OEM rear shock question

[Jimmy2Time]

I'm in the market for replacing my shocks on my 99 r1100rt-p.

How do I tell if my "factory shocks are equipped with the OEM remote hydraulic pre-load mechanism"?

If my bike isn't, should I get after-market shocks with a pre-load mechanism?

 

I really don't know much about shocks or how to set them up. I just know that when I take my wife for rides that I can feel the back end bottom out. I figured its time to replace. After all, an RT-P with 77k and I'm not sure when the oem shocks were changed, if ever.

 

[Dick]

If you are bottoming out, you probably need to consider a shock with a heavier spring also.

 

Look over this site (http://www.epmperf.com/) and you will be able to learn a little more about an aftermarket possibility.

 

Another one in your area is (http://www.gpsuspension.com/aboutus/).

[philbytx]

James,

 

If you remove the RH side plastic "V" behind your right thigh, you should see a knurled adjuster. THIS is the factory adjuster and should be screwed in pretty much to the bottom for two-up riding.

Righty tighty, lefty loosey. Sometimes the preload adjuster doesn't work correctly due to lack of fluid. You can easily tell if the preload adjuster is shot if you back it all the way out and it feels easy to turn almost all the way down. Some kind person did a write-up on this procedure which just involves adding some jack oil to the preload adjuster mechanism. You may NOT need a new shock if this is the issue

[Jimmy2Time]

James,

 

If you remove the RH side plastic "V" behind your right thigh, you should see a knurled adjuster. THIS is the factory adjuster and should be screwed in pretty much to the bottom for two-up riding.

Righty tighty, lefty loosey. Sometimes the preload adjuster doesn't work correctly due to lack of fluid. You can easily tell if the preload adjuster is shot if you back it all the way out and it feels easy to turn almost all the way down. Some kind person did a write-up on this procedure which just involves adding some jack oil to the preload adjuster mechanism. You may NOT need a new shock if this is the issue

 

Hey thanks. I will check that out this tonight or this weekend.

 

I emailed a shop around here and he said I would be wasting my money if I went with the works performance and that I should go with Ohlins.

I'll have to call him when I get a chance to find out why he thinks that way.

[Selden]

Refilling the preload reservoir will at least help ride height; it's a 15 minute job, requiring only a few wrenches and a little jack oil or power steering fluid. Make sure you back off the preload adjuster fully before opening it. DAMHIK.

 

Ideally, the preload on your rear shock should be such that the adjuster is at 1 turn for your weight, with no luggage or passenger. Static sag of 1.5-1.75" in the desired ballpark.

 

That said, the stock shocks are almost certainly toast after 70,000 miles. They can be rebuilt, or you can spend more money for after-market shocks. Which choice is something of a religious issue, like so many things on this forum. Whichever path you take, a reputable suspension specialist should interview you and then set things up to your weight and riding style.

[bmwmick]

I'm in the market for replacing my shocks on my 99 r1100rt-p.

How do I tell if my "factory shocks are equipped with the OEM remote hydraulic pre-load mechanism"?

 

 

James, If you find you need to refill the preload circuit,

Here is the link: http://seatrider.org/techntips/rear%20shock%20preload.htm

and here is the thread: http://bmwsporttouring.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=176421&Searchpage=1&Main=17565&Words=preload&Search=true#Post176421

 

 

Mick

[migrant]

If you find that a new shock is needed, Kyle Racing (near Monterey CA) is having a 24% discount on Ohlins for the ADV Rider group. I bit the bullet today and ordered a rear for my RT.

 

Link:

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=408664

[ratfink]

Not sure if this this is the shop you emailed but in anycase I have had good experience with: http://cheshiremotorsports.com/

 

Also want to invite you to post a pic of your -P in Motorcycle Talk, -p owners attn. please thread.

 

[Jimmy2Time]

If you find that a new shock is needed, Kyle Racing (near Monterey CA) is having a 24% discount on Ohlins for the ADV Rider group. I bit the bullet today and ordered a rear for my RT.

 

I sent an email to Dan to see what he would charge.

 

One of the local shops quoted me $995 rear and $794 front plus $100 installation.

 

Ouch. That is tough in this economy.

[Selden]

I sent an email to Dan to see what he would charge.

 

One of the local shops quoted me $995 rear and $794 front plus $100 installation.

 

Ouch. That is tough in this economy.

Check out Lindemann Engineering : Shock rebuild and revalve, OEM without airvalve $295

[Selden]

Rear shock is pretty easy to remove/install yourself. Front requires removing bodywork and the gas tank, when means a lot more work.

[topdal46]

James;

 

 

As Selden said, refilling the preload adjuster will make a big improvement, I did it on my 1999 R1100RT, and like stated it's a 15 minute job, very simple.

