weekend that was flawless. It appears that once you've had the new BMW's for a year they work as they were intended and are now providing smiles and grins as I was always accustomed to with my previous models.

 

 

Hi, Paul!!

[yabadabapal]

BMW Motorcycles set the standard. Its in a class all its own.

 

[bmurphypdx]

As with all polls, it's how you ask the question. How about this one:

 

Which motorcycle is most reliable at 100,000 miles?

[Firefight911]

Which motorcycle is most reliable at 100,000 miles?

 

The one still running!

[Penforhire]

I'd still bet on the FJR1300 and ST1300 over most BMW's at 100K miles. BMW has a lost reputation (not just with me) to recover.

[upflying]

We don't buy BMW's because they are the most reliable make.

Then why do we buy them?

 

[Rinkydink]

Because we can!

[moshe_levy]

Funny to read this today... I commuted to work on the wife's R60/5, now approaching 40 years old. On the way back home, I stopped to help a stranded fellow on a 2009 Shadow which wouldn't start. After we tinkered for a bit, he called a tow on his cell phone. He was pretty peeved as I left, when my wife's ancient Beemer instantly started without difficulty!

 

-MKL

[Paul Mihalka]

We don't buy BMW's because they are the most reliable make.

Then why do we buy them?

Because for the last almost 30 years a BMW motorcycle does best what I want from a motorcycle.

[bmurphypdx]

I'd still bet on the FJR1300 and ST1300 over most BMW's at 100K miles. BMW has a lost reputation (not just with me) to recover.

 

My point exactly. The list just dropped from 10 bikes to 2!!. Also, that's your opinion (which is fine) but I'd rather rely on a BMW.

[tallman]

BMW's win awards too

 

Perhaps one just needs to know who to ask.

 

I spend some time on the Honda and Yamaha boards reading posts about the problems their owners are having with those bikes.

They all have issues.

 

Best wishes.

[OlGeezer]

As with all polls, it's how you ask the question. How about this one:

 

Which motorcycle is most reliable at 100,000 miles?

 

Gawd, I'm not sure I even remember 100,000!

 

[Boone60]

Surprised that Goldwing didn't make the list.

 

A few years back I had stopped at the Honda dealer to look at the new Wings, when I came out to my bike a guy on a '96 RT was pulled up alongside and says to me, "What are you doing on my stomping grounds." We chatted for a bit, and as I glanced at his bike I noticed that he had 200K on the bike. We talked about how his bike was reliable and how he was just back from a 5K trip. When I asked if he was looking at buying a new bike, "NO, I'd never cheat on her."

[Paul Mihalka]

"Surprised that Goldwing didn't make the list."

 

It's a European publication. I don't think there are any Goldwings in Europe

 

 

[Little_Brit]

Just a few responces to comments so far.

 

Bill, I'd expect a UK survey to look fairly similar at 100,000 miles but I would expect RTs and GSs to figure too. I doubt many of the RRs would make 100k, they're more likely to have become part of the scenery! And the Suzuki is too pretty to take that sort of use and survive... Oh, and the Deauville would almost certainly still be in 1st place!

 

As for the lack of Gold Wings Dan, we do have a few but they are horendously expensive and not well suited to what most people want to do on a motorcycle in the UK, too much of a one trick pony.

 

So why do I ride a BMW now? Mmm, good question. I'd have to say that they achieve the right balance between cutting edge performance and style, real world useability and just about adequate reliability backed up by the most fantastic dealer support - in the UK and in my experience at least.

 

Derek

 

 

 

[Boffin]

"Surprised that Goldwing didn't make the list."

 

It's a European publication. I don't think there are any Goldwings in Europe

 

 

There are plenty of Goldwings in Europe - I even know a few 'wing owners.

 

They do however, have the reputation of being a two-wheeled Winnebago, for old-men or the eccentric and far too American...

 

Oh, and they are definitely in the minority in UK motorcycling, which is dominated by sports bikes.

