Cluth Fluid

[Mark G]

So I got raped at the dealer today who completed a I-ABS flush on my 02 1150rtp, then replaced my rear pads and TB sync/valve adjustment. They seemed to have found another problem. The tech opened my clutch m/c cylinder and the fluid was somehwat cloudy, tech thinks it smelled like gear oil and thinks I have a leak from the rear imput shaft into the cluth slave cyl which is circulating gear oil in my cluth line.

 

The master cylinder had 4 screws but only 3 were actually threaded in, the fourth was too short.

 

Question is should I be concerned? Could the cloudiness be from moisture seeping into the clutch m/c because the fourth screw was not tight? Or should I just start pulling the bike apart to replace the slave cylinder? I don't have any cluth problems at the moment.

 

[Boffin]

Sounds like BS to me. I have never hear of anything like this - when the clutch slave seal fails, clutch fluid leaks into the clutch pushrod tube and can contaminate the clutch making it slip.

 

I would simply flush the fluid, topping up to the LOWER step on the level indicator - the level rises with clutch wear. It may be worth pulling the slave from the back of the tranny - tight but possible without removing the swingarm - and checking the condition of the throwout bearing - looking for leaking fluid.

 

Andy

[Ken H.]

In a word – Impossible.

 

In more words – There is no possible path for gear oil from the transmission, out of the transmission, into the slave cylinder, into the line, and up to the clutch master cylinder.

 

[Mark G]

Thanks guys. It was explained to me that there is a piece of felt on the input shaft which prevents this type of situation however the seal can become worn and leak. The exact words on the order are found gear oil contaminating clutch fluid, suspect rear input shaft seal leak and cluth slave cylinder leak. I will just flush out the clutch line and refil with new fluid.

[4wheeldog]

Thanks guys. It was explained to me that there is a piece of felt on the input shaft which prevents this type of situation however the seal can become worn and leak. The exact words on the order are found gear oil contaminating clutch fluid, suspect rear input shaft seal leak and cluth slave cylinder leak. I will just flush out the clutch line and refil with new fluid.

 

If the tech suspects that you have gear oil in your clutch circuit, it is because he put it there.

Flush it as others have suggested, and don't let that tech touch your bike again. He is either dishonest or a moron......And I am being as charitable as possible in this assessment.

[Ken H.]

There is so much wrong with this whole “explanation” I don’t even hardly know where to start. But if interested read on and I’ll dissect some of what was said to illustrate just how unknowledgeable (and I’m being charitable too) this person is…

 

First point – the felt ring mentioned does exist, but the clutch slave cylinder and the rear input shaft seal are on the same side of it so it stopping this is impossibility #1.

 

Second point – the clutch hydraulic system is a closed system. If it where not, even if because of a failure, your clutch lever would not work at all, and yours does. So gear oil getting it is impossibility #2.

 

Third point – the input shaft rear seal and the clutch slave cylinder occupy the same cavity in the rear of the transmission, but it is not a sealed nor pressurized cavity. It is open to the air via the hollow input shaft and out the front of the tranny. So gear oil being forced toward or into the slave cylinder (even in a failed slave cylinder situation) is impossibility #3.

 

Forth point – there is no “circulating” anything in the clutch hydraulic circuit. The fluid at the master cylinder end pushes the fluid in the hydraulic line, which push the fluid in the slave cylinder on the other end. The actual fluid in the master cylinder never actually travels all the way to the slave cylinder nor visa versa. So gear oil, caster oil, or vinegar & oil traveling from the slave cylinder to the master cylinder is impossibility #4.

 

“4wheeldog” said it right: This guy is either a crook or a moron. Either way, run don’t walk, RUN to a different servicer.

 

[flars]

"...So gear oil, caster oil, or vinegar & oil traveling from the slave cylinder to the master cylinder is impossibility #4...."

So, Ken - why does the clutch fluid in the master cylinder turn chocolate color when the slave cylinder fails?

[Mark G]

Son of a B! I got my brakes/I-ABS blead out and refilled, got the TB sync and the Valves adjusted....felt like I got robbed and while the tech was explaining the clutch issue to me, an owner was picking up his bike and gave the WTF look, ha. I kind of took that as a hint. So they robbed me for the above services and I won't be revisiting that store in maryland again.

 

Does the heat off the engine screw with the fluid in the lines between the m/c and the s/c for the clutch, discoloring them??

[outpost22]

So gear oil, caster oil, or vinegar & oil traveling from the slave cylinder to the master cylinder is impossibility #4.

 

I knew these were agricultural engines, and could be used in the cultivation of a lettuce field, but never suspected we could get our salad "dressed" at the same time

[Jeepster]

Just for giggles I would take your repair order with the impossible explanation and have a talk with the owner of the dealership.

Let him know that if that tech is allowed to do that in that shop you cannot trust HIS dealership.

[ratfink]

I had to run out and sniff the clutch cable on my 1100.

 

I detected garlic and dill. But I don't want a pickle.

[pjw73nh]

I agree that the explanation is not very good. I would certainly talk to the owner about it. it could be the way it wa written was not what was meant. Not being there. I really have no basis to judge. As to the rip off? Depends on what you paid to have the work that they DID do done. They did SOME legitimate work, correct?

 

That said, I guess I have the same question as Flars. I'm not trying to start anything here I just want to know. When I had my clutch/spline shaft surgery a couple of months ago, I got a close look at the clutch slave cylinder. It was very much as Flars described it. Chocolate shmutz. It did smell like gear oil. It was the consistency of light weight grease. I am fortunate to live only a few miles from my dealer and I stopped by a few times during the surgery to look at it. I actually took the slave cylinder home and post mortem'd it. It appeared to be your basic hydraulic spring loaded piston in a cylinder, with a retaining clip on on end.

 

I am not familiar with just how the whole clutch setup works (I would think that you pull the clutch lever in, the slave cylinder piston expands, pushes forward, pushes on the clutch rod, and into the spring). But it appears that is not the case.

 

Anyway, they replaced the cylinder and the rod/felt. My clutch WAS contaminated but hadn't started slipping yet (though it was grabby).

 

So yeah, Does anyone know what makes the slave cylinder all chocolatey?

 

Paul.../NH

[Boffin]

I am not familiar with just how the whole clutch setup works (I would think that you pull the clutch lever in, the slave cylinder piston expands, pushes forward, pushes on the clutch rod, and into the spring). But it appears that is not the case.

 

Anyway, they replaced the cylinder and the rod/felt. My clutch WAS contaminated but hadn't started slipping yet (though it was grabby).

 

 

So yeah, Does anyone know what makes the slave cylinder all chocolatey?

 

Paul.../NH

 

There is a sealed bearing between the piston and the pushrod. When the slave cylinder seal fails, the dot-4 washes the grease out of this bearing leaving the chocolate mush.

 

Andy