 

Last year before I moved from Texas to Vancouver,Washington I had new shocks put on the bike, I went with Works Performance, then I took the bike to a guy in Austin. He set the bikes suspension up for me. So after spending all that money on new shocks, it's better yes, more controlled than before, but the biggest improvement I really felt was the refill on the preload adjuster.

 

James, Know of any local BMW guys for motorcycle tune ups in the Portland area?

[Peter Parts]

I sent an email to Dan to see what he would charge.

 

One of the local shops quoted me $995 rear and $794 front plus $100 installation.

 

Ouch. That is tough in this economy.

Check out Lindemann Engineering : Shock rebuild and revalve, OEM without airvalve $295

 

+1

Had my front shock rebuilt and revalved for $175 by the shock guru of Buckhorn, Ontario. There are reasons (besides $1000 per shock) why that might be smarter than buying aftermarket. See my website.

 

Remember, spring rate is the basic parameter, preceding damping.

[SDRT]

James;

 

 

As Selden said, refilling the preload adjuster will make a big improvement, I did it on my 1999 R1100RT, and like stated it's a 15 minute job, very simple.

 

Last year before I moved from Texas to Vancouver,Washington I had new shocks put on the bike, I went with Works Performance, then I took the bike to a guy in Austin. He set the bikes suspension up for me. So after spending all that money on new shocks, it's better yes, more controlled than before, but the biggest improvement I really felt was the refill on the preload adjuster.

 

James, Know of any local BMW guys for motorcycle tune ups in the Portland area?

 

Recently added hyd jack oil to my pr load. Followed the directions provided on the forum. Made a world of difference. I had lost more then half of my adjustment range. Now I feel ressitance on the first click. Make sure you depress the piston inside the res.

[Richard_D]

http://members.cox.net/slartidbartfast/bmwfix/shock-oil/shock-oil.htm I thought I needed new shocks until I did this. They were like new after that.

[russell_bynum]

James,

 

If you remove the RH side plastic "V" behind your right thigh, you should see a knurled adjuster. THIS is the factory adjuster and should be screwed in pretty much to the bottom for two-up riding.

Righty tighty, lefty loosey. Sometimes the preload adjuster doesn't work correctly due to lack of fluid. You can easily tell if the preload adjuster is shot if you back it all the way out and it feels easy to turn almost all the way down. Some kind person did a write-up on this procedure which just involves adding some jack oil to the preload adjuster mechanism. You may NOT need a new shock if this is the issue

 

Hey thanks. I will check that out this tonight or this weekend.

 

I emailed a shop around here and he said I would be wasting my money if I went with the works performance and that I should go with Ohlins.

I'll have to call him when I get a chance to find out why he thinks that way.

 

Works Performance makes great shocks...the shop you talked to is full of crap (and probably trying to sell you Ohlins).

 

One option that you might look at if you go with aftermarket shocks, is Works with their "ARS" rear shock. This is basically two springs, a light and a heavy, and an indexed cup on the bottom of the shock. The cup has three positions, and is used to determine when you transition from the soft spring to the stiff one. The factory will set the shock up so that the three positions correspond to "solo", "2-up", and "2-up with luggage". When you want to switch modes you just pop off that black plastic side cover and rotate the cup either 1/3 or 2/3 of a turn.

 

This is quicker than adding a gazillion clicks of preload with a traditional remote hydraulic preload adjuster. Also, using preload to adjust for varying weight is not optimal. The ideal way to adjust for different loads would be to change the spring. Since that isn't practical, the Works ARS system with two springs is a good compromise.

 

I had Works shocks on my R1100RT with the ARS rear and really liked them. I've also ridden Ohlins and Wilbers on R1100RT's. All of them are considerably better than an OEM shock. Wilbers can be ordered with more adjustability than any of the other choices (including high and low speed compression damping). Ohlins, to me, have the nicest ride, but only by a little bit. If I still had an R1100RT and I was looking for shocks, I would buy Ohlins if the bike was primarily a 1-up bike or primarily a 2-up bike, and Works with the ARS rear if it was for solo and 2-up.

 

In the meantime...by all means, check/refill the oil in your remote preload adjuster and start using it. That will make a big difference. Note that if you add preload you will likely also need to add rebound damping (a screw on the left side of the shock. There's a hole in the footpeg plate that lets you reach it with a long flathead screwdriver.)

 

It is a good idea to record any changes that you make in a notebook. Start by opening the rebound screw all the way, counting how many turns it took until the screw snugged against the stop. Write that down...that's your starting point. Then tighten it that same number of turns to get back where you started. Do the same with the preload. This gives you the ability to go back where you started so no matter how bad you screw it up, you can always just go back to where you started.