 

Another data-point - the average annual motorcycle mileage in the UK is 4000 miles. The referenced rag ran a competition for high-mileage bikers a year or two ago - you had to do more than 2000 miles a year to enter... Plenty of "weekend warriors" are stunned by my 15K miles per year average.

 

As a result, BMW also forms a minority in the general motorcycling community in the UK - so will figure way down in such a survey because the number of BMW riders is statistically small in the sample.

 

Andy

 

Andy

[Little_Brit]

Good points Andy, I should have coverred most of that in my first post!

 

Boring as it is, as far as the road race biased UK media are concerned, I think you'd support my suggestion that the Deauville would probably still be top dog at 100k. No?

 

Cheers

 

Derek

[Boffin]

Good points Andy, I should have coverred most of that in my first post!

 

Boring as it is, as far as the road race biased UK media are concerned, I think you'd support my suggestion that the Deauville would probably still be top dog at 100k. No?

 

Cheers

 

Derek

 

I owned the 650 version for a year and covered 18,000 trouble free miles on it. If it were more capable of pulling two-people plus luggage I would still have it. BTW, the NTV700 Deauville weighs 20kg more than a R1200RT - hence its lethargic performance. If Honda could loose some of that weight it would be a much better seller.

 

As for reliability - look at what the dispatchers ride - the Montessa-Honda NTV650/700 Deauville is one of the favourites in that field.

 

Andy

 

A

[tallman]

Good points Andy, I should have coverred most of that in my first post!

 

Boring as it is, as far as the road race biased UK media are concerned, I think you'd support my suggestion that the Deauville would probably still be top dog at 100k. No?

 

Cheers

 

Derek

 

I owned the 650 version for a year and covered 18,000 trouble free miles on it. If it were more capable of pulling two-people plus luggage I would still have it. BTW, the NTV700 Deauville weighs 20kg more than a R1200RT - hence its lethargic performance. If Honda could loose some of that weight it would be a much better seller.

 

As for reliability - look at what the dispatchers ride - the Montessa-Honda NTV650/700 Deauville is one of the favourites in that field.

 

Andy

 

A

 

Andy,

Beat me to it.

Deauville can't carry me, my wife, and some gear.

Not a bike for sport touring for anyone who isn't diminutive.

Or wants some ooomph.

Might be the right ride for some, but it wouldn't hold a candle to the GS over 100,000 miles in this country.

 

The kind of riding dispatchers do, isn't that delivery based?

Not exactly sport touring.

 

The UK's Motorcycle News named the RT BOY, didn't they?

[RavennaAl]

We don't buy BMW's because they are the most reliable make.

Then why do we buy them?

 

Why do we buy them?

 

Well, for starters, I was able to test ride 3 different models home (35 miles one way) to show the wife before I made my mind up which one I wanted. Try getting a Honda/Yamaha/Kawasaki/Suzuki dealer to let you do that. Secondly, every time I go to my local BMW dealer, they treat me like an adult. The last time I was in a H/Y/K/S dealer, they acted like I was a teen age kid, though at 50+ years old, sometimes I wish I could be a teen age kid again. Also, I know that if I'm on a trip somewhere and have a problem, there's a good chance I'll be able to get the nearest dealer to get me back on the road again, even if it means that they might have to stay late, or work a weekend to do it. With a H/Y/K/S, I know there is almost NO chance that anyone would even care if I ever got my bike fixed and back on the road.

 

Buying a BMW may not guarentee that you are getting the most reliable bike, but I'm willing to bet that you will not find a more reliable network of support anywhere, period!

[Little_Brit]

We don't buy BMW's because they are the most reliable make.

Then why do we buy them?

 

Why do we buy them?