 

Ideally you would only make one change at a time (i.e. don't change damping and preload at the same time) and you would make a note of any differences they you feel. Sometimes it helps to throw in some really big adjustments...like go from full soft to full hard on the rebound damping. That really makes it obvious what the adjustments do. Then go back to your baseline and start making small adjustments...a half turn or so at a time on the rebound and maybe a couple of turns at a time on preload.

 

A really high-level way to describe it is you should add preload until the bike stops bottoming out, and then add rebound damping until the bike doesn't wallow through the turns or pogo in the bumps. That's grossly oversimplified, but it's a good place to start.

 

I'm a big fan of aftermarket suspension...I've invested in it on every one of my bikes for the street, track, and dirt. IMO, the OEM stuff from BMW is terrible. But you can make a big difference just by taking the time to tune your OEM suspension.

 

You should get to a point where you know that if you're switching from Solo to 2-up you just need to add X turns of preload, and Y turns of rebound damping...but it's going to take some experimentation and time to get to that point.

[Jimmy2Time]

As Selden said, refilling the preload adjuster will make a big improvement, I did it on my 1999 R1100RT, and like stated it's a 15 minute job, very simple.

 

Last year before I moved from Texas to Vancouver,Washington I had new shocks put on the bike, I went with Works Performance, then I took the bike to a guy in Austin. He set the bikes suspension up for me. So after spending all that money on new shocks, it's better yes, more controlled than before, but the biggest improvement I really felt was the refill on the preload adjuster.

 

James, Know of any local BMW guys for motorcycle tune ups in the Portland area?

 

Thanks for the info. I need to check my preload adjuster before I drop any money.

 

Arrgh. There are so many options.

The guys at gp suspension told me, in his opinion, that if I went with Works Performance that I would be wasting my money and they weren't rebuild-able.

I contacted Tom at Works Performance and he said their shocks were "fully rebuild-able". Also, Works Performance said I could ship my rear shock and they would incorporate my OEM preload mechanism onto the new shock, which will save me some money.

 

Local BMW work? I've heard a couple people say this guy does good work in Portland. http://cheshiremotorsports.com/

I've used both local dealers in Portland; Portland Motorcycle Co. and Western BMW of Oregon (Tigard) . I got a better price on tires at BMWOR. They're dealers so you'll end up paying more anyway.

 

When I get all this figured out, we should go on a ride.

[Peter Parts]

Yeah, rebuilding AND REVALVING is the way to go.

 

1. A large fraction of bikes at BMW rallies have ill-adjusted after-market suspensions, says a suspension specialist.

 

2. After a chat with your rebuilder, he (or she) will know exactly how to revalve your shocks... unlike starting in the dark and further screwing up with Ohlins.

 

Question for this thread: the height adjuster on R1100S is built into the top of the rear shock. I heard it is hard to refill it and the devil to get the bubbles out. DAMHIK. Can anybody please explain or link me to guidance? (No, the folks at Pelican Parts, R1100S forum, never work on their stockers.)

[Jimmy2Time]

As Selden said, refilling the preload adjuster will make a big improvement, I did it on my 1999 R1100RT, and like stated it's a 15 minute job, very simple.

 

... but the biggest improvement I really felt was the refill on the preload adjuster.

Last night, I refilled the preload adjuster. Before adding hydraulic fluid the tension just started at 4 lines from the bottom. After filling the preload adjuster with hydraulic oil, the adjuster hit tension/resistance at the top of the adjuster.

 

Whoever said this was a 15 minute job hasn't seen me work on my bike. It took me @ 45 minutes to complete this simple task, spilling a cup of hydraulic oil all over the floor (user error) and making a big mess in the process. Lovely...

 

So, I'm going to ask another stupid question.

How exactly does the preload adjuster work? What I mean is, when do I crank it down to high and then back it off to normal?

Solo riding = normal and 2-up riding = high preload?

 

Before you comment, yes, I admit that I've had this bike for a couple years and yes, I admit that I am still discovering that I'm not using all the tools this bike provides. As my friends would say, "You're doing it wrong."

 

I haven't had a chance to take it out and see how it rides just yet. If this helps with the bounce if feel in the curves or bottoming out with a passenger, then I can hold off on the major shock purchase for a little bit longer.

 

Thanks for everyone's advice, suggestions and help.

[russell_bynum]

1. A large fraction of bikes at BMW rallies have ill-adjusted after-market suspensions, says a suspension specialist.

 

And most of the rest have ill-adjusted stock suspensions. What's your point?

 

2. After a chat with your rebuilder, he (or she) will know exactly how to revalve your shocks... unlike starting in the dark and further screwing up with Ohlins.

 

If you just order a Stock Ohlins off the shelf and stick them on your bike, yes. IMO, as long as you get the right spring, you'll still be better off than with stock shocks...rebuilt/resprung/revalved or not.

 

 

If you work with a reputable tuner like Dan Kyle, Stig Peterson, Dave Moss, etc they will take care of that for you.

 

When you order Works Performance shocks, you spend some time talking to them about your weight range, riding style, how you like the bike to feel. The shocks are built custom for you. Likewise when you order Wilbers shocks.

 

 

[Selden]

So, I'm going to ask another stupid question.

How exactly does the preload adjuster work? What I mean is, when do I crank it down to high and then back it off to normal?

Solo riding = normal and 2-up riding = high preload?

 

Before you comment, yes, I admit that I've had this bike for a couple years and yes, I admit that I am still discovering that I'm not using all the tools this bike provides. As my friends would say, "You're doing it wrong."

 

I haven't had a chance to take it out and see how it rides just yet. If this helps with the bounce if feel in the curves or bottoming out with a passenger, then I can hold off on the major shock purchase for a little bit longer.

Think of the remote adjuster as a screw jack. If the initial spring pre-load on the OEM shocks is adjustable, you should aim for about 1.5-1.75" (1/3 of total suspension travel) static sag (the difference in rear wheel travel on the center stand vs when you are seated with your full weight on the bike.)

 

Static sag is actually pretty easy to measure: I taped a yardstick to the FD, then strapped a black marker to the frame, so that it touched the edge of the yardstick. This marked full extension. I then gently rolled the bike off the centerstand, and took as much weight as possible off my feet; this gave me the second measurement.

 

If you can achieve the desired static sag without using the remote adjuster (i.e., by adjusting spring preload), then you have no pressure in the hydraulic jack riding solo, and you have its entire range to use for two-up, luggage, etc. riding conditions. On the other hand, If you have to turn the remote adjuster in halfway for solo, you don't have much to play with for two-up riding, and the hydraulic fluid is always under pressure.

[Peter Parts]

1. A large fraction of bikes at BMW rallies have ill-adjusted after-market suspensions, says a suspension specialist.

 

And most of the rest have ill-adjusted stock suspensions. What's your point?

 

2. After a chat with your rebuilder, he (or she) will know exactly how to revalve your shocks... unlike starting in the dark and further screwing up with Ohlins.

 

If you just order a Stock Ohlins off the shelf and stick them on your bike, yes. IMO, as long as you get the right spring, you'll still be better off than with stock shocks...rebuilt/resprung/revalved or not.

 

 

If you work with a reputable tuner like Dan Kyle, Stig Peterson, Dave Moss, etc they will take care of that for you.

 

When you order Works Performance shocks, you spend some time talking to them about your weight range, riding style, how you like the bike to feel. The shocks are built custom for you. Likewise when you order Wilbers shocks.

 

+1 - and well expressed

 

But in as much as I spend some of my professional time translating subjective experience into hardware (and vice versa), I'd say there's a really big improvement when the rider says "this shock I am holding in my hand jars my dentures" as compared to a phone conversation with Wilbers about stuff.

 

Likewise, really big gap between what some race-oriented guys at Ohlins think is the right spring for your weight and what you or I might think. There is simply no objective way to decide, "that's the right spring rate for your weight" even with some vague fudge-factor about "riding style" factored in.

 

Those are good places to start. Of course, you could just start with your stockers too and end up ahead.

 

In any case, I offer (second hand) the observation that say what you want, a lot of aftermarket shocks are found to be ill-adjusted.

[conwaykraM]

Links to reworking / refilling stock struts above don't work. Does anyone have good information as to th process to rebuild stock struts - add oil etc... Thanks in advance

[azccj]

These are listed on Ebay. Not a bad price for the pair but the rear one will only work on the 1150 models.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-R1150RT-USED-OHLINS-FRONT-REAR-SUSPENSION-SHOCK-R1150-RT-R-1150-RT-/170874651152?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item27c8ec4210&vxp=mtr

[Peter Parts]

Links to reworking / refilling stock struts above don't work. Does anyone have good information as to th process to rebuild stock struts - add oil etc... Thanks in advance

My link seems to work for me.

Good suspension is important to good riding. But you might get there easiest by starting with your stock shocks (which are honky-dory for many riders without modification) and not paying for gold coloring.

Ben

[AndyS]

...Good suspension is important to good riding. But you might get there easiest by starting with your stock shocks (which are honky-dory for many riders without modification) and not paying for gold coloring.

Ben

 

+1 on this Ben. A refilled preload reservoir can make all the difference