 

Well, for starters, I was able to test ride 3 different models home (35 miles one way) to show the wife before I made my mind up which one I wanted. Try getting a Honda/Yamaha/Kawasaki/Suzuki dealer to let you do that. Secondly, every time I go to my local BMW dealer, they treat me like an adult. The last time I was in a H/Y/K/S dealer, they acted like I was a teen age kid, though at 50+ years old, sometimes I wish I could be a teen age kid again. Also, I know that if I'm on a trip somewhere and have a problem, there's a good chance I'll be able to get the nearest dealer to get me back on the road again, even if it means that they might have to stay late, or work a weekend to do it. With a H/Y/K/S, I know there is almost NO chance that anyone would even care if I ever got my bike fixed and back on the road.

 

Buying a BMW may not guarentee that you are getting the most reliable bike, but I'm willing to bet that you will not find a more reliable network of support anywhere, period!

 

+1 to that.

 

I tried to get a test ride on an ST1300 a couple of years ago. I did eventually get one but I had to move heaven and earth to do so. Like you I had to put up with some pretty inane conversations too and I am also the wrong side of 50, and then some.

 

By contrast our local BMW dealer had me out on an R1200RT in a trice and with no pressure. No surprise that I returned to them last year to buy my lovely new 2009 R1200GS!

 

Derek

[OlGeezer]

Good points Andy, I should have coverred most of that in my first post!

 

Boring as it is, as far as the road race biased UK media are concerned, I think you'd support my suggestion that the Deauville would probably still be top dog at 100k. No?

 

Cheers

 

Derek

 

I owned the 650 version for a year and covered 18,000 trouble free miles on it. If it were more capable of pulling two-people plus luggage I would still have it. BTW, the NTV700 Deauville weighs 20kg more than a R1200RT - hence its lethargic performance. If Honda could loose some of that weight it would be a much better seller.

 

As for reliability - look at what the dispatchers ride - the Montessa-Honda NTV650/700 Deauville is one of the favourites in that field.

 

Andy

 

A

 

I realize that the UK (and the Continent) have a different market than the US, but I doubt if the Deauville will be successful here. I don't see anything wrong with the bike, but the distances are too great, particularly in the West, for a sub-liter motorcycle. Just look at history and you will see what I mean.

[Little_Brit]

Good points Andy, I should have coverred most of that in my first post!

 

Boring as it is, as far as the road race biased UK media are concerned, I think you'd support my suggestion that the Deauville would probably still be top dog at 100k. No?

 

Cheers

 

Derek

 

I owned the 650 version for a year and covered 18,000 trouble free miles on it. If it were more capable of pulling two-people plus luggage I would still have it. BTW, the NTV700 Deauville weighs 20kg more than a R1200RT - hence its lethargic performance. If Honda could loose some of that weight it would be a much better seller.

 

As for reliability - look at what the dispatchers ride - the Montessa-Honda NTV650/700 Deauville is one of the favourites in that field.

 

Andy

 

A

 

I realize that the UK (and the Continent) have a different market than the US, but I doubt if the Deauville will be successful here. I don't see anything wrong with the bike, but the distances are too great, particularly in the West, for a sub-liter motorcycle. Just look at history and you will see what I mean.

 

I'm sure you're probably correct regarding the US market but if I was looking for a managable motorcycle to ride a very long way without any likelyhood of experiencing any problems I'd consider the Deauville long and hard!

 

[Paul Mihalka]

"I realize that the UK (and the Continent) have a different market than the US, but I doubt if the Deauville will be successful here. I don't see anything wrong with the bike, but the distances are too great, particularly in the West, for a sub-liter motorcycle. Just look at history and you will see what I mean."

 

Well, the most miles I have on one type of motorcycle was the BMW K75. '86 K75 200K miles, '91 K75RT 130K miles. 750cc, 70 hp. They sold well and many people swear by them. I don't remember weight, but must be close to the Honda NT700. More power I have on the later bikes is nice, but I really never lacked power. Those bikes took me everywhere. I ride alone, with just enough stuff to motel it. If I wouldn't be so involved with BMW bikes, this Honda would be on my very short